NHL 2021-2022 NHL Out of Town Thread IV - Eichel traded to Vegas

[BruinDust]

How does an entire defense let a guy just cruise on by.... and twice already this season

Yes McDavid is crazy good, but the defense is also less than stellar.

He's got NHL D-men literally afraid to attack him with the puck and they just keep backing in giving him more and more space. No NHL forward has ever back off D-men like this guy. You attack him, he burns you. You sit back and let him come to you, he takes the time and space and still burns you.

 

[Aussie Bruin]

Given the shit that Canes management and ownership pulls to draw attention to themselves, I really do think the move was purely trolling. As absurd as that is considering this is a real business with millions at stake.

It got tons of attention and was funny for awhile, so I think it accomplished the short term goal. But when it comes down to purely business, throwing away draft picks and 6 million dollars for what is and was a player that has proven next to nothing in this league…it was really unlikely it wouldn’t go south IMO.

Agreed. A good ploy and PR stunt, but then what? Around $5 mil flushed down the drain if you consider what a 4C normally costs. Plus I suspect the only reason Kotkaniemi's even making the team when a guy like Stepan could probably do a better job is because of the bad optics if they scratched him. Of course a team can still win a Cup with money left on the table, but it becomes that much harder.

The Canes are a bit odd - they're building a solid roster and they have a really serious, quality coach in Brind'Amour, but their management still seem obsessed with making media waves and giving their fans a sugar-rush of things to keep them entertained and filling seats. And I'm really not sure it's necessary, especially in the NC market - just put together a good team that plays good hockey and the rest will take care of itself.

 

[Blowfish]

Leafs winning is horrible here in Niagara.

 

[AngryMilkcrates]

Unless you make a rule specifically for water.

Quite frankly Wally, I know how capitalism works and “business”. Again, what would be the problem in setting a rule for water and water only? Because it’s you know…water. That’s the question I’m looking to have answered.

Because it's business and the dollar rules. If you made a rule about price-fixing water they would just add something to the water to not make it officially water. Then sell it for $10.
They do this in China, Russia, heck the Sahara. Businessmen will find a way to get an edge, always. The only thing we can do is educate ourselves to not be suckered and boycott bad behavior by simply NOT buying.

IE: BUY LOCAL HONEY
Anything on the shelf that says 100% honey is not 100% honey. The FDA cannot determine if a batch of 100% honey is actually what it says it is without expensive testing. So they just cut corners on regulating it. A not-so-recent article on this says that as much as 3/4 of the honey on your shelves is not 100% honey. In fact, manufacturers can fool simple tests by just adding a minimal amount of 100% honey to a larger mixture of Corn Syrup/Beet Sugar/etc. and get away with it. A local honey manufacturer here in Del Rio, TN. Has been caught backing up tanker trucks of corn syrup to its processing facility and STILL selling their bottles labeled 100% Mountain Honey.
Honey is very good for you IF it is local. The local flora is what affects your body, so you need honey made from that local flora. Buying honey from Pennsylvania when you live in California wont help you. Buying honey that is superheated in manufacturing processes kills most of what's good about honey, it won't help you. Your only source for honey should be your local farmers market where you can buy from a TRUSTED source so you know your getting 100% local honey.

Businesses serve their board of directors and have a bottom line to make a profit. They will cut corners, fudge records, and straight out lie to do this. Until human nature changes, our way of doing business will not. We can regulate them with all the bureaucracy we can muster, but there will always be loopholes and lobbies to create them that allow for profits to be poured through.

YES, we should have checks and balances. But that will only be able to do so much.

The best course for any consumer is to vote with their wallet.

 

[SPLBRUIN]

Leafs winning is horrible here in Niagara.

The Leafs season will be defined by the playoffs, their serious fans know this and don't get carried away with regular season success. Most of the noise you are hearing from the Leafs fan base is coming from a slew of 12-15 year olds.

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

Because it's business and the dollar rules. If you made a rule about price-fixing water they would just add something to the water to not make it officially water. Then sell it for $10.
They do this in China, Russia, heck the Sahara. Businessmen will find a way to get an edge, always. The only thing we can do is educate ourselves to not be suckered and boycott bad behavior by simply NOT buying.

IE: BUY LOCAL HONEY
Anything on the shelf that says 100% honey is not 100% honey. The FDA cannot determine if a batch of 100% honey is actually what it says it is without expensive testing. So they just cut corners on regulating it. A not-so-recent article on this says that as much as 3/4 of the honey on your shelves is not 100% honey. In fact, manufacturers can fool simple tests by just adding a minimal amount of 100% honey to a larger mixture of Corn Syrup/Beet Sugar/etc. and get away with it. A local honey manufacturer here in Del Rio, TN. Has been caught backing up tanker trucks of corn syrup to its processing facility and STILL selling their bottles labeled 100% Mountain Honey.
Honey is very good for you IF it is local. The local flora is what affects your body, so you need honey made from that local flora. Buying honey from Pennsylvania when you live in California wont help you. Buying honey that is superheated in manufacturing processes kills most of what's good about honey, it won't help you. Your only source for honey should be your local farmers market where you can buy from a TRUSTED source so you know your getting 100% local honey.

Businesses serve their board of directors and have a bottom line to make a profit. They will cut corners, fudge records, and straight out lie to do this. Until human nature changes, our way of doing business will not. We can regulate them with all the bureaucracy we can muster, but there will always be loopholes and lobbies to create them that allow for profits to be poured through.

YES, we should have checks and balances. But that will only be able to do so much.

The best course for any consumer is to vote with their wallet.

Interesting points though I still think I rest my point on your second to last sentence. Though I also agree entirely with your final sentence.

Just out of curiosity, what exactly is it that goes on in Russia and China? What do they add to the water? Do they just forgo selling water entirely?

 

[AngryMilkcrates]

Interesting points though I still think I rest my point on your second to last sentence. Though I also agree entirely with your final sentence.

Just out of curiosity, what exactly is it that goes on in Russia and China? What do they add to the water? Do they just forgo selling water entirely?

The Russia/China/Sahara reference was to the larger issues of financial gain by deception, not to water specifically. While I could find cases of water being overly monetized in these three area's I just don't have the time to link articles this morning. My point was more to the general idea of people will cut corners to make a profit and when they do and succeed at that it bolsters them to keep doing it. In some cultures, it is actually recommended that you deceive your customers, encouraged, and praised. It is hailed as a sort of "wisdom" that overcomes your customers "wisdom" to produce profit.
Greed is a helluva addictive poison.

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

The Russia/China/Sahara reference was to the larger issues of financial gain by deception, not to water specifically. While I could find cases of water being overly monetized in these three area's I just don't have the time to link articles this morning. My point was more to the general idea of people will cut corners to make a profit and when they do and succeed at that it bolsters them to keep doing it. In some cultures, it is actually recommended that you deceive your customers, encouraged, and praised. It is hailed as a sort of "wisdom" that overcomes your customers "wisdom" to produce profit.
Greed is a helluva addictive poison.

I guess I find it hard to get on board with your argument when you can’t point to something specifically to do with water.

It’s not like another good or commodity because it’s water. I feel like a lot of the pushback to what I’m saying is intentionally clouding the fact that I’m not just talking about some random commodity or good. I’m talking about the most vital source of life we have yet to discover. I understand it’s a business and I understand the goal of profit. Capitalism, like democracy, is the worst system outside of all of the other systems.

But after all of this back and forth, I still have not been swayed on my original argument that a margin limit on bottled water...that the vendors buys as water from the bottling company...would be appropriate.

If we want to talk loose examples, I guess I can bring in my Woodstock example (either 94 or 99). People weren’t allowed to bring in their own water and were bound by paying exorbitantly high prices for bottled water. Many people suffered heatstroke and a few days. Now obviously this over the course of at least a day Outside, if not multiple, but it still shows the danger of people voluntarily entering a place without reasonable access to water and bad things happening.

I just don’t see the issue because it’s water and water only. I understand we have a particular way of doing things here, but I can’t understand how a concept like this is such a sticking point beyond introducing the “slippery slope” fallacy.

 

[AngryMilkcrates]

I guess I find it hard to get on board with your argument when you can’t point to something specifically to do with water.

It’s not like another good or commodity because it’s water. I feel like a lot of the pushback to what I’m saying is intentionally clouding the fact that I’m not just talking about some random commodity or good. I’m talking about the most vital source of life we have yet to discover. I understand it’s a business and I understand the goal of profit. Capitalism, like democracy, is the worst system outside of all of the other systems.

But after all of this back and forth, I still have not been swayed on my original argument that a margin limit on bottled water...that the vendors buys as water from the bottling company...would be appropriate.

If we want to talk loose examples, I guess I can bring in my Woodstock example (either 94 or 99). People weren’t allowed to bring in their own water and were bound by paying exorbitantly high prices for bottled water. Many people suffered heatstroke and a few days. Now obviously this over the course of at least a day Outside, if not multiple, but it still shows the danger of people voluntarily entering a place without reasonable access to water and bad things happening.

I just don’t see the issue because it’s water and water only. I understand we have a particular way of doing things here, but I can’t understand how a concept like this is such a sticking point beyond introducing the “slippery slope” fallacy.

I think you are missing my point that the goods in question are regardless. As long as people have greed in their hearts they will find ways to exploit others for their own gain. You can try to stem the tide, but it's like building a seawall, you will prevent the large waves but it won't protect against everything. There are no easy solutions. The tribes of the middle east have fought over wells for millennia. Murder, overcharging, and water theft have been non-stop. Still happens today. Compare the cost of bottles of water you buy in the store to the production cost of those bottles and the water purification process. The profit margin is massive and it will continue to be as long as people pay for it.
Making clean water a "right" and free to all peoples does not work either. In asian countries corners for water purification are cut so bad in order to either make budget goals or to skim off the top for upper level managers personal profit. People get tainted water that causes health problems because of this. Same problem in Russia under communism.

Socialism is a high ideal that has never worked in practice. Why? Not enough bureaucracy? Insufficient systems in place?
No, because people in charge AND at ALL levels in the hierarchy abuse the trust and responsibility given them for their own gain.
The ROOT of the issue is people themselves internally. Until that is fixed any system in place to counterbalance bad decisions will just at its best tread water so to speak.

As for your water margin suggestion. Easily bypassed. The margin of profit would be directly related to the need of water. Arguments can be made that clean drinking water is rare on this planet and getting rarer each year(research supports this). So they can hike water prices up as they like due to the rarity OR create a rarity in the system so they can then hike water prices. They do it with oil all the time.

Now to your specific example of Woodstock. Sadly, that's not uncommon. To ME that is not a problem with water, it's a problem with concessions companies that are allowed to restrict what people can bring to a venue to destroy competition. If your food and drink are so expensive and bland that people will bring a PB&J from home then you are a poor businessperson and need to change your strategy. Not be allowed to eliminate competition so people are forced to buy your products.

Besides, are there not public water fountains required in any place large people congregate? I thought that was a building requirement.

Edit: We are getting WAY of track off this threads theme and treading into political and social commentary.

 

[Agent86]

Leafs winning is horrible here in Niagara.

No, it's horrible everywhere.

 

[The National]

No, it's horrible everywhere.

Makes the first round collapse even sweeter.

 

[The National]

Poor guy, late healthy scratch for tonight’s game playing in his home town.

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

I think you are missing my point that the goods in question are regardless. As long as people have greed in their hearts they will find ways to exploit others for their own gain. You can try to stem the tide, but it's like building a seawall, you will prevent the large waves but it won't protect against everything. There are no easy solutions. The tribes of the middle east have fought over wells for millennia. Murder, overcharging, and water theft have been non-stop. Still happens today. Compare the cost of bottles of water you buy in the store to the production cost of those bottles and the water purification process. The profit margin is massive and it will continue to be as long as people pay for it.
Making clean water a "right" and free to all peoples does not work either. In asian countries corners for water purification are cut so bad in order to either make budget goals or to skim off the top for upper level managers personal profit. People get tainted water that causes health problems because of this. Same problem in Russia under communism.

Socialism is a high ideal that has never worked in practice. Why? Not enough bureaucracy? Insufficient systems in place?
No, because people in charge AND at ALL levels in the hierarchy abuse the trust and responsibility given them for their own gain.
The ROOT of the issue is people themselves internally. Until that is fixed any system in place to counterbalance bad decisions will just at its best tread water so to speak.

As for your water margin suggestion. Easily bypassed. The margin of profit would be directly related to the need of water. Arguments can be made that clean drinking water is rare on this planet and getting rarer each year(research supports this). So they can hike water prices up as they like due to the rarity OR create a rarity in the system so they can then hike water prices. They do it with oil all the time.

Now to your specific example of Woodstock. Sadly, that's not uncommon. To ME that is not a problem with water, it's a problem with concessions companies that are allowed to restrict what people can bring to a venue to destroy competition. If your food and drink are so expensive and bland that people will bring a PB&J from home then you are a poor businessperson and need to change your strategy. Not be allowed to eliminate competition so people are forced to buy your products.

Besides, are there not public water fountains required in any place large people congregate? I thought that was a building requirement.

Edit: We are getting WAY of track off this threads theme and treading into political and social commentary.

Im not missing your greater point at all. Actually, I’m agreeing with much of it.

And you’re right, it is getting off topic and political because, I’ve got to say, the pushback to what I’m saying has relied almost entirely on straw man arguments and generalities on economic systems.

We can end it here, but I’m talking about bottled water. A product which will continue to be produced regardless of what rules are leveled on venue owners. These long, rambling diatribes about capitalism and rules and how wars are fought over resources and so on and so forth. None of it directly addresses the issue I speak of. Which is a retailer/vendor selling the water. If it shifted demand in any way and changed the manufacturer’s price, then the vendor would just shift their price/margin based on that. You’d find a new price equilibrium. This country pays off farmers for excess agricultural yields for the sole purpose of keeping them solvent because the market price would leave most out of business. But how dare we interfere with the market, right?

At this point, I accept that we just disagree.

If a developed nation in the modern world couldn’t uphold a rule on bottled water, and deal with any cheats to the system, we may as well abolish government period (I know some people get a pants tent over such a statement). And that’s essentially the argument that you are trying to make. To me, it’s nonsense. And with that, I’m finished talking about it.

If you have any desire to continue talking about economics in general, shoot me a PM. I’d be more than happy to continue.

 

[The National]

 

[Smitty93]

Poor guy, late healthy scratch for tonight’s game playing in his home town.

The worst part is he spent all his call-up money on buying tickets for family and friends. I don't think the team is obligated to play him, but at least give him a heads up that he most likely won't play so he doesn't go and spend money unnecessarily.

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

Poor guy, late healthy scratch for tonight’s game playing in his home town.

Man, that really sucks.

 

[BruinDust]

The worst part is he spent all his call-up money on buying tickets for family and friends. I don't think the team is obligated to play him, but at least give him a heads up that he most likely won't play so he doesn't go and spend money unnecessarily.

If I was a veteran on that Dallas team I'd pick up the tab for him after finding out he wasn't playing. He could be back in the AHL tomorrow making peanuts in comparison.

 

[The National]

The worst part is he spent all his call-up money on buying tickets for family and friends. I don't think the team is obligated to play him, but at least give him a heads up that he most likely won't play so he doesn't go and spend money unnecessarily.

Bonehead move by Bowness, the guy going in for him in Kiviranta has been invisible.

 

[Smitty93]

If I was a veteran on that Dallas team I'd pick up the tab for him after finding out he wasn't playing. He could be back in the AHL tomorrow making peanuts in comparison.

Hopefully that's the case. I saw on Reddit that Nick Bjugstad, who's from the same area, helped purchase tickets after Tufte ran out of money.

 

[Alicat]

Congrats to the Islanders and their fans. Been a long time coming

 

[Alicat]

Well this sucks for the Islanders.

Josh Bailey is also out w/ Covid

 

[The National]

Bomb from Garland.

Canucks collapse incoming?

 

[Bridges31]

What an absolute horse shit call on Colorado for that hit on Dunn.

 

[The National]

Has the novelty worn off the Kraken yet? They blow.

 

[Fenway]

NHL - 2021-2022 NHL Out of Town Thread V - The Islanders finally play a home game