Prospect Info: 2023 draft opinions

[Al Lagoon]

So, years past, the draftees would generate pages of discussion.

This year's crop not so much apart from Stramel and Heidt.

I graded this draft a C+/B-: Potential, and need met.

What do you all think?

Click to read more...

 

[TaLoN]

I think most of it was covered in the draft thread and in the Stramel thread to be honest.

 

[Wabit]

I had it at a C+, but I think I'm going to bump it down to a straight C due to the Poink pick. It was only a 5th round pick, but it's still another LD from the 2021 (eligible) draft class.

 

[Saga of the Elk]

Hard to get too excited when it really looks like the GM picked "his guy," with a big reach against consensus. Didn't work out with Filip Johansson either.

Wisconsin is my alma mater so I hope Stramel takes a leap forward and proves people wrong.

For years, the Wild have been known as a dull, defense-first team whose franchise emblem, Mikko Koivu, was known as a middling offensive performer and arguably elite shutdown guy. Now the team has Joel Eriksson-Ek, a middling offensive performer and arguably elite shutdown guy. Maybe they drafted another one in Stramel. But seems like a missed opportunity to draft an arguably elite guy that can score goals and produce offense.

Early days but elite players win championships and drafting for positional need is foolish, especially in the first round of a quality draft class.

 

[HotDish]

I tend not to be critical of players picked 20th and after. The first pick may have been a reach but if you swapped Heidt with him it wouldn't cause anyone to bat an eye so in the end I don't think it matters.

 

[57special]

Picking Heidt more or less erased my concerns with picking Stramel. I get picking a big, sturdy guy with wheels who plays C reasonably well. Also understand that many pre draft age players don't show much in the B10, and that there are reasons(losing father, bad coach)to think he might rebound in the future. Our top C prospect, Rossi, has struggled with the size and strength of pro hockey, and Marat also looks to be a small man.
Heidt, while not big, is significantly bigger than Rossi, and is known to have a feisty game to go along with his skill. I've heard mixed things about his skating, but at worst he still seems to be a better skater than Rossi also, and seems to have great passing ability.

I know nothing about Kumpu except that he is big. I guess we could've picked Sawchyn(some similarities to Heidt), or gone for a wing in Lardis, or moved up to pick a Nelson or Molgaard, but I am not going to second guess them.

Basically, i was very glad that they picked 3 C's with their first three picks. The later picks... hard to say much of anything about them. We're talking about 5th and later rounders, here. Seem to be good skaters, with the possible exception of Clark. I noticed that Jake Fisher(big C) from CDH didn't get drafted... I would've preferred him to Clark, but it's not a biggie. The odds are very small that any of those guys will play any NHL games.

You can argue that Stramel is their boom/bust pick. Usually that term is associated with skilled players with flaws, but I think the label fits him, also. He has shown skill and productivity in the past, and his flaws have the potential to be overcome, as it appears they might be due to external factors.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Fine concept, questionable execution. A lot riding on Stramel's season this year.

 

[BagHead]

Hard to get too excited when it really looks like the GM picked "his guy," with a big reach against consensus. Didn't work out with Filip Johansson either.

Wisconsin is my alma mater so I hope Stramel takes a leap forward and proves people wrong.

For years, the Wild have been known as a dull, defense-first team whose franchise emblem, Mikko Koivu, was known as a middling offensive performer and arguably elite shutdown guy. Now the team has Joel Eriksson-Ek, a middling offensive performer and arguably elite shutdown guy. Maybe they drafted another one in Stramel. But seems like a missed opportunity to draft an arguably elite guy that can score goals and produce offense.

Early days but elite players win championships and drafting for positional need is foolish, especially in the first round of a quality draft class.

I agree about drafting for position, but playing devil's advocate for a second, wouldn't the only time you can draft for position successfully be in a deep draft? The argument goes that in most drafts the talent falls off too early, and you'd end up with a player who may not even make the NHL by reaching for position, but in a draft that's exceptionally deep, even drafting for position at the expense of high-reward skill, you'll likely get good pro players.

 

[Saga of the Elk]

I agree about drafting for position, but playing devil's advocate for a second, wouldn't the only time you can draft for position successfully be in a deep draft? The argument goes that in most drafts the talent falls off too early, and you'd end up with a player who may not even make the NHL by reaching for position, but in a draft that's exceptionally deep, even drafting for position at the expense of high-reward skill, you'll likely get good pro players.

I think you always have to bet on skill. A guy like Oliver Moore, for example, might end up as an Andrew Cogliano or Darren Helm-type player -- limited upside but can be a positive player due to his elite speed. Stramel might be a larger version of Freddie Gaudreau if he can't figure out how to play in all three zones and make plays with the puck. I see what you mean, and obviously scouting is inexact at best, but even with the weakness of the center prospects, elite skill is and will always be an NHL team's greatest need and should always be the priority.

 

[Digitalbooya]

I tend not to be critical of players picked 20th and after. The first pick may have been a reach but if you swapped Heidt with him it wouldn't cause anyone to bat an eye so in the end I don't think it matters.

Heidt is a worse player than Stramel when you look at the opinion analysts that actually matter.

 

[57special]

Heidt is a worse player than Stramel when you look at the opinion analysts that actually matter.

That's just flat out wrong. Bob Mackenzie, for one, ranked Heidt above Stramel, as did many others. If you think that BM "doesn't matter", then you are in opposition to just about everyone in hockey circles over the past few decades.

 

[Digitalbooya]

That's just flat out wrong. Bob Mackenzie, for one, ranked Heidt above Stramel, as did many others. If you think that BM "doesn't matter", then you are in opposition to just about everyone in hockey circles over the past few decades.

Bob is 1/3 of the opinions that matter to me and he barely had Heidt above Stramel (32 v 34). The other two, Pronman and Wheeler, had Stramel above Heidt by a good margin.

Bob also said this in the article of his final draft rankings:

centre Riley Heidt claimed the final spot, with a range between 20 on the high end and 60 on the low side.

Show me where he says Stramel goes as low as 60.

 

[MuckOG]

I don't care about immediate reactions of drafts. The only opinions that matter are those that are given 3-4 years after the draft.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I don't care about immediate reactions of drafts. The only opinions that matter are those that are given 3-4 years after the draft.

Boldy is good.

 

[AKL]

Boldy is good.

He's still young and hopefully growing, ask me again in 3-4 more years

 

[TaLoN]

He's still young and hopefully growing, ask me again in 3-4 more years

Too early to judge a career and really know, wait another 8 years after that.

 

[AKL]

Too early to judge a career and really know, wait another 8 years after that.

Yeah good point. I'm just about ready to have an opinion on Sidney Crosby.

 

[BagHead]

It's a fair criticism you guys are giving to Muck, but he's also completely right. Everything this early is complete speculation, and isn't really worth most people's time. If you enjoy the waste of time, that's cool. I enjoy video games, and they're a complete waste of time, too.

 

[AKL]

It's a fair criticism you guys are giving to Muck, but he's also completely right. Everything this early is complete speculation, and isn't really worth most people's time. If you enjoy the waste of time, that's cool. I enjoy video games, and they're a complete waste of time, too.

I'm not trying to criticize him I was just joking around mostly.

I'm fine with people not having opinions on this if they don't want to put themselves out there like that. When I have an opinion on something like this, it's an opinion based on what I know at the time. It's subject to change and my original opinion may end up wrong, but it doesn't mean I can't have one.

The idea that it's too early to have an opinion is weird. I think that's being conflated with it being too early to know exactly how things are going to end up.

 

[Minnewildsota]

I'm not trying to criticize him I was just joking around mostly.

I'm fine with people not having opinions on this if they don't want to put themselves out there like that. When I have an opinion on something like this, it's an opinion based on what I know at the time. It's subject to change and my original opinion may end up wrong, but it doesn't mean I can't have one.

The idea that it's too early to have an opinion is weird. I think that's being conflated with it being too early to know exactly how things are going to end up.

I don’t think it’s too early to have an opinion. I just think weird to say the draft was “good” or “bad”.

I think it’s perfectly fine to say, “I didn’t like the pick” or something along those lines but again it being good or bad is subjective.

I don’t like mushrooms, so I would say they are bad. Others may like them, so they say they are good. It’s all a matter of preference.

Proof that a pick is good or bad won’t come until many years later (most likely). Then you try into that grey area of when it’s opinion versus fact.

Looking back at B.Pouliot picked at #4, one would/could say that was a bad pick. If he were picked in the 7th round, one would/could say it was a good pick.

TLDR: people saying “I would have preferred..” or “I think x would have been a better pick” is fine in my book (not that I’m the police). Saying a pick was bad is premature because we don’t know yet.

 

[MNRube]

I think it’s ridiculous to suggest we would get a 1C at #21. That happens about once a decade. By the time Stramel is ready, the team will likely be completely different. Hell, if Rossi is ready this fall, we will all be clamoring for another RHD or a RHS W instead of a scoring C

 

[Saga of the Elk]

Saying good/bad might be silly, sure. I look at it from a fantasy perspective. Every year when we do our draft, there's a run on goalies. That led me, last year, to draft Thatcher Demko with an early pick. Is he a good goalie? Sure. Is it a position of need? Sure. But who ended up being the most valuable goalie on my fantasy team, and one of the best in the league? Gustavsson, picked up as an early free agent.

Stramel might end up being the steal of the draft. The GM has information the public doesn't. The pick is criticized because the consensus had Stramel with less draft value, the GM and Head Scout basically admitted they liked his size more than his overall game, and it was a "position of need."

A bottle of liquid has enhanced value for a man in the desert; that doesn't mean you give away the farm for a bottle of warm piss when you could wait an hour for a cold beer.

 

[Minnewildsota]

Saying good/bad might be silly, sure. I look at it from a fantasy perspective. Every year when we do our draft, there's a run on goalies. That led me, last year, to draft Thatcher Demko with an early pick. Is he a good goalie? Sure. Is it a position of need? Sure. But who ended up being the most valuable goalie on my fantasy team, and one of the best in the league? Gustavsson, picked up as an early free agent.

Stramel might end up being the steal of the draft. The GM has information the public doesn't. The pick is criticized because the consensus had Stramel with less draft value, the GM and Head Scout basically admitted they liked his size more than his overall game, and it was a "position of need."

A bottle of liquid has enhanced value for a man in the desert; that doesn't mean you give away the farm for a bottle of warm piss when you could wait an hour for a cold beer.

Depending on the beer, I would argue they are the same thing

In seriousness, I understand and support your point.

 

[TaLoN]

I'm not trying to criticize him I was just joking around mostly.

This stuff is serious, this is no joking matter!

I just think weird to say the draft was “good” or “bad”.

It's a prediction of it being good or bad. Predictions are either right or wrong.

 

[BagHead]

Depending on the beer, I would argue they are the same thing

In seriousness, I understand and support your point.

Beer snobs unite!

This stuff is serious, this is no joking matter!


It's a prediction of it being good or bad. Predictions are either right or wrong.

Hockey's not a game, the Minnesota Wild are my identity!