Why is the OHL stalling on realignment

[Hammer9001]

Because it's not necessary. This has been brought up over and over again. Someone has posted a chart with the mileage and the current alignment is the best option.

I’d be interested to see this chart if anyone has it.

I posted it a while back, and the current alignment isn't the best option. Here is the file, but I made it viewer only, and while it should be fine to download, in the interest of encouraging good computer safety habits, copy paste it into excel and play around with it yourself.



I never said which alignment would be the best, although my test alignment came out as superior to the current one, I didn't number crunch this to find the complete perfect alignment. I don't think that it should be the final alignment as it ruins the Kitchener/Guelph rivalry, gives the Mid-West division a substantial overall travel advantage.

Really the only change in alignment I'd like to see is Hamilton and Mississauga change places as that benefits 6 teams (Ottawa, Kingston, Peterborough, Oshawa, Hamilton and Niagara) to 4 teams detriment (Sudbury, North Bay, Barrie, Mississauga). However, this change doesn't substantially change a lot. It is more to accommodate Ottawa and Kingston who have harsher total travel then Sudbury and North Bay; and that Mississauga has the current easiest travel in the league, they can endure being in the east. That said, I acknowledge that change would produce a small amount of less total travel, it would put more travel on the already high central division.

It also probably would be better for those teams as Hamilton and Niagara tend to be good draws due to the short distances involved, and I would think Mississauga and Oshawa would as well.

EDIT: Two things

1. This sheet is arena to arena, not city core, to city core.

2. If it is not clear, my Test Alignment was West Stays the same, Mid-West becomes South with Hamilton, Niagara, London, Kitchener and Erie, Central becomes North with Sudbury, North Bay, Barrie, Owen Sound, Guelph and East stays the same, only Mississauga moves over to replace Hamilton.

That said, again I don't advocate for it, as it gives the new South division a substantial advantage in terms of travel over everyone else.

 

[Otto]

You're just mentioning two matchups. Hamilton should not be in the east. Mississauga is closer to every single east team than Hamilton is. And Oshawa and Peterborough are approximately the same distance to Mississauga than Niagara and Barrie is to it. And then Kingston and Ottawas distance versus Sudbury and North Bay is negligible. How about Niagara games vs Erie, and London, and Kitchener. Those should increase to. Like I said Guelph gets shafted in the realignment as they're the odd team out in the entire OHL (besides Soo lol)

If each team voted on the proposed realignment, I'm pretty sure every east team would be in favour, the west wouldn't care, Barrie would probably vote for it to be able to play in a division with Guelph and Owen sound, Niagara and Hamilton would to be in a division with London's Erie would as they get less travel time to Owen sound and Guelph (versus Niagara/Hamilton). So the only teams that would probably oppose it are Guelph, Owen sound, Mississauga, maybe London, maybe Kitchener and that's it. Every other team (besides the maybe who wouldn't really be affected) would actually gain from it besides 3-5 at most

I guarantee you that the West would care and the fact that Mississauga's travel would be increased (as previously posted) I doubt they would go for it.

I posted two current matchups. Rivalry games are built in for Barrie/Owen Sound and Hamilton/Niagara. Your proposal would add potentially two more home games for each team against these new rivals. However Guelph & Owen Sound would suffer not playing Kitchener & London as frequently

 

[Otto]

I posted it a while back, and the current alignment isn't the best option. Here is the file, but I made it viewer only, and while it should be fine to download, in the interest of encouraging good computer safety habits, copy paste it into excel and play around with it yourself.



I never said which alignment would be the best, although my test alignment came out as superior to the current one, I didn't number crunch this to find the complete perfect alignment. I don't think that it should be the final alignment as it ruins the Kitchener/Guelph rivalry, gives the Mid-West division a substantial overall travel advantage.

Really the only change in alignment I'd like to see is Hamilton and Mississauga change places as that benefits 6 teams (Ottawa, Kingston, Peterborough, Oshawa, Hamilton and Niagara) to 4 teams detriment (Sudbury, North Bay, Barrie, Mississauga). However, this change doesn't substantially change a lot. It is more to accommodate Ottawa and Kingston who have harsher total travel then Sudbury and North Bay; and that Mississauga has the current easiest travel in the league, they can endure being in the east.

It also probably would be better for those teams as Hamilton and Niagara tend to be good draws due to the short distances involved, and I would think Mississauga and Oshawa would as well.

Thanks for posting. As previously posted, given Mississauga's attendance woes I'm not sure that adding more fuel to that fire would be the best thing.

The thing I'm not understanding with all of these new alignment ideas is what is everyone's plans for rivalry games as they currently stand? A lot of the travel issues people are saying are there have already been accounted for in the currently schedule.

 

[Hammer9001]

Thanks for posting. As previously posted, given Mississauga's attendance woes I'm not sure that adding more fuel to that fire would be the best thing.

The thing I'm not understanding with all of these new alignment ideas is what is everyone's plans for rivalry games as they currently stand? A lot of the travel issues people are saying are there have already been accounted for in the currently schedule.

This is the thing, in terms of Rivalry, who does Mississauga have as a rival in the Central as it stands? I may be speaking from ignorance here, but I didn't think Niagara and Barrie were making big away trips there, but I have no idea. I know there kind of is a bit of a forced rivalry with the Bulldogs and the Fish, but I've never seen it as remotely comparable to Ice Dogs v Bulldogs.

Compare that to Oshawa (whose fans travel well) and Peterborough? I don't have the answer to this one.

As far as rivalry games, so long as you don't have a lot of conference switching, they still stay mostly intact and you'll have to find new ones, which generally will become more likely if travel is made easier.

The other thing this chart doesn't account for is travel in terms of doing multi-day hotel trips. I'd think you'd want to avoid lone teams being on islands, like SMM, Erie, Niagara and Ottawa currently are and instead make it so you can make a hotel accommodation and get at least two games done and scheduled that way. Of that list though, Niagara is the only one you can fix by putting them in the same division as Hamilton.

Also, heads up the KM involved in this chart is from arena to arena. Not city core to city core.

 

[Otto]

This is the thing, in terms of Rivalry, who does Mississauga have as a rival in the Central as it stands? I may be speaking from ignorance here, but I didn't think Niagara and Barrie were making big away trips there, but I have no idea. I know there kind of is a bit of a forced rivalry with the Bulldogs and the Fish, but I've never seen it as remotely comparable to Ice Dogs v Bulldogs.

Compare that to Oshawa (whose fans travel well) and Peterborough? I don't have the answer to this one.

As far as rivalry games, so long as you don't have a lot of conference switching, they still stay mostly intact and you'll have to find new ones, which generally will become more likely if travel is made easier.

The other thing this chart doesn't account for is travel in terms of doing multi-day hotel trips. I'd think you'd want to avoid lone teams being on islands, like SMM, Erie, Niagara and Ottawa currently are and instead make it so you can make a hotel accommodation and get at least two games done and scheduled that way. Of that list though, Niagara is the only one you can fix by putting them in the same division as Hamilton.

Also, heads up the KM involved in this chart is from arena to arena. Not city core to city core.

Mississauga's current schedule make up

NB x6
BAR x6
SUD x6
NIA x6

OTT X4
PBO X4
KGN X4
HAM X6
OSH X4

LDN X2
OS X2
GUE X4
KIT X2
ER X4

WSR X2
SAG X2
SAR X2
FLT X2
SOO X2

So they have 2 rivalry games each vs Hamilton, Guelph & Erie. So I'm curious, if Hamilton & Mississauga changed places what effect would that have on the schedule?

Also, thanks for doing the work on the distances and using the km between arenas!

 

[Otto]

But in the grand scheme of things I'd be willing to bet that the OHL has no plans to realign until they get a firm idea as to what's going on with the Steelheads. From what i can see they signed a 5 year lease agreement May 1st, 2018. That means the deal is up this year. Not sure when the BOG meets again.. but the Bulls move was announced March 15th, the Whalers January 14th and the Battalion was done November 5th. I'd think if anything was going to happen we would know by the end of March.

Ideally a move to Cornwall then they can swap easily with Hamilton. I'm not seeing a site in New York that would support junior hockey and would work with a move to the Eastern Conference. Syracuse has the Crunch and Rochester has the Amerks.

 

[Hammer9001]

Mississauga's current schedule make up

NB x6
BAR x6
SUD x6
NIA x6

OTT X4
PBO X4
KGN X4
HAM X6
OSH X4

LDN X2
OS X2
GUE X4
KIT X2
ER X4

WSR X2
SAG X2
SAR X2
FLT X2
SOO X2

So they have 2 rivalry games each vs Hamilton, Guelph & Erie. So I'm curious, if Hamilton & Mississauga changed places what effect would that have on the schedule?

I think you have 2 too many games there. I thought the schedule is 68.

Hamilton's schedule is slightly unbalanced.

Ott x5
Kgn x6
Pbo x7
Osh x6

Sby x4
Bar x4
NB x4
Nia x6
Miss x6

Everyone Else X2

Obviously there would be a division swap with Central and East, but I think Missi would remain the same, only they'd probably drop the two to Erie (that Hamilton would pick up) and do x6 to Niagara.

As far as Hamilton, I'd presume it would look something like this

Sby x6
NB x6
Nia x6
Bar x6

Miss x6
Osh x4
Pbo x4
Kgn x4
Ott x4

Erie x4

Everyone else x2

 

[Hammer9001]

But in the grand scheme of things I'd be willing to bet that the OHL has no plans to realign until they get a firm idea as to what's going on with the Steelheads. From what i can see they signed a 5 year lease agreement May 1st, 2018. That means the deal is up this year. Not sure when the BOG meets again.. but the Bulls move was announced March 15th, the Whalers January 14th and the Battalion was done November 5th. I'd think if anything was going to happen we would know by the end of March.

Ideally a move to Cornwall then they can swap easily with Hamilton. I'm not seeing a site in New York that would support junior hockey and would work with a move to the Eastern Conference. Syracuse has the Crunch and Rochester has the Amerks.

The only play in New York I can see them trying to make a go at it would be Buffalo itself, but I have doubts it would work with the Sabres and Bills there. In terms of US expansion, I just don't see it unless you muscle out the Toledo Walleye, a new arena gets built in Lansing or you go back to Plymouth. You aren't going to see the Amerks move. They are owned by Buffalo and they want their affiliate close and the Amerks are the second oldest AHL franchise next to Hershey.

I think Syracuse is too deep into New York state for serious consideration. Yeah, Ottawa and Kingston might like it, but it's an 11 hour drive from the Soo to Syracuse. That said, I could totally see Tampa moving them and upgrading the Orlando Solar Bears from the ECHL to the AHL.

 

[Otto]

I think you have 2 too many games there. I thought the schedule is 68.

Hamilton's schedule is slightly unbalanced.

Ott x5
Kgn x6
Pbo x7
Osh x6

Sby x4
Bar x4
NB x4
Nia x6
Miss x6

Everyone Else X2

Obviously there would be a division swap with Central and East, but I think Missi would remain the same, only they'd probably drop the two to Erie (that Hamilton would pick up) and do x6 to Niagara.

As far as Hamilton, I'd presume it would look something like this

Sby x6
NB x6
Nia x6
Bar x6

Miss x6
Osh x4
Pbo x4
Kgn x4
Ott x4

Erie x4

Everyone else x2

Thanks... I'll take a look in the morning to see where I screwed up. One of the big problems is, once you alter one schedule, then you need to make changes to all of the others. For the amount of work required the league probably doesn't think it's worth it.

 

[OMG67]

The only play in New York I can see them trying to make a go at it would be Buffalo itself, but I have doubts it would work with the Sabres and Bills there. In terms of US expansion, I just don't see it unless you muscle out the Toledo Walleye, a new arena gets built in Lansing or you go back to Plymouth. You aren't going to see the Amerks move. They are owned by Buffalo and they want their affiliate close and the Amerks are the second oldest AHL franchise next to Hershey.

I think Syracuse is too deep into New York state for serious consideration. Yeah, Ottawa and Kingston might like it, but it's an 11 hour drive from the Soo to Syracuse. That said, I could totally see Tampa moving them and upgrading the Orlando Solar Bears from the ECHL to the AHL.

Another team in the USA doesn’t really make any sense at this point. With Flint and Saginaw in the West, it links up nicely with Sault, Windsor and Sarnia. That little pocket works really well.

You could give Erie a team closer and that benefits Erie but then you’d have two teams in the same situation as Erie is in now. Deep into Lake Erie like Cleveland or Akron causes issues. Although, I guess road teams could hit both?

The OHL needs a team in Cornwall. Since the move from Belleville to Hamilton, the east has had a disconnect. It really doesn’t matter what the 5th team is. There is no good solution. To be honest, if Cornwall were to build a rink, it would probably make more sense to put the AHL team there and return a team to Belleville for the OHL. Considering the bus travel through upstate NY in the AHL, Cornwall would be easier for the AHL and Belleville easier for the OHL. Not by a lot but enough.

I would assume it would be Mississauga that would be the team moving. That would solve some “problems.”

But, as mentioned, there are some outlier teams that will have difficulties no matter what. It is what it is. There is no perfect solution. We have some very large bodies of water that get in the way.

Regarding road trips, Brian Kilrea always used to say, “It doesn’t matter how long it takes to get there. It only matters the distance between the games once you are there.” Ottawa used to drive to Windsor same day (Thursday) and play in Windsor. Then they’d play Plymouth/Detroit and Sarnia on Friday and Saturday and hit London on Sunday afternoon on the way home. It was a long drive to Windsor but once they were there, it was easier than a day trip to Kingston which is Ottawa’s closest team. I think people lose that perspective In these discussions.

 

[Hammer9001]

Another team in the USA doesn’t really make any sense at this point. With Flint and Saginaw in the West, it links up nicely with Sault, Windsor and Sarnia. That little pocket works really well.

You could give Erie a team closer and that benefits Erie but then you’d have two teams in the same situation as Erie is in now. Deep into Lake Erie like Cleveland or Akron causes issues. Although, I guess road teams could hit both?

The OHL needs a team in Cornwall. Since the move from Belleville to Hamilton, the east has had a disconnect. It really doesn’t matter what the 5th team is. There is no good solution. To be honest, if Cornwall were to build a rink, it would probably make more sense to put the AHL team there and return a team to Belleville for the OHL. Considering the bus travel through upstate NY in the AHL, Cornwall would be easier for the AHL and Belleville easier for the OHL. Not by a lot but enough.

I would assume it would be Mississauga that would be the team moving. That would solve some “problems.”

But, as mentioned, there are some outlier teams that will have difficulties no matter what. It is what it is. There is no perfect solution. We have some very large bodies of water that get in the way.

Regarding road trips, Brian Kilrea always used to say, “It doesn’t matter how long it takes to get there. It only matters the distance between the games once you are there.” Ottawa used to drive to Windsor same day (Thursday) and play in Windsor. Then they’d play Plymouth/Detroit and Sarnia on Friday and Saturday and hit London on Sunday afternoon on the way home. It was a long drive to Windsor but once they were there, it was easier than a day trip to Kingston which is Ottawa’s closest team. I think people lose that perspective In these discussions.

Well if we are going to talk Cornwall/Belleville when does the Sens lease in Belleville end? Until that happens, they aren't moving anywhere. I think part of what the Sens are trying to do in Belleville is try to make territorial divide between them and Toronto and build a greater regional interest in the parent club.

Does Cornwall serve that end? I honestly don't know what the team demographics there would look like, but I would presume they lean more towards Ottawa and Montreal then Toronto as it stands. That said, I think some have posted that even out as far as Kingston, the Leafs are still the dominant presence.

As far as the road trips are concerned, sure in a perfect world, where the schedule always runs in 3 game stints along a proper line of teams, that makes sense, but it doesn't always work out that way, particularly in spots like Ottawa, Hamilton and London where there is fairly frequent other event use or other teams using the facility.

 

[HuGo Burner Acc]

I guarantee you that the West would care and the fact that Mississauga's travel would be increased (as previously posted) I doubt they would go for it.

I posted two current matchups. Rivalry games are built in for Barrie/Owen Sound and Hamilton/Niagara. Your proposal would add potentially two more home games for each team against these new rivals. However Guelph & Owen Sound would suffer not playing Kitchener & London as frequently

Like I said Guelph and Owen sound would 100% oppose this proposal. The west stays unchanged and will pretty much have the same schedule as before. Nothing changes with them. And yes Mississauga wouldn't like it as their travel slightly increases (from Sudbury/North Bay to Kingston/Ottawa) but again that's offset by Hamilton not having to play those teams which will save travel time overall for teams. Like I said, there are 3-5 teams that would oppose the realignment. But the west wouldn't care as it stays unchanged, the central (besides Mississauga) would go for it as they now get Guelph and Owen sound. Niagara would go for it as they get in a division with more desirable opponents. The east goes for it as they're travel gets minimized a bit (Mississauga<hamilton). So the only division that wouldn't care much for the realignment is the current Midwest (besides Erie)

 

[DCruickshank]

You're just mentioning two matchups. Hamilton should not be in the east. Mississauga is closer to every single east team than Hamilton is. And Oshawa and Peterborough are approximately the same distance to Mississauga than Niagara and Barrie is to it. And then Kingston and Ottawas distance versus Sudbury and North Bay is negligible. How about Niagara games vs Erie, and London, and Kitchener. Those should increase to. Like I said Guelph gets shafted in the realignment as they're the odd team out in the entire OHL (besides Soo lol)

If each team voted on the proposed realignment, I'm pretty sure every east team would be in favour, the west wouldn't care, Barrie would probably vote for it to be able to play in a division with Guelph and Owen sound, Niagara and Hamilton would to be in a division with London's Erie would as they get less travel time to Owen sound and Guelph (versus Niagara/Hamilton). So the only teams that would probably oppose it are Guelph, Owen sound, Mississauga, maybe London, maybe Kitchener and that's it. Every other team (besides the maybe who wouldn't really be affected) would actually gain from it besides 3-5 at most

Again...let me say..Owen Sound wants NOTHING to do with re-alignment

 

[OMG67]

Well if we are going to talk Cornwall/Belleville when does the Sens lease in Belleville end? Until that happens, they aren't moving anywhere. I think part of what the Sens are trying to do in Belleville is try to make territorial divide between them and Toronto and build a greater regional interest in the parent club.

Does Cornwall serve that end? I honestly don't know what the team demographics there would look like, but I would presume they lean more towards Ottawa and Montreal then Toronto as it stands. That said, I think some have posted that even out as far as Kingston, the Leafs are still the dominant presence.

As far as the road trips are concerned, sure in a perfect world, where the schedule always runs in 3 game stints along a proper line of teams, that makes sense, but it doesn't always work out that way, particularly in spots like Ottawa, Hamilton and London where there is fairly frequent other event use or other teams using the facility.

I really don’t think fan allegiance has much to do with Belleville. I think the strategic nature of it as 2.5 hours away is probably more attractive than worrying about attendance. Binghamton was the previous AHL Farm Club for Ottawa.

From an AHL perspective, Cornwall would be somewhat closer to Ottawa than Belleville but after looking at a map, it seems that Belleville and Cornwall would be similar for travel into upstate NY. The more viable US Border crossing is about half way between Belleville and Cornwall. Although Cornwall is on a border crossing, it isn’t as accessible/convenient for upstate NY access.

Regardless, the reality is, from an OHL perspective, Belleville is a better option if we are looking at travel. Maybe not as good for Ottawa but it is better for all other 19 teams in the league. Regarding the lease, if it was a straight swap, the existing tenant would only need to rework the deal with the landlord. It happens all the time in commercial agreements. A business sells and the lease needs to transfer. A business goes under and a new business does a lease takeover. It is pretty normal provided there is an agreement in place and there is no gap in occupancy.

 

[Otto]

Like I said Guelph and Owen sound would 100% oppose this proposal. The west stays unchanged and will pretty much have the same schedule as before. Nothing changes with them. And yes Mississauga wouldn't like it as their travel slightly increases (from Sudbury/North Bay to Kingston/Ottawa) but again that's offset by Hamilton not having to play those teams which will save travel time overall for teams. Like I said, there are 3-5 teams that would oppose the realignment. But the west wouldn't care as it stays unchanged, the central (besides Mississauga) would go for it as they now get Guelph and Owen sound. Niagara would go for it as they get in a division with more desirable opponents. The east goes for it as they're travel gets minimized a bit (Mississauga<hamilton). So the only division that wouldn't care much for the realignment is the current Midwest (besides Erie)

The west wouldn't be "unchanged" you've added extra trips to Hamilton and Niagara. I'm sure the Soo would not like that. And would you still have Sarnia play extra games against London?

As far as Mississauga goes, adding additional expenses to a floundering team is not offset by making things better for another team.

You can't just look at a map and make a decision, there are many factors at play here.

 

[OMG67]

Like I said Guelph and Owen sound would 100% oppose this proposal. The west stays unchanged and will pretty much have the same schedule as before. Nothing changes with them. And yes Mississauga wouldn't like it as their travel slightly increases (from Sudbury/North Bay to Kingston/Ottawa) but again that's offset by Hamilton not having to play those teams which will save travel time overall for teams. Like I said, there are 3-5 teams that would oppose the realignment. But the west wouldn't care as it stays unchanged, the central (besides Mississauga) would go for it as they now get Guelph and Owen sound. Niagara would go for it as they get in a division with more desirable opponents. The east goes for it as they're travel gets minimized a bit (Mississauga<hamilton). So the only division that wouldn't care much for the realignment is the current Midwest (besides Erie)

Minor incremental changes aren’t worth the effort. That is a make work project. Why would the league even entertain any realignment when the potential perceived benefits would be minimal? The sheer amount of “discussion” would be a waste of time at the Governor level.

If there was going to be a realignment, at minimum the Bulldogs would have swapped with Mississauga at the time of their relocation. The league didn’t want to open that can of worms at that time. Why would they open a bigger can of worms now?

Unless there is a significant relocation like Mississauga going to Cornwall, there is no ”need” for realignment. Any perceived benefits would be minimal at best and not worth the time for discussion.

 

[Otto]

Regardless, the reality is, from an OHL perspective, Belleville is a better option if we are looking at travel.

Also, best chicken wings in the OHL were in Belleville at the Slapshot bar. Reason enough for me to bring them back!

I really don’t think fan allegiance has much to do with Belleville. I think the strategic nature of it as 2.5 hours away is probably more attractive than worrying about attendance. Binghamton was the previous AHL Farm Club for Ottawa.

From an AHL perspective, Cornwall would be somewhat closer to Ottawa than Belleville but after looking at a map, it seems that Belleville and Cornwall would be similar for travel into upstate NY. The more viable US Border crossing is about half way between Belleville and Cornwall. Although Cornwall is on a border crossing, it isn’t as accessible/convenient for upstate NY access.

Regardless, the reality is, from an OHL perspective, Belleville is a better option if we are looking at travel. Maybe not as good for Ottawa but it is better for all other 19 teams in the league. Regarding the lease, if it was a straight swap, the existing tenant would only need to rework the deal with the landlord. It happens all the time in commercial agreements. A business sells and the lease needs to transfer. A business goes under and a new business does a lease takeover. It is pretty normal provided there is an agreement in place and there is no gap in occupancy.

I think the league was pursuing a New York State/Ohio situation at one point for territorial reasons.. but at this point they will take anyone who has money and won't be picky.

 

[OMG67]

Also, best chicken wings in the OHL were in Belleville at the Slapshot bar. Reason enough for me to bring them back!

I actually really liked the atmosphere in Belleville. Great popcorn too!

From a 67’s perspective, it made some of the roadies a little better. We now do a fair number of one off games in Oshawa. Prior to Belleville being gone, we’d have a lot of Belleville-Oshawa (Sat/Sun) trips which were fun as a fan. Now, most of the Kingston, Peterborough, Oshawa games are one offs. Straight there and back. In fact, this season, all road games in Peterborough, Oshawa and Kingston are one off’s. There and back! I’m not driving to Oshawa on a Sunday or Peterborough on a Thursday and then turn around and drive back home. I sort of miss the intra-division road trips.

 

[Hammer9001]

Also, best chicken wings in the OHL were in Belleville at the Slapshot bar. Reason enough for me to bring them back!


I think the league was pursuing a New York State/Ohio situation at one point for territorial reasons.. but at this point they will take anyone who has money and won't be picky.

I have never been to Slapshot, so I won't say they are better, but if you are in Hamilton and you have time Five Alarm Wings in Hamilton is exceptional. Back when we briefly had Waterfront Wingfest I believe they took more then a few trophies.

The Buffalo Anchor bar is also by the arena, but while they may be the original chicken wing, I would not say they are the best. There's another great joint called Red Rockets that isn't too far off.

 

[OMG67]

I think the league was pursuing a New York State/Ohio situation at one point for territorial reasons.. but at this point they will take anyone who has money and won't be picky.

They could make that work but they’d need a full division of five teams with Niagara being the 5th For it to be viable. It would be cool though. They’d need to add at least two teams and preferably three. I think the Minor leagues are too strong in much of that area to make it viable. Plus, the territories are now assigned. There is no real strategic reasons to do it. I remember the days of discussions surrounding, “If we get a team in New York state, we get access to all of their players.” That is now off the table with the territory divisions for all continental USA.

 

[HuGo Burner Acc]

Again...let me say..Owen Sound wants NOTHING to do with re-alignment

Completely agree. But besides 3ish teams who would oppose it (OS included) and an entire division (west) who wouldn't care, the rest of the league would probably support it

 

[HuGo Burner Acc]

The west wouldn't be "unchanged" you've added extra trips to Hamilton and Niagara. I'm sure the Soo would not like that. And would you still have Sarnia play extra games against London?

As far as Mississauga goes, adding additional expenses to a floundering team is not offset by making things better for another team.

You can't just look at a map and make a decision, there are many factors at play here.

Then Mississauga should relocate. Travel expenses are an immense cost. The west would have to Niagara and Hamilton instead of Guelph and Owen sound. That's a negligible difference. Literally every league nowadays breaks divisions into geography to lessen travel. The same should be done here as well.

 

[Otto]

Then Mississauga should relocate. Travel expenses are an immense cost. The west would have to Niagara and Hamilton instead of Guelph and Owen sound. That's a negligible difference. Literally every league nowadays breaks divisions into geography to lessen travel. The same should be done here as well.

They do. And the schedule is altered to allow for teams not in the division to play each other more if they are close by. That's why there isn't a problem.

You're talking about breaking divisions into geography to lesson travel, and yet you have moved Kitcheners closest team to another conference

 

[twinsdad]

... yet you have moved Kitcheners closest team to another conference

Just want to point out that Owen Sound's and Soo's closest opponents are currently in another conference. Erie's three closest opponents are also in another conference.

 

[HuGo Burner Acc]

They do. And the schedule is altered to allow for teams not in the division to play each other more if they are close by. That's why there isn't a problem.

You're talking about breaking divisions into geography to lesson travel, and yet you have moved Kitcheners closest team to another conference

Yes but the new division Kitchener is in would probably have the least exhausting schedule besides Erie which is always going to be an issue. London, Kitchener, Hamilton, and Niagara are all relatively close to eachother