NHL Entry Draft 2019 Entry Draft Discussion (part 3)

[SENATOR]

You did not seem to understand the context, in which I was replying to the people who were upset that the Senators wasted picks, this past draft, on players that had been through a previous draft(s) and were not selected. They suggested Ottawa should have selected prospects who were only 18 years old.

I just pointed out that Batherson had been through a draft before, and for that matter so did Zack Smith who was not selected in 2007, when he too was draft eligible.

Taking players, who went undrafted in a previous year (or two) is not a wasted pick.

Batherson is not even a NHL player and Smith is just Smith, a cannon fodder.

 

[aragorn]

Never scored at a high rate at any level. It wont happen in the NHL it just doesnt happen. With having the 44th pick sitting there I believe this will go down as one of the worst picks in this history of the organization.

I guess we'll see, I have no idea how this kid will turn out & will leave it to others to guess. I think the next couple of yrs at ND should give us an indication of what to expect from him in future. I also wanted other guys left on the board like Lavoie or Leason but it's history now.

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

Batherson is not even a NHL player and Smith is just Smith, a cannon fodder.

Do you mean he's not an NHL player right now or will not be one?

 

[SENATOR]

The question is how much more was Pinto valued as a pick over
Kaliyev
Brink
Hoglander
Lavoie
Rees
Afanasyev
Matthew Robertson
Korczak
Nick Robertson

and why?

WE MUST HAVE PINTO ????? I like him but must have him? Pinto is great and all these guys are ****e .. How is he so much more coveted than to take an extra pick to move down 1 spot. 1 spot...

Why would you like Pinto? He is lacking everywhere. Besides, only second round picks who made to the NHL through out 28 years of Sens modern existence were Fisher, Vermette and Neckac. Pinto is against huge odds. He is in reality third rounder and away at least 3-5 years in development His array of shots not good and have no power. No decking skills, passing is average. Defensive game needs a development. Skating above average but non-existing edge work. Prototypical Zack Smith and forth liner, if can learn defense. Kaliyev could play next season and has to develop only his defensive zone coverage.

 

[Upgrayedd]

Interesting that you describe it as fascinating. There are just so many more accurate adjectives that are appropriate.

Perhaps for yourself, having essentially removed myself from truly caring about the day to day and accepting the fate of a Eugene Melnyk owned business, the only thing left with this husk of a team that interests me are the constant poor moves and more so the thought processes behind them which I find fascinating personally, my statement should not be taken as condoning the actions.

 

[bert]

Perhaps for yourself, having essentially removed myself from truly caring about the day to day and accepting the fate of a Eugene Melnyk owned business, the only thing left with this husk of a team that interests me are the constant poor moves and more so the thought processes behind them which I find fascinating personally, my statement should not be taken as condoning the actions.

Touche! Haha i am starting to feel the same, good explanation.

 

[bert]

Why would you like Pinto? He is lacking everywhere. Besides, only second round picks who made to the NHL through out 28 years of Sens modern existence were Fisher, Vermette and Neckac. Pinto is against huge odds. He is in reality third rounder and away at least 3-5 years in development His array of shots not good and have no power. No decking skills, passing is average. Defensive game needs a development. Skating above average but non-existing edge work. Prototypical Zack Smith and forth liner, if can learn defense. Kaliyev could play next season and has to develop only his defensive zone coverage.

So you ignored the posts that showed you all the 2nd round picks that have made the NHL completely? Listen i hate the pick too but atleast be accurate.

 

[Upgrayedd]

Touche! Haha i am starting to feel the same, good explanation.

A real shame as this continues the team will continue to lose that essential core of fans who were somewhat raised on the team solely because of 1 human being. 5 years ago I would have said I will be a die hard Sens and NHL fan until I die, today is the opposite, I will be surprised if I ever fully invest again, I feel let down personally by the owner and league itself.

I still miss the game and the team, however as each event now passes by which I spend my former Senators dollars on and receive universally better value all around, I miss it less and less.

 

[bert]

A real shame as this continues the team will continue to lose that essential core of fans who were somewhat raised on the team solely because of 1 human being. 5 years ago I would have said I will be a die hard Sens and NHL fan until I die, today is the opposite, I will be surprised if I ever fully invest again, I feel let down personally by the owner and league itself.

I still miss the game and the team, however as each event now passes by which I spend my former Senators dollars on and receive universally better value all around, I miss it less and less.

Again I wholeheartedly agree.

If new ownership happens I think we will all be back. Yes Melnyk is the driving force behind my disinterest of the team but the hatred portion that stems from Dorion. The bold faced lies and the cowardly explanations of constantly throwing literally everyone else under the bus and passing the buck every time something going wrong. Meanwhile patting himself on the back for any minor success, that is what has truly driven me away. I am not sure a combination of two people could destroy a fan base any faster. It really feels like they are actively trolling the fanbase. The patronizing comments to your revenue stream and client base are like nothing I have ever seen in professional marketing.

 

[Upgrayedd]

Again I wholeheartedly agree.

If new ownership happens I think we will all be back. Yes Melnyk is the driving force behind my disinterest of the team but the hatred portion that stems from Dorion. The bold faced lies and the cowardly explanations of constantly throwing literally everyone else under the bus and passing the buck every time something going wrong. Meanwhile patting himself on the back for any minor success, that is what has truly driven me away. I am not sure a combination of two people could destroy a fan base any faster. It really feels like they are actively trolling the fanbase. The patronizing comments to your revenue stream and client base are like nothing I have ever seen in professional marketing.

Im not Pierre's biggest fan at the moment but find it hard to truly judge anyone working under Gene (too many horrific first hand stories of dealing with the guy from current employees who are terrified of losing there jobs combined with working for poor leaders before), that said everyone should get the axe if a new owner ever shows up, I wouldn't be surprised if Pierre is somewhat vindicated once the inevitable Melnyk tales from the crypt begin to roll out....of course that would get you into the debate of how much blame should someone share when they clearly sign up for an absolute no win job but I digress...

A la Seinfeld...Gene/Pierre, why did you do it?...Spite!

 

[bert]

I guess we'll see, I have no idea how this kid will turn out & will leave it to others to guess. I think the next couple of yrs at ND should give us an indication of what to expect from him in future. I also wanted other guys left on the board like Lavoie or Leason but it's history now.

Yeah lets hope this is truly a long term game here because his individual skills are not there, not even close to a player like Lavoie.

 

[bert]

Im not Pierre's biggest fan at the moment but find it hard to truly judge anyone working under Gene (too many horrific first hand stories of dealing with the guy from current employees who are terrified of losing there jobs combined with working for poor leaders before), that said everyone should get the axe if a new owner ever shows up, I wouldn't be surprised if Pierre is somewhat vindicated once the inevitable Melnyk tales from the crypt begin to roll out....of course that would get you into the debate of how much blame should someone share when they clearly sign up for an absolute no win job but I digress...

A la Seinfeld...Gene/Pierre, why did you do it?...Spite!

Bryan Murray acted nothing of the sort, Pierre is an asshole plain and simple. Best day of his life trading Mark Stone. Either he is dumbest person on the planet or he is just an absolute prick. I personally think its a combination of both.

 

[Agent Zub]

Bryan Murray acted nothing of the sort, Pierre is an ******* plain and simple. Best day of his life trading Mark Stone. Either he is dumbest person on the planet or he is just an absolute prick. I personally think its a combination of both.

I think Pierre is just really dumb but also thinks he's the smartest person in the room.

 

[Viletho]

Yeah lets hope this is truly a long term game here because his individual skills are not there, not even close to a player like Lavoie.

Pinto is surely a project. From his tsn1200 interview post draft he said he didn't focus heavely on hockey before he was 15 y/o. ( he's what? 18 y/o now? )

He was more into baseball and football but then decide to play hockey seriously.

Let's see what he become.

 

[coladin]

A real shame as this continues the team will continue to lose that essential core of fans who were somewhat raised on the team solely because of 1 human being. 5 years ago I would have said I will be a die hard Sens and NHL fan until I die, today is the opposite, I will be surprised if I ever fully invest again, I feel let down personally by the owner and league itself.

I still miss the game and the team, however as each event now passes by which I spend my former Senators dollars on and receive universally better value all around, I miss it less and less.

Nothing beats better value, in today's day and age. Keep getting those deals!

 

[aragorn]

Yeah lets hope this is truly a long term game here because his individual skills are not there, not even close to a player like Lavoie.

I have to agree. He hasn't really shown anything special at the development camp yet but he also doesn't look like he is all that far behind some of the better prospects with the exception of Batherson who IMO is the best player at this camp. He also has competition from Davidsson RW who is really impressing me at this camp with his overall skill level.

Pinto's got decent size, seems to skate well & handles the puck well. What we don't know or haven't seen yet is how he handles himself in games, how physical he is & whether he is able to get into scoring areas or if he has any playmaking ability. I hope to see some of that tomorrow night at the prospects game in Kanata & will certainly write about it. Have a good day Bert.

 

[BK201]

Why would you like Pinto? He is lacking everywhere. Besides, only second round picks who made to the NHL through out 28 years of Sens modern existence were Fisher, Vermette and Neckac. Pinto is against huge odds. He is in reality third rounder and away at least 3-5 years in development His array of shots not good and have no power. No decking skills, passing is average. Defensive game needs a development. Skating above average but non-existing edge work. Prototypical Zack Smith and forth liner, if can learn defense. Kaliyev could play next season and has to develop only his defensive zone coverage.

Really i read really good skating good wrist shot good one timer..

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Good article here from Larry Fisher https://thehockeywriters.com/2019-nhl-draft-evaluating-team-results/

Sens were not the only team to go off the board.. If we consider this "the board" in this instance .. LA did very well as did the Hawks, Vegas, Canes, Leafs

Check out 176) Anthony Romano, RW = 177, 177, 175 ... Who else had him pegged 175 - 177?

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I wonder if this question was about Kaliyev. Someone should have replied , yah, he scored over 100 pts and had 50 goals without even trying. Time to go Pierre. Your usefulness has apparently run its course.

 

[Jersey Fan 12]

With all the kvetching about the reaches on overage picks this year, I thought it might be fun to go back and see how the Sens have done with these sort of players in the past. Beginning in 2008 when they actually began scouting the amateur ranks again after Muckler gutted the department:

2013

Round 6/Pick 168: Quentin Shore - Second year eligible. Didn't work out, but I can see the logic. He had a good freshman year in college and even made the US WJC team the following season.

Must be a June thing or a no sports on TV thing but just going over the Sens draft history and came across Shore. (This is the most recent posting when I did a search which likely answers my question).

Seemed like his numbers were decent at U of Denver but he never appeared to stick above ECHL (where he was nearly point-per-game scorer in his three pro seasons).

What was it that kept him from advancing higher?

 

[Ouroboros]

Must be a June thing or a no sports on TV thing but just going over the Sens draft history and came across Shore. (This is the most recent posting when I did a search which likely answers my question).

Seemed like his numbers were decent at U of Denver but he never appeared to stick above ECHL (where he was nearly point-per-game scorer in his three pro seasons).

What was it that kept him from advancing higher?

I think his biggest issue was skating, but he didn't have much in the way of offensive skills or instincts either. He was primarily known as a defensive center in college - if I recall correctly he was a finalist for defensive forward of the year in his senior year.

I think there is a feeling that he didn't really develop much over the course of his NCAA run. He never signed an ELC with Ottawa, or any other club for that matter.