What was a worse catastrophe for Canadian Hockey?

[GKJ]

Tommy Salo was crucified after Salt Lake.

The entire team was. In a Swedish newspaper, the entire team had their pictures and salaries and other things printed in the paper like they were criminals

 

[LadyJet26]

Just out of curiousity I can remeber when the Soviets were considered the best that would be from '79 to about '84 when they lost to Canada and of course the Czechs win in '98 and then win three straight World Championships from '99-01 and two WJC '00 '01. And of course Canada has been the best out of anybody the most since '72 but when was it that the Swedes were ever considered the best in the World? I'm just lost here. They won the WJC in '81 if I remember correctly then won the Silver in '93, '94 and '96. They havent medalled since then. They also havent ever won a Canada Cup or Olympic event of the best on best. All I can think of is in '94 when they won the Olympics with the amateurs.

In Canada Cup/World Cup/Olympics best on best tournaments Canada has a 9-2 record against the Swedes. I'm just wondering when in the world at any time was Sweden the best Hockey country in the World?

Yeah I remember the 94 Olympic hockey teams being full of future NHL stars.

Kariya, Forsberg, Salo, Jonsson... that's just off the top of my head.

 

[Big Phil]

I remember us winning the first game 3-2 in OT and that was deemed controversial because some said Brind'Amour (not sure if it was him, was he even on the team?) went offside. And then the Americans tied the next game with about 6 seconds to go in the third period, pretty sure Modano had the goal.It WAS a defensive zone faceoff. They ended up winning in overtime too after like ten minutes of play if I recall correctly.

Okay what you are thinking about is in Game one of the '96 World Cup final. USA tied the game with 6 seconds left and then Canada won in OT on Yzerman's goal in which Brindamour was offside. You can even hear the crowd in disagreement over the call as they were going over the line. USA then won the next two games 5-2.

 

[Form and Substance]

Okay what you are thinking about is in Game one of the '96 World Cup final. USA tied the game with 6 seconds left and then Canada won in OT on Yzerman's goal in which Brindamour was offside. You can even hear the crowd in disagreement over the call as they were going over the line. USA then won the next two games 5-2.

Right thanks for clearing that up, I was only 9 at the time.

 

[Greenback]

Off the ice, the Swift Current Broncos bus crash.

I think this tragedy has to rank in the top three...and I can't think of the other two.

 

[mazmin]

Expansion to the southern states

 

[jiggs 10]

Probably the movement of teams from Winnipeg & Quebec City to Phoenix & Denver (although the team is drawing MUCH better in Denver than in Quebec, and Denver is a REAL sports town).

ALso the embarrasing brawl in the WJC in '87 (?), where they turned the lights out and forfeited the game to Russia. Brenden Shanahan was on that team, I know. How sad for Canada.

 

[gr8haluschak]

I remember us winning the first game 3-2 in OT and that was deemed controversial because some said Brind'Amour (not sure if it was him, was he even on the team?) went offside. And then the Americans tied the next game with about 6 seconds to go in the third period, pretty sure Modano had the goal.It WAS a defensive zone faceoff. They ended up winning in overtime too after like ten minutes of play if I recall correctly.

I would love to know how having two centres on the ice was a moronic move? it was smart because if the USA tired to get our guys kicked out ofthe faceoff circle or he got himself kicked out of the circle then we atleast have a second guy out there that takes draws regularly.

 

[canucksfan]

Probably the movement of teams from Winnipeg & Quebec City to Phoenix & Denver (although the team is drawing MUCH better in Denver than in Quebec, and Denver is a REAL sports town).

ALso the embarrasing brawl in the WJC in '87 (?), where they turned the lights out and forfeited the game to Russia. Brenden Shanahan was on that team, I know. How sad for Canada.

To me the brawl wasn't embrassing. You had the Russians leaving the bench first. Canada was well on it's way to probably getting a gold medal.You would have had two Russians beating on one Canadian. If the Canadian players wouldn't have gone out and helped their teamates that would have been embrassing.

 

[espo*]

Okay for those of us who are old enough to remember the panic surronding Canada's biggest losses in internatioanl play which one do you think gave us the most panic?

First off: Start with the '79 Challenge Cup when the Russians pummelled Team NHL 6-0 in the third game. Yeah it was more of an all-star game but it was still very embarassing then throw in the '81 Canada Cup when we lost 8-1 to them and panic city started to fall over us. Throughout that decade we needed OT to eliminate the Russians in '84 and '87 so it wasnt easy after that but from '79 up until Bossy's OT goal in '84 it was panic that the "Commies" were better than us.

The one I remember the most is '96 and '98. First off, the USA had a good team on paper in '96 that matched up with us very well I must admit. And when we lost the Round Robin game to them 5-3 I started to panic. Then we lose in the final to them and it was a big uproar because Americans are "stealing" our game! Then we stupidly build a '98 team that is built to beat the Americans. Unfortunatley it wasnt built to beat anyone esle and the Czechs ands even the Finns beat us. For four years we had to here how the Euros have more skill than us and how Canadians cant play Hockey anymore. It didnt help that we weren't winning the WJC either. All was right with Canada after Salt lake City and then '04.

But which one do you think was a worse crisis for us?

Actually,i don't think any of them ended up being catastrophies for us at all.In the end they made us get better and stronger.We accepted that we had been outplayed and vowed to learn from it and get better,that's the hallmark of a strong regenerative system and a country of people and hockey officials that care and are up to the challenge.While certainly crushing losses at the time, I'm very proud of how we've reacted to these setbacks,the same can't be said for other places.

I would use the Russian hockey system as an example of this.They have'nt adapted and taken the bull by the horns as a hockey country since the old Soviet system crumbled and died.They've been content to churn out skilled players while neglecting the importance of team building,variety of players and organization,even after numerous setbacks and results for about a decade and a half now.The talent is still there but the willingness to accept reality and move forward with the will to improve and learn from others has'nt IMO.Their results for a long time now have not been worthy of what they are still capable of and could achieve with an enlightened sense of humility and strenthened resolve.

International hockey is always evolving and everyone needs to change and adapt,if you don't.........then setbacks become catastrophies.

 

[jiggs 10]

To me the brawl wasn't embrassing. You had the Russians leaving the bench first. Canada was well on it's way to probably getting a gold medal.You would have had two Russians beating on one Canadian. If the Canadian players wouldn't have gone out and helped their teamates that would have been embrassing.

No, they would have won the game if they hadn't gone out and acted like idiots. Come on, one Canadian against two (?) Russians...isn't that fair (in Canuck minds)? I saw the low-lights of that game on TV...Russia would have won that game WITHOUT the forfeit, so why put the asterisk in the record books? A very sad day for Team Canada.

 

[espo*]

There was like 3 Russian guys on one Canadian guy at times(with the canuck still winning the fight too)
Our guys did exactly what they should have.The most embarrasing and shameful event ever in
soviet hockey for sure.It should go down as a lesson in how to not play the game with any honor.......with that soviet team as the stars of the show.They almost gave us a repeat this past world juniors too!!
Required viewing in how to lose with no class,they were getting their *** kicked and they knew it so they started a brawl.Shame on you!!

But they got what they asked for,and that is why that Canadian team will always be legendary for those old enough to remeber the real deal.Gold medal winners for real fans,although the official results won't show it.Our boys did the whole country proud.

 

[12# Peter Bondra]

There was like 3 Russian guys on one Canadian guy at times(with the canuck still winning the fight too)

Yeah right.

Why do you hate so much European hockey? On the Internationa board, here..

 

[espo*]

Yeah right.

Why do you hate so much European hockey? On the Internationa board, here..

Yeah right,what slants you guys put on things.

I don't like European hockey because they don't like Canadian hockey(and to a lesser extent North american hockey) why should i like a section of the hockey playing world that does'nt like us?(and more importantly does'nt respect us) No mystery there. I 'm pretty fair really,if i think the overall skill and play of a European player and team is better i'll say it,but i rarely see that reciprocated by Euro posters(mainly Czech and Russian) even when any bo-zo knows the Canadian player and team in certain examples is better.By the way,i like Finnish hockey mostly..........their fans are respectful ,their players don't cheat(i.e dive) and they are reasonable for the most part.

I call em as i see em!!!

 

[jiggs 10]

Yeah right,what slants you guys put on things.

I don't like European hockey because they don't like Canadian hockey(and to a lesser extent North american hockey) why should i like a section of the hockey playing world that does'nt like us?(and more importantly does'nt respect us) No mystery there. I 'm pretty fair really,if i think the overall skill and play of a European player and team is better i'll say it,but i rarely see that reciprocated by Euro posters(mainly Czech and Russian) even when any bo-zo knows the Canadian player and team in certain examples is better.By the way,i like Finnish hockey mostly..........their fans are respectful ,their players don't cheat(i.e dive) and they are reasonable for the most part.

I call em as i see em!!!

Yeah, Finns like Esa Tikkinnen and Jerko Ruutu are REAL classy! 2 of the worst offenders in the last 20 years of hockey. I'm North American, I'm well over 40 years old, and I watched the highlights of that 1987 game. It SUCKED! All the chest-pounding clowns who thought that's the way to finish a game needed to be forced to watch REAL hockey for a few years to rid themselves of that idea! Sure, sometimes the Russians have been silly, but come on, look at Don Cherry every week! He's the worst bigot I've ever seen in sports, and a small group of people think he's the smartest guy in the world.

BTW. Euros are better than NA players in almost every aspect of the game, except sometimes having grit. And I don't mean crap like fighting! THAT'S not grit, that's being a poor player having to hang on somehow! Skill-wise, the Euros are usually better than NA players.

 

[espo*]

Yeah, Finns like Esa Tikkinnen and Jerko Ruutu are REAL classy! 2 of the worst offenders in the last 20 years of hockey. I'm North American, I'm well over 40 years old, and I watched the highlights of that 1987 game. It SUCKED! All the chest-pounding clowns who thought that's the way to finish a game needed to be forced to watch REAL hockey for a few years to rid themselves of that idea! Sure, sometimes the Russians have been silly, but come on, look at Don Cherry every week! He's the worst bigot I've ever seen in sports, and a small group of people think he's the smartest guy in the world.

BTW. Euros are better than NA players in almost every aspect of the game, except sometimes having grit. And I don't mean crap like fighting! THAT'S not grit, that's being a poor player having to hang on somehow! Skill-wise, the Euros are usually better than NA players.

brrrp............wrong.

O.K: you're telling me that Canada started a brawl in a game with gold medal implications if they won by a certain amount of goals where they were currently ahead by 2-3 goals(can't recall) Really?were they all smoking crack on the bench jiggs? This just does'nt have any logic at all.Post that replay man,i wanna see it!!! Good God.

Second,you say in your post that Russia Would have won that game no question.Again,Canada was leading and putting the boots to them but you somehow KNOW Russia would have won that game? You must clean up at the track.

Amd what side of the North American border do you fall under anyway,if it's the North side then i wonder if you are getting paid to kiss up to these guys or it's a free service.Whatever it is, the perks are hardly worth it.If you reside south of it,i can only conclude that your "slant" and conclusions on that incident are colored by the same animosities Euro posters would be concerning this and thus your views are to be taken with a grain of salt,sort of like a Montana rancher at the bargaining table in a beef dispute with Alberta.

Regardless,The Soviets started that brawl and we finished it.They got exactly what they asked for and any canuck who does'nt stand behind those boys needs to get their head examined pronto IMO.

And one last question,are you really Brian Williams?

As far as the Finn players you mentioned,every country has it's pain in the *** players,but as a rule...................the Finns are'nt into diving,and i respect that.I won't even go into the Euro's are better in almost every aspect foolishness.Just posting it makes you look like you don't watch hockey very much.

 

[jiggs 10]

Far more than you, apparently.

Skating: Euros.
Stickhandling: Euros.
Passing: Euros.
Shooting: N.A.'s
Hockey sense: probably a tie, although I lean toward the Euro way of thinking about NOT dumping in the puck when they have no play.
Hitting: N.A., although it's a far less useful skill than, say, SKATING.

Watch how the great Russian or Swedish players weave through people on the ice, not just barrel down the wing. Sergei Fedorov is a prime example, as is Peter Forsberg. Sure, there are some NA players who play like that, but overall the Euro players are smoother, better skaters and puckhandlers.

This coming from someone who watches 100+ games a year, and has for many years.

 

[espo*]

Far more than you, apparently.

Skating: Euros.
Stickhandling: Euros.
Passing: Euros.
Shooting: N.A.'s
Hockey sense: probably a tie, although I lean toward the Euro way of thinking about NOT dumping in the puck when they have no play.
Hitting: N.A., although it's a far less useful skill than, say, SKATING.

Watch how the great Russian or Swedish players weave through people on the ice, not just barrel down the wing. Sergei Fedorov is a prime example, as is Peter Forsberg. Sure, there are some NA players who play like that, but overall the Euro players are smoother, better skaters and puckhandlers.

This coming from someone who watches 100+ games a year, and has for many years.

Apparently not,all those skills you mentioned,i would give skating and stickhandling to Euro's and the rest would go to you know who,especially hockey sense.That's four out of six.But you're watching a different game evidently.

And not much of them.This from a guy who posted that Russia was going to win that hockey game no doubt but was behind and down two and being outplayed at the time.Just based on that why would i give credence to your above ratings?

Yet you are the authority on skill sets. Like hell.

 

[Transported Upstater]

I don't like European hockey because they don't like Canadian hockey

Nice stereotype. That's Avery-like.

 

[Maken*]

Skating: Euros.
Stickhandling: Euros.
Passing: Euros.
Shooting: N.A.'s
Hockey sense: probably a tie, although I lean toward the Euro way of thinking about NOT dumping in the puck when they have no play.
Hitting: N.A., although it's a far less useful skill than, say, SKATING.

Stickhandling maybe...

How about the other 10 or so categories that you didn't mention... oh... NA probably wins them and destroys your arguement.

Start paying attention dude.

 

[jiggs 10]

Stickhandling maybe...

How about the other 10 or so categories that you didn't mention... oh... NA probably wins them and destroys your arguement.

Start paying attention dude.

To what, DUDE? I play and/or watch hockey nearly every day from August through April. What other catagories could you mention? Fighting? Slashing? Cussin'? Sure, us NA's would win in those! But on the average, the Euros are the better skaters, stickhandlers, and passers. There are always exceptions (Mike Modano or Pat LaFontaine, for instance), but as a whole, the Czechs, Swedes, Finns, Russians, etc. are better at most of the skills that it takes to play hockey well. They may lack a bit of grit, but not nearly as much as some posters would like people to believe.

Watch more hockey, DUDE.

 

[Snap Wilson]

I remember us winning the first game 3-2 in OT and that was deemed controversial because some said Brind'Amour (not sure if it was him, was he even on the team?)

It was Yzerman, and he very clearly did go offsides.

 

[Sixty Six]

Yeah right,what slants you guys put on things.

I don't like European hockey because they don't like Canadian hockey(and to a lesser extent North american hockey) why should i like a section of the hockey playing world that does'nt like us?(and more importantly does'nt respect us) No mystery there. I 'm pretty fair really,if i think the overall skill and play of a European player and team is better i'll say it,but i rarely see that reciprocated by Euro posters(mainly Czech and Russian) even when any bo-zo knows the Canadian player and team in certain examples is better.By the way,i like Finnish hockey mostly..........their fans are respectful ,their players don't cheat(i.e dive) and they are reasonable for the most part.

I call em as i see em!!!

 

[therealdeal]

To what, DUDE? I play and/or watch hockey nearly every day from August through April. What other catagories could you mention? Fighting? Slashing? Cussin'? Sure, us NA's would win in those! But on the average, the Euros are the better skaters, stickhandlers, and passers. There are always exceptions (Mike Modano or Pat LaFontaine, for instance), but as a whole, the Czechs, Swedes, Finns, Russians, etc. are better at most of the skills that it takes to play hockey well. They may lack a bit of grit, but not nearly as much as some posters would like people to believe.

Watch more hockey, DUDE.

If the Europeans are just far better at everything at hockey, why do they always lose and fail to contribute at key times where Canadians do time, and time again?

In total, the European countries have won only 2 of 9 best on best tournaments, 7 of 9 have gone to North American squads. Go figure.

As for biggest catastrophe in the NHL, probably Gretz going south, biggest catastrophe internationally, Nagano.

 

[espo*]

Nice stereotype. That's Avery-like.

This is what you wasted space on?This post? Go take a look around and tell me all the wonderful comments you see from Euro posters about Canadian hockey,go ahead and find them for me.

100% total overboard political correctness posted to garner "sweetheart" status around here.I don't care what you say,that's the way it is.