Speculation: What would it cost for the NYI to acquire a LTIR contract ?

[CREW99AW]

One of the nyi posters reported a rumor he had heard, that Lou is looking to acquire a LTIR contract to create cap space. It's an interesting idea. This is the same move that allowed the Leafs to spend $10+ above last yr's cap ceiling.

So, what would it cost for the isles to add Kesler with 2 yrs/$6.8m caphit? He would be my top choice.
Or maybe add Gaborik at 1yr/$4.8m? Hossa $1 yr/$5.2m?

I wouldn't be interested in Seabrook. There are reports that his feels his rehab has gone so well that he is ready to play and has no intention of being on LTIR. he also hasn't the longest remaining contract of any of the players above.

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[Nikishin Go Boom]

LTIR doesnt add to cap space though

 

[boredmale]

LTIR doesnt add to cap space though

I think the theory is trade Ladd or even Boychuk for a LTIR contract

 

[lwvs84]

One of the nyi posters reported a rumor he had heard, that Lou is looking to acquire a LTIR contract to create cap space. It's an interesting idea. This is the same move that allowed the Leafs to spend $10+ above last yr's cap ceiling.

So, what would it cost for the isles to add Kesler with 2 yrs/$6.8m caphit? He would be my top choice.
Or maybe add Gaborik at 1yr/$4.8m? Hossa $1 yr/$5.2m?

I wouldn't be interested in Seabrook. There are reports that his feels his rehab has gone so well that he is ready to play and has no intention of being on LTIR. he also hasn't the longest remaining contract of any of the players above.

Kesler alone wouldn't cost anything, but because he's covered by insurance the Ducks are only paying him about $1.3 mil per year. They wouldn't take a cap dump with more real dollars than that without an add. If you had a back diving contract that had less real dollars but is going to play (causing a cap hit), then there could probably be a deal.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

I think the theory is trade Ladd or even Boychuk for a LTIR contract

the idea is trading non-replaceable cap hit for a replaceable cap hit. That may be expensive.

 

[boredmale]

Kesler alone wouldn't cost anything, but because he's covered by insurance the Ducks are only paying him about $1.3 mil per year. They wouldn't take a cap dump with more real dollars than that without an add. If you had a back diving contract that had less real dollars but is going to play (causing a cap hit), then there could probably be a deal.

Boychuk 2 Years 5.25M in actual salary remaining(6M caphit)
Ladd 3 Years 9M in actual salary remaining(5.5M caphit)
Hickey 2 Years 3.75M in actual salary remaining(2.5M caphit)
Komarov 2 years 3.5M in actual salary remaining(2.5M caphit)

My guess is Hickey and Komarov can be traded for a bad contract that just has less of a caphit(then place that player in the AHL) so it's the other 2 that Lou would want to get rid of.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

If Boychuk will waive you should swnd him to Ottawa, Florida, or Arizona. Hes only owed a total of 5.25M for the last 2 years of his contract (1.25 this year).

As for acquiring LTIR contracts. They dont give you cap space at all

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Kesler alone wouldn't cost anything, but because he's covered by insurance the Ducks are only paying him about $1.3 mil per year. They wouldn't take a cap dump with more real dollars than that without an add. If you had a back diving contract that had less real dollars but is going to play (causing a cap hit), then there could probably be a deal.

Yeah the Ducks aren't moving Kesler for a comparable contract without major incentive, as you said he actually costs them very little in terms of real dollars.

I considered someone like Komarov who has the same term remaining (2 years) but he even at a reduced salary he makes almost as much this year as the Ducks owe Kesler for the two years combined. Anaheim likely won't be looking at taking on much additional salary for the next couple seasons. There would need to be serious incentive if the contract is much larger than Kesler's and owed to a player we don't really want/need.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Ottawa may be your best shot if your cap hit guy costs less than 3 million real dollars. I believe Hossa's deal costs around 3.1 million in real dollars as it wasnt insured (could be wrong).

Boychuk costs 1.25 million in real dollars this year but 4 million next year. Im not sure if that would work for Ottawa but it would be the best shot for the Islanders.

 

[ToDavid]

One of the nyi posters reported a rumor he had heard, that Lou is looking to acquire a LTIR contract to create cap space. It's an interesting idea. This is the same move that allowed the Leafs to spend $10+ above last yr's cap ceiling.

So, what would it cost for the isles to add Kesler with 2 yrs/$6.8m caphit? He would be my top choice.
Or maybe add Gaborik at 1yr/$4.8m? Hossa $1 yr/$5.2m?

I wouldn't be interested in Seabrook. There are reports that his feels his rehab has gone so well that he is ready to play and has no intention of being on LTIR. he also hasn't the longest remaining contract of any of the players above.

That was a very specific situation. The Islanders could find themselves in that situation but it's too early to start worrying about that now.

The Clarkson move was to protect the Leafs in the event Marner held out into the season. The important thing to know about LTIR, is that it only gives you the space you need to replace the injured player (in a very oversimplified way). So if a $5 million player is injured, you receive $5 million in relief to replace him. If you already have $5 million in unused cap space and a $5 million player is injured, you do not have $10 million in space. You still only get the $5 million necessary to replace the injured player. You lose that unused cap space.

This is effectively where the Leafs were last summer. They had Horton's $5.3 million in LTIR relief and then about ~$5.5 million in unused cap space. By acquiring Clarkson they turned that unused cap space into more LTIR relief, which they could then access after the season started if necessary. They didn't create more space, they just "preserved" the cap space they had which they would have otherwise lost once the season started. It all ended up being moot because Marner signed before the season started, so the Leafs would have been fine had they not made that deal, but that's the principle.

 

[lwvs84]

Boychuk 2 Years 5.25M in actual salary remaining(6M caphit)
Ladd 3 Years 9M in actual salary remaining(5.5M caphit)
Hickey 2 Years 3.75M in actual salary remaining(2.5M caphit)
Komarov 2 years 3.5M in actual salary remaining(2.5M caphit)

My guess is Hickey and Komarov can be traded for a bad contract that just has less of a caphit(then place that player in the AHL) so it's the other 2 that Lou would want to get rid of.

The actual dollars are more of a concern than the cap hit. I doubt the owners would want to take on more salary, especially given the current conditions. Kesler is owed $2.6 mil (real dollars) over the next two years.

 

[CREW99AW]

LTIR doesnt add to cap space though

Aren't teams allowed to use the cap space of the player on LTIR?
Say a $6m player on LTIR, would allow a team to spend $6m elsewhere while that LTIR player is out?

 

[CREW99AW]

That was a very specific situation. The Islanders could find themselves in that situation but it's too early to start worrying about that now.

The Clarkson move was to protect the Leafs in the event Marner held out into the season. The important thing to know about LTIR, is that it only gives you the space you need to replace the injured player (in a very oversimplified way). So if a $5 million player is injured, you receive $5 million in relief to replace him. If you already have $5 million in unused cap space and a $5 million player is injured, you do not have $10 million in space. You still only get the $5 million necessary to replace the injured player. You lose that unused cap space.

This is effectively where the Leafs were last summer. They had Horton's $5.3 million in LTIR relief and then about ~$5.5 million in unused cap space. By acquiring Clarkson they turned that unused cap space into more LTIR relief, which they could then access after the season started if necessary. They didn't create more space, they just "preserved" the cap space they had which they would have otherwise lost once the season started. It all ended up being moot because Marner signed before the season started, so the Leafs would have been fine had they not made that deal, but that's the principle.

If I am understanding your bolded comments, the isles would need to spend to the ceiling with the LTIR player, then claim a need for his cap space?

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Aren't teams allowed to use the cap space of the player on LTIR?
Say a $6m player on LTIR, would allow a team to spend $6m elsewhere while that LTIR player is out?

Sure but that isn’t extra space. Its the same space used twice.

 

[CREW99AW]

Ottawa may be your best shot if your cap hit guy costs less than 3 million real dollars. I believe Hossa's deal costs around 3.1 million in real dollars as it wasnt insured (could be wrong).

Boychuk costs 1.25 million in real dollars this year but 4 million next year. Im not sure if that would work for Ottawa but it would be the best shot for the Islanders.

Maybe retain some of Boychuk's salary, if Ottawa balks at that $2.75m bonus due July ,2021.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

If I am understanding your bolded comments, the isles would need to spend to the ceiling with the LTIR player, then claim a need for his cap space?

No that isn’t how it works. You get to spend 81.5 million on roster players no matter if ya have an additional 50 million, hyperbole for sure, in non roster players.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

The only reason to aquire a LTIR player is because you already have a player you want to put on the LTIR but are too far below the cap ceiling to get full cap relief. You get the 2nd player to bring your cap hit very close to the ceiling and then you put both players on LTIR at the same time to get close to a full cap relief

Having LTIR players is generally bad as then you don't accrue cap space and can't fit in deadline acquisitions as easily.

 

[ToDavid]

If I am understanding your bolded comments, the isles would need to spend to the ceiling with the LTIR player, then claim a need for his cap space?

Yes, this is the same mechanic behind why teams always try to max their salary before using LTIR. So if there’s a small gap teams will usually just add players to their roster then send them down afterward to open the space back up.

 

[WingsMJN2965]

How is trading a cap dump for an LTIR contract any different than just trading a cap dump for nothing...

 

[boredmale]

How is trading a cap dump for an LTIR contract any different than just trading a cap dump for nothing...

If the LTIR isn't insured then it could make a difference

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

If I am understanding your bolded comments, the isles would need to spend to the ceiling with the LTIR player, then claim a need for his cap space?

Getting to the cap limit of $81.5m, then putting a player on LTIR, does maximize the amount of cap relief. But the way you get to the cap limit does not need to be more players that will go on LTIR.

Acquiring a player that is destined for LTIR in itself does not gain you any space. While it can allow you to spend $X over the cap, that player also adds $X to that allowable space. It doesn't both deduct $X from what you're spending AND increase your limit at the same time.

 

[mouser]

One of the nyi posters reported a rumor he had heard, that Lou is looking to acquire a LTIR contract to create cap space. It's an interesting idea. This is the same move that allowed the Leafs to spend $10+ above last yr's cap ceiling.

So, what would it cost for the isles to add Kesler with 2 yrs/$6.8m caphit? He would be my top choice.
Or maybe add Gaborik at 1yr/$4.8m? Hossa $1 yr/$5.2m?

I wouldn't be interested in Seabrook. There are reports that his feels his rehab has gone so well that he is ready to play and has no intention of being on LTIR. he also hasn't the longest remaining contract of any of the players above.

The Leafs were $10m over the cap--that $10m was being paid to Clarkson and Horton. The actual Active Roster the Leafs iced was under the $81.5m ceiling.

It's not possible to have an Active Roster over the cap using LTIR. The LTIR relief simply allows the team to replace the injured player.

 

[IranCondraAffair]

The Leafs were $10m over the cap--that $10m was being paid to Clarkson and Horton. The actual Active Roster the Leafs iced was under the $81.5m ceiling.

It's not possible to have an Active Roster over the cap using LTIR. The LTIR relief simply allows the team to replace the injured player.

This is probably the best answer.

No matter what you do, you cannot exceed the hard cap on your roster. At best, LTIR can allow you to spend more than 81.5M on players as long as you never have more than 81.5M on your active roster at any one time.

That said, having permanent LTIRs can help you get as close to the cap as humanly possible.

 

[mouser]

This is probably the best answer.

No matter what you do, you cannot exceed the hard cap on your roster. At best, LTIR can allow you to spend more than 81.5M on players as long as you never have more than 81.5M on your active roster at any one time.

That said, having permanent LTIRs can help you get as close to the cap as humanly possible.

I would say it's possible for LTIR to help a team get closer to the cap, but not guaranteed. Really depends on the cap situation of the individual team. Then you have to factor in that all performance bonuses roll over to the next season's cap if a team is using LTIR at the end of the season. Almost all of the teams are going to have at least some performance bonuses earned.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

Would Zetterberg's $6.083M/1yr. for Leddy @ $5.5M-2yrs + Leo 1yr work?