2013 Draft Thread IV–June 30 3pm–8 16 38 52 69 129 130 143 159 189–Draft Primer in OP

[Myllz]

and about 5 inches.

are rick nash and carl hagelin similar to you?

Being taller doesn't mean anything, nor does your comparison.

 

[Afinogretzky]

Being taller doesn't mean anything, nor does your comparison.

ok, i'll be more clear. the only thing max and nichushkin have in common is their country of birth. it's a lazy comparison.

 

[Paxon]

ok, i'll be more clear. the only thing max and nichushkin have in common is their country of birth. it's a lazy comparison.

From what I've seen they have a good deal in common. I don't like Nichushkin's shot nor that he tries to stickhandle through an entire team and cut in on net. Two things that were problems with Afinogenov.

 

[Afinogretzky]

From what I've seen they have a good deal in common. I don't like Nichushkin's shot nor that he tries to stickhandle through an entire team and cut in on net. Two things that were problems with Afinogenov.

oh please. never in a million years would Max's name come up if A, Nichushkin wasn't Russian, or B, this wasn't a Sabres board.

One's a water bug, the other is 6'4". It's not close.

 

[Myllz]

oh please. never in a million years would Max's name come up if A, Nichushkin wasn't Russian, or B, this wasn't a Sabres board.

One's a water bug, the other is 6'4". It's not close.

What does his size have to do with playing style?

 

[Paxon]

oh please. never in a million years would Max's name come up if A, Nichushkin wasn't Russian, or B, this wasn't a Sabres board.

One's a water bug, the other is 6'4". It's not close.

Obviously he was brought up because this is a Sabres board. What's the problem with that?

What I said is true, he has those same issues Afinogenov had. He's a few inches taller, OK... does that somehow make trying to stickhandle through the team and not having a good wrist shot not a problem?

 

[1TuchAnd1NoTuch]

What does his size have to do with playing style?

He uses his size to protect the puck and play a power game

 

[Luceni]

Given reasonable scenarios, you're one of the few.

I'd still take Lindholm or Monahan over Nichu, and I have to think really long and hard before taking him over Ristolainen.

Just no.

With Girgs, Larsson we have got two very good two way centers close to nhl centeres.

If Lindholm, Monahan and Nichuskin are available, than you have too take the best offensive forward and the fastest player out of that trio. We need speed badly. And we need am elite scoret. nishuskin is more likely going to become an elite scorer than Monahan/Lindholm due his skillset alone.

Ristolainen/Nurse are the "coward-safe"-picks in the first round. Both will for sure make the NHL and both have got a solid defenseive awareness already. But also both of them are limited offensivly and have the fewest room to improve. If one of them is available at 16 we have to take him, especially if we make the risky pick with Nishuskin at 8th.

My dream szenario is that Drouin falls to 5, we put together a package (8th + 36th pick) and draft him. then we could go with ha risly pick @ 16 too.

 

[Afinogretzky]

Obviously he was brought up because this is a Sabres board. What's the problem with that?

What I said is true, he has those same issues Afinogenov had. He's a few inches taller, OK... does that somehow make trying to stickhandle through the team and not having a good wrist shot not a problem?

one has the frame to get a lot bigger, the other doesn't.

and using old players from the same organization or the same country as a comparison is lazy. you're just cramming them into an already formed opinion and forcing them to fit.

 

[Luceni]

Nichuskin has the frame/body to dangle through the defenders. Afinogenov was a small bug compared to nichuskin.

If nichuskin is available at 8th, DR shouldn't think twice and take him.

 

[1972]

Saying Nichushkin is like Afinogenov reminds me of the people who said Grigorenko is like Malkin

 

[Paxon]

one has the frame to get a lot bigger, the other doesn't.

and using old players from the same organization or the same country as a comparison is lazy. you're just cramming them into an already formed opinion and forcing them to fit.

I'm not cramming anyone into an already-formed opinion and I'm not forcing anything. I stated that, like Afinogenov, Nichushkin has several problems in his game. If those remain problems, like Afinogenov, he will struggle to produce at a high level in the NHL. The fact they're both Russian is meaningless. I'm one of the biggest fans of Russian players on the Sabres board and was a fan of Afinogenov for all his problems. So he has a bigger frame, so what? That's irrelevant to a discussion of his hockey sense or his questionably accurate shot.

The idea that Nichushkin will be an elite offensive player in the NHL is a nice idea, but it's far from certain. Another comment just implied he has a better chance of being an elite scorer than Monahan or Lindholm. If he does, it's a not a considerably greater chance while they have a much better chance of being good hockey players. Nichushkin needs to completely change his game if he wants to be a high-end NHL player, and if he isn't a high-end NHL player he probably isn't an NHL player at all.

It's not like he blew anyone away with his play in the KHL to the point where you'd think he'll be great offensively in the NHL. People are in love with his combination of size and skating. It's hardly unfair then that I am questioning things that do not involve his size or skating.

 

[wunderpanda]

Nichushkin was named KHL rookie of the year and traded for 10 million dollars. He impressed someone.

 

[jfb392]

Nichushkin was named KHL rookie of the year and traded for 10 million dollars. He impressed someone.

Well, he's built to be a star in the international game and KHL people realize that.
The international game is different than the North American game, though.

 

[Paxon]

Nichushkin was named KHL rookie of the year and traded for 10 million dollars. He impressed someone.

Well, he is impressive. His size + speed is impressive. He's fun to watch. What he isn't is showing anything that would make you think he's definitely going to have an impact on the NHL when he wasn't overly impressive in his time in the KHL. Of course, he's just a kid. I'm not saying he should be dominating the KHL. It's a matter of where people are now projecting him as an elite player, it seems it's mostly based on size and speed.

 

[Superhero]

I'm hoping that the Sabres will somehow obtain another 1st round pick and get Hartman. He has speed, tenacity, physicality, and is solid both offensively and defensively.

 

[BloFan4Life]

Well, he is impressive. His size + speed is impressive. He's fun to watch. What he isn't is showing anything that would make you think he's definitely going to have an impact on the NHL when he wasn't overly impressive in his time in the KHL. Of course, he's just a kid. I'm not saying he should be dominating the KHL. It's a matter of where people are now projecting him as an elite player, it seems it's mostly based on size and speed.

If he was in the Q, he would have been a top player and fighting with the other two Q players for the top spot. Don't let stats dilute your perception of his talent. The kid is unbelievable in terms of things you can't teach. A guy that big, with that much speed and that much dangle doesn't come along often.

 

[wunderpanda]

Well, he is impressive. His size + speed is impressive. He's fun to watch. What he isn't is showing anything that would make you think he's definitely going to have an impact on the NHL when he wasn't overly impressive in his time in the KHL. Of course, he's just a kid. I'm not saying he should be dominating the KHL. It's a matter of where people are now projecting him as an elite player, it seems it's mostly based on size and speed.

Agreed 100%. He did get better as the playoffs went on tho, even earned playing time during OT in the finals. Thats the part that got my attention, he didn't look out of place or intimidated in that high stress situation.

 

[Paxon]

If he was in the Q, he would have been a top player and fighting with the other two Q players for the top spot. Don't let stats dilute your perception of his talent. The kid is unbelievable in terms of things you can't teach. A guy that big, with that much speed and that much dangle doesn't come along often.

I'm not letting stats dilute my perception. I often give credit to Euros playing in men's leagues and don't put much stock in the stats 17 and 18 year olds put up in any league. I've seen Nichushkin play and while I think he could be a very good player I cringe to think about the other possibility.

His dangle doesn't impress me that much, frankly. What is impressive is his skating, especially for his considerable size.

 

[jfb392]

If he was in the Q, he would have been a top player and fighting with the other two Q players for the top spot. Don't let stats dilute your perception of his talent. The kid is unbelievable in terms of things you can't teach. A guy that big, with that much speed and that much dangle doesn't come along often.

Or his flaws would be even more glaring after hundreds of game reports were filed on him.

 

[Paxon]

I'm hoping that the Sabres will somehow obtain another 1st round pick and get Hartman. He has speed, tenacity, physicality, and is solid both offensively and defensively.

He'd be a fan favorite for sure

 

[BloFan4Life]

Or his flaws would be even more glaring after hundreds of game reports were filed on him.

He would destroy the Q. The league is a defensive joke.

 

[EichHart]

He would destroy the Q. The league is a defensive joke.

I have a hard time comparing the strength of leagues sometimes. Granlund absolutely "dominated" in a "Mens" league for his age. The view from the Minnesota forum is he is already a bust in the NHL. The majority of them believe he will never live up to the hype he got from performing so well in that league. Sometimes it is just difficult to compare players in juniors, European leagues, KHL, etc....So many factors go into this as how good each team is, the age of the players on each team, the training and support each player gets from the staff, etc....

 

[Jame]

He would destroy the Q. The league is a defensive joke.

join us in the present

 

[Paxon]

He would destroy the Q. The league is a defensive joke.

The Q isn't anything like it used to be. The three CHL sub-leagues aren't as unique as they once were. Of more interest is how his game would play on NA-sized ice. Of all the Euros who come to the CHL for various reasons, Nichushkin's the one I wish came over so we could see how he adjusts to the ice and expanded his game as would be necessary.