Post-Game Talk: #65| Blues at FLYERS | Thu., Mar. 5, 2015

[OzFlyers]

This team has some good "bones". Too bad so much cap space is wasted in the press box!

 

[kelmitchell]

LOL at this guy saying OV is worth 7+ though. If you think Ovechkin is a better player than Giroux you're ****ing lost my friend

He may not be a better all around player but you don't get a constant 40+ goal scorer for any less than that

 

[kelmitchell]

But still I don't want to just miss the playoffs and get a mediocre selection, we have to first round picks why not just say **** it and finish top 10, yes I know it's not what everyone wants but it's what we should do just for this year, next year we won't have a drastic overhaul of this teams ****** defense so what does it matter, I'd love to go provonov (however you spell it) he's got #1 potential while being ranked at #10, everyone wants this process sped up but can't take 1 bad season even if it is on purpose?

 

[Mkoll]

So then there is nothing to lose then . Why not have a go at it and let the chips fall where they fall . Personally i enjoy playoff hockey much more if the Flyers are in it .

I am not advocating tanking, I still want the Flyers to win. But, sometimes fans need to be pragmatic. The reality is, as much as it may pain some of us to admit it to ourselves, the Flyers probably wont go very far in this season's playoffs.

Fans are in it for the long haul, if it means grabbing better talent now that could help the team win and actually go to the Cup in the future. And all it would take is to suffer the indignity of defeat temporarily. I am willing to swallow my pride and deal with that.

So, it's not exactly true that there is nothing to lose... there is something to lose. A better draft position, and a better future.

 

[kelmitchell]

I am not advocating tanking, I still want the Flyers to win. But, sometimes fans need to be pragmatic. The reality is, as much as it may pain some of us to admit it to ourselves, the Flyers probably wont go very far in this season's playoffs.

Fans are in it for the long haul, if it means grabbing better talent now that could help the team win and actually go to the Cup in the future. And all it would take is to suffer the indignity of defeat temporarily. I am willing to swallow my pride and deal with that.

So, it's not exactly true that there is nothing to lose... there is something to lose. A better draft position, and a better future.

Exactly what I was saying, thank you!!!

 

[Jtown]

-14 goal differential. just embarassing.

 

[Curufinwe]

It's about what you'd expect for a team tied for 21st place in the league. The teams they are tied with, Dallas and Colarado, have almost the same differential.

 

[Jtown]

It's about what you'd expect for a team tied for 21st place in the league. The teams they are tied with, Dallas and Colarado, have almost the same differential.

-14 and right in the middle of a playof race is what is embarasssing.

 

[Curufinwe]

Florida are one spot ahead of us in Points% but have a -26 differential.

 

[Jtown]

Florida are one spot ahead of us in Points% but have a -26 differential.

that too is embarassing.

 

[MiamiScreamingEagles]

Florida are one spot ahead of us in Points% but have a -26 differential.

Take a look at the (shootout, overtime) S/O column. Panthers lead the League with 16.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/standings.htm?season=20142015&sort=shootoutRecord&type=LEA

 

[flyershockey]

At this point, they're not close to a top five pick anymore, so I'm pulling for the playoffs. I say that with full knowledge that it's a shortsighted view of things.

 

[CSKA1974]

This team has some good "bones". Too bad so much cap space is wasted in the press box!

Don't forget an intellect wasted behind the bench- shame we can't send him to the press box...or Siberia.

 

[Garbage Goal]

Were heading for a top 8 pick or so. Making the playoffs makes it 14th (I think?) at best by default.

Last time Florida made the playoffs it was for the same reason. OT/SO points and an embarrassing differential.

 

[TheSpectrum]

One of the better games I have seen Read play in quite a while. His patience play on the Simmonds goal showed great awareness. I rip him a lot but you have to give credit when it is due.

MDZ, I just don't know what to think of him. He love his ability to move up on the play you can tell it really catches the opposition off-guard a lot of times. But he is average at best in his own end.

It's going to be interesting to see what price tag Hextall puts on that type of defenseman.

 

[Sombastate]

I think signing MDZ is a necessity

 

[AndHeMissedTheNet]

One of the better games I have seen Read play in quite a while. His patience play on the Simmonds goal showed great awareness. I rip him a lot but you have to give credit when it is due.

MDZ, I just don't know what to think of him. He love his ability to move up on the play you can tell it really catches the opposition off-guard a lot of times. But he is average at best in his own end.

It's going to be interesting to see what price tag Hextall puts on that type of defenseman.

So are most of our defensemen. And MDZ can actually contribute offensively.

He's only 24. He's got plenty of time to grow. People are still forcing the whole "give him more time" thing with Luke Schenn, why not MDZ as well?

Anyway, great game. The next game against Boston will make or break the season. No pressure.

 

[bb12]

One of the better games I have seen Read play in quite a while. His patience play on the Simmonds goal showed great awareness. I rip him a lot but you have to give credit when it is due.

MDZ, I just don't know what to think of him. He love his ability to move up on the play you can tell it really catches the opposition off-guard a lot of times. But he is average at best in his own end.

It's going to be interesting to see what price tag Hextall puts on that type of defenseman.

The thing with offensive minded D is they arent always great in their zone because that isnt their strength. They are good enough but what carries them to the NHL level is their offensive awareness and ability to join the play and catch teams off guard. That is their value. Of course some are great in both ends but thats the beauty D pairings. You cant put a MDZ and Karlson together they'd be -30, MDZ has the talent to be in a top 4 on a lot of teams as long as he is paired with the right guy.

 

[TheSpectrum]

The thing with offensive minded D is they arent always great in their zone because that isnt their strength. They are good enough but what carries them to the NHL level is their offensive awareness and ability to join the play and catch teams off guard. That is their value. Of course some are great in both ends but thats the beauty D pairings. You cant put a MDZ and Karlson together they'd be -30, MDZ has the talent to be in a top 4 on a lot of teams as long as he is paired with the right guy.

Yea I get all that so if you are planning to bring him back you can't have him skating out there with Schenn or Grossmann. I know they are technically stay at home d-men but between their slow skates, sloppiness on the puck and MDZ's frenetic pace up and down the ice it turns into a complete ish show.

 

[StandingCow]

I am not advocating tanking, I still want the Flyers to win. But, sometimes fans need to be pragmatic. The reality is, as much as it may pain some of us to admit it to ourselves, the Flyers probably wont go very far in this season's playoffs.

Fans are in it for the long haul, if it means grabbing better talent now that could help the team win and actually go to the Cup in the future. And all it would take is to suffer the indignity of defeat temporarily. I am willing to swallow my pride and deal with that.

So, it's not exactly true that there is nothing to lose... there is something to lose. A better draft position, and a better future.

Exactly my feeling, making the playoffs would hurt us in the long term, making the playoffs and getting knocked out in the 1st or 2nd round does nothing to help the team in the long run.

 

[TheLegendkiller]

Exactly my feeling, making the playoffs would hurt us in the long term, making the playoffs and getting knocked out in the 1st or 2nd round does nothing to help the team in the long run.

We have 2 first round picks...its fine. Not only that, I bet you the 2nd first round pick becomes the better player. For an organization that drafts well in the late first round, NOT picking in the top 10 isn't an issue. Its not. They're not getting in the top 3 or 5 so it doesn't matter really 8-20 or whatever.

 

[Curufinwe]

We also have six tough road games coming up this month, and the Oilers. I'll worry that we're gonna make the playoffs if they win more than one or two of them.

3/7/15 at Bruins
3/8/15 at Devils
3/12/15 at Blues
3/15/15 at Senators
3/17/15 at Canucks
3/19/15 at Flames
3/21/15 at Oilers

 

[TheKingPin]

I'm in bed heading to sleep and on my phone so I'm not really going to address this further, but I quite literally never used the term top three pick. I never even used a specific number.

I also quite literally never said anything contrary to the team not being in our control. I actually already referenced that. Obviously if we had control of the team the frustration wouldn't be with the team but with ourselves.

I definitely don't need to take any step in any direction either. Aside from you stuffing words everywhere that I never even said, I accepted what this team is about twenty to thirty games ago. Only thing that annoys me is the holier then thou attitude some people have about making the playoffs.

Your description of what Giroux should make is also still absurdly silly. "About 7 mil" includes numbers above 7 mil. And if Giroux makes 7 mil exactly is that fair while if he made 7.1 mil is that undeserved? Because that's the level of deflection and nitpicking you're making.

According to you only four players in the entire league deserve over 7 mil. The highest cap hits in the league are 11.5 and neither of them belong to any of those four players. There's also a hell of a lot more then four players making over 7 mil currently. Even just looking at Giroux he's been at the top of league scoring for several years now and with a sub-par team mostly. He had a Hart nomination last season. His playoff PPG is silly high. I can't check the numbers now and I honestly don't care to talk about this anymore, but I'm also relatively confidant Giroux has outscored at least half of those four players at different points throughout the last few seasons. He's also been a leader in knocking out Crosby/Malking out of the playoffs (both of them, together) before. Ovechkin barely has any playoff credibility to his team in recent seasons. SRamkos isn't terribly far ahead in that regard. Malkin/Crosby play on the same freaking team and are known as a joke of a choking team that's regressing lately and nobody takes seriously as a Cup threat anymore. That's the four players you describe as "you can only hope to contain".

Your description of those four players and of who deserves over 7 mil is not only factually incongruent with the reality of the contracts out there but illogical and absurd.

Lol take it easy.

I was simply trying to get you to understand my perspective. Getting into debates with fellow fans of my team is not why I got on this board.

All i will say is if being an optimist in philadelphia is described as "holier then thou" that is really sad. I know we have sub 5% chance of making it. You are only going to be cheerful IF in 5 years we have a stacked team? I prefer to get behind this team, which is trending in the right direction, and root for the playoffs. I personally wanted Timo, Coburn, and Grossmann all traded for picks, wanting more for the future. But the playoffs are what makes me happy, why I spend my money on the team in whatever capacity. If you'd rather tank then this team is not for you. Don't know what else to say regarding that.

IMO G is worth right at 7 mill. Thats about 10% of the expected cap NEXT year. Not even when he signed it. IMO the guys that I noted to be the top players in the league all have unique skills and/or pedigrees. G has not won anything, disappears for long stretches of games and in seasons. Yea he may get a lot of PP points and points off the rush but those things are easily defended against once teams have games plans, hence his drop off every so often. I am not saying that drop off is unacceptable to G. I think its pretty fitting with his player type. I am saying that a 8.5 million dollar player doent get that luxury.

The pens have not won in awhile because of Fluery, not malkin/crosby. OV is one of the top scoring threats in the league. Stamkos the same. These player require double coverage or shadowing by specialists like couts. And even still they get chances. Thats what makes they elite IMO and "deserving" of making that high percentage of their teams cap. You but double coverage on G, or an elite guy like Bergeron on him, he's completely shut down. Again not saying he is not a great player and again this is all my opinion that I am trying to clarify for you. Not really trying to persuade anyone to be honest.

 

[hatcher]

Lol take it easy.

I was simply trying to get you to understand my perspective. Getting into debates with fellow fans of my team is not why I got on this board.

All i will say is if being an optimist in philadelphia is described as "holier then thou" that is really sad. I know we have sub 5% chance of making it. You are only going to be cheerful IF in 5 years we have a stacked team? I prefer to get behind this team, which is trending in the right direction, and root for the playoffs. I personally wanted Timo, Coburn, and Grossmann all traded for picks, wanting more for the future. But the playoffs are what makes me happy, why I spend my money on the team in whatever capacity. If you'd rather tank then this team is not for you. Don't know what else to say regarding that.

IMO G is worth right at 7 mill. Thats about 10% of the expected cap NEXT year. Not even when he signed it. IMO the guys that I noted to be the top players in the league all have unique skills and/or pedigrees. G has not won anything, disappears for long stretches of games and in seasons. Yea he may get a lot of PP points and points off the rush but those things are easily defended against once teams have games plans, hence his drop off every so often. I am not saying that drop off is unacceptable to G. I think its pretty fitting with his player type. I am saying that a 8.5 million dollar player doent get that luxury.

The pens have not won in awhile because of Fluery, not malkin/crosby. OV is one of the top scoring threats in the league. Stamkos the same. These player require double coverage or shadowing by specialists like couts. And even still they get chances. Thats what makes they elite IMO and "deserving" of making that high percentage of their teams cap. You but double coverage on G, or an elite guy like Bergeron on him, he's completely shut down. Again not saying he is not a great player and again this is all my opinion that I am trying to clarify for you. Not really trying to persuade anyone to be honest.

This is right on. I like that G plays both ends of the ice but it is killing his offence away worse than others. Can't remember the last awesome play he has made to his wingers 5 on 5. 7mil is right on but should have been no higher. Every player on every winning team plays D first but some are better then others.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

Take a look at the (shootout, overtime) S/O column. Panthers lead the League with 16.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/standings.htm?season=20142015&sort=shootoutRecord&type=LEA

20 times the Flyers have got the game past regulation this season.
21 times the Panthers have got the game past regulation this season.

The NHL really needs to stop rewarding teams for winning after regulation. because just about every team now including the Flyers are looking to get the game to OT if the score is tied in the 3rd period. I have never liked rewarding teams for losing.
Of course I am old school and never did have a problem with ties.