Post-Game Talk: #54| STL 2 at PHI 0| Mon., Feb 6, 2017 | Konecny injury update: out 4-to-6 weeks, LBI

[Lindberg]

I don't think it's ridiculous at all to note:

Last season Hakstol made the playoffs, Julien did not, even though most would agree Hakstol had the weaker roster.

This season Hakstol's team is slightly above Julien's team in the standings and point%, even though most would agree Hakstol has at least a slightly weaker roster.

Since Hakstol took over, Hakstol is 67-48-21 (.570) vs. Julien's 68-54-15 (.551) even though most would agree Hakstol has had at least slightly weaker roster.

There's just no evidence that the Flyers would have a better record with Julien. Hakstol has achieved better results with less.

Ghost was playing phenomenal last year and with the passing of Ed Snider this team was determined as all hell to make the playoffs. I bet every member of this club had a fire lit under their ass to make sure they did not disappoint. There comes a point to where I personally believe at the NHL level your passion/desire to win over rules skill in rare cases.

You're using an extremely small sample size to prove a point and besides that isn't even that many points in the end. That is a four point difference over that many games played. I can't really speak for Boston since I don't ever watch them play but this team is just bad.

 

[renberg]

this team is just bad.

Sums things up to a tee. Hakstol is a hockey coach not a magician. There is no magic wand that he can pull out to hit VdV, PEB, MDZ, etc with which will turn them into better hockey players. These stiffs are playing because there is no one in the system that can take their jobs. The Flyers are one of the few teams that are having no problem covering their better players for the ED. That says a lot about how bad they are.
I'd like to believe that Morin, Sanheim and Hagg are better players right now than MDZ, Streit and Schultz but TPTB who know more about hockey than we do feel differently. The same goes with other positions on the team. Laughton and Leier theoretically should be able to fill in and take jobs away from guys that are here but they haven't as of yet.
We have to be patient and understand how bad the talent pipeline was until Hextall became GM. Two years from now, it will be a different story. If Hakstol doesn't have the team in the POs at that time, then he should be canned. However its unfair to judge him with the mutts that he has at this time.

 

[WIP CALLER]

yes, let's wait so that Hakstols ineptness hurts the team when they are talented and ready to compete. let's blow a season where we could be competing to show the coach doesn't belong when he's proven it plenty over 2 years.

 

[GKJ]

great coaches usually come with great goaltenders.
Does Julien get that Cup with Tim Thomas having a historically great season.
I am not trying to diminish the job he did in Boston, but the guy was fortunate to have some really good goaltenders on his clubs. Thomas and now Rask who is starting to wear down because they had to play him every night.

Julien would've been fired if they lost to the Habs that year. Game 7 went into OT.

 

[Curufinwe]

Julien's goalies:

07-08: Thomas - 57 GP, .921; Auld - 23 GP, .919
08-09: Thomas - 54 GP, .933; Fernandez - 28 GP, .910
09-10: Rask - 45 GP, .931; Thomas - 43 GP, .915
10-11: Thomas - 57 GP, .938; Rask - 29 GP, .918
11-12: Thomas - 59 GP, .920; Rask - 23 GP, .929
12-13: Rask - 36 GP, .929; Khudobin - 14 GP, .920
13-14: Rask - 58 GP, .930; Johnson - 27 GP, .925
14-15: Rask - 70 GP. 922; Svedberg - 18 GP, .918
15-16: Rask - 64 GP, .915; Gustavsson - 24 GP, .908
16-17: Rask - 44 GP, .911; Khudobin - 8 GP, .885

 

[CSKA1974]

Boston has been better at 5v5 than us (not by much but still) and is the BEST possesion team in the league.

The only reason we are ahead in Points Percentage is because of our Powerplay being better..

They also have a banged up Bergeron clearly not at his best.

And its absolutely relevant that Julien has been there for 10 seasons and should be a factor in comparing Bostons performance to ours this season. Even Scotty Bowman changed teams multiple times. Its the nature of sports.

Julien >>> Hak

Reminds me of recent Popular Vote Debate.

 

[WIP CALLER]

what the hell does the goalie stat prove other than its clear that when their new management got rid of several talented defenders and replaced them with lesser players, that their goaltenders sv pct dropped? using that to argue Juliens success is only due to good goaltending is just a completely idiotic argument.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

Julien would've been fired if they lost to the Habs that year. Game 7 went into OT.

yup. and also when they had to rally from 4-1 down to beat Toronto in round 1 in game 7 at home. they lose that game he gets fired as well.

 

[deadhead]

What is shows is Julien has had above average to excellent goalie play his entire tenure - makes coaching a lot easier.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

what the hell does the goalie stat prove other than its clear that when their new management got rid of several talented defenders and replaced them with lesser players, that their goaltenders sv pct dropped? using that to argue Juliens success is only due to good goaltending is just a completely idiotic argument.

stats aside it is kind of true. you look around the league to all the what is considered best coaches and they all pretty much have really good to great goaltenders.
Do you think AV for example survives NY if he had a goalie that was giving him .900 goaltending like we are getting? (not trying to compare Hakstol to AV).
it is a results driven league. if you are getting bad goaltending you are probably on the hotseat undeserved or not and vice versa.

 

[WIP CALLER]

yup and if richards doesnt KO kreijci in 2010, and if rask doesn't allow 2 goals in the last minute of the Stanley cup, we are talking about the Boston dynasty led by Julien.

 

[WIP CALLER]

yeah the fact he had one of the best defenses in the league had nothing to do with those goaltending stats. nope.

 

[Curufinwe]

Talented defenders don't affect goalie performance that neatly. St Louis have the type of defense we dream of, and have two goalies with awful save percentages. Buffalo have a crap defense, but two goalies with good save percentages.

Buffalo
Lehner .923, Nilsson. 922

Ristolainen, McCabe, Franson, Gorges, Kulikov, Bogosian

St Louis
Allen .900, Hutton .902

Pietrangleo, Bouwmeester, Parayko, Shattenkirk, Edmundson, Gunarsson

 

[Flyotes]

Jester used to argue that point constantly (and I agreed).

 

[Rebels57]

stats aside it is kind of true. you look around the league to all the what is considered best coaches and they all pretty much have really good to great goaltenders.
Do you think AV for example survives NY if he had a goalie that was giving him .900 goaltending like we are getting? (not trying to compare Hakstol to AV).
it is a results driven league. if you are getting bad goaltending you are probably on the hotseat undeserved or not and vice versa.

Hank is only at .910 this season, which is below league average, and he is still 24-13-1

Save Percentage is a team stat to an extent, just like GAA.

When a team sucks, the save percentage of its goalies can suffer.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

yup and if richards doesnt KO kreijci in 2010, and if rask doesn't allow 2 goals in the last minute of the Stanley cup, we are talking about the Boston dynasty led by Julien.

yup and the Flyers didn't have AHL goaltending in 2010 the Cup drought would be 7 instead of 40 plus and Lavy is probably still here.

 

[Rebels57]

yup and the Flyers didn't have AHL goaltending in 2010 the Cup drought would be 7 instead of 40 plus and Lavy is probably still here.

Why'd you have to go and remind us?

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

Hank is only at .910 this season, which is below league average, and he is still 24-13-1

Save Percentage is a team stat to an extent, just like GAA.

When a team sucks, the save percentage of its goalies can suffer.

if this team had better scoring depth and had more than 3 at best defenseman you can trust every night Haksol probably isnt getting the venom is he getting from Flyer fans.
the Rangers have more scoring depth than the Flyers do and they are getting a career year out of Grabner. AV has his faults too, he falls in love with certain types of players over kids.
I know 90 percent of the fanbase hates Hakstol but I think I would like to see what he could do with a roster that was as solid as the Rangers that didn't have some of the plugs he plays too much.
Am I saying Hakstol is equal to AV? no, but Hakstol has had a flawed roster ever since he got here. AV has been able to fall back on one of the best goaltenders on the planet when things aren't going right for the Rangers.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

Why'd you have to go and remind us?

sorry. it is very painful for me to write that out, never mind read it.

 

[Curufinwe]

The defense on the Flyers was no better than it is now in 14-15 when Mason was a .928 goalie.

Streit, Schultz, MDZ, Grossmann, MacDonald, Schenn

 

[Rebels57]

if this team had better scoring depth and had more than 3 at best defenseman you can trust every night Haksol probably isnt getting the venom is he getting from Flyer fans.
the Rangers have more scoring depth than the Flyers do and they are getting a career year out of Grabner. AV has his faults too, he falls in love with certain types of players over kids.
I know 90 percent of the fanbase hates Hakstol but I think I would like to see what he could do with a roster that was as solid as the Rangers that didn't have some of the plugs he plays too much.
Am I saying Hakstol is equal to AV? no, but Hakstol has had a flawed roster ever since he got here. AV has been able to fall back on one of the best goaltenders on the planet when things aren't going right for the Rangers.

I can't deny that we have had a very flawed roster in Haks tenure so far. But I also can't deny that he has made it harder on himself through his decisions and doesn't seem to have buy-in from the team with his system right now.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

I can't deny that we have had a very flawed roster in Haks tenure so far. But I also can't deny that he has made it harder on himself through his decisions and doesn't seem to have buy-in from the team with his system right now.

I cant argue against that point at all. some of his decision making has been questionable.
No matter where we go beyond this year with a head coach I feel they need to find a guy and stick with him. I don't think it does anyone any good to fire a coach every 2 years.