Speculation: All-encompassing Draft Thread

[Big Friggin Dummy]

The only way you move the #1 is if you can guarantee you'll get Byfield and Drysdale at #3 and #5. If that's not the case, keep Lafreniere.

Hell, even if you could land those two, I'd be really, really hesitant to deal the #1 and Lafreniere. But those two are the only way I'd even consider it. Any other combination of two guys and it's a flat-out no.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

The only way you move the #1 is if you can guarantee you'll get Byfield and Drysdale at #3 and #5. If that's not the case, keep Lafreniere.

Hell, even if you could land those two, I'd be really, really hard-pressed to deal the #1 and Lafreniere. But those two are the only way I'd even consider it.

Byfield does not impress me. I love Drysdale though. But yeah, you pick Lafrenière and roll a killer top 9 of:

Lafrenière - Crosby - Zucker
Guentzel - Malkin - Rust
Poulin - FIND SOMEONE - Hornqvist

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Byfield does not impress me. I love Drysdale though. But yeah, you pick Lafrenière and roll a killer top 9 of:

Lafrenière - Crosby - Zucker
Guentzel - Malkin - Rust
Poulin - FIND SOMEONE - Hornqvist

Yeah, I don't think you're ever going to regret landing Lafreniere, but the other two are really intriguing. Teams that win build down the middle and on the blueline. You could do a lot worse than Byfield and Drysdale in that regard.

But again, my preference is to just pick Lafreniere if we win the lottery. I was just saying a situation where the other two are guaranteed ours at #3 and #5 is the only situation I'd even think about moving the #1.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'd trade pick #1 for picks #3 and #5 if Ottawa also took JJ's contract.

Get Stutzle and Drysdale and move both McCann and Murray for actual value, instead of sinking the value of one to move JJ.

 

[The Old Master]

If you win the lottery, you pick La frenière. Trading back would be dumb.

Lafrenière is the best pick for us PRECISELY because he is a winger who can play with Sid or Geno day 1.

that follows the normal rules of trading "team that gets the best player wins" but for this team 1. wing is not our biggest need 2. we could fill a lot of needs. it could be a long while befor we get a chance to get talent that would be avaleable in this years top ten. and this would give us two. and if nessecary we would have a chance to move up a spot to get the guy's we want.

 

[EVGENIMERLIN]

Byfield does not impress me. I love Drysdale though. But yeah, you pick Lafrenière and roll a killer top 9 of:

Lafrenière - Crosby - Zucker
Guentzel - Malkin - Rust
Poulin - FIND SOMEONE - Hornqvist

Drysdale is such a good skater, I'd love to land him. I am high on Stutzle as well so getting Drysdale and him for 1OV would seem like a decent trade-off, but looking at that top 9 is hard to ignore.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

Yeah. Although iirc he was fast for a big lad but not particularly agile, which isn't great.

Maybe, but skating wasn’t going to save the rest of his game. He was terrible with the puck and confused defensively. I definitely remember the disbelief of the pick when I was him in the preseason or whatever it was. I think they had some dumbass belief he has untapped offensive upside because of his playoffs, too.

Lauzon in contrast, while I didn’t like the pick was a prospect I could see what they were thinking once we saw him play. Good skater, pretty mature in his own zone and he wasn’t bad with the puck. I could see why they thought he’d develop into something useful. Of course both had injury problems.

I feel like we'd have been a lot more nonplussed by the 2016 draft if we weren't so darn happy with everything. At least 2017 had some interesting lower round gambles and only big reach for a physical guy.

The fact that both might still go down as good drafts (with a decent slice of luck by now) amuses me.

But in any case, based on his record with us, I'd predict something fairly tame with 3 + 5OA if he had them, although with Rutherford, a mad moment is never that far away. I wouldn't be surprised, f'ex, if he went with Sanderson at 5OA in such a scenario - which is not a million miles off some predictions tbf. And would also be a virtual mirror move of what Yzerman did with Seider too, so hardly some unique stroke of madness either.

The thing with JR is that he’s JR and could do something crazy at any moment. You could walk away from the draft with a future 1D and 1C or you could walk away a defensive defenseman and someone they try to sell as a power forward.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

Drysdale is such a good skater, I'd love to land him. I am high on Stutzle as well so getting Drysdale and him for 1OV would seem like a decent trade-off, but looking at that top 9 is hard to ignore.

I absolutely LOVE Drysdale. Would love getting him. Byfield, meh.

I do not know enough about Stutzle to comment.

Lafrenière is Hossa 2.0, I want him with Sid or Geno.

 

[Pittsburgh1776]

The stuff I've read was from hockey journalists on twitter (wish I had a link, but I saw it a while back when I didn't think the Pens were going to be in this lottery, so I didn't save it...) Word there was the Sens might be willing to trade #3 and 5 for #1. Given the state of that franchise, getting the excitement of a #1 overall pick for their fans may well be more important to them than getting 3 and 5. Maybe the Pens could get more than just those two picks, even?

That said, teams use journalists to spread misinformation all the time, so take it with a grain of salt, anyway.

Like I said, I'm not in love with the idea - I certainly wouldn't complain if the Pens won the lottery and just took Lafreniere! But it's an interesting idea to contemplate. The Pens are one of the few teams that could afford to pass on Lafreniere in order get a wider boost. Especially with the flat cap - imagine being able to replace 3 spots in the roster with ELCs next year because they can put, say, Byfield, Drysdale and Poulin in the lineup. If the Pens feel POJ is ready, you could even have a third pairing of POJ and Drysdale, in that scenario, and still be able to protect them. The potential to do something like that is why this intrigues me. Maybe only do it if you can feel out the other teams in the top 5 picks to figure out who they want to pick?

Still, Lafreniere - Crosby - Guenztel on line one with Zucker - Malkin - Rust on line 2 does seem difficult to pass up....

Lol, not for me! Sid, here are your two stars. Geno, here's the scraps!

 

[Scandale du Jour]

I'd trade pick #1 for picks #3 and #5 if Ottawa also took JJ's contract.

Get Stutzle and Drysdale and move both McCann and Murray for actual value, instead of sinking the value of one to move JJ.

Why would Ottawa do that?

If I had 3 and 5, I would not trade for 1. If I had 1, I would not trade for 3 and 5.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Is Lafreniere really that good defensively to garner a Hossa comparison? Because if he is, that's a big f***ing deal.

 

[Andy99]

Except Kapanen, and Gustavsson, and Hallander, and Bjorkqvist. So, discounting Sprong as neither, that's 40% of our 10 top 100 picks. That's pretty much average considering 42% of players in the last two drafts are European. If you're considering only Kapanen as not low down the draft, then we've only had two picks not low down the draft, so it's 50%! Give over here Andy. This team drafts a bunch of Europeans. We don't look much at Russia, but the rest of Europe is scouted well.

It's a bit early to be judging Rutherford's drafts but I think it can be done for 2014 and 15. 14, Kapanen's become a full time NHLer and it looks like Lafferty will join him. 15, Simon's a full time NHLer (or at least for a few seasons) and Sprong kept his value long enough to get Pettersson. Angello is still in play as a potential NHLer too, and I guess maybe Pavlychev too. I dunno what else you're expecting from 9 picks, only 2 in the top 100, but that's pretty solid. 16 and 17 aren't looking like much, but who knows - 18 and 19 are so far tracking well. If you still think they've been crap then you do you, but we do not shy away from Europeans - we do not shy away from skill - and we don't fixate on skating projects. Those are pretty much facts.

I’m not impressed with the players we’ve drafted...hopefully Poulin, Legare and Addison become very good NHL players, but of the ones we know, only Kapanen turned out well...I mean Simon, Angello, Lafferty are basically replacement level and haven’t helped us do anything the last three years, compared to Guentzel, Rust, and others drafted by earlier regimes. Blueger made it in like 6 years out of his own hard work and has limitations...no one he drafted yet has been worth keeping...hopefully that changes but I still feel skeptical of him as a drafter

 

[Rakell67]

The only way you move the #1 is if you can guarantee you'll get Byfield and Drysdale at #3 and #5. If that's not the case, keep Lafreniere.

Hell, even if you could land those two, I'd be really, really hesitant to deal the #1 and Lafreniere. But those two are the only way I'd even consider it. Any other combination of two guys and it's a flat-out no.

What about this:

To OTT: #1, Murray, Johnson
To PIT: #3, #5, #49, Tkachuk

To LAK: #3, #49, McCann
To PIT: #2

Pens net Byfield, Drysdale and Tkachuk + Johnson cap dump for Lafreniere, Murray and McCann.

 

[EVGENIMERLIN]

I absolutely LOVE Drysdale. Would love getting him. Byfield, meh.

I do not know enough about Stutzle to comment.

Lafrenière is Hossa 2.0, I want him with Sid or Geno.

I can see the argument of trading to restock, but I agree he could end being the best winger they've ever had in the Sid Geno era and he slots in right away making our top 6 absolutely filthy.

If we don't land the first pick I would love to trade up to get Drysdale or Sanderson

 

[Scandale du Jour]

Is Lafreniere really that good defensively to garner a Hossa comparison? Because if he is, that's a big f***ing deal.

Day one, no.

Down the line, yes.

He has the hockey IQ to do so.

Smooth powerful skater. Uber smart. Good stickhandler. Great playmaker. Good scorer. Uses angles VERY well. Uses his teammates VERY well. Does not try "junior stuff". Very good positioning.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Why would Ottawa do that?

If I had 3 and 5, I would not trade for 1. If I had 1, I would not trade for 3 and 5.

Dorion has basically indicated that he's ready to trade picks #3 and #5 for pick #1, though. It's not a stretch to imagine that he's desperate enough to also be willing to take JJ on top of that.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

Dorion has basically indicated that he's ready to trade picks #3 and #5 for pick #1, though. It's not a stretch to imagine that he's desperate enough to also be willing to take JJ on top of that.

IMO, it is a pretty dumb trade for both teams.

Ottawa needs help everywhere. They already have an elite LW in Tkachuk. Drysdale and Byfield/Stutzle would had to their young core.

For us, Lafrenière entends our window and make sure we have 4 VERY good top 6 wingers.

Both teams would be better off staying put, IMO.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

Why would Ottawa do that?

If I had 3 and 5, I would not trade for 1. If I had 1, I would not trade for 3 and 5.

1 Lafreniere is cheaper than 2 players if everyone pans out.


They’d get Lafreniere and the excitement of a 1OA to attract fans.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

1 Lafreniere is cheaper than 2 players if everyone pans out.


They’d get Lafreniere and the excitement of a 1OA to attract fans.

Sure, who is their franchise center? They do not have one.

If they won the lottery. Sure, pick Lafrenière. But why sacrifice 2 top 5 picks when you are rebuilding? The money argument is not a good one... especially not when you guys think they also would take JJ's contract.

 

[The Old Master]

Why would Ottawa do that?

If I had 3 and 5, I would not trade for 1. If I had 1, I would not trade for 3 and 5.

the sen's have a lot of picks and young talent. what they don't have is a super star. they are in a good place to make that trade. and laf is the best player.

 

[EVGENIMERLIN]

Day one, no.

Down the line, yes.

He has the hockey IQ to do so.

Smooth powerful skater. Uber smart. Good stickhandler. Great playmaker. Good scorer. Uses angles VERY well. Uses his teammates VERY well. Does not try "junior stuff". Very good positioning.

Yeah his hockey IQ seems a little underrated around here and that is what makes me think he could be the best winger we have had. You pair him with Sid and you have two lethal play makers who can score. A guy like Zucker who is fast and has decent hands would have so many tap in goals like he did in game 2 cause opposing teams wouldn't be able to keep up with Sid and Lafraniere skating circles in the Ozone.

Then you'd have Jake/Geno/Rust which was only one of the best lines in hockey for a couple of months before Jake got hurt...

 

[Scandale du Jour]

the sen's have a lot of picks and young talent. what they don't have is a super star. they are in a good place to make that trade.

Why do WE make it then?

 

[Scandale du Jour]

Yeah his hockey IQ seems a little underrated around here and that is what makes me think he could be the best winger we have had. You pair him with Sid and you have two lethal play makers who can score. A guy like Zucker who is fast and has decent hands would have so many tap in goals like he did in game 2 cause opposing teams wouldn't be able to keep up with Sid and Lafraniere skating circles in the Ozone.

Then you'd have Jake/Geno/Rust which was only one of the best lines in hockey for a couple of months before Jake got hurt...

Exactly! That's why you do not trade that pick.

Drafting Lafrenière gives you two lines that could be the best line in the NHL.

 

[The Old Master]

Why do WE make it then?

see all my above posts

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Part of me is entirely sold on Lafreniere if we get the #1 pick. A kid like that is not something you can pass up without risking ~20 years of franchise altering regret.

Part of me realizes that successful teams are built from strength down the middle and on the blueline. If we could turn Lafreniere into a stud C prospect and stud D prospect, that's the only way I'd really listen. Likely still wouldn't deal the #1 pick, but I'd at least think about it.

What about this:

To OTT: #1, Murray, Johnson
To PIT: #3, #5, #49, Tkachuk

To LAK: #3, #49, McCann
To PIT: #2

Pens net Byfield, Drysdale and Tkachuk + Johnson cap dump for Lafreniere, Murray and McCann.

That's pretty nuts, so if you could pull that off, sure. It's difficult to pass on Lafreniere, but again, C + D is how long-lasting championship teams are built, and you're getting a damn good, young LW in Tkachuk in the process. Dumping JJ is just icing on the cake.