2001 Devils and Avalanche best teams ever?

[GordieHowsUrBreath]

are these the best teams ever?

lemieux said the devils were the best team he ever faced in the playoffs, then the avs beat them without forsberg

does this make them the best teams ever

this article has the quote

http://www.vindy.com/news/2001/may/20/nhl-playoffs-somber-mellon-arena-may-not-see-game/?print

Click to read more...

 

[983 others]

2001 Devils probably wouldn't even be in the top 50 teams of all time.

2001 Avalanche would probably be like top 30 or something.

 

[Hisch13r]

No. It might be the finals with the best competition though

 

[93LEAFS]

No. It'd be one of the dynasty Oilers, Isles or Habs teams. Best team of the post fall of the iron curtain would probably be the 1996-97 Red Wings.

 

[Jason MacIsaac]

Statistically during the regular season they were one of the better teams of the last 30 years. Patrick Roy is the only reason NJ didn't win the cup that year. The best goaltender ever played like it.

 

[LordNeverLose]

'50s Habs
'70s Habs
'80s Isles
'80s Oilers

Those are the best teams of all-time.

 

[Mad Brills*]

I do think it's the best finals ever in terms of pure talent on each team though.

 

[LordNeverLose]

I do think it's the best finals ever in terms of pure talent on each team though.

'83 or '84 Finals

Dynasty Isles vs. Dynasty Oilers

 

[sfoote]

are these the best teams ever?

lemieux said the devils were the best team he ever faced in the playoffs, then the avs beat them without forsberg

does this make them the best teams ever

this article has the quote

http://www.vindy.com/news/2001/may/20/nhl-playoffs-somber-mellon-arena-may-not-see-game/?print

Wha, wha, what ?

 

[sfoote]

I do think it's the best finals ever in terms of pure talent on each team though.

Again, wha, wha, what ?. I guess you missed the '83 or '84 finals or have never youtubed them.

 

[Brodeur]

lemieux said the devils were the best team he ever faced in the playoffs, then the avs beat them without forsberg

does this make them the best teams ever

That's a pretty big conclusion to jump to. Mario said the Devils were the best team he had ever faced in the playoffs, not necessarily the best team of all time. Lemieux's playoff history is a little bit shorter than most would think (1988-2001). Mario obviously didn't get to compete in the playoffs against a bunch of teams.

The article is also from right after the Devils took a 3-1 series lead in the 2001 ECF. I generally wouldn't take a ton of quotes at face value when players are speaking in the heat of the moment.

 

[Big Phil]

There are those of us that think the 2001 Devils are the best team in franchise history. Better than 1995, 2000 or 2003 who ended up winning each time. I don't necessarily disagree with that. The 2001 Devils had a "feel" about them. I mean, they lost in 2001, but there is still a bit of reverence for them being such a well rounded team. The "A" line was in top form, Stevens, Niedermayer, Rafalski and Daneyko were all on defense. That Brodeur guy was in net. They had more points in the regular season than any other time in their history and they were 2nd in points in 2001 behind Colorado which was a team possessed to win.

In a way they remind me of the 1976 Flyers. Not style-wise, but in the way that they were the defending champs, probably looking as good as they ever did and had a team at least as good as the previous Cup winners but they played a team in the final that was better than any other one they faced.

As for the Lemieux comments, I can see that. Heck, I might even agree with him. The 2001 Devils really shut him down and Lemieux wouldn't have the biggest pool of great teams to choose from that he played against:

1989 - Rangers, Flyers
1991 - Devils, Capitals, Bruins, Northstars
1992 - Capitals, Rangers, Bruins, Hawks
1993 - Devils, Islanders
1994 - Capitals
1996 - Capitals, Rangers, Panthers
1997 - Flyers
2001 - Capitals, Sabres, Devils

That's it. Look at that list. What teams are considered "near great" teams on that list? 1991 Bruins, 1997 Flyers and 2001 Devils. That's all I see. Maybe 1992 Hawks but they had only 87 points that year. If the 2001 Devils aren't the best playoff team Mario faced then who is?

 

[LightningStorm]

What a finals this was. The 2 teams were on a collision course to meet all season long. Colorado had the best record, the MVP in Joe Sakic, and Ray Bourque chasing that elusive cup in his 22nd season. New Jersey had the 2nd best record and was the defending champs. And of course this ended in maybe the most iconic Stanley Cup moment ever with Sakic handing the cup straight to Bourque.

One thing I distinctly remember about this series was Joe Sakic embarrassing Scott Stevens at times. He scored a goal in game 1 where he deked Stevens so bad that Stevens was crawling on the ice. In game 7, Stevens went to hit Sakic, but Sakic ran him over and knocked him down. Then came the goal that put the Avs up 3-0 in that game where Sakic faked out Stevens with a slap shot then shot the puck in between Stevens's legs for a goal. All while Sakic was using Stevens to screen Brodeur.

Overall, Sakic had 4 goals and 5 assists (9 points) that series. What makes this even more impressive was Forsberg being out allowed Stevens to be out there against Sakic more. Plus Stevens was playing at a high level, having shut down Lemieux and Jagr the previous series. But in the finals Sakic played like the Hart trophy winner he was that season.

 

[LightningStorm]

There are those of us that think the 2001 Devils are the best team in franchise history. Better than 1995, 2000 or 2003 who ended up winning each time. I don't necessarily disagree with that. The 2001 Devils had a "feel" about them. I mean, they lost in 2001, but there is still a bit of reverence for them being such a well rounded team.

I think they were definitely better than the 1995 and 2003 teams. The 2000 team was basically the same once Robinson came in though. They started playing at this 2001 level in 2000 after Ftorek was fired and Robinson replaced him, with them going on to beat my Stars in the finals. In 2001 they were able to play at their post Ftorek 2000 level for the whole season, but unfortunately ran into what is arguably an all time great team in the 2001 Avalanche.

As for the Lemieux comments, I can see that. Heck, I might even agree with him. The 2001 Devils really shut him down and Lemieux wouldn't have the biggest pool of great teams to choose from that he played against:

1989 - Rangers, Flyers
1991 - Devils, Capitals, Bruins, Northstars
1992 - Capitals, Rangers, Bruins, Hawks
1993 - Devils, Islanders
1994 - Capitals
1996 - Capitals, Rangers, Panthers
1997 - Flyers
2001 - Capitals, Sabres, Devils

That's it. Look at that list. What teams are considered "near great" teams on that list? 1991 Bruins, 1997 Flyers and 2001 Devils. That's all I see. Maybe 1992 Hawks but they had only 87 points that year. If the 2001 Devils aren't the best playoff team Mario faced then who is?

How about the 1992 Rangers? They were the President's trophy winners who won the cup 2 seasons later. Messier was MVP and Leetch won the Norris that season as well.

 

[BenchBrawl]

No, they are not.

The best team ever in my opinion is the late-50s Montreal dynasty, especially the early part with Rocket Richard still on top.

 

[Big Phil]

How about the 1992 Rangers? They were the President's trophy winners who won the cup 2 seasons later. Messier was MVP and Leetch won the Norris that season as well.

Fair enough, but they didn't even make it out of the 2nd round that year. I think the 1992 Rangers are a downgrade for sure from the 2001 Devils.

 

[Doctor No]

Fair enough, but they didn't even make it out of the 2nd round that year.

Yeah, because they were beaten - by Lemieux's Penguins.

The natural extension to your point is that players can't beat great teams (because if they get beaten, then they can't be great).

 

[Fear the Wushu]

'50s Habs
'70s Habs
'80s Isles
'80s Oilers

Those are the best teams of all-time.

Have to disagree. The Avs, Wings, and Devils of the 90's/00's are much more balanced teams then then 80's dynasty teams.

Just look at the forward and defensive makeup of the teams and then add legendary goaltenders on all three squads (Roy, Marty, Hasek) The 80's teams would have had a hard time dealing with the physicality/system play of all three teams. I am a bit biased but in regards to the NHL imo storyline, star power, and rivalries, the 90's/00's is without parallel in NHL history.

 

[BraveCanadian]

are these the best teams ever?

Not even close.

The Avs were a real strong team, though.

 

[tony d]

Nope, it was a great series but the teams aren't the best all time.

 

[quoipourquoi]

The Avalanche nearly made it through the entire playoffs without ever trailing by more than 1 goal (the Devils finally took a 3-1 lead in Game 5). That has to be rare for the four-round era. Not a dynasty team, but still one that went to Game 7 of the WCF in the three years surrounding their championship - with the best roster being 2001 (the only one that had Bourque/Blake/Foote - half of Canada's Olympic defense).

Weak penalty kill might be susceptible to high-end PP units, but as a single-season team, they might be top-3 of the four-round playoff era. Killer top-two lines and they dropped a cumulative .940 (502/534) on teams that finished 1st in GF in the East and 3rd and 4th in the West. Put them against the 1984 Oilers with a healthy Fuhr and a healthy Forsberg, and you'll have a good show.

 

[double5son10]

Have to disagree. The Avs, Wings, and Devils of the 90's/00's are much more balanced teams then then 80's dynasty teams.

Just look at the forward and defensive makeup of the teams and then add legendary goaltenders on all three squads (Roy, Marty, Hasek) The 80's teams would have had a hard time dealing with the physicality/system play of all three teams. I am a bit biased but in regards to the NHL imo storyline, star power, and rivalries, the 90's/00's is without parallel in NHL history.

This shows a decided lack of knowledge about those Islanders and Oilers squads. Last I checked both sides had legendary, HoF goalies in Smith & Fuhr, I'd take ANY of the Isles & Oilers third lines over what the Avs could roll out & say those 80s teams are the equal of the other two, and did you just write that the Isles and Oilers would've struggled with physical play? Let's see Isles: Potvin, Trottier, Gillies, Nystrom, Tonelli, Goring, Howatt, Morrow & two Sutters; Oilers: Messier, Anderson, Linseman, Semenko, McClelland, Fogolin, Gregg, Smith, Tikkanen, McSorley & Beukeboom. These guys couldn't handle physical play? Har har. And as far as systems, you would seem to suggest Al Arbour & Glen Sather wouldn't be up to the task as coaches. Last I checked they were both HoFers as well. I think they'd adjust just fine.

 

[Big Phil]

Yeah, because they were beaten - by Lemieux's Penguins.

The natural extension to your point is that players can't beat great teams (because if they get beaten, then they can't be great).

The 2001 Devils beat Lemieux's Penguins and had already been to the dance a year earlier. I know I would take the 2001 Devils over the 1992 Rangers any day of the week.

 

[Bleedred]

Not the two best teams ever, but definitely one of the most recent times that two of the league's absolutely best teams squared off head to head in the finals.

Was this the last time a 1 seed vs 1 seed matchup happened in the finals? I think it might have been, too lazy to look up right now though.

 

[snipes]

This shows a decided lack of knowledge about those Islanders and Oilers squads. Last I checked both sides had legendary, HoF goalies in Smith & Fuhr, I'd take ANY of the Isles & Oilers third lines over what the Avs could roll out & say those 80s teams are the equal of the other two, and did you just write that the Isles and Oilers would've struggled with physical play? Let's see Isles: Potvin, Trottier, Gillies, Nystrom, Tonelli, Goring, Howatt, Morrow & two Sutters; Oilers: Messier, Anderson, Linseman, Semenko, McClelland, Fogolin, Gregg, Smith, Tikkanen, McSorley & Beukeboom. These guys couldn't handle physical play? Har har. And as far as systems, you would seem to suggest Al Arbour & Glen Sather wouldn't be up to the task as coaches. Last I checked they were both HoFers as well. I think they'd adjust just fine.

Great post.

It's hilarious that he thinks the 80s Oilers wouldn't be able to handle the physicality or toughness of the 90s/early 2000s Wings, Avs, and Devils. Semenko, McSorley, Messier, Anderson, etc. could more than handle those teams.

It's funny, some people think the 80s Oilers were all skill. They weren't. It was the opposing team fearing laying a hand on Gretzky that also helped give him so much space beyond his unparalleled vision. The 80s Oilers were one of the toughest teams in the league. Messier was an absolute animal during his years with the Oilers.

To the OP: No those teams aren't even close to the best ever. I would take the 50s Habs, as well as the 80s Isles and Oilers without question.