Toggle sidebar

OT: 2018 Phillies Thread Part 2

Status
Not open for further replies.
wankstifier

wankstifier

All glory to the harvest god
Jun 19, 2018
7,756
11,186
The 2008 Phillies were in the top third of the league in both pitching and hitting. The bench, bullpen, and defense were close to league best. I think the 2015 Royals might've had a similar profile?

Adam Warlock said:
Do you really think Sixto will be a bigger impact player over the next 3-6 years than Manny?
Click to expand...

Sanchez might not pass a physical right now, so moot issue. Further, it's silly to ask this question because the Phillies wouldn't acquire Machado with an extension in place...
 
  • Like
Reactions: JojoTheWhale
Magua

Magua

Entirely Palatable Product
Apr 25, 2016
37,584
155,811
Huron of the Lakes
Adam Warlock said:
Do you really think Sixto will be a bigger impact player over the next 3-6 years than Manny?
Click to expand...

source.gif


giphy.gif



You're asking the wrong question. Sixto is the best prospect in the organization and a true blue chipper with unlimited upside. Machado is a guy dead-set on going to free agency and would be joining a team that, let's face it, still has an uphill battle. You can use the argument that trading for Machado gives you the most slightest of legs up in free agency, provided he likes it here, and also drums up attention for a fanbase in need of something nice........to a point. Sixto is past that point.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JojoTheWhale
JojoTheWhale

JojoTheWhale

CORN BOY
May 22, 2008
33,780
105,367
Adam Warlock said:
Do you really think Sixto will be a bigger impact player over the next 3-6 years than Manny?
Click to expand...

You don't get to frame the discussion in a way that makes no sense because it supports your point.

The argument is 6+ years of team control on Sanchez combined with injury risk versus 3 months of team control on Machado and a hope that it changes anything about where he signs in the offseason, which I seriously doubt. Absolute best case, it makes you win contract ties. I don't value that particularly highly.

wankstifier said:
The 2008 Phillies were in the top third of the league in both pitching and hitting. The bench, bullpen, and defense were close to league best. I think the 2015 Royals might've had a similar profile?
Click to expand...

Yeah, that 2008 Phillies team was better on the mound that people remember for whatever reason. Probably because they got very good years from guys like Moyer that don't get romanticized.
 

Adam Warlock

Registered User
Apr 15, 2006
6,838
6,574
I just think if he is there guy...they need to be aggressive and make sure thry get him. Letting him get traded to another team is playing with fire because he very well could resign there after a 2 month trial period. He could go to the world series with LA...it would be hard to walk after that.

I get what everyone is saying but I think the only way he ends up on the phillies is if they trade for him.
 
LegionOfDoom91

LegionOfDoom91

Registered User
Jan 25, 2013
82,058
140,037
Philadelphia, PA
Adam Warlock said:
I just think if he is there guy...they need to be aggressive and make sure thry get him. Letting him get traded to another team is playing with fire because he very well could resign there after a 2 month trial period. He could go to the world series with LA...it would be hard to walk after that.

I get what everyone is saying but I think the only way he ends up on the phillies is if they trade for him.
Click to expand...

Not really he’s going to be an expensive luxury for LA past this year when Seager gets back.

The Phils still have by far the most payroll flexibility & no real roadblocks at SS/3B unlike the Dodgers & Yankees.
 
FLYguy3911

FLYguy3911

Sanheim Lover
Oct 19, 2006
53,167
86,561
Getting him now and hoping to woo him over works both ways. He could hate Kapler or something along those lines. But it will come down to money like it always does in baseball. You'll see how bad the Phillies want him this offseason.

Even if you thought for some reason that 2+ months of Machado was worth Sixto, trading Sixto pretty much takes you out of consideration for whatever controllable star hits the market in the coming years. At the moment, the Phillies don't have another prospect that could headline a package for such player. Machado alone probably doesn't take you where you want to go. There will be another shoe to drop if and when he is added to the team next season.
Hiesenberg said:
He's not going to get it with Harper on the market.
Click to expand...
Huh?
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: wankstifier
deadhead

deadhead

Registered User
Feb 26, 2014
49,215
21,617
Adam Warlock said:
We won a world series with players like Machado and a trash rotation. We didnt win a world series with 4 high end, at least 2 of them elite, starters. Id take the elite position player over the elite starter any day.

The Phillies can pay him what he wants, give him the position he wants, are a rising team, are near by, and have connections to him already. Only way he doesnt come here is if hes traded elsewhere and falls in love with that team. LA has that effect on people.
Click to expand...

That is an argument only a homer can make, Machado would spend most of his time in Philly in a hotel room, the ballpark or on the road.
He's not going to fall in love with the city in two months.

2008 Phillies had one player with an off the charts season, Utley, Howard .885 OPS, Burrell .875 and Werth .861 had solid seasons.
But they also had Ruiz .620, Feliz .705.
Utley 9.0 WAR, Rollins 5.5, Victorino 4.4, Werth 3.7, Burrell 2.4, Howard 1.8 - only position players over 1.0 WAR.
Utley at his peak was better than Machado.
Machado is a 5 WAR guy at SS, 6 WAR at 3B.
He'd help but so would just developing solid players at each position and a deep bench.

Hamels, Lidge, Condrey and Madson were the key to the pitching staff.
tied for 2nd in runs scored, 4th in ERA in the NL that year.
The current Phillies are building a much deeper pitching staff, both SP and the pen.
 
Hiesenberg

Hiesenberg

Registered User
Jul 2, 2013
15,576
1,875
FLYguy3911 said:
Getting him now and hoping to woo him over works both ways. He could hate Kapler or something along those lines. But it will come down to money like it always does in baseball. You'll see how bad the Phillies want him this offseason.

Even if you thought for some reason that 2+ months of Machado was worth Sixto, trading Sixto pretty much takes you out of consideration for whatever controllable star hits the market in the coming years. At the moment, the Phillies don't have another prospect that could headline a package for such player. Machado alone probably doesn't take you where you want to go. There will be another shoe to drop if and when he is added to the team next season.

Huh?
Click to expand...

I believe Harper will get the biggest contract
 
FLYguy3911

FLYguy3911

Sanheim Lover
Oct 19, 2006
53,167
86,561
Hiesenberg said:
Just my guess. I'm not saying he's deserving, but I think he'll out-earn Machado
Click to expand...
Can’t see it between the year he is having, durability concerns, and defensive value. I think Machado will set the market and the rest will fall into place.
 
Hiesenberg

Hiesenberg

Registered User
Jul 2, 2013
15,576
1,875
FLYguy3911 said:
Can’t see it between the year he is having, durability concerns, and defensive value. I think Machado will set the market and the rest will fall into place.
Click to expand...

That's definitely the most logical thought process, but Harper just seems like "the name" and almost feel like the GMs are all predetermined to have Harper be the most expensive contract.
 
FLYguy3911

FLYguy3911

Sanheim Lover
Oct 19, 2006
53,167
86,561
Hiesenberg said:
That's definitely the most logical thought process, but Harper just seems like "the name" and almost feel like the GMs are all predetermined to have Harper be the most expensive contract.
Click to expand...
Nah. Collectively baseball GMs are the smartest of any sport.
 
DancingPanther

DancingPanther

Foundational Titan
Sponsor
Jun 19, 2018
32,058
70,010
Whew

Looks like Diaz is the centerpiece going back. Their 2nd best hitting prospect behind Verdugo and Rosenthal seems to think LA has to sweeten the pot even more. Lot of similarities to the Phillies reportedly willing to include Medina. If this is the case, perhaps the O's simply likes Diaz better than Medina.

I think it's unfair to rip on the Phils here tbh. They went after him hard with a similar offer (again if reports are accurate).

I still don't think the value is there for a pure rental, hence my whew. Machado will be there in the winter. Take a shot at him then.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Latest posts

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

Top Bottom