He obviously raised his hands on top of his head in disgust and disappointment. His body language can be seen even in a low quality video and it clearly tells he wasn't celebrating.
Olympics: Wouldn't it be cool to see other countries play in Sochi?
- Thread starter Eagle Eye Cherry
- Start date
He obviously raised his hands on top of his head in disgust and disappointment. His body language can be seen even in a low quality video and it clearly tells he wasn't celebrating.
Siamese Dream
Registered User
Indeed, and with a goalie brought out of retirement after the #1 got injured. There was almost a miraculous comeback against France. Then when all was lost, a 21 year old goalie with no senior team experience was put in against Kazakhstan and kept the score respectable.
IIRC it was something like 6-1 against Latvia, 4-2 against France, and 6-0 against Kazakhstan
Denmark is slowly moving it's way towards the top eight.
As for Holland it is also partly the climate and the canals they used for their long skating runs. That developed the tradition but the climate is too unpredictable to develop for playing on natural rinks which is how the game started in Scotland.
Poland were fairly decent Oliwa and company but have declined but are trying to make a concerted effort to move forward.
The Baltic states efforts at hockey were disrupted by their takeover and since then basketball is Lithuania's game along with a growing affection for rugby.
Elsewhere the climate is not really suited to a winter sports mentality or the facilities are lacking. Even here in GB.
But there are efforts in Argentina, India for example to develop the game.
As for Holland it is also partly the climate and the canals they used for their long skating runs. That developed the tradition but the climate is too unpredictable to develop for playing on natural rinks which is how the game started in Scotland.
Poland were fairly decent Oliwa and company but have declined but are trying to make a concerted effort to move forward.
The Baltic states efforts at hockey were disrupted by their takeover and since then basketball is Lithuania's game along with a growing affection for rugby.
Elsewhere the climate is not really suited to a winter sports mentality or the facilities are lacking. Even here in GB.
But there are efforts in Argentina, India for example to develop the game.
We'd be a pretty top hockey nation by now but for the organizational mess of the sport here.
Strangely North American as it were sports have taken a hold here ie baseball was huge in the early part of the twentieth century but never kicked on for various reasons. Not that I like baseball.
Shame about hockey. We need another Wembley Lions team.
QnebO
Wheel, snipe, celly
- Feb 11, 2010
- 9,763
- 644
#synthetic ice
#pricedevelopment
Goverments / Towns build those outdoor rinks with public money.. I hope synthetic ice gets cheaper, and then I'm sure in democratic countries where taxes are actually used for peoples wealth, there will be hockey rinks too. In extreme capitalist countries this of course would never happen. But in synthetic ice, I see possibility.. for outdoor rinks but maybe for hockey arenas too. Why couldn't hockey leagues be played in that type of "ice" in southern part of the world.
#fieldhockey
#noiceneeded
Why would an Indian start playing ice hockey? Why? Most people there haven't even seen snow.
A good portion of them think we live in igloos and among polar bears and that we probably should move somewhere South where you don't need to stay indoors in order not to die during wintertime.
It's just not a part of their life and never will be.
ozo
Registered User
- Feb 24, 2010
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There isn't much separating countries from 9th to 18th place in the IIHF rankings, but the there is such a huge gulf in quality and skill between the real medal candidates and Latvias, Austrias, Norways, Slovenias of this world that addition of more of such countries is really pointless. Current format is quite ok - as a Latvian I'm already proud that we once again squeezed ourselves in this elite tournament.
QnebO
Wheel, snipe, celly
- Feb 11, 2010
- 9,763
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Well, it could be one of their Favourite sports. Hockey is so fun to play, have noticed? That is why I play it, that is why most of us play it, it has NOTHING to do with weather or snow. I even go play it at summers when its +20. Every summer we have couple of tournaments. And i'm not even a semi pro, semi pros and pros have much more chances to play at summer. It is so great game to play, much better than football ect, that its most cerntain that there would be alot of people who would like to play it. It is not so liked sport because we couldn't play football ect... It's just so FUN to play.
That's why it easily could be part of peoples life in south. Reason why people play hockey has nothing to do with cold weather to be honest. It doesn't matter if there is snow or not, is it south or north, as long as there is possibility to play hockey no one cares. That's why I said synthetic ice, maybe you don't realize what it is? Put that in youtube or google... California has great hockey program going on as well, and they are in south. Its ridiculously cleaer that cold weather alone isn't needed to play hockey and it just proves it. All we need is chance to play, and great game will be liked once people get to know it.
Field hockey ect has nothing to do with real hockey. They are so different, that cant replace hockey any way.
What you say is the reason why hockey is so popular in North and not in south, its true. But in the future, the same 1900's limitations might not apply anymore, as techniques move forward. If there are circumstances to play, there will be players.
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While ice hockey may require ice to play on which does restrict natural venues and also requires some pretty expensive equipment to pick up and play as opposed to say association football the attitudes of the previous posts from our friends in Latvia is not the right one.
The IIHF haave been and will continue to grow the sport in the future so it becomes global.
We are limited by our short lifespans but in a couple of hundred years assuming we haven't rendered ourselves extinct because of out stupidity it may well be the case.
Rugby union for instance while easier to pick up and play has been growing in countries where a few years ago people might have said what is it when you talked about it.
I also disagree about limiting the Olympic hockey finals to a few countries ie just the so called big eight.
The finals give other countries and their programmes and players something to aspire. After all the taking part is just as important as winning.
It raises the profile of the sport in their country as well and is important for the sport's growth.
At the football and rugby world cups only a few countries have a realistic shot at winning it as well but the importance of the finals for each discipline is how it raises the profile of the sport and gives a boost in particular to the countries competing within it and impetus for others to try and reach the finals over a timeframe their own sports bodies think is realistic.
The IIHF haave been and will continue to grow the sport in the future so it becomes global.
We are limited by our short lifespans but in a couple of hundred years assuming we haven't rendered ourselves extinct because of out stupidity it may well be the case.
Rugby union for instance while easier to pick up and play has been growing in countries where a few years ago people might have said what is it when you talked about it.
I also disagree about limiting the Olympic hockey finals to a few countries ie just the so called big eight.
The finals give other countries and their programmes and players something to aspire. After all the taking part is just as important as winning.
It raises the profile of the sport in their country as well and is important for the sport's growth.
At the football and rugby world cups only a few countries have a realistic shot at winning it as well but the importance of the finals for each discipline is how it raises the profile of the sport and gives a boost in particular to the countries competing within it and impetus for others to try and reach the finals over a timeframe their own sports bodies think is realistic.
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you know how they have exhibition sports? they should do that as a b tournament for the non tradtitonal hockey nations at the olypmics
Ice hockey has nothing to do with ice or snow? That is the one and only reason you and I have played it. I think you fail to realize the connection between these two phenomena.
I strongly suggest you to go and talk to someone outside of your region. Tell them about how they should invest their monthly salary into a sport which revolves around people sliding around on a solid state of water OR a solid-water substitute (synthetic ice) that costs a couple of hundred thousand euros to install.
Obviously, you'll have to convince the national/municipal government that they need to invest dozens/hundreds of millions of euros into building a series of giant freezers with seats, so more people could slide around on solid water and organize themselves into teams collectivelly sliding around on solid water.
California has a great hockey programme? Do you know how many NHL players spent their childhood years there? Do you know how they all started playing hockey? Do you know at what age they all moved out of California?
Do you know that California is a part of the United States? Do you know that NHL is based in the United States of America and as an effect gains nationwide exposure to the league and the sport?There's not a single example of hockey succesfully developing outside of the global snow cover zone. Mind you, I'm not talking about some localized points around ice rinks where some people play hockey, but otherwise the sport is completely 100% marginal on a national level. In that case we already have "great hockey programmes" in Australia, South Africa, Middle East, etc.
We're talking about nations that could raise thousands of ice hockey players on their own and qualify for the Olympic Games.
What specifically makes you think that it might be the case?
Rugby is in no way a valid comparison.
jwhouk
Former Cheesehead, Always a Preds Fan
I don't think team Thailand would want to play in an international tournament, not after their fiasco at the Asian winter games a few years back.
Shootmaster_44
Registered User
What I've often wondered is why they don't go back to the 1998 format? I realize the largest complaint was that the NHL didn't shut down for it and very few NHLers from those countries played. But having the final two qualifying rounds as the opening rounds of the actual Olympic tournament would be nice to see brought back.
I've often thought that part of the reason that the weaker teams are blown out is that they don't have time to gel as a team. I know it is an even playing field, but the weaker teams need help to be competitive. By playing an opening round as part of the Olympic tournament, this would help them gel as a team and perhaps after 3 games, might not be lambs led to the slaughter as in the past.
As for Japan at the Worlds, they didn't pay to be there. If I remember right, the IIHF attempted to grow the game in Asia by holding what they called the Far East Qualification Tournament every year, guaranteeing the winner a spot in the main draw. Since it really didn't spur hockey to greater heights in Asia as a result of it, they stopped doing it. If I remember right, it was always Japan that qualified and they usually blew out the other teams participating in that tournament.
I know the NHL would never commit to something like this, but I would like to see Olympic qualifying resemble World Cup of soccer qualifying. There is no guaranteed spots except for the host and everyone must win their way in. You weight the continental groups, so that it is fair. I would say North America should get 1 automatic spot and Europe 3. The second stage would see the second place North American team, the winner of Asia, some number of European finishers and perhaps the winner of an African/South American/Oceania tournament play for the remaining spots.
The North American tournament, could feature a double round robin (as I assume only Canada, US and Mexico would participate) format and the top two (I assume Canada and the US) would then play a best of 7 tournament for the North American spot. This could be spread over a two summer period.
But the point would be the United Arab Emirates has just as much of a chance of making the Olympics as Canada. Of course, generally much like World Cup of soccer qualifying, the Faroe Islands of the world are gone fairly quickly, but it would be interesting to see the mix of teams that might come out of this. You could see a shocker where say Denmark gets in but Russia does not. Also, by only granting North America one spot for the champion, it does mean that in theory either Canada or the US could fail to qualify.
I've often thought that part of the reason that the weaker teams are blown out is that they don't have time to gel as a team. I know it is an even playing field, but the weaker teams need help to be competitive. By playing an opening round as part of the Olympic tournament, this would help them gel as a team and perhaps after 3 games, might not be lambs led to the slaughter as in the past.
As for Japan at the Worlds, they didn't pay to be there. If I remember right, the IIHF attempted to grow the game in Asia by holding what they called the Far East Qualification Tournament every year, guaranteeing the winner a spot in the main draw. Since it really didn't spur hockey to greater heights in Asia as a result of it, they stopped doing it. If I remember right, it was always Japan that qualified and they usually blew out the other teams participating in that tournament.
I know the NHL would never commit to something like this, but I would like to see Olympic qualifying resemble World Cup of soccer qualifying. There is no guaranteed spots except for the host and everyone must win their way in. You weight the continental groups, so that it is fair. I would say North America should get 1 automatic spot and Europe 3. The second stage would see the second place North American team, the winner of Asia, some number of European finishers and perhaps the winner of an African/South American/Oceania tournament play for the remaining spots.
The North American tournament, could feature a double round robin (as I assume only Canada, US and Mexico would participate) format and the top two (I assume Canada and the US) would then play a best of 7 tournament for the North American spot. This could be spread over a two summer period.
But the point would be the United Arab Emirates has just as much of a chance of making the Olympics as Canada. Of course, generally much like World Cup of soccer qualifying, the Faroe Islands of the world are gone fairly quickly, but it would be interesting to see the mix of teams that might come out of this. You could see a shocker where say Denmark gets in but Russia does not. Also, by only granting North America one spot for the champion, it does mean that in theory either Canada or the US could fail to qualify.
Yeah I would love to see China one day, in either the Olympics or the WC.
I think if no Chinese business person(s) are willing to invest a large amount of cash in hockey here, I think our only hope is that Russians or Canadians would be interested in developing Chinese hockey. For what reason I don't know. Out of kindness perhaps.
Someone mentioned Asian teams in MHL and MHL-B, VHL etc. I think that could be one way. If Russians were interested in including Chinese, Koreans and Japanese teams in the junior and lower leagues. This would help to develop a lot. Maybe we can have Russian coaches and staff to help build hockey in the northern parts to begin with.
I think if no Chinese business person(s) are willing to invest a large amount of cash in hockey here, I think our only hope is that Russians or Canadians would be interested in developing Chinese hockey. For what reason I don't know. Out of kindness perhaps.
Someone mentioned Asian teams in MHL and MHL-B, VHL etc. I think that could be one way. If Russians were interested in including Chinese, Koreans and Japanese teams in the junior and lower leagues. This would help to develop a lot. Maybe we can have Russian coaches and staff to help build hockey in the northern parts to begin with.
Shootmaster_44
Registered User
Yeah I would love to see China one day, in either the Olympics or the WC.
I think if no Chinese business person(s) are willing to invest a large amount of cash in hockey here, I think our only hope is that Russians or Canadians would be interested in developing Chinese hockey. For what reason I don't know. Out of kindness perhaps.
Someone mentioned Asian teams in MHL and MHL-B, VHL etc. I think that could be one way. If Russians were interested in including Chinese, Koreans and Japanese teams in the junior and lower leagues. This would help to develop a lot. Maybe we can have Russian coaches and staff to help build hockey in the northern parts to begin with.
If you want to get technical China is in the World Championship. They are in Division II Group B, which is still part of the World Championship. But I get what you mean, you mean the Top Level.
There was some interest in women's hockey in China was there not? I remember the first couple Olympics featured China. For awhile they were competitive at the World Women's Championship too. What happened? Did the results not come, so the government stripped the funding?
You are way too optimistic/naive about the difference in quality between different national teams.
The teams at the very bottom of the rankings are basically still learning to play ice hockey. They don't even have a full lineup.
Teams ranked 35th and lower would see scores like 0:40, 0:50 or more against the top teams.
Even teams like Lithuania (#26) or Spain (#30) would have a really hard time trying to not lose by more than a 10 goal margin to 2nd tier national teams (Germany, Norway, Latvia, etc.).
Teams ranked 25th and above are semi-decent and could try to hold a respectable score against teams outside of the big 8, but would get absolutely pummeled by everyone else.
There's just literally zero potential for a major surprise. There are about 18-20 teams that can in theory try to qualify.
In Euro/World Cup qualification they have a two-round robin, so the chances of a possible major upset are actually reduced, when compared to the current system.
UPD: Also, all the weaker teams actually have a better team chemistry than teams from the Big 8. Everyone knows each other, everyone has played with each other at the junior level, etc. There's no depth and most players represent the national team on a regular basis with little to no changes every year.
novisor
Registered User
There is a large group of teams right below the Big 7 (Big 8 now, Switzerland is a team that qualifies for every tournament and they are consistently beating/having close games with Big 7 teams) that are essentially all equally in ability:
Theres an upper "tier" of these teams that regularly qualify for big tournaments with the Big 8 being: Norway, Latvia, Denmark, Germany + Austria and Slovenia (little weaker than first 4, though both in Olympics)
And a lower "tier" that usually do not qualify for big tournaments but have in the past, and their participation in WHC and WJC is not surprising: Belarus, Ukraine, Kazakstan, Italy, France.
I am quite surprised at the Degradation of Belorussian hockey of late after their 4th place finish at the 2002 OG. They have NHL calibre talent in Grabovski, as well as the Kostitsyn brothers but have finished a dismal 14th place at the last 3 WHC, and did not qualify for the 2006 and 2014 Olympics.
Theres an upper "tier" of these teams that regularly qualify for big tournaments with the Big 8 being: Norway, Latvia, Denmark, Germany + Austria and Slovenia (little weaker than first 4, though both in Olympics)
And a lower "tier" that usually do not qualify for big tournaments but have in the past, and their participation in WHC and WJC is not surprising: Belarus, Ukraine, Kazakstan, Italy, France.
I am quite surprised at the Degradation of Belorussian hockey of late after their 4th place finish at the 2002 OG. They have NHL calibre talent in Grabovski, as well as the Kostitsyn brothers but have finished a dismal 14th place at the last 3 WHC, and did not qualify for the 2006 and 2014 Olympics.
IIHFjerseycollector
Registered User
id put Belarus and France in your top paragraph and switch out Austria and Slovenia, who are consistent elevator teams..France has been in the top level since 2007. Belarus since 2002. France also beat Russia in the worlds last year and is developing some NHL players.
The degredation of Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine is a bit surprising.Ukraine fell all the way to Div 1B last year.
That would be cool, but having the best players playing in the NHL tops that, AINEC.
Yes the top, the only one that really matters.
Actually the government has never really funded ice hockey in China, if I understand what you mean. It's very much a grassroot sport, and in Shanghai for example the club owner of the team, he himself offers free hockey equipment for the women that wants to practice hockey, he pays for it with his own money. The government couldn't care less.
So it's the individuals that keeps this sport alive here.
What happened to the women's team I don't really know. Perhaps a combination of the other countries getting better and China standing still or getting worse.
thekernel
Registered User
- Apr 11, 2011
- 6,259
- 3,517
So basically you want to watch all the shoddy teams from the NHL14 National teams in live action? I mean, as much as I want to see other nations become competitive in hockey, they already have a relegation/qualification system in place.
On a quasi-related note, when does the Olympic rosters update drop on NHL14?
And yet they didn't qualify.
There's not enough time for a 16-team tournament. 4 groups with 4 teams each sounds like a decent idea at first, but if only the top 2 teams advance to the play-off stage, you'll see that the groups will always be completely unbalanced. The top 2 seeds are going to be something like Sweden&Canada in one group compared to Czech Republic&Switzerland in another group.
In WHC they always played another qualification stage where the top 3 teams from each group advance and play a round-robin against the top 3 teams from another group. And after that the top4 advances to QFs.
