Post-Game Talk: #65| Blues at FLYERS | Thu., Mar. 5, 2015

[Embiid]

20 times the Flyers have got the game past regulation this season.
21 times the Panthers have got the game past regulation this season.

The NHL really needs to stop rewarding teams for winning in regulation. because just about every team now including the Flyers are looking to get the game to OT if the score is tied in the 3rd period. I have never liked rewarding teams for losing.
Of course I am old school and never did have a problem with ties.

Wasn't it the late Roger Nielson that argued that teams who lose in OT should get a point or was it Hitchcock (I think the latter)? I just remember one of the Flyers coaches made a pitch to the league for the current system. Can't recall how influential they were but I just remember one of our previous coaches making the argument and it picked up from there and was eventually instituted.....

I rather go back to ties as well...I'm old school too

 

[flyershockey]

These player require double coverage or shadowing by specialists like couts. And even still they get chances. Thats what makes they elite IMO and "deserving" of making that high percentage of their teams cap. You but double coverage on G, or an elite guy like Bergeron on him, he's completely shut down. Again not saying he is not a great player and again this is all my opinion that I am trying to clarify for you. Not really trying to persuade anyone to be honest.

That's absolute horse ****. You know what guys like Malkin, Crosby, Stamkos and Ovechkin all have? Competent defenses that can move the puck adequately to the forwards. Without that, you're not doing anything at ES.

Also, every team in the league knows to just double team Giroux because no one else (outside of Voracek) is a consistent threat to beat them. Not Raffl. Not Schenn. Not Simmonds. But it never fails that Giroux's wingers usually end up with 2 or 3 chances a game where they're wide open because everyone is so worried about where Giroux is. It would also help if our defensemen could contribute at even an average level (outside of MDZ) in the offensive zone. Teams don't even bother defending our points anymore because our defensemen can't find the net even when wide open (by NHL standards).

Those three things combined are what's keeping Giroux down at ES.

 

[Hiesenberg]

Should be a 3 pt system

Win in Reg - 3
Loss in Reg - 0
Win in OT - 2
Lose in OT - 1


I'm shocked that this system has been in place this long. Its an unfair system, A game needs to be weighed the same every time out and as soon as a game goes to OT, its a 3 pt game, its actually UNFAIR to a team that wins in regulation.

 

[Curufinwe]

And Giroux is still outscoring Ovechkin (and everyone else) this decade.

http://www.quanthockey.com/nhl/seasons/2010s-nhl-players-stats.html

 

[flyershockey]

Wasn't it the late Roger Nielson that argued that teams who lose in OT should get a point or was it Hitchcock (I think the latter)? I just remember one of the Flyers coaches made a pitch to the league for the current system. Can't recall how influential they were but I just remember one of our previous coaches making the argument and it picked up from there and was eventually instituted.....

I rather go back to ties as well...I'm old school too

I'd rather go back to ties as well. It's annoying watching teams flat-out not even try to play aggressive in a tied game because of the mentality that "one is better than none". If they're not going to bring back ties, then they should at least create a 3 point system.

 

[CanadianFlyer88]

The league will likely never change the current point distribution system. It keeps teams closer to a playoff spot later into the season, which keeps fans in the seats.

In a true 3 point system, fans of teams in the bottom third of the standings would stop going to games after Christmas.

Better to just accept it as part of the game now.

 

[Curufinwe]

It doesn't look that different. Calgary are the only team to really be affected.

http://hockeystandings.info/?page=threepoints

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

Wasn't it the late Roger Nielson that argued that teams who lose in OT should get a point or was it Hitchcock (I think the latter)? I just remember one of the Flyers coaches made a pitch to the league for the current system. Can't recall how influential they were but I just remember one of our previous coaches making the argument and it picked up from there and was eventually instituted.....

I rather go back to ties as well...I'm old school too

I don't remember. Had to edit my post again. but I think you got what I was trying to say. I have never been a fan of the current system. Wasn't that long ago that fans of the Flyers were *****ing that teams with loser points behind us were staying in contention. now we are near the top of the league in loser points.

The league will likely never change the current point distribution system. It keeps teams closer to a playoff spot later into the season, which keeps fans in the seats.

In a true 3 point system, fans of teams in the bottom third of the standings would stop going to games after Christmas.

Better to just accept it as part of the game now.

I know the league will never change but that doesn't change the fact it is a flawed system. Maybe 3 points for a regulation win isn't the answer. But increasing the OT period to 7 or 10 minutes and giving a team zero points for losing before the SO would work.
The AHL does 4 minutes of 4 on 4 and 3 minutes of 3 on 3. Guess what the amount of games decided in a SO are way down. you still get loser points for losing in the OT though. Never bought into the game is better with the SO logic. It really isn't.

 

[deadhead]

How can you be unhappy when we've rebuilt the prospect pool and have 7 picks in the first 101 this summer and are still in playoff contention? Losing might move our first and fourth round picks up 5 slots or so (Holmgren already traded the 2nd and 3rd rd picks) - is that really worth it? At least they're worth watching the rest of the way. Wait until camp to get excited about Morin, Sanheim, Ghost, Hagg and AK.

The team is playing better because players are playing better - Read is finally healthy, White adds a winger with speed, Raffl is back, MDZ woke up (he was benched because he was playing brain dead), VV discovered you can use a stick for more than slashing, etc. Biggest problem is that V and G went on vacation a couple months early, Berube split them up because they spent a month figure skating together.

Berube is such an awful coach he's kept this team in contention despite Mason missing a month and having to play Emery and Zepp in goal. I'm sure his horrid coaching is the reason G & V took February off. And it made it much easier for him to coach without Timonen and Coburn playing like he wanted a new address (or Adderal) - which is why trading them had no impact, nothin' from nothin' is nothin'.

I'm happy to see them still competitive despite having to carry a bunch of dead weight in Umberger and Vinnie, as well as marginal talents we hope are replaced the next couple years. Complete rebuilds are tough, look at Edmonton, while patch jobs, well, we know what that gets you. Hextall just might end up with the best of all worlds, a competitive team with lots of young talent in the pipeline as he clears out the deadwood.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Berube hasn't kept this team in contention, this team has stayed in contention despite his failings.

 

[Embiid]

As much as Berube gets a lot of criticism..both warranted and unwarranted..the team does seem to want to play for him for the most part. No indication he has a fractured room or anything except a few fractured egos when he benches players like Vinny. Anyway..not saying I'm a huge fan or that he is some genius...clearly he is not but seems the fans hate him more than the actual players.

 

[SgtJoseph*]

How can you be unhappy when we've rebuilt the prospect pool and have 7 picks in the first 101 this summer and are still in playoff contention? Losing might move our first and fourth round picks up 5 slots or so (Holmgren already traded the 2nd and 3rd rd picks) - is that really worth it? At least they're worth watching the rest of the way. Wait until camp to get excited about Morin, Sanheim, Ghost, Hagg and AK.

The team is playing better because players are playing better - Read is finally healthy, White adds a winger with speed, Raffl is back, MDZ woke up (he was benched because he was playing brain dead), VV discovered you can use a stick for more than slashing, etc. Biggest problem is that V and G went on vacation a couple months early, Berube split them up because they spent a month figure skating together.

Berube is such an awful coach he's kept this team in contention despite Mason missing a month and having to play Emery and Zepp in goal. I'm sure his horrid coaching is the reason G & V took February off. And it made it much easier for him to coach without Timonen and Coburn playing like he wanted a new address (or Adderal) - which is why trading them had no impact, nothin' from nothin' is nothin'.

I'm happy to see them still competitive despite having to carry a bunch of dead weight in Umberger and Vinnie, as well as marginal talents we hope are replaced the next couple years. Complete rebuilds are tough, look at Edmonton, while patch jobs, well, we know what that gets you. Hextall just might end up with the best of all worlds, a competitive team with lots of young talent in the pipeline as he clears out the deadwood.

How dare you bring a level headed well thought out and very accurate opinion to this board !

 

[Striiker]

Wow.

You have to be a special type of clueless to actually believe Berube has "kept them in contention".

Then look at who's agreeing with you... that really says it all.

It's truly insane that there are still people who think Berube is anything other than detrimental to this team. Must not pay much attention during games. The few things he actually has control over are consistently hurting the teams chances and the only reason they're winning is because of the individual skill of a few players carrying the weak links and idiotic coach. Giroux's overall game, Voracek's offensive skill, Simmonds goal scoring, Couturiers defense, some timely offensive from Streit and MDZ, and Masons goaltending are why they're winning games, not Craig ****ing Berube.

 

[GKJ]

This coach is so great, that's why they're always ready to come out with fire and not lose games to teams they shouldn't, like Buffalo, Calgary, Carolina, and Toronto. So much so that scratching Del Zotto in December was completely justified.

 

[Embiid]

I personally want another coach...I just wonder how much the players do? I see all the criticisms fans bring up as well...I'm just baffled that the team hasn't quit on him. Yeah they have been mediocre and inconsistent but I don't see much to suggest the players don't buy into him...yet. That is my point in all of this...

 

[Striiker]

That makes no sense.

What do you expect? The players to just stop playing? Go on strike?

They want to be in the playoffs so obviously they're going to keep playing with 100% effort like they have all year.

 

[Lindberg]

This coach is so great, that's why they're always ready to come out with fire and not lose games to teams they shouldn't, like Buffalo, Calgary, Carolina, and Toronto. So much so that scratching Del Zotto in December was completely justified.

A lot of that is on the players also. I don't understand why that is a hard concept to grasp.

 

[Embiid]

That makes no sense.

What do you expect? The players to just stop playing? Go on strike?

They want to be in the playoffs so obviously they're going to keep playing with 100% effort like they have all year.

Right..because they haven't done that before....just quit on their coach to the point that they look like a complete mess on the ice. I have not seen that with this team necessarily...they have been pretty structured in their play despite a clown posse on D. They are just absolutely boring but that is bc they have to play within their limitations. This is something plenty of people were irked about with Lavi when he tried to force his style despite no longer having the players which was Holmgren's fault as much as it was Lavi's stubborn head. Takes two hands to clap. Having said all this...I'm not saying I'm a fan of Berube at all but I don't totally buy into the argument he is coaching in some vacuum..that makes little sense to me.