Prospect Info: 2014 NHL draft discussion - Part III

[truck]

The more I'm hearing and based off my own expectations this draft is going to be a complete mess in terms of predictions. It's going to be all over the place.

Also the more I hear, the more I am not as much worried about Larkin being the Jets pick but rather Larkin might not even make it to the Jets. Interesting.

The talk on his value reminds me of talk surrounding Horvat last year.

Somewhat similar players too (net effect and projection, not style) although I think I like Larkin's, skating, vision and upside more.

Still, would likely pass on either of em for a guy who had more clear 1st line upside.

 

[allan5oh]

There's quite a few interesting draft picks that might step right onto IceCaps as well (Richard Nejezcheleb, Colby Cave, Lucas Wallmark among others).

Excellent point, we had 2 last year.

 

[truck]

There's quite a few interesting draft picks that might step right onto IceCaps as well (Richard Nejezcheleb, Colby Cave, Lucas Wallmark among others).

I still can't believe Wallmark went undrafted.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

The talk on his value reminds me of talk surrounding Horvat last year.

Somewhat similar players too (net effect and projection, not style) although I think I like Larkin's, skating, vision and upside more.

Still, would likely pass on either of em for a guy who had more clear 1st line upside.

I never bought the Horvat hype last year. He was 24 on my list. Still project Horvat more as a 2nd/3rd line tweener. Horvat I'd compare to McCann from the this draft, both in playing style and upside.

Larkin is more of a dynamic offensive player with much more upside. I easily see 1st line potential out of Larkin. He is a great playmaker but he combines that with a great shot and skating. I put Patrick Marleau as my comparison, but with his skills he could be Jeff Carter or better defensively Claude Giroux in reality depending on how it pans out.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

Excellent point, we had 2 last year.

Yup. There's also a couple of interesting prospects that will re-enter draft like Coda Gordon and Brady Vail which I did not even consider when doing my rankings (not that either would be top 65 prospects, but could be considered draftable).

I still can't believe Wallmark went undrafted.

No idea how that happened. Last year I had two players from top 60 go undrafted. One was a big reach which I liked in Alex Coulombe the other was Wallmark. I have no idea how that happened. He is in top 60 for 2nd straight year.

 

[truck]

Yup. There's also a couple of interesting prospects that will re-enter draft like Coda Gordon and Brady Vail which I did not even consider when doing my rankings (not that either would be top 65 prospects, but could be considered draftable).



No idea how that happened. Last year I had two players from top 60 go undrafted. One was a big reach which I liked in Alex Coulombe the other was Wallmark. I have no idea how that happened. He is in top 60 for 2nd straight year.

Considering the kinds of flyers teams take late in the draft leaving Wallmark - regardless of any concussion concerns - makes no sense.

I will never fully understand the GMs in this league.

 

[CorgisPer60]

I'd be pretty happy if we could grab Nejezcheleb in the 3rd round, but I doubt he makes it past the 2nd. The kid's got a pretty decent scoring touch. I didn't get to watch him often enough with the Wheaties, though.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

I'd be pretty happy if we could grab Nejezcheleb in the 3rd round, but I doubt he makes it past the 2nd. The kid's got a pretty decent scoring touch. I didn't get to watch him often enough with the Wheaties, though.

I don't know about Nejezcheleb. He has been passed over twice. He is also not a very impressive skater, which I find takes quite a bit (too much, IMO) of precedence with drafting teams. I wouldn't be surprised with him getting drafted mid-2nd or not getting drafted at all.

 

[CorgisPer60]

Well, invite to training camp to see what he has then?

Edit: Oh, I also thought he was younger than that. If he's been passed over twice already, I'd feel a lot more comfortable using a later pick, not a 3rd.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

Well, invite to training camp to see what he has then?

Edit: Oh, I also thought he was younger than that. If he's been passed over twice already, I'd feel a lot more comfortable using a later pick, not a 3rd.

If he goes undrafted I'd hope Jets would at least invite him to camp. I'd sign him the day after draft to ELC. Like I said I have him rated in top 60 for draft, so I'd have no problem at all drafting him 3rd round. To be honest I have him rated much higher than JC Lipon last year who was selected in the 3rd round by Winnipeg. Remember too guys like Tanner Pearson (1st round), JC Lipon (3rd round) and Sven Andrighetto (3rd round) were all top 3 round selections in the past 2 years despite being passed over twice.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

Also there will be an article coming out soon on my potential picks for the Jets for all 7 rounds. Hope you all will be interested. Be plenty of a new names. The later part of the draft really makes or breaks scouting staffs.

 

[CorgisPer60]

If he goes undrafted I'd hope Jets would at least invite him to camp. I'd sign him the day after draft to ELC. Like I said I have him rated in top 60 for draft, so I'd have no problem at all drafting him 3rd round. To be honest I have him rated much higher than JC Lipon last year who was selected in the 3rd round by Winnipeg. Remember too guys like Tanner Pearson (1st round), JC Lipon (3rd round) and Sven Andrighetto (3rd round) were all top 3 round selections in the past 2 years despite being passed over twice.

Good point. I wish I had the patience for an analytical eye. If skating's a knock against, Rich can always train and improve that.

 

[baronvonadam]

These players will join the Ice Caps:

Ryan Olsen
Connor Hellebuyck
Scott Kosmachuk

Hopefully Jordan Samuels-Thomas is there as well.

Blomquist?

 

[Holden Caulfield]

Blomquist?

He's too young. It's back to junior or NHL for him.

 

[Whileee]

I never bought the Horvat hype last year. He was 24 on my list. Still project Horvat more as a 2nd/3rd line tweener. Horvat I'd compare to McCann from the this draft, both in playing style and upside.

Larkin is more of a dynamic offensive player with much more upside. I easily see 1st line potential out of Larkin. He is a great playmaker but he combines that with a great shot and skating. I put Patrick Marleau as my comparison, but with his skills he could be Jeff Carter or better defensively Claude Giroux in reality depending on how it pans out.

How could the Jets not draft him at #9 if this is an accurate projection?

Has he really shown that much offense and upside as a playmaker? If so, the Jets should go after him for sure. A top-2 C combo of Scheifele and Larkin would be terrific. Size, speed, character, smarts and a 200-foot game.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

How could the Jets not draft him at #9 if this is an accurate projection?

Has he really shown that much offense and upside as a playmaker? If so, the Jets should go after him for sure. A top-2 C combo of Scheifele and Larkin would be terrific. Size, speed, character, smarts and a 200-foot game.

Those are top end projections. My emphasis there was that he shown both great playmaking and goalscoring ability throughout his junior career. Honestly the most common comparison I've heard is Derek Stepan. Many people see him more as a playmaker. But whenever I saw him I saw a he had a wicked wrist shot that he got off real quick, as evidenced by his second on team 48 goals across USDP and USHL.

The thing about Larkin is that he is a Scheifele type riser. He kind of came out of nowhere this year. He was a depth player last year and just took the next step this year.

For me I love his 200 foot game. He skates both up and down the rink hard. He is still very raw in terms of size. He has shown some very great hockey IQ to find the great areas for his goals combined with his shot and in the past has also shown passing ability (the fact that he played with hands and passing Milano almost all year probably reduced his assist total). He has a very high hockey IQ offensively in all aspects. It's why I projected him as a Patrick Marleau, a good skating hard working versatile forward that has a wicked shot while being a solid playmaker as well. Honestly the Larkin-Marleau projection is my absolute favourite among all projections, that's exactly what I see out of him.

I've been told be an NHL scout that at 8 I have him even lower than he has him.

 

[Bob E]

Those are top end projections. My emphasis there was that he shown both great playmaking and goalscoring ability throughout his junior career. Honestly the most common comparison I've heard is Derek Stepan. Many people see him more as a playmaker. But whenever I saw him I saw a he had a wicked wrist shot that he got off real quick, as evidenced by his second on team 48 goals across USDP and USHL.

The thing about Larkin is that he is a Scheifele type riser. He kind of came out of nowhere this year. He was a depth player last year and just took the next step this year.

For me I love his 200 foot game. He skates both up and down the rink hard. He is still very raw in terms of size. He has shown some very great hockey IQ to find the great areas for his goals combined with his shot and in the past has also shown passing ability (the fact that he played with hands and passing Milano almost all year probably reduced his assist total). He has a very high hockey IQ offensively in all aspects. It's why I projected him as a Patrick Marleau, a good skating hard working versatile forward that has a wicked shot while being a solid playmaker as well. Honestly the Larkin-Marleau projection is my absolute favourite among all projections, that's exactly what I see out of him.

I've been told be an NHL scout that at 8 I have him even lower than he has him.

Starting to lose faith that he'll be there at 9 now, thanks a lot.

Though if he slides into the top 8, someone else drops. He does sound like a TNSE pick though. Late riser, 200 ft game, character, speed, hard working, bit of a 'surprise' pick. Though in this draft, there could be a few 'surprise picks' starting early.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

Starting to lose faith that he'll be there at 9 now, thanks a lot.

Though if he slides into the top 8, someone else drops. He does sound like a TNSE pick though. Late riser, 200 ft game, character, speed, hard working, bit of a 'surprise' pick. Though in this draft, there could be a few 'surprise picks' starting early.

I've heard that you might see more than a few "surprise" picks this year. For the average person it'll be who? and the average draft pundit what? (I consider most HFers draft pundits compared to population though haha). That's one thing I'd stress with this draft class in particular even if the Jets take someone rated my 30's, give it time. There are very few NHL ready prospects, we have lots of skill here but it's really raw. This draft won't be decided soon, it'll take quite a bit of time. This draft has plenty of talent but it's very close right now and very unpredictable. We'll see.

I'll still take cred when Kempe and Larking are quality NHLers though . Seriously those are my top targets for Jets.

 

[Aavco Cup]

He's too young. It's back to junior or NHL for him.

There was some talk at development camp/ rookie tourney that he might be AHL eligible. Not sure how accurate that was. Euro rules are a bit fuzzy to me.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

There was some talk at development camp/ rookie tourney that he might be AHL eligible. Not sure how accurate that was. Euro rules are a bit fuzzy to me.

In terms of the NHL draft, he is NOT european. He was drafted/signed out CHL so he is subject to the CHL-NHL agreement. Which means he is ineligible for the AHL next year.

 

[Aavco Cup]

In terms of the NHL draft, he is NOT european. He was drafted/signed out CHL so he is subject to the CHL-NHL agreement. Which means he is ineligible for the AHL next year.

I thought he was a free agent, never drafted.

 

[ps241]

If he goes undrafted I'd hope Jets would at least invite him to camp. I'd sign him the day after draft to ELC. Like I said I have him rated in top 60 for draft, so I'd have no problem at all drafting him 3rd round. To be honest I have him rated much higher than JC Lipon last year who was selected in the 3rd round by Winnipeg. Remember too guys like Tanner Pearson (1st round), JC Lipon (3rd round) and Sven Andrighetto (3rd round) were all top 3 round selections in the past 2 years despite being passed over twice.

Funny you should mention this, last night I was talking to a person connected to Kamloops and I asked him about Lipon and he mentioned JC was a late bloomer physically which is well documented but then he mentioned that JC was a national champ in wakeboarding and it wasn't until he was 18 that he decided to give that dream up and put all his commitments behind hockey. He mentioned after that it’s like a switch went off and he was a different player.

Funny watching the Kings play and how good Pearson looks I recall everyone joking about the Jets taking Pearson. I can't even remember why it became a running joke but I think it was because posters said watch Chevy take Pearson at #9 in the 2012 draft. I have to admit I am surprised by how good he looks in the NHL and I am thrilled for the kid.

I love the underdog types.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

I thought he was a free agent, never drafted.

What you are talking about is not mutually exclusive. Axel Blomqvist took the same route as Martin Jones with the Kings.

Ok so some draft information. Every player when they first hit their draft age is eligible (which is a 17 year old year for most players, 18 year old year for players born after September 15th). IF they fail to get selected in the NHL draft they are free to attend any teams training camp that they wish. Any player that played the PREVIOUS SEASON in North America is then able to sign an ELC with the team that they attended training camp with. Their birth place or where they plan to play the next season does not matter. If they do not sign a contract or played the previous season in Europe they go back into the draft. If the player is a CHL player he is subject to the same CHL-NHL rules as draft picks (if a USHL or other non-CHL player signs he can play in AHL immediately). All players who play in North America if undrafted go through this twice (ie being eligible 3 times) and those who play in Europe go through it three times (being eligible 4 times), but those playing in Europe do not have the option to sign a contract in training camp. After that they become UFA. Any player signed or drafted out of CHL in any year is subject to same rules, they must be 20 (as defined by birth year, not start of season age) before they can play in AHL (only exception is "exceptional" players who play 4 years CHL before 20 years old (15, 16, 17, 18) but that has not happened since to date all "exceptional" players have made NHL before that).

 

[Grind]

Funny you should mention this, last night I was talking to a person connected to Kamloops and I asked him about Lipon and he mentioned JC was a late bloomer physically which is well documented but then he mentioned that JC was a national champ in wakeboarding and it wasn't until he was 18 that he decided to give that dream up and put all his commitments behind hockey. He mentioned after that it’s like a switch went off and he was a different player.

Funny watching the Kings play and how good Pearson looks I recall everyone joking about the Jets taking Pearson. I can't even remember why it became a running joke but I think it was because posters said watch Chevy take Pearson at #9 in the 2012 draft. I have to admit I am surprised by how good he looks in the NHL and I am thrilled for the kid.

I love the underdog types.

Pearson played on a line with Schiefele in Barrie, had risen into the back end of the first in draft rankings, and Atlanta/jets had a history of drafting players out of barrie. I think that's where the joke came from

I was really hoping he'd be available with our 2nd that draft, or that we'd trade up to get him.

instead we got lucas "i'm ****ing terrible at hockey" sutter

 

[Aavco Cup]

What you are talking about is not mutually exclusive. Axel Blomqvist took the same route as Martin Jones with the Kings.

Ok so some draft information. Every player when they first hit their draft age is eligible (which is a 17 year old year for most players, 18 year old year for players born after September 15th). IF they fail to get selected in the NHL draft they are free to attend any teams training camp that they wish. Any player that played the PREVIOUS SEASON in North America is then able to sign an ELC with the team that they attended training camp with. Their birth place or where they plan to play the next season does not matter. If they do not sign a contract or played the previous season in Europe they go back into the draft. If the player is a CHL player he is subject to the same CHL-NHL rules as draft picks (if a USHL or other non-CHL player signs he can play in AHL immediately). All players who play in North America if undrafted go through this twice (ie being eligible 3 times) and those who play in Europe go through it three times (being eligible 4 times), but those playing in Europe do not have the option to sign a contract in training camp. After that they become UFA. Any player signed or drafted out of CHL in any year is subject to same rules, they must be 20 (as defined by birth year, not start of season age) before they can play in AHL (only exception is "exceptional" players who play 4 years CHL before 20 years old (15, 16, 17, 18) but that has not happened since to date all "exceptional" players have made NHL before that).

That's how I understand it too but I believe Axel himself said in an interview (before signed) that he would be willing to play in St. Johns if the Jets signed him. And his agent at one point did the same. It might just have been Axel not being entirely sure of his status or being misinformed by his agent.