GDT: 2022 NHL Draft Lottery - Devils win 2nd overall pick!

[Captain3rdLine]

Not sure how much emphasis will be placed in these kids WC but it will be very interesting to see how they do ( Slaf Kiricek Nemec ) Is Cooley playing in the WC ? I have zero interest in him but some say (jackasses) that he might be a possibility for us at #2 ( please lord no. I cant see it happening )

Yes I’m really excited and gonna watch as much as I can. I’ll post a breakdown of when everyone is playing later.

 

[StevenToddIves]

Not sure how much emphasis will be placed in these kids WC but it will be very interesting to see how they do ( Slaf Kiricek Nemec ) Is Cooley playing in the WC ? I have zero interest in him but some say (jackasses) that he might be a possibility for us at #2 ( please lord no. I cant see it happening )

Logan Cooley is a phenomenal hockey talent, so it's important not to take too much stock in what is said by people who haven't followed the prospects at all until the Devils won the #2 pick in the lottery.

When you combine the rankings, the Devils team needs, the Devils recent draft strategies, the words of Tom Fitzgerald and just logic in general... well, there's no chance the Devils are taking him at #2 overall.

 

[Team Concept]

McKenzie has Slafkovsky at #2 and Kemell at #5.

Kemell played top 6 all year and on the 1PP. Slafkovsky didn't get out of the bottom 6 or get PP time until post-Olympics.

The same reasons being argued not to draft Slafkovsky high are the same arguments which were used against his closest NHL comparable Mikko Rantanen.

Simon Nemec is 6'1-195. I think he was 5'9 4 years ago.

Lastly, debating drafting on the basis of stats without watching the players is a very tough sell, because there are a ton of knowledgable people on the Devils draft boards.

I disagree. Production matters. For example, why did we draft Zacha back in 2015 when he wasn't even averaging a point per game in the OHL?

And its not just his production last season with TPS. You compare him with Kakko and Rantanen and his production does match those two in WJC-20, U20 SM-liiga, or the World Championships.

 

[Dialamo]

Well what a wonderful surprise to find out we moved up YET AGAIN. It's justice for what happened to our goaltending this season!

 

[Devs3cups]

I disagree. Production matters. For example, why did we draft Zacha back in 2015 when he wasn't even averaging a point per game in the OHL?

And its not just his production last season with TPS. You compare him with Kakko and Rantanen and his production does match those two in WJC-20, U20 SM-liiga, or the World Championships.

Production does matter. Context matters also. After being placed in a role that fits him (top-6, PP), Slafkovsky got 6 points (4G 1A) in 10 regular season games. That’s a 36 point pace in the role where he should’ve been. He also had good good playoffs and great Olympic games as a 17 year old. Asking him to produce in a bottom-4 role as a 17 year old in a men’s league is a pipe dream. He did well when put in a role where he could truly use his abilities.

 

[Hisch13r]

Production does matter. Context matters also. After being placed in a role that fits him (top-6, PP), Slafkovsky got 6 points (4G 1A) in 10 regular season games. That’s a 36 point pace in the role where he should’ve been. He also had good good playoffs and great Olympic games as a 17 year old. Asking him to produce in a bottom-4 role as a 17 year old in a men’s league is a pipe dream. He did well when put in a role where he could truly use his abilities.

I mean he still averaged 14 minutes on the season on the whole. It's not like the guy was buried with 8-9 minutes a game.

 

[Devs3cups]

I mean he still averaged 14 minutes on the season on the whole. It's not like the guy was buried with 8-9 minutes a game.

He was still put with bottom-6 talent. The roles aren’t similar at all, neither is the linemate talent level.

 

[Hisch13r]

He was still put with bottom-6 talent. The roles aren’t similar at all, neither is the linemate talent level.

How do we square the D-1 U20 production? 0.81 PPG compared to say Kemell's (who I don't take over Slaf but still) 0.95, Rantanen's 1.06, Aho's 1.34, Hintz's 1.36, Kakko's 1.45, Puljujarvi's 1.65 (same that Slaf had in his U20 games this year). This is a guy who is ROUTINELY not as productive as you'd want for a 2nd overall pick. But hey he shot 29% (with 0 assists) in a 7 game sample against mediocre competition YIPEE

 

[Devs3cups]

How do we square the D-1 U20 production? 0.81 PPG compared to say Kemell's (who I don't take over Slaf but still) 0.95, Rantanen's 1.06, Aho's 1.34, Hintz's 1.36, Kakko's 1.45, Puljujarvi's 1.65 (same that Slaf had in his U20 games this year). This is a guy who is ROUTINELY not as productive as you'd want for a 2nd overall pick. But hey he shot 29% (with 0 assists) in a 7 game sample against mediocre competition YIPEE

I mean his production at lower levels is a fair point, but it doesn’t disprove my point that he’s produced real nicely at the Liiga level when put in a position to use his abilities to their full potential. If we’re going with S% though, he barely shot over 5% this year. That probably shows a bit on bad luck. Should probably have a few more goals.

Anyways, I don’t really have a dog in this fight lol, I know your guy is Jiricek, I’d be just as happy with Jiricek. I’m high on him also.

 

[Hisch13r]

I mean his production at lower levels is a fair point, but it doesn’t disprove my point that he’s produced real nicely at the Liiga level when put in a position to use his abilities to their full potential. If we’re going with S% though, he barely shot over 5% this year. That probably shows a bit on bad luck. Should probably have a few more goals.

Anyways, I don’t really have a dog in this fight lol, I know your guy is Jiricek, I’d be just as happy with Jiricek. I’m high on him also.

My guy is Jiricek but I could still accept Nemec or Cooley decently. I just don't want Slaf.

 

[Devs3cups]

My guy is Jiricek but I could still accept Nemec or Cooley decently. I just don't want Slaf.

That’s fine, as I said I’m really high on Jiricek also. Not so much on Cooley who I feel is very redundant to what we have.

Also, just wanted to point out (for anyone interested) that his total U-20 production really isn’t bad. 31 games, 14 goals, 20 assists. 1.1 PPG. Also, his U-20 draft year production is better than Aho’s was. That’s the only one I checked since I’m on my phone lol, apologies for that.

 

[Hisch13r]

That’s fine, as I said I’m really high on Jiricek also. Not so much on Cooley who I feel is very redundant to what we have.

Also, just wanted to point out (for anyone interested) that his total U-20 production really isn’t bad. 31 games, 14 goals, 20 assists. 1.1 PPG. Also, his U-20 draft year production is better than Aho’s was. That’s the only one I checked since I’m on my phone lol, apologies for that.

1.1 total for the Finish junior league really isn't special. I mean a guy like Salminen had a 0.86 in his D-1 and Slaf had a 0.81. A 1.53 in his DY and Slaf with a 1.64 in his DY. I'm obviously not saying Salminen=Slaf but I also just don't see what's so special to justify a 2nd overall pick besides big boi

 

[njdevils1982]

oh man ......once the lotto machine is filled and starts that ping pong ball guy's suit gets more and more f***ed up......who in the f*** is his tailor? that guy should be fired

bargain bin look thats forsure

 

[Triumph]

I mean his production at lower levels is a fair point, but it doesn’t disprove my point that he’s produced real nicely at the Liiga level when put in a position to use his abilities to their full potential. If we’re going with S% though, he barely shot over 5% this year. That probably shows a bit on bad luck. Should probably have a few more goals.

Anyways, I don’t really have a dog in this fight lol, I know your guy is Jiricek, I’d be just as happy with Jiricek. I’m high on him also.

This is going to come up a ton so I will just keep mentioning it over and over - the shooting percentages in SM-Liiga are uniformly low and the shot rates uniformly high. The second leading scorer had a shooting percentage of 9.8%. And this is something I have noticed over the years in that league. I think SM-Liiga counts missed shots as well as shots on goal as part of shots. To that extent, Slafkovsky's S% is still low but not inordinately so.

 

[Eggtimer]

My guy is Jiricek but I could still accept Nemec or Cooley decently. I just don't want Slaf.

Understandable. It’s very important to hit with this pick and having the #2 pick, we want to are sure we get the best player we can for the team. “Power forward“ prospects have always scared me . More often that not it seems like they don‘t reach their potential. However I don‘t know enough when evaluating talent to see how or if Slafkovsky differs from previous power forward prospects that have bust or not reached potential. If he ends up like a Rantanen … I’ll be pissed we missed out on him . If he ends up like Kassian … I will probably say to myself “I knew it ! Should have taken Jiricek !

 

[Hisch13r]

Understandable. It’s very important to hit with this pick and having the #2 pick, we want to are sure we get the best player we can for the team. “Power forward“ prospects have always scared me . More often that not it seems like they don‘t reach their potential. However I don‘t know enough when evaluating talent to see how or if Slafkovsky differs from previous power forward prospects.

I wonder if the draft was after FA and we signed Nuke if people would still be clamoring for Slaf or if they'd see Cooley as the forward to go after. Obviously it's not that way and we don't know if we'd be able to sign Nuke come draft time but I think a lot of people would be singing a different tune and would see Cooley as the better forward

 

[Captain3rdLine]

I wonder if the draft was after FA and we signed Nuke if people would still be clamoring for Slaf or if they'd see Cooley as the forward to go after. Obviously it's not that way and we don't know if we'd be able to sign Nuke come draft time but I think a lot of people would be singing a different tune and would see Cooley as the better forward

Not me. Slafkovsky is the way to go. Not even sure who Cooley is. Never heard of him. Sounds like the kind of guy you’re looking for in the 7th.

 

[Eggtimer]

I wonder if the draft was after FA and we signed Nuke if people would still be clamoring for Slaf or if they'd see Cooley as the forward to go after. Obviously it's not that way and we don't know if we'd be able to sign Nuke come draft time but I think a lot of people would be singing a different tune and would see Cooley as the better forward

Meh. My take is we need more than just one of that type of player. It’s not like having too many is a detriment like having a small D man that is a PP specialist. That is somethippng you want to limit how many of that specific type player you have. However , a big power forward that’s skilled plus hard to play against ? The more the better!!! I’d rather have a forward group of all Nichushkin ’ than all Tatars.

Speaking of Nichushkin . Is it safe to say that Slafkovsky’s floor is what Nuke is now? Im scared Slafkovsky’s ceiling is that and he ends up having a very similar career path as Nuke. Yes Nuke is “good” now but he isn’t elite and it took him years get to “good” . He was mediocre for his first few years in the league and even when he first came back from the KHL.

 

[Hisch13r]

Meh. My take is we need more than just one of that type of player. It’s not like having too many is a detriment like having a small D man that is a PP specialist. That is somethippng you want to limit how many of that specific type player you have. However , a big power forward that’s skilled plus hard to play against ? The more the better!!! I’d rather have a forward group of all Nischushkins’ than all Tatars.

I too would rather have a forward group of the best two way playdrivers in the league over a guy past his prime.

 

[Eggtimer]

I too would rather have a forward group of the best two way playdrivers in the league over a guy past his prime.

I know ,examples are poor but couldn’t think of fair ones of what I am trying to say. I’d prefer a full lineup of power forwards that have say 40 point potemtial a year than a full group of 50 point potential one dimensional soft players.

 

[Hisch13r]

I know ,examples are poor but couldn’t think of fair ones of what I am trying to say. I’d prefer a full lineup of power forwards that have say 40 point potemtial a year than a full group of 50 point potential one dimensional soft players.

If those power forwards are good defensively then sure because it doesn’t necessarily mean they will be. Grit and physicality often get conflated with defense but just because you’re big physical gritty guy it doesn’t mean you can play defense.

Montreal Tatar was also better than a 50 pt soft one dimensional player. Guy was an elite two way play driver who was a top 20 5v5 producer

 

[Eggtimer]

If those power forwards are good defensively then sure because it doesn’t necessarily mean they will be. Grit and physicality often get conflated with defense but just because you’re big physical gritty guy it doesn’t mean you can play defense.

Montreal Tatar was also better than a 50 pt soft one dimensional player. Guy was an elite two way play driver who was a top 20 5v5 producer

Still. Big bodied guys that are average at defence is > soft small guy that is average at defence.

If those power forwards are good defensively then sure because it doesn’t necessarily mean they will be. Grit and physicality often get conflated with defense but just because you’re big physical gritty guy it doesn’t mean you can play defense.

Montreal Tatar was also better than a 50 pt soft one dimensional player. Guy was an elite two way play driver who was a top 20 5v5 producer

With all due respect and not to sound like an ass but Devils Tatar is crap and don’t care what he did before. He has shown me too many times that he can’t take a hit to make a play / shies away from contact too often .

 

[Hisch13r]

Still. Big bodied guys that are average at defence is > soft small guy that is average at defence.


With all due respect and not to sound like an ass but Devils Tatar is crap and don’t care what he did before. He has shown me too many times that he can’t take a hit to make a play / shies away from contact too often .

If 2 players are the same defensively the better offensive player is better regardless of size.

 

[Devs3cups]

This is going to come up a ton so I will just keep mentioning it over and over - the shooting percentages in SM-Liiga are uniformly low and the shot rates uniformly high. The second leading scorer had a shooting percentage of 9.8%. And this is something I have noticed over the years in that league. I think SM-Liiga counts missed shots as well as shots on goal as part of shots. To that extent, Slafkovsky's S% is still low but not inordinately so.

Interesting! Did not know that they counted shot attempts, that would in fact affect S% a lot. Thanks for the clarification!

 

[Hisch13r]

Interesting! Did not know that they counted shot attempts, that would in fact affect S% a lot. Thanks for the clarification!

According to this video his ixG was 7 and he scored 5 so slightly lower but nothing huge. Also 45% on puck battles. Expected that to be higher