Prospect Info: 2020 85th Overall Pick | RW Maxim Groshev

[Meuracas]

We

Well, why should I care?

Well you obviously cared enough to get all touchy, comrade.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

You miss the major point of Groshev's case being completely different. Why do I need to read pages of Kucherov's revelations? I know more about those issues than you ever will. So what?

You don't need to read pages, which is why I quoted the important section of it for you. And apparently you don't know why Kucherov left if you keep believing its was because he was "with a bad organization" or "lazy or too impulsive to look for better options in Russia." That's simply not true, as to the real information I've provided in my last replay.

For Kucherov it might have been the right option to waste time in the AHL at that point. For Groshev is doesn't make any sense.

And nobody accuses the AHL of anything. Stop defending it. It is what it is. There are options and you choose one. And if a player has a chance to play in the KHL instead of the AHL it's always the better choice to play in the KHL.

The right option to waste time? When is that ever the right option? Again, agree to disagree on if it was beneficial or not. If the player said it was, why lie? Nobody wants to be in the AHL. The goal is not only whatever gets you to the NHL, but what keeps you there as well. Kucherov was in Syracuse and lit up the league offensively, but when asked if his offensive production had earned him a call up to the big club, he said no and that he had more to work on before he was ready. Time will tell what is best for Groshev, but almost all players that get drafted by us go through the system. There are special players like Stamkos and Hedman and Sergachev who bypass that league. Maybe Groshev will be another. And as I also said before, it's not about which league is better. It's about if this path can give a player what they specifically need to make the jump to the NHL.

As for the different kind of hockey... watch the KHL.

It wasn't an insult if that's how you took it. The Russian leagues and North American leagues have different styles of play. This is nothing new. For Vasilevskiy doing his work in the AHL specifically, it was about getting use to seeing pucks through the layers of players that screen a goalie, adjusting to the pressure and traffic around the net, and getting use to shooters who don't look to score as much as they do to create rebounds. All things that are uncommon playing on the bigger ice surfaces in the KHL and a more open & skilled game than what N.A. coaches preach over here. It is because of the difference in style that the Russians teach and groom their young players in to produces so many skilled & talented prospects, that we continually keep drafting Russian prospects.

P.S. Don't let me AGAIN give you the real and the whole look on Kucherov and how good he was and how dumb NHL GMs were. There is no hindsight involved. Just the best U18 player ever and bunch of NHL morons and their prejudice and ignorance. If they did not see him 128pts good, then it's their fault and inability to do their jobs. In this case scouting.

You realize Kuch did something that nobody has done in the league since 1996, a completely different era? How was anyone suppose to see that coming? That's crazy. Obviosuly the scouting community got it wrong where they valued his U-18s teammates Yakupov and Grigorenko higher than him and I don't disagree there was a bias or ignorance on the part of others that made him drop. Thankfully we obviously thought highly enough of him to take him in the 2nd round. But no one can say they saw this version of Kucherov coming. Except for only you, right?

 

[DistantThunderRep]

You don't need to read pages, which is why I quoted the important section of it for you. And apparently you don't know why Kucherov left if you keep believing its was because he was "with a bad organization" or "lazy or too impulsive to look for better options in Russia." That's simply not true, as to the real information I've provided in my last replay.
The right option to waste time? When is that ever the right option? Again, agree to disagree on if it was beneficial or not. If the player said it was, why lie? Nobody wants to be in the AHL. The goal is not only whatever gets you to the NHL, but what keeps you there as well. Kucherov was in Syracuse and lit up the league offensively, but when asked if his offensive production had earned him a call up to the big club, he said no and that he had more to work on before he was ready. Time will tell what is best for Groshev, but almost all players that get drafted by us go through the system. There are special players like Stamkos and Hedman and Sergachev who bypass that league. Maybe Groshev will be another. And as I also said before, it's not about which league is better. It's about if this path can give a player what they specifically need to make the jump to the NHL.


It wasn't an insult if that's how you took it. The Russian leagues and North American leagues have different styles of play. This is nothing new. For Vasilevskiy doing his work in the AHL specifically, it was about getting use to seeing pucks through the layers of players that screen a goalie, adjusting to the pressure and traffic around the net, and getting use to shooters who don't look to score as much as they do to create rebounds. All things that are uncommon playing on the bigger ice surfaces in the KHL and a more open & skilled game than what N.A. coaches preach over here. It is because of the difference in style that the Russians teach and groom their young players in to produces so many skilled & talented prospects, that we continually keep drafting Russian prospects.

You realize Kuch did something that nobody has done in the league since 1996, a completely different era? How was anyone suppose to see that coming? That's crazy. Obviosuly the scouting community got it wrong where they valued his U-18s teammates Yakupov and Grigorenko higher than him and I don't disagree there was a bias or ignorance on the part of others that made him drop. Thankfully we obviously thought highly enough of him to take him in the 2nd round. But no one can say they saw this version of Kucherov coming. Except for only you, right?

Didn't Pointer by pass the AHL?

 

[DistantThunderRep]

Just going to say, full KHL development fails to produce NHL talent 99% of the time. The issue isn't KHL talent being good, I am saying the NHL is a different league, with a different style than the KHL. And the transfer of skill and play isn't 1 to 1.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

Didn't Pointer by pass the AHL?

He technically played 11 games there when his season with Moose Jaw ended and he was reassigned to finish it out there. That’s why you can google images of Point in a Crunch sweater.

It’s also interesting to think if Cally was healthy to start the season, would Point have really started off with the Crunch. If he did, I doubt he would have stayed long anyway.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

Google translated:

Two pupils of our club phoned this afternoon - Mikhail @ sergachev31 Sergachev and Maxim Groshev. Mikhail congratulated Max on the Tampa Bay Lightning draft.

Recall that yesterday Groshev was drafted under the general number 85

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

@TheDaysOf 04 IIRC in the Sport Express article he said Federov took over after he had already made his decision to leave and he didn't have a problem with him.

 

[These Are The Days]

Is Groshev under contract in any way with the KHL? I'd like us to get him over here ASAP. As far as I know he can play in Syracuse despite his age due to some clause with Euro players? It's not gonna do him any good to remain overseas when we can work with him directly here to address his strengths and weaknesses

 

[Volodya Krutov]

At such a young age I'm not having issues whether a Russian kid remains in the K for development. North American hockey can be physically AND mentally punishing, still development-wise. The thing that seemed overlooked is the cultural barriers of communication. Teenagers are extremely vulnerable to their environments. In some ways Atas 2000 brings up a good point, but he articulates it so badly I just can't defend it./

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

@TheDaysOf 04 IIRC in the Sport Express article he said Federov took over after he had already made his decision to leave and he didn't have a problem with him.

I couldn't find that article, but I think I found something very similar to what you are talking about. But yeah, Fedorov didn't try to stop him from leaving, but Kucherov I guess was just upset about how the whole thing went down.

Niyo: Fedorov ‘at peace’ with Wings, says Yzerman is ‘back where he belongs’

When Fedorov took over as GM of CSKA Moscow, Kucherov’s contract with the club was expiring. And with a serious shoulder injury that was going largely untreated in Moscow, the young forward was eager to make the jump to the NHL. Yzerman was ready, too, and Fedorov, who was just beginning to sort out his own staff in Moscow, wasn’t going to stand in the way.

“As soon as I found out that Tampa wants to bring him to North America and rehab him, I basically put both hands up and said, ‘Absolutely,’” Fedorov said.

He wasn't under contract, so there really was nothing Fedorov could do anyway. I believe he took over as GM in May 2012 and the Lightning's development camp was in early July, so there was some overlap between these 2 events, although I don't know what the communication was between the 2 during this time.

Is Groshev under contract in any way with the KHL? I'd like us to get him over here ASAP. As far as I know he can play in Syracuse despite his age due to some clause with Euro players? It's not gonna do him any good to remain overseas when we can work with him directly here to address his strengths and weaknesses

Elite Prospects says he's under contract until the end of this season (2020-21). After that if he wanted to come over, you are correct about the age and it wouldn't stop Groshev from playing in the AHL.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

First the telephone call, and now the in home visit. Sergachev doing his best to recruit Groshev.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

Groshev has played 12 games this season and is averaging 12:12 of ice time per game.

He played 18:45 in game 1 and 19:34 in game 2. Take those two games out and his average ice time is 10:49 in his last 10 games. He played only 7:10 yesterday.

 

[Everblades13]

 

[Zwui21]

But no one can say they saw this version of Kucherov coming.

I'll have to correct you on this. In 2016, Ovie was already saying that Kucherov would have evolved to become one of the best ever Russians to play in the NHL
Ovechkin says Kucherov will be one of Russia's greatest-ever NHLers - Sportsnet.ca

 

[HoseEmDown]

I'll have to correct you on this. In 2016, Ovie was already saying that Kucherov would have evolved to become one of the best ever Russians to play in the NHL
Ovechkin says Kucherov will be one of Russia's greatest-ever NHLers - Sportsnet.ca

I'll have to correct you on this. In 2014 RobertGuess said that Kucherov would be one of the players in the league. I still thought Connolly was going to be better than him.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

Russia’s roster for the annual Karjala Cup in Helsinki between Russia, Finland, Sweden, and Czech Republic.

Hugo Alnefelt will also be there for Sweden

 

[Major4Boarding]

Cool for Groshev. Seems like we don't get a potential Miftakhov/Alnefelt matchup though

 

[GoBoltz56]

Cool for Groshev. Seems like we don't get a potential Miftakhov/Alnefelt matchup though

Miftakhov is already 20 so he's too old, otherwise I'd assume he would have been there as he became the U20 starter last year.

 

[Major4Boarding]

Miftakhov is already 20 so he's too old, otherwise I'd assume he would have been there as he became the U20 starter last year.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

A little more info on the Karjala Tournament

"One hour ago Team Russia posted their roster for the Karjala Cup and that's hot news because it's the Team Russia under 20 that will play for the Karjala Cup instead of the men's team. So I think that will be a really good experience for a lot of players on that team before world juniors because like you know, no Super Series this year and no some tournaments for junior teams and that's why I think it will be a good battle for our boys."

"Yes [they will be playing against men], and many guys who are playing now are in the KHL like Yegor Chinakhov, Shakir Mukhamadullin, and Rodion Amirov. Everybody who was just in the NHL draft, they're very good boys and yes it will be a very good experience in the game and also good experience in the bubble life. In Karjala they will live in the bubble in Helsinki."

Igor Larionov will also coach the U-20 team in place of Valeri Bragin, who just recovered from covid.

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

from yesterday's game

Assist @ 1:42
Scoring chance @ 3:57


He played 11:17 of ice time.

 

[Point21]

 

[These Are The Days]

Yeah but is he going to just be stapled to the bench and play only 6 minutes or what?

 

[Felonious Python]

Yeah but is he going to just be stapled to the bench and play only 6 minutes or what?

Groshev has been very good in the VHL lately. I'd think he'd at least play, but with the KHL, who knows.

 

[These Are The Days]

Groshev has been very good in the VHL lately. I'd think he'd at least play, but with the KHL, who knows.

I'd like to get him over here to North America but all I can hear is the sound of Alex Volkov's voice carrying into the wind about how it's too cold in Syracuse


27 in Syracuse
26 in St. Petersburg Russia

#logic