When Does the USA Surpass Canada as the #1 Hockey Country?

[psycho_dad*]

I know there are exceptions. But the town I recently moved to has a population of about 50,000 people, which in Canada would be large enough to have a dozen rinks and a major junior team. But the closest ice rink is 110 miles away so Im reduced to driving 40 miles to get to the nearest roller rink.

Luckily Ill probably be back in LA in a few years where Ill have to pay $300+ to play in a beer league for a couple months

Heheh...I could go out to play on the pond. 5 minutes walk and I'd be on a real outdoors rink. About 4-6 indoor rinks within 15 minute walk.

I'd say that Canada and Finland are the ones that "breathe hockey"....sweden is also high on it, but soccer is their main thing.

 

[Daily Special]

The average American cares about hockey as much as Pakistan cares about hockey. Until the 6' 9" black dudes from Brooklyn realize they can make millions skating around an ice rink, putting on moves and hitting people, Canada has hockey all to themselves.

Winning tournaments however, is another story; especially with drafts starting to see more Americans going in the first round than ever before.

 

[Chileiceman]

The average American cares about hockey as much as Pakistan cares about hockey. Until the 6' 9" black dudes from Brooklyn realize they can make millions skating around an ice rink, putting on moves and hitting people, Canada has hockey all to themselves.

Winning tournaments however, is another story; especially with drafts starting to see more Americans going in the first round than ever before.

Then american hockey fans are not average?

 

[Rabid Ranger]

Russia is WAY more likely to surpass Canada than the U.S. Hell, I'd even say Finland has more chances, at least the sport is #1 in here. And yeah, the quality of life here is quite similar to Canada. I have lived in both countries (and the U.S) and I'd say Finland is Canada without mountains. And that I prefer them both over U.S.

Russia has the quantity to go past Canada. Finland would, if we had more than 5-6 million people here. Russia in a long run, USA not in a very very long time. At least hockey is somewhat of a big deal in russia.

Laughable, absolutely laughable. I take it you're making these statements while completing ignoring the facts about hockey development in the U.S?

 

[Rabid Ranger]

If you're comparing the USHL to either the WHL, OHL, or QMJHL, you're going to get laughed off this board. No way does the USHL even come close to the level of play and talent that is in the WHL, OHL or QMJHL. As a matter of fact, I'll go on record and say that the worst team in the CHL would blow the best team from the USHL right off the face of the earth. The USHL is no competition when compared to Major Junior hockey in Canada. That my friend is not a statement being blown out my a$$, that's a fact.

As for the USNTDP, I'm going to give it it's due. It has produced some great players. But those players pale in comparison to what Major Junior hockey in Canada has produced. Once again, that is a fact.

It's also quite funny that most of these kids who play in U.S. will usually opt for the chance to play in Canada. There's a reason for that and it's this. The programs here are much better in terms of development. Hockey Canada quite simply has THE best hockey program in place. If the U.S. are to catch and surpass Canada, then the organzied aspect of junior hockey in the U.S. really needs to emulate what Canada is doing. However, as long as the majority of talented U.S. players are willing to cross our borders and play hockey here, the U.S. national programs will always pale in comparison to the Canadian programs. You can take that to bank.

Learn to read.

1) I never compared the USHL to the CHL. I merely stated that the USHL is Tier 1, which it is. It's a league that is getting more competitive every year.

2) Since the USHL has never played CHL, I don't see how you can say it's a fact that the CHL would blow the USHL out of the water. I think the best USHL team would do okay against several CHL teams.

3) As for the USNTDP, yeah, overall the CHL does produce alot more talent, which isn't surprising since the CHL is much bigger than one country's national team program. However, the USNTDP has become a major source of talent. Witness Jack Johnson and Jack Skille last year and a guy like Erik Johnson this year.

4) Most of the kids in the U.S. opt to take the college route. That is a fact. Do some research.

5) The U.S. program doesn't pale to Canada's as witnessed by our gold medal win two years ago with a team made up mostly from the NCAA. The U.S. is also favored this year.

 

[psycho_dad*]

Laughable, absolutely laughable. I take it you're making these statements while completing ignoring the facts about hockey development in the U.S?

I know the U.S have great junior players coming up. I also know that Russia is doing that, and they have so much more history and interest in hockey, I would predict they will be the only ones who could challenge Canada. They have the quantity (like U.S) but hockey is more important to them than it is to U.S.

When I am comparing the young stars of russia to the young stars of USA, what kind of conclusion should I draw?

 

[Rabid Ranger]

I know the U.S have great junior players coming up. I also know that Russia is doing that, and they have so much more history and interest in hockey, I would predict they will be the only ones who could challenge Canada. They have the quantity (like U.S) but hockey is more important to them than it is to U.S.

When I am comparing the young stars of russia to the young stars of USA, what kind of conclusion should I draw?

1) While the U.S. as a whole isn't hockey crazy, there are several pockets of the country (Minnesota, Michigan, New York, and New England) that are. Hockey is also exploding in non-traditional markets like California and Texas.

2) What great junior players are coming out of Russia, Ovechkin and Malkin? That's about it. The well is dry on defense and in goal.

3) History only counts for so much. The fact is, the U.S. has just as many rinks and registered players as Canada and the numbers are growing. Also, the U.S. has a very well-endowed national team program, and the funds and infrastructure for a sport like hockey to continue to grow. Russia's hockey federation is in constant turmoil and the country's economy is spotty. Do the math.

4) When you bring up "young stars," I assume you're talking about Ovechkin and Malkin, correct? I guess depending on your defininition, Kovalchuk and Frolov are in the mix as well. I will readily admit the U.S. currently doesn't have that beacon of light at forward, but our prospect depth at defense and goal blows Russia's out of the water. That is fact.

Draw your own conclusions.

 

[CSKA]

1)
2) What great junior players are coming out of Russia, Ovechkin and Malkin? That's about it. The well is dry on defense and in goal.

Radulov, Volochenko, Zherdev , Zubov etc ..........

You know what ? Maybe we have only 2 Superstars in the making BUT we have THIS players ! This players will decide games and not only in the NHL.

Thats the "little" diffrenz

 

[LaLaLaprise]

2) Since the USHL has never played CHL, I don't see how you can say it's a fact that the CHL would blow the USHL out of the water. I think the best USHL team would do okay against several CHL teams.

Considering Ryan Salvis had 3 goals in 30 games with Moncton and then left to play for Lincoln in the USHL and had a goal per game says a lot.

Salvis was a 3rd/4th line checker in the CHL and he turned into a top offensive player in the USHL.

The USHL is getting stronger but its no where close to CHL....yet. It is improving by leaps and bounds each year though.

 

[fism]

As a young kid, i would usually play hockey in the winter from 8am to 12am and 13pm to 17pm every single saturday and sunday and i was actually always there with plenty of other people.

That was me, only it was inline hockey.

I played ice hockey too, but I paid $600 for 12 games and 1 practice for a house league, and about $1300 for 12 games and 12 practices for my high school. Mind you, these practices were at 6AM before school or 10PM after school.

Guess which one I was good at, and which one I was terrible at.

 

[espo*]

That was me, only it was inline hockey.

I played ice hockey too, but I paid $600 for 12 games and 1 practice for a house league, and about $1300 for 12 games and 12 practices for my high school. Mind you, these practices were at 6AM before school or 10PM after school.

Guess which one I was good at, and which one I was terrible at.

The hockey practices?OOOOh.............1300 hundred clams for 12 practices?.................just a little bit high!!

I bet you were a good in-line player!!

 

[Rabid Ranger]

Considering Ryan Salvis had 3 goals in 30 games with Moncton and then left to play for Lincoln in the USHL and had a goal per game says a lot.

Salvis was a 3rd/4th line checker in the CHL and he turned into a top offensive player in the USHL.

The USHL is getting stronger but its no where close to CHL....yet. It is improving by leaps and bounds each year though.

I totally agree. My only point is the USHL is considered Tier 1.

 

[trickster]

Best reply of all time

Some time after you go to sleep and before you wake up.

i love it

 

[arrbez]

The average American cares about hockey as much as Pakistan cares about hockey. Until the 6' 9" black dudes from Brooklyn realize they can make millions skating around an ice rink, putting on moves and hitting people, Canada has hockey all to themselves.

How many 6'9 black dudes from Canada choose hockey over basketball?

I hate to get into this sort of stereotyping, but the black inner-city demographic is not going to make or break US hockey.

 

[thebodyczech]

When does the USA surpass Canada as the #1 hockey country?

When it surpasses Russia, Finland, Sweden, the Czech Republic, and Slovakia. Then, it can worry about Canada. Let's face it, save Liles, Gomez, DiPietro and select others, most US superstars are geezers at this point. You can't say that about the Russians with Evgeni Malkin, Alexander Ovechkin, Ilya Kovalchuk, and others. Similarly, you can't say that about Wade Redden, Ed Jovanovski, Roberto Luongo, Dany Heatley, Jason Spezza, Eric Staal, Nathan Horton, etc... etc... etc...

 

[Butchered]

To say it couldn't ever happen is being foolish. To say it isn't very likely, and that it would take a very large ammount of time to happen, is not.

It only takes one big splash. There has to be that one person kids want to be. You get the right American born player to explode, and you never know what could happen.

Canada will obviously maintain dominance for a long while, but unless you restrict the game to only Canadians, you can't honestly expect that to continue throughout the life of the sport.

 

[Devonator]

I have to also concur that too say the U.S. could never equal Canada in terms of Hockey excellence is pure stupidity or Canadian insecurity ad nauseum!!

However, I tend to think that Soccer/Football is where the U.S. is going to become a perrenial superpower and consistent challenger for the World cup....much too the Football Purists of Europa and South America......I always look forward to the World Cup and will be cheering on the U.S. in a few months.....they were more then impressive last World Cup and save for a appalling decision against Germany may have advanced to the Semis...

As Hockey goes, I believe the key is too see how much the Northern States are growing in Population and Economic clout.........someone had suggested that in just a few of the Northern States their is a population of 40 million.......if you add in smaller states also from New England and the Dakotas and perhaps Washington, the U.S. will have a formidable pool to draw upon........and not too mention most of these States are fairly well off economically.......

But certainly for the foreseeable future, Canada will not be overtaken anytime soon if ever..........Russia sadly is losing its population rapidly and their economic situation right now is dire........Hopefully that will turn around as I love Russia and its great history and peoples...........

I would love too see Hockey gain further prominence in America and get the deserved exposure Worldwide that it deserves........Canadians should not be complaining about such possibilities but welcoming it.........Can you imagine if hockey in the U.S. got even a fraction of the exposure that Baseball and Football does??? It would be wonderful for the game too see multidudes of Americans playing the world's best sport....

Only time will tell....

 

[Transported Upstater]

If you're comparing the USHL to either the WHL, OHL, or QMJHL, you're going to get laughed off this board. No way does the USHL even come close to the level of play and talent that is in the WHL, OHL or QMJHL. As a matter of fact, I'll go on record and say that the worst team in the CHL would blow the best team from the USHL right off the face of the earth. The USHL is no competition when compared to Major Junior hockey in Canada. That my friend is not a statement being blown out my a$$, that's a fact.

As for the USNTDP, I'm going to give it it's due. It has produced some great players. But those players pale in comparison to what Major Junior hockey in Canada has produced. Once again, that is a fact.

It's also quite funny that most of these kids who play in U.S. will usually opt for the chance to play in Canada. There's a reason for that and it's this. The programs here are much better in terms of development. Hockey Canada quite simply has THE best hockey program in place. If the U.S. are to catch and surpass Canada, then the organzied aspect of junior hockey in the U.S. really needs to emulate what Canada is doing. However, as long as the majority of talented U.S. players are willing to cross our borders and play hockey here, the U.S. national programs will always pale in comparison to the Canadian programs. You can take that to bank.

The majority of US players play in the CHL?


Are you serious?

 

[billykyjoe]

I think the quantity and quality of American players will continue to increase over time. I also think that the amount of top quality players will remain to be Canadian. As long as top American athletes prefer to play other sports, such as football, soccer, basketball, etc., the amount of top quality American-born hockey players will never equal Canadian-born players. I have no doubt that the States will increasingly gain on Canada in quality and quantity, I just do not see it surpassing Canada.

 

[UvBnDatsyuked]

Radulov, Volochenko, Zherdev , Zubov etc ..........

You know what ? Maybe we have only 2 Superstars in the making BUT we have THIS players ! This players will decide games and not only in the NHL.

Thats the "little" diffrenz

Agree.
If Russia had the amount of money, rinks, players that Canada has they would be unstoppable.

Honestly. A country with (what 550,000 players?) should be dominating more! Czech has about 15% that number. Russia even less.

This would be like someone from the US talking smack about how 19 of the top 20 scorers in the NBA are from the US. Who cares? It should be expected.

 

[Mr. Hab]

Heh... China has about 1.3 billions, football is very popular there but they still suck.
Czech Republic has about 8-10 millions and they are among the best in football and hockey.
It's hard to compare based only on population.

About China...good point!
your whole post...intelligent!

+ you forgot to mention that Czech Republic has always been great at tennis and producing beer!! (the original Pilsner!). And, don't worry I'm not biased! (I'm not Czech, (just stating the obvious about Czech Republic and Slovakia). Funny thing...every friend I have/I've had who is/was Czech or Slovakian were really, really good at tennis, hockey, football (no joke!!)...

 

[skellart]

This will never happen and here's why. My kid plays inline hockey in Chattanooga TN and can't get a stick anywhere in town so we took a ride to Atlanta. We did find a stick but couldn't find anywhere that had inline pucks, hockey pants or a helmet his size. I know you can get stuff online but do you know how much of a pain this can be for some people. I mean, really, is it not easier to just go down to your local department store chain and get a cup & shin pads and toss em out on the soccer field? Sports Authority didn't even know what an inline hockey puck was.

 

[Bixby Snyder]

Well, according to Bob McKenzie the US has already surpassed Canada as far as registered players...

 

[espo*]

Agree.
If Russia had the amount of money, rinks, players that Canada has they would be unstoppable.

Honestly. A country with (what 550,000 players?) should be dominating more! Czech has about 15% that number. Russia even less.

This would be like someone from the US talking smack about how 19 of the top 20 scorers in the NBA are from the US. Who cares? It should be expected.

I disagree.Most of those registered players are'nt high level players.They are just guys like me who are hacks at the beer league.With the amount of countries that play this game now and the development they put into it...................Canada's sucess is about as complete as you can hope for in a sport of this nature.What is more strange to me is how we have'nt lost our heavyweight title yet with all the competition.just goes to show you how passion for the game can keep you on top.over 30 years of accepted challenges by all who care to challenge and still on top all this time.Good stuff.We are'nt afraid to put our title on the line.................speaks volumes for us in this sport.

 

[triggrman]

This will never happen and here's why. My kid plays inline hockey in Chattanooga TN and can't get a stick anywhere in town so we took a ride to Atlanta. We did find a stick but couldn't find anywhere that had inline pucks, hockey pants or a helmet his size. I know you can get stuff online but do you know how much of a pain this can be for some people. I mean, really, is it not easier to just go down to your local department store chain and get a cup & shin pads and toss em out on the soccer field? Sports Authority didn't even know what an inline hockey puck was.

Come on up to Nashville, we have plenty for you.

I'm shocked that Chattanooga doesn't have a hockey shop, especially with the way Red Bank's and Soddy Daisy's programs have been growing. I'll open one in Ft. Ogelthorpe and name it Oggy's.....