Speculation: Will we sign Antti Raanta?

[Jamieh]

I have to stop at this and say no it isn't.
Darling wasn't anywhere near as proven as Raanta will be this summer, Darling was a full backup(only in Chicago) at the time fo signing.
Raanta has shown to play great anywhere he has been, starting from Finland to Chicago, and from Chicago to Rangers and from Rangers to Arizona.

For the fans who want him re-signed the good thing is he's a Finn. Humble& modest is how one usually describes a Finn and even in NHL it has shown in contracts, none of Barkov, Granlund, TT, Ristolainen, Maatta have gone to sign massive contracts. They have all signed good deals, few of them steals from the moment they signed them.

4M in todays NHL is not that much, you don't buy a game changer with that money, especially from the UFA market.

Darling and Raanta have played 20 games apart in the NHL with very similar records. I think Raanta is much better but nothing has been proven in regards to being a legit number 1 starter. Talbot is a better co parable and im

 

[BB88]

Darling and Raanta have played 20 games apart in the NHL with very similar records. I think Raanta is much better but nothing has been proven in regards to being a legit number 1 starter. Talbot is a better co parable and im

Darling had zero starts as a starter, and was backup to one of the best teams in the league.
Raanta is much more proven than him and looks miles better than him this year, it's not even close.

Having a consistent goaltender carries big value to teams. It's not fun for players to play in front of goalies they have no idea what to expect, they calm things down& the team is easier to sell to players.

Talbot signed his current contract on mid january(1st year as a starter), so Raanta will be more proven than him if he signs at the end of season and with the cap increase similar contract would be somewhere in the 5M range.

 

[Jamieh]

Darling had zero starts as a starter, and was backup to one of the best teams in the league.
Raanta is much more proven than him and looks miles better than him this year, it's not even close.

Having a consistent goaltender carries big value to teams. It's not fun for players to play in front of goalies they have no idea what to expect, they calm things down& the team is easier to sell to players.

Talbot signed his current contract on mid january(1st year as a starter), so Raanta will be more proven than him if he signs at the end of season and with the cap increase similar contract would be somewhere in the 5M range.

That hair splitting at best. None of the three were NHL starting goalies in the traditional sense and all were proven backups with hopes of more. In reality right now Raanta still has zero seasons as an NHL starting goalie as he has only played the workload of a backup. To pay him $5 million going forward would be a massive gamble IMO.

 

[BB88]

That hair splitting at best. None of the three were NHL starting goalies in the traditional sense and all were proven backups with hopes of more. In reality right now Raanta still has zero seasons as an NHL starting goalie as he has only played the workload of a backup. To pay him $5 million going forward would be a massive gamble IMO.

No it isn't.
Darling was a backup when Carolina traded for him and signed him to a longterm contract, with zero seasons as a starter.
Ari traded for backup Raanta with 1 year left on his contract and this is his 1st season as a starter, and he's doing a fantastic job. In the summer when his contracts runs out he'll have 1 season as a starter under his belt.

Darling,
backup- Chicago.

Raanta,
backup- Chicago,
backup- Rangers,
starter Arizona.

I'm not saying you should pay him 5M, but that's similar to Talbots contract when he signed his. Darling the backup signed a 4x 4.15M contract a year ago.

If I may say so you seem to be living in the past regarding NHL contracts, I'll say it again, 4M buys you nothing special from the UFA market and it's what you pretty much atleast have to pay to get a shot at any kind of UFA starter. Failed starters/goalies past their prime you can likely get for cheaper, but who wants them as a starter is another thing.

 

[hbk]

Raanta has looked very good lately but let's not totally forget his injuries this year; particularly at the start of the season which is a very big reason why the Coyotes had such a horrific start. Something to think about. I'm good for 4-5 years at $3.5-$4.5 per. That appears to be the market.

 

[Jamieh]

No it isn't.
Darling was a backup when Carolina traded for him and signed him to a longterm contract, with zero seasons as a starter.
Ari traded for backup Raanta with 1 year left on his contract and this is his 1st season as a starter, and he's doing a fantastic job. In the summer when his contracts runs out he'll have 1 season as a starter under his belt.

Darling,
backup- Chicago.

Raanta,
backup- Chicago,
backup- Rangers,
starter Arizona.

I'm not saying you should pay him 5M, but that's similar to Talbots contract when he signed his. Darling the backup signed a 4x 4.15M contract a year ago.

If I may say so you seem to be living in the past regarding NHL contracts, I'll say it again, 4M buys you nothing special from the UFA market and it's what you pretty much atleast have to pay to get a shot at any kind of UFA starter. Failed starters/goalies past their prime you can likely get for cheaper, but who wants them as a starter is another thing.

I think you are kinda making my point, Talbot hasn't exactly proven to be a legit starter at this point and neither has Raanta, he comes with risk if signed for term and dollars. You do know Raanta is about to turn 29 right?? He isn't a kid

 

[Jormungandr]

That hair splitting at best. None of the three were NHL starting goalies in the traditional sense and all were proven backups with hopes of more. In reality right now Raanta still has zero seasons as an NHL starting goalie as he has only played the workload of a backup. To pay him $5 million going forward would be a massive gamble IMO.

Trading Raanta and bringing in another backup to be our starter is just as much of a gamble as paying Raanta. Let’s say, hypothetically, we trade Raanta and bring in Grubauer and give him his first chance to be a #1 and he flops as hard as Darling. Minus the contract, how is this a better scenario than paying Raanta 4-4.5 AAV? It’s a gamble either way you look at it.

 

[Jamieh]

Has Raanta proven this year that he can start 60 plus games and be a rock for his team for that many?? I don't see his year as portraying that with certainty.

 

[Jamieh]

Trading Raanta and bringing in another backup to be our starter is just as much of a gamble as paying Raanta. Let’s say, hypothetically, we trade Raanta and bring in Grubauer and give him his first chance to be a #1 and he flops as hard as Darling. Minus the contract, how is this a better scenario than paying Raanta 4-4.5 AAV? It’s a gamble either way you look at it.

I have never made the suggestion you are presenting so I'm not sure why I would answer the hypothetical??? But if you can't get Raanta on a reasonable deal you roll the dice on two unproven goalies for the price of one unproven Raanta.

 

[Jormungandr]

I have never made the suggestion you are presenting so I'm not sure why I would answer the hypothetical??? But if you can't get Raanta on a reasonable deal you roll the dice on two unproven goalies for the price of one unproven Raanta.

You’re suggesting “rolling the dice” on two unproven goalies which is exactly what my hypothetical is presenting.

And to be clear, I’m not saying you’re wrong in suggesting we be careful with handing out a large contract. I agree with you there. I’m fine with a 4x4, or 4x4.5 per contact for Raanta. Now I would be worried if we went out and gave him the Freddy Andersen contact.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Raanta played nearly a starter's workload with NYR last year when Hank was injured. He handled it lights-out.

Raanta has also established that he's a guy the team will fight for and who meshes well with our young team.

Now, if you guys are all gun-shy because of the Smith fiasco, I get that. But otherwise, I simply don't get how signing him to a reasonable deal is anything but a boon for this team.

 

[cobra427]

No it isn't.
Darling was a backup when Carolina traded for him and signed him to a longterm contract, with zero seasons as a starter.
Ari traded for backup Raanta with 1 year left on his contract and this is his 1st season as a starter, and he's doing a fantastic job. In the summer when his contracts runs out he'll have 1 season as a starter under his belt.

Darling,
backup- Chicago.

Raanta,
backup- Chicago,
backup- Rangers,
starter Arizona.

I'm not saying you should pay him 5M, but that's similar to Talbots contract when he signed his. Darling the backup signed a 4x 4.15M contract a year ago.

If I may say so you seem to be living in the past regarding NHL contracts, I'll say it again, 4M buys you nothing special from the UFA market and it's what you pretty much atleast have to pay to get a shot at any kind of UFA starter. Failed starters/goalies past their prime you can likely get for cheaper, but who wants them as a starter is another thing.

This why the Coyotes don't need to over pay. Talbot was paid by the Oilers, as I recall, after he played a starters load and had a good year. Raanta hasn't done that this year. Carolina made a mistake with darling, something Chayka won't do. If the y give him term, 3-4 years, the number should be closer to 3 mill, representative of his track record. I wouldn't pay more then 4 mill and 2 years max at that. No other team will sign him to a 4 year 4+ mill contract. The Darling/Smith/talbot and other UFA goalie mistake contracts will make any GM cautious and not over pay.

 

[cobra427]

Raanta played nearly a starter's workload with NYR last year when Hank was injured. He handled it lights-out.

Raanta has also established that he's a guy the team will fight for and who meshes well with our young team.

Now, if you guys are all gun-shy because of the Smith fiasco, I get that. But otherwise, I simply don't get how signing him to a reasonable deal is anything but a boon for this team.

No he didn't. he played 30 games last year and only 35 so far this year. That is heavy back up minutes not starter load minutes or games. This has nothing to do with Smith its based on value. Should we sign him? Yes. Should we over pay or give out too much term? NO. We don't have to, we can give him market rates for his age, experience and production.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

No he didn't. he played 30 games last year and only 35 so far this year. That is heavy back up minutes not starter load minutes or games. This has nothing to do with Smith its based on value. Should we sign him? Yes. Should we over pay or give out too much term? NO. We don't have to, we can give him market rates for his age, experience and production.

$4.5M/year for 4 years with no NTC/NMC is eminently reasonable. That's a market rate for a starter.

 

[cobra427]

$4.5M/year for 4 years with no NTC/NMC is eminently reasonable. That's a market rate for a starter.

For a proven starter, you are correct. Raanta isn't proven yet, no NHL GM will give him that rate/term.

 

[BB88]

This why the Coyotes don't need to over pay. Talbot was paid by the Oilers, as I recall, after he played a starters load and had a good year. Raanta hasn't done that this year. Carolina made a mistake with darling, something Chayka won't do. If the y give him term, 3-4 years, the number should be closer to 3 mill, representative of his track record. I wouldn't pay more then 4 mill and 2 years max at that. No other team will sign him to a 4 year 4+ mill contract. The Darling/Smith/talbot and other UFA goalie mistake contracts will make any GM cautious and not over pay.

Then you'll lose him.

Carolina made a mistake with Darling, but again Darling had been backup for 1 team, Raanta has been the backup for 2 different teams and the starter for Arizona. So he'll be much more proven than Darling when his contract runs out and you'll need to say few thank you's if he takes less than unproven backups to stay.
Raanta is doing exactly what Talbot did when he got his contract and Talbot was signed in january, it's february already and the cap has gone up from that time.

I think you are kinda making my point, Talbot hasn't exactly proven to be a legit starter at this point and neither has Raanta, he comes with risk if signed for term and dollars. You do know Raanta is about to turn 29 right?? He isn't a kid

For a proven starter, you are correct. Raanta isn't proven yet, no NHL GM will give him that rate/term.

We are talking 4M here in todays NHL.
Price signed a 10M contract(signed last summer), if you want a superstar that's about the price you need to pay, star starters around 8M in todays NHL.
Average starter like Jones goes for 5.75M(signed last summer).

Goalies hit their primes the latest and steal their spots later than others.
I would have thought the last thing you want is let a promising goalie go because you won't pay him 4M and replace him with one of the worst goalies in the league to save a mill.

You need to think how do you sell the team to players and fans. Keep the talented players and build from it.

 

[Jamieh]

Then you'll lose him.

Carolina made a mistake with Darling, but again Darling had been backup for 1 team, Raanta has been the backup for 2 different teams and the starter for Arizona. So he'll be much more proven than Darling when his contract runs out and you'll need to say few thank you's if he takes less than unproven backups to stay.
Raanta is doing exactly what Talbot did when he got his contract and Talbot was signed in january, it's february already and the cap has gone up from that time.





We are talking 4M here in todays NHL.
Price signed a 10M contract(signed last summer), if you want a superstar that's about the price you need to pay, star starters around 8M in todays NHL.
Average starter like Jones goes for 5.75M(signed last summer).

Goalies hit their primes the latest and steal their spots later than others.
I would have thought the last thing you want is let a promising goalie go because you won't pay him 4M and replace him with one of the worst goalies in the league to save a mill.

You need to think how do you sell the team to players and fans. Keep the talented players and build from it.

He's just about 29 years old, has played less than 100 games before this season, and was not able to stay healthy this year to play a starters load of games. I like him, see the potential, but don't want our limited dollars spent with the risk of bust. There isn't a lineup of teams looking for Raanta so the Coyotes should be looking to keep the cost reasonable. Somewhere between $3 and $4 million for 4 years or less.

 

[hbk]

Honestly the difference u guys are arguing about is less than a million. I’m pretty certain the Coyotes braintrust can navigate this. If they feel the demands are not justified they will deal him either at the deadline or at the draft.

 

[cobra427]

Then you'll lose him.

Carolina made a mistake with Darling, but again Darling had been backup for 1 team, Raanta has been the backup for 2 different teams and the starter for Arizona. So he'll be much more proven than Darling when his contract runs out and you'll need to say few thank you's if he takes less than unproven backups to stay.
Raanta is doing exactly what Talbot did when he got his contract and Talbot was signed in january, it's february already and the cap has gone up from that time.





We are talking 4M here in todays NHL.
Price signed a 10M contract(signed last summer), if you want a superstar that's about the price you need to pay, star starters around 8M in todays NHL.
Average starter like Jones goes for 5.75M(signed last summer).

Goalies hit their primes the latest and steal their spots later than others.
I would have thought the last thing you want is let a promising goalie go because you won't pay him 4M and replace him with one of the worst goalies in the league to save a mill.

You need to think how do you sell the team to players and fans. Keep the talented players and build from it.

Jones was a proven starter for 2 years. Also had a .924 save % in 24 games going to the cup finals. Last year was a .935 in the playoffs. 2 proven years and 2 solid playoff performances and that is why he got 5.75m. Raanta isn't close to that proven. I am not saying he should take back up money, but he will get unproven but with potential starter money, 3 mill 3-4 years, 4 mill max for 2 years.

I guess we will see what happens, I just don't think there is any need to over pay (4 by 4.5).

 

[BB88]

He's just about 29 years old, has played less than 100 games before this season, and was not able to stay healthy this year to play a starters load of games. I like him, see the potential, but don't want our limited dollars spent with the risk of bust. There isn't a lineup of teams looking for Raanta so the Coyotes should be looking to keep the cost reasonable. Somewhere between $3 and $4 million for 4 years or less.

So he's starting his prime for a goalie.

How do you not see the market around the league?

Let's go it, once again.

Backup, Darling, 4.15Mx4 last summer, 29y.
Average starter with not a long CV, Jones, 5.75Mx6, last summer, 28y.
Superstar Price, 10.5Mx8 last summer, 29y.

If Raanta asks 4-4.5M that's not way too much, if he accepts less great but by how he has played he can ask for more without being way too much.
I've seen lots of Carolinas games and Darling looks inferior in comparison to Raanta, Raanta is calm& controlled, quick in his reflexes. Darling seems to be lost and relying on his size.

Jones was a proven starter for 2 years. Also had a .924 save % in 24 games going to the cup finals. Last year was a .935 in the playoffs. 2 proven years and 2 solid playoff performances and that is why he got 5.75m. Raanta isn't close to that proven. I am not saying he should take back up money, but he will get unproven but with potential starter money, 3 mill 3-4 years, 4 mill max for 2 years.

I guess we will see what happens, I just don't think there is any need to over pay (4 by 4.5).

Jones is an average starter and got 5.75M, but because of his CV I didn't say Raanta should get that, but a 1-1.5M less for him is more than fair.

 

[Jamieh]

So he's starting his prime for a goalie.

How do you not see the market around the league?

Let's go it, once again.

Backup, Darling, 4.15Mx4 last summer, 29y.
Average starter with not a long CV, Jones, 5.75Mx6, last summer, 28y.
Superstar Price, 10.5Mx8 last summer, 29y.

If Raanta asks 4-4.5M that's not way too much, if he accepts less great but by how he has played he can ask for more without being way too much.
I've seen lots of Carolinas games and Darling looks inferior in comparison to Raanta, Raanta is calm& controlled, quick in his reflexes. Darling seems to be lost and relying on his size.



Jones is an average starter and got 5.75M, but because of his CV I didn't say Raanta should get that, but a 1-1.5M less for him is more than fair.

So because Carolina screwed up big time the Coyotes have to use that contract as a comparable?? How about Jake Allen, Matt Murray, Vasilesky, Hellebuyckn as comparable for contract??? Either way enough arguing, we all like him, hopefully a reasonable deal gets done and he proves the worth of it.

 

[rt]

It's going to be 4x4 - I'm calling it now.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

Before this year I would have said that goalie isn't much of a priority, that we can always find a goalie. Our experience with Domingue convinces me that the choice of goalie is very important. I would give him a front loaded 5 year ontract.

 

[Jakey53]

Raanta has a plenty-big sample size. The idea of trading him at the deadline is ludicrous unless you're on the tank train.

Raanta is holding all the cards here. If he gets traded then we know he wants to be elsewhere.

He has no years as a full time NHL starting goalie, as in 60 plus games. I wouldn't trade him but I also wouldn't jump the gun with massive contract either. Hopefully Raanta is a reasonable guy??

Who would you want if Raanta walks, and what kind of contract would you give such goalie?

Raanta's not going to ask for a Smith-level contract, but he's going to want to get paid. 4 x $4.5M sounds good to me - no NMCs though.

That a bit rich.

That's a lot of contract for a player with one year of over 30 starts. I highly doubt he gets that contract.

I agree. If he thinks he can, it won't be here.

 

[Jakey53]

If he lead us to the WCF like Smith did and played 60+ games, he would get Smith money. 4 by 4.5 is too much in term and dollars for an unproven starter. Besides, we picked up Bryz/Smith/Duby/Greiss/Raanta at different times, all pretty good in net. There is no need to lock up any goalie with term unless they are proven starters and top 15. 2 years at 3.5-4 mill or 3 years at 3 mill and no more NMC's.

Who do you think we can get at 2 yrs. at 3.5 mill that is as good or better than Raanta?