Prospect Info: 2016 Leafs Board Prospect Ranking #18

[bobermay]

I cant understand why a player i like is not as high as expected

simply outrageous. I demand a recount.

I take this as a jab at me, as I've been one of the more vocal posters in these threads.

I am not saying anything is outrageous or unfair needing a re-count. I respect other peoples opinions.

I simply do not see what other fans see in Leivo and am very surprised by the lack of fanfare our recent draft picks are getting.

Is there anything wrong with that?

 

[Banic]

All the comments in the last few polls about underrated players are getting to be much.

If a player has been taken in a later round, and/or was drafted as an over ager than they really aren't being underrated. Since about 10 this entire thing has been a crap shoot and most of these prospects are about equal. Some will make it in bottom 6 capacity, some may have a chance at more but most will bust.

 

[bobermay]

All the comments in the last few polls about underrated players are getting to be much.

If a player has been taken in a later round, and/or was drafted as an over ager than they really aren't being underrated. Since about 10 this entire thing has been a crap shoot and most of these prospects are about equal. Some will make it in bottom 6 capacity, some may have a chance at more but most will bust.

Well... Grundstrom was neither taken in a later round, nor as an overager

Okay, I'm done

 

[AlienWorkShop]

I cant understand why a player i like is not as high as expected

simply outrageous. I demand a recount.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHIdSxs5_eQ

 

[Banic]

Well... Grundstrom was neither taken in a later round, nor as an overager

Okay, I'm done

Not referring only to Grundstrom. However he is a mid 2nd rounder who was projected to go later than that . We have a recent 1st rounder in Gauthier who is still on the board.

Leivo and Hyman have both developed into nhl ready players. Hyman looks to be even an impact player. This is more than most of the guys left will get to. Lindberg seems to be progressing well also. There is a case to be made for Grundstrom but you are making it out to be a catastrophe that he's still on the board when that is simply not the case.

 

[bobermay]

Not referring only to Grundstrom. However he is a mid 2nd rounder who was projected to go later than that . We have a recent 1st rounder in Gauthier who is still on the board.

Leivo and Hyman have both developed into nhl ready players. Hyman looks to be even an impact player. This is more than most of the guys left will get to. Lindberg seems to be progressing well also. There is a case to be made for Grundstrom but you are making it out to be a catastrophe that he's still on the board when that is simply not the case.

He was not projected to go later than where we selected him.

I think you're just reading me wrong, but thats okay. I've stated I understand why people would rank a Hyman (or people already selected other than maybe Leipsic) ahead of Grundstrom. Leivo on the other hand, I'm really not a fan of and don't see the potential other fans see in him.

 

[Joey Hoser]

If you look at the past polls from past years, there is usually 2-4 NHL players in the entire list and the rest were relatively equal failures.

Complaining about picls in the teens and pushing 20 is just complaining about nothing. What's happening now is like being upset about Robbie Earl being selected before Chad Rau or Tyler Ruegsegger.

 

[Morgs]

Easily Grundstrom, then Woll/Hyman.

Don't get the love for Leivo, never have.

 

[Joey Hoser]

Easily Grundstrom, then Woll/Hyman.

Don't get the love for Leivo, never have.

Leivo is basically a PPG AHL player at 23 and he isn't even picked yet at #18.

I'm confused as to how people are confused about him.

 

[TheKingSlayer]

Leivo is basically a PPG AHL player at 23 and he isn't even picked yet at #18.

I'm confused as to how people are confused about him.

I agree. Kid has an NHL level shot, skates well and is physical. He just needs to have a great off-season of conditioning and he could slot into our top 9 quite nicely.

I would not mind seeing a line of Leivo - Bozak - Nylander.

 

[Morgs]

Leivo is basically a PPG AHL player at 23 and he isn't even picked yet at #18.

I'm confused as to how people are confused about him.

Piss poor skating, bad conditioning, and playing consistently with better players sinks his stock for me.

It's like Hyman coming out of University of Michigan. He put up 54 pts in 38 games in his senior season (should be too good, especially for the NCAA) and that was the first time he put up more than .50 PPG. Is it because he got magically amazing at hockey, or is it because he started playing with Dylan Larkin?

Is Leivo really that good, or is it because he's sheltered/plays with better players?

 

[Joey Hoser]

Piss poor skating, bad conditioning, and playing consistently with better players sinks his stock for me.

It's like Hyman coming out of University of Michigan. He put up 54 pts in 38 games in his senior season (should be too good, especially for the NCAA) and that was the first time he put up more than .50 PPG. Is it because he got magically amazing at hockey, or is it because he started playing with Dylan Larkin?

Is Leivo really that good, or is it because he's sheltered/plays with better players?

Well I dont even know where you get "piss poor skating" from, as I would describe it as at least average.

Leivo didn't just suck and then become good when playing with better players. He's made solid progression since being drafted except for a bit of a stall last year when he was somewhat injury-plauged.

 

[bobermay]

Leivo is basically a PPG AHL player at 23 and he isn't even picked yet at #18.

I'm confused as to how people are confused about him.

PPG in AHL (especially at the age of 23) doesn't necessarily translate to NHL success.

I agree. Kid has an NHL level shot, skates well and is physical. He just needs to have a great off-season of conditioning and he could slot into our top 9 quite nicely.

I would not mind seeing a line of Leivo - Bozak - Nylander.

I'll give you the good shot, but I wouldn't agree that he skates well or is physical. You could be right and that he'll be a good third liner... I just think the odds are stacked against him.

 

[Jeypic]

People have different voting methods, hyman is a lock for the nhl at this point
other guys may have a higher ceilings sure but arent as sure thing as hyman.
vote for the sure thing or a good bet or shoot for the stars and pick potential.
Thats why im not a fan of mixing pro and junior prospects.

The way I try to vote is considering trade value of each player. Leivo could end up on our waivers. So to me, his value is less then a prospect like grundstrom.

 

[Joey Hoser]

PPG in AHL (especially at the age of 23) doesn't necessarily translate to NHL success.
.

Of course not, but we're talking about #18 here. The expectation of being an NHL player should not be a requirement here.

 

[bobermay]

The way I try to vote is considering trade value of each player. Leivo could end up on our waivers. So to me, his value is less then a prospect like grundstrom.

This is fair. I think of it more along the same lines too.

Its funny, if the Leafs drafted 'sexy' names like Abramov/Niemelainen/Fox/Bitten/Pu/Allard... there is no chance they would have lasted this long in the rankings. I trust Hunter's judgement.

 

[bobermay]

Of course not, but we're talking about #18 here.

And there are still prospects on board that have better potential than Leivo.

 

[Lauro]

And there are still prospects on board that have better potential than Leivo.

Who?

 

[bobermay]

Who?

Cameranesi

Hey, its a three-way tie right now!!

 

[Big Easy]

This is a prospect list and therefore I go for potential. Who has the higher ceiling and who is most valuable to the organization. Out of Leivo, Hyman and Grundstrom, Carl takes this one.

 

[LV*]

This is a prospect list and therefore I go for potential. Who has the higher ceiling and who is most valuable to the organization. Out of Leivo, Hyman and Grundstrom, Carl takes this one.

How? No one on here has seen him play over a hand full of times... Those that know him as a player say he projects as a third line player... Hyman can be a third liner, but is likely a fourth liner, Leivo is a third line player and has shown it... Plus his chemistry with Nylander is great. His shot is top 3, if not top 2 on this whole prospect list.



If he gets traded from here after camp he's going to be a top nine player for someone else, like Colborne.

 

[Once]

How? No one on here has seen him play over a hand full of times... Those that know him as a player say he projects as a third line player... Hyman can be a third liner, but is likely a fourth liner, Leivo is a third line player and has shown it... Plus his chemistry with Nylander is great. His shot is top 3, if not top 2 on this whole prospect list.



If he gets traded from here after camp he's going to be a top nine player for someone else, like Colborne.

I don't mind Leivo and I see why he is loved, but for me his future is not with this organization.

 

[Auston Powers]

His shot is top 3, if not top 2 on this whole prospect list.

If he gets traded from here after camp he's going to be a top nine player for someone else, like Colborne.

I like Leivo but I wouldn't go that far as to say he is top 3 on this whole list.

I also do agree with you though that if we lose him because of our logjam upfront that he probably will end up in a top 9 role for someone else.

 

[Stringer Bell]

Lol. Josh Leivo does not get the credit he deserves. I don't know much about his conditioning...none of you do. All we have off that is what Babcock said, but it's not as if his conditioning is some tangible evidence we've all witnessed like him getting absolutely gassed after a shift and coughing up a lung.

Aside from that he only has one weakness, and it's not even a career killing weakness: his skating. It's average at worst. It's not up to the rest of his skills so it sticks out but it's nothing that will keep him out of the league.

He has a fantastic shot, and I'm a little annoyed that someone described him as not physical. Maybe he doesn't go around being a pest and hitting everything that moves but the guy is an absolute warrior along the boards and is fantastic at shielding the puck. While not being super heavy he also bumps guys off of him in close all the time and goes hard to the net. In fact he is a pain around the net and you'll see him hacking at everything to get the rebound. He can also pull off JVR moves in close sometimes by shielding the puck with his back and using his great puck handling skills to put it between his legs or find room to get a shot off from in close.

He also sticks up for his teammates and while not being a fighter he has dropped the gloves at least 6 or 7 times.

To fans of this board 23 is quite long in the tooth to not be an NHL regular but we'll be quite lucky if in four years a player like Grundstrom is putting up PPG for the Marlies and looking to force his way on to one of the last spots for the Leafs. But at that time bobermay will be undeniably perplexed as to why our most recent 2nd rounder isn't higher on our lists because all of the scouting reports around the draft talked about how many great NHL potential qualities he has and how great his style will most likely translate to the NHL game one day. Sort of like what our Leafs scouts were saying soon after...Josh Leivo was drafted...

 

[bobermay]

To fans of this board 23 is quite long in the tooth to not be an NHL regular but we'll be quite lucky if in four years a player like Grundstrom is putting up PPG for the Marlies and looking to force his way on to one of the last spots for the Leafs. But at that time bobermay will be undeniably perplexed as to why our most recent 2nd rounder isn't higher on our lists because all of the scouting reports around the draft talked about how many great NHL potential qualities he has and how great his style will most likely translate to the NHL game one day. Sort of like what our Leafs scouts were saying soon after...Josh Leivo was drafted...

I want to apologize to fellow HFers if my posts/opinions have offended them. It seems like I've offended Stringer Bell, and possibly other posters. This isn't my train of thought, and I can see how my opinions/posts could be interpreted the wrong way.

There were many prospects I was hoping to draft in the second round, and Grundstrom was one of them. I figured we wouldn't have had a shot at him in the late 2nd TBH.

I have also been vocal in recent years in that I don't see what other fans see in Leivo. I don't deny he could make the NHL, he definately has an NHL caliber shot, but it seems to me like he's just missing that extra gear. I could be wrong, I'm not denying that.

But one thing I think we can all agree on is that our future is looking bright! It would be great if 7 or 8 of our current prospects can pan out into impact NHL players.