2018 Forbes NHL values. NYR tops at $1.55B. Average $630m

[alko]

Just curious. Why Rangers on top?

They dont have any significant star n the roster.
They dont won anything significant in the last years.
Stanley Cup is now miles away from this franchise.

So, what is so special on New York Rangers? Madison "Cubic" Garden?

 

[SoundAndFury]

Just curious. Why Rangers on top?

They dont have any significant star n the roster.
They dont won anything significant in the last years.
Stanley Cup is now miles away from this franchise.

So, what is so special on New York Rangers? Madison "Cubic" Garden?

As you understand the value is mostly tied to long-term money-making potential so the things you listed have next to no impact to it. And yes, the fact that more people know the name of their arena than the name of any NHL team explains their value fairly well.

 

[Deadly Dogma]

You really see the separation of the big dogs when you look at operation income

 

[alko]

As you understand the value is mostly tied to long-term money-making potential so the things you listed have next to no impact to it. And yes, the fact that more people know the name of their arena than the name of any NHL team explains their value fairly well.

The Nicks are worth 4 000 000 000 USD! And every NBA franchise is > 1 billion.

 

[GuelphStormer]

to be honest, i have never understood how forbes figures the venue and organizational structure of the parent company (and all of its extra-hockey revenue streams like concession, venue fees, broadcasting, media delivery, etc.) into valuating just one entity - the NHL franchise.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

The Nicks are worth 4 000 000 000 USD! And every NBA franchise is > 1 billion.

I knew Fleetwood Mac made a lot of money, but 4 Billion?

 

[patnyrnyg]

As you understand the value is mostly tied to long-term money-making potential so the things you listed have next to no impact to it. And yes, the fact that more people know the name of their arena than the name of any NHL team explains their value fairly well.

The parent company owns the arena, but not sure how the value of the arena is split among the Rangers and the Knicks for accounting purposes.

 

[patnyrnyg]

As you understand the value is mostly tied to long-term money-making potential so the things you listed have next to no impact to it. And yes, the fact that more people know the name of their arena than the name of any NHL team explains their value fairly well.

The parent company owns the arena, but not sure how the value of the arena is split among the Rangers and the Knicks for accounting purposes.

 

[patnyrnyg]

Just curious. Why Rangers on top?

They dont have any significant star n the roster.
They dont won anything significant in the last years.
Stanley Cup is now miles away from this franchise.

So, what is so special on New York Rangers? Madison "Cubic" Garden?

Lundqvist is not a significant star?

My tickets are the 4th cheapest in the arena and they are $89 each for full sth. Lower bowls are all in excess of $100 each. They also own the tv network, well the parent company does, although not sure how the revenues of the network are distributed by Forbes. Their concessions is self-op, so they do not split that revenue with a vendor such as Delaware North.

 

[YEM]

Just curious. Why Rangers on top?

They dont have any significant star n the roster.
They dont won anything significant in the last years.
Stanley Cup is now miles away from this franchise.

So, what is so special on New York Rangers? Madison "Cubic" Garden?

you had to ask why an original 6 team playing in THE city in America in the "world's most famous arena" is worth the most?

 

[TerminatorBlue]

I thought Calgary would he higher on the list.

 

[CorbeauNoir]

I thought Calgary would he higher on the list.

Calgary's being taken on it's first step towards becoming the Detroit of the 21st century. Watch that space.

 

[Zusammenhalt]

If the NHL went public would you buy stock in it?

 

[Bookie21]

If the NHL went public would you buy stock in it?

Yes

 

[LeHab]

If the NHL went public would you buy stock in it?

Depends on the value of the stock and what would be included. How would the NHL (not franchises) make money?

 

[BattleBorn]

If the NHL went public would you buy stock in it?

The NHL isn't an actual, real thing that makes money, it's just a pass through type of corporation.

It's like the NFL a few years ago when the less-informed twittosphere/reality got into a frenzy over the NFL being "non-profit." It was true, the NFL doesn't make much money, it facilitates monetary distributions to it's members. It's a multi-billion dollar corporation in name only. It doesn't make money since league revenues are distributed to league owners.

The fact that this is a question is a testament to the idea that people don't get how the world works. Sure, it may be possible to "invest" in the NHL if that was an option, but if you do, you should only do it against the advice of someone that knows what they're doing. Invest in the companies that own teams if you really want to capitalize on success,

 

[Roadrage]

Not surprising that Arizona and Florida both lost value. Shocking that Pittsburgh and Anaheim were neutral.

 

[boredmale]

You would think given the fanbase(ie I would assume it has the biggest fanbase for all nhl teams, thus their local tv and radio deals would be the highest of anyteam) that the Leafs would be the most valuable team

The only think I could see making Rangers more profitable would be the Dolans own the arena and TV Station the Rangers play on thus they are triple dipping into the profits

 

[oknazevad]

You really see the separation of the big dogs when you look at operation income

Completely. And it's that separation in value that makes the "average value" listed completely worthless. The disparity of the top five or so teams is so great that they skew the numbers. The arithmetic mean of all values may be $630M, but more than half the teams in the league are below that figure, meaning it is not a meaningful average. The median, which is the Minnesota Wild at $490M, is far more telling as to what someone would expect to pay if rthey were to buy a random NHL team. Of course, the days of buying whatever team goes up for sale regardless of location are pretty much done, but it's not like any other team is going to fetch over three times the median like the Rangers.

The NHL isn't an actual, real thing that makes money, it's just a pass through type of corporation.

It's like the NFL a few years ago when the less-informed twittosphere/reality got into a frenzy over the NFL being "non-profit." It was true, the NFL doesn't make much money, it facilitates monetary distributions to it's members. It's a multi-billion dollar corporation in name only. It doesn't make money since league revenues are distributed to league owners.

The fact that this is a question is a testament to the idea that people don't get how the world works. Sure, it may be possible to "invest" in the NHL if that was an option, but if you do, you should only do it against the advice of someone that knows what they're doing. Invest in the companies that own teams if you really want to capitalize on success,

Yeah, the NHL is not a single entity league. Heck, MLS, the poster child for single entity, isn't really one anymore (it's more of a hybrid, with some things still handled by the single entity league LLC, but a lot of independent operations by the investor/operators.)

 

[LeHab]

Completely. The median, which is the Minnesota Wild at $490M, is far more telling as to what someone would expect to pay if rthey were to buy a random NHL team. Of course, the days of buying whatever team goes up for sale regardless of location are pretty much done, but it's not like any other team is going to fetch over three times the median like the Rangers.

$490 is what current owner may expect to receive. Potential buyer will also have to pay down or assume any outstanding debt which impacts actual value.

 

[Burke the Legend]

Forbes even admits they undervalue the Bruins

TD Center is a mid-size NHL arena, but the Bruins make a lot of money because they own the building and have sold out every game since December 2009. This enables the team to profit from non-NHL events like concerts. Not included in our valuation of the Bruins is their 20% ownership stake in NESN (the Red Sox own 80%), one the most profitable regional sports networks. NESN generated cash flow (in the sense of earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization) of more than $170 million in 2017. The team raised ticket prices 7% on average for the 2018-19 season after two straight years of price freezes.

It is impossible to put a true worth on Delaware North's Boston operations the way the family structures their holdings. In any event, their initial investment was $10 million in 1975 of which only $2 million was in cash.

That would multiply the difficulty of valuing every club as a lot of owners have complicated tie-ins between the team and other business ventures so I assume they are trying to compartmentalize other business. Like for the Montreal Canadiens they include the arena, but I would be surprised if it includes the "Evenko" promotion business built around the arena, or the whatever stake they have in the massive condo development going on around the arena. In this Bruins example in the club's valuation maybe you wouldn't include the value of the stake in the TV network, but instead cook in the amount of revenue the local TV contract would provide them, possibly at a market value estimation if the actual arrangement was say low-balled for revenue sharing considerations but they were fully compensated through the ownership structure.

 

[LeHab]

to be honest, i have never understood how forbes figures the venue and organizational structure of the parent company (and all of its extra-hockey revenue streams like concession, venue fees, broadcasting, media delivery, etc.) into valuating just one entity - the NHL franchise.

Forbes methodology for valuation is as follows:

Methodology: Revenue and operating income are for the 2017-18 season, include postseason and applicable non-NHL arena revenue, and are net of revenue sharing and arena debt service. All figures are in U.S. dollars based on average exchange rate during 2017-18 season. Team values are enterprise values (equity plus net debt) of teams based on current arena deal (unless new arena is pending). Operating income is earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization. Debt includes arena when recourse to team owner.

Wonder what "applicable non-NHL arena revenues" would include. In any case numbers are mostly guesses based on interviews and other sources.

 

[Newsworthy]

Just curious. Why Rangers on top?

They dont have any significant star n the roster.
They dont won anything significant in the last years.
Stanley Cup is now miles away from this franchise.

So, what is so special on New York Rangers? Madison "Cubic" Garden?

Rangers are always on top. That is why. Simple google search can answer this question for you.
Henrik is star and will be Hall of Fame.
Knicks worth a fortune as well and they are worse off than the NY Rangers.
Sweet TV deal all around. Other bad teams could learn a thing or two from these two clubs from a business sense.
Yankees also on top.
Yankees climb the mountain. Flag is waving on the highest peak.