What are some of the once plausible, now laughible prospect analysis's you have seen?

[BlueBull]

There have to be some old analysis's on the hfboards that were good at the time but terrible now! I joined this site on October 11th of this year so I don't know nothing. You guys (and gals) can go forth!

Click to read more...

 

[Hobnobs]

Daigle being the next Lemieux comes to mind as th emost obvious.

 

[MS]

Daigle being the next Lemieux comes to mind as th emost obvious.

That was a weird one because I don't think most people who really knew what they were talking about actually thought that, and he wasn't even considered a dead lock to go #1 overall. He was obviously considered an excellent prospect who earned some more reasonable Yzerman comparisons ... but the over-the-top hype to me was the product of hockey card and magazine companies looking to duplicate the sales boom they got from Lindros in 1991 (which was then completely missing in a boring 1992 draft). Daigle was an outgoing kid and really easy to market and it ended up being run with far in excess of his actual talent. To me, he was almost a 'created' star in the same way that Hallmark invents new holidays to sell cards. Regardless, though - you're completely right, the hype was stupid.

In terms of looking ludicrous in hindsight, the spirited 2007 discussion about whether Drew Doughty or Yann Sauve was going to be the great defenseman to come out of the 2008 draft has to be right up there.

The 1990 THN draft preview listed Jaromir Jagr as 'not flashy' and Geoff Sanderson as a 'weak skater'. Oops.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

The 1990 THN draft preview listed Jaromir Jagr as 'not flashy' and Geoff Sanderson as a 'weak skater'. Oops.

i think those must have been examples of writers going on bad intel and no having ever seen the players play. tbf, i never saw either guy as a prospect either so i could be wrong but i doubt those descriptions were ever plausible.

i think cody hodgson matches the point of this thread nicely though.

here's HF's prospect report:

Hodgson is a solid all around talent. He does not possess blinding speed, or flashy moves, but he tends to get the job done. He has developed into a fine two-way player. Hodgson is an extremely smart player who uses all of his skills in both ends of the ice. Excellent skater, very strong on the puck, can quarterback the powerplay. Hodson has very good hands and excellent on ice-vision.

The annual OHL coaches poll distinguished Hodgson as the smartest player (for the second consecutive season), the hardest worker, the best on faceoffs and the best penalty killer.

we now know there were extenuating health problems that made him flame out of the league in his last buffalo year and then in nashville. but even when he was at full speed and scoring at a decent second line pace, the last things you'd say about him would be fine two-way player or excellent skater, and i don't think too many people would call him an especially hard worker during his time in the NHL.

probably more importantly, as a prospect he was viewed as a leader and future captain. and his performances at the WJC did nothing to dispel those projections.

here's GM mike gillis on hodgson right after he drafted him:

GM Mike Gillis said Hodgson is a natural leader who impressed the Canucks' sport psychologist.

"His ability, leadership and character were all over the top as far as I was concerned," Gillis said. "[The psychologist] had him ranked at the very top in terms of leadership, integrity and character."

again, nobody doubted this. seriously, nobody. we all watched him at the WJC, followed him on route to winning CHL player of the year in brampton, he sounded like mike ricci with elite offensive skill. cody wore #19 in junior and i was ready to un-retire naslund's jersey for him so he could join his rightful place in the trottier - yzerman - sakic pantheon.

and then he came into the league, demanded icetime he hadn't earned over the reigning two-time 1st team all-star center and the previous year's selke winner, and demanded a trade from the #1 team in the league. who would have known?

 

[BlueBull]

i think those must have been examples of writers going on bad intel and no having ever seen the players play. tbf, i never saw either guy as a prospect either so i could be wrong but i doubt those descriptions were ever plausible.

i think cody hodgson matches the point of this thread nicely though.

here's HF's prospect report:





we now know there were extenuating health problems that made him flame out of the league in his last buffalo year and then in nashville. but even when he was at full speed and scoring at a decent second line pace, the last things you'd say about him would be fine two-way player or excellent skater, and i don't think too many people would call him an especially hard worker during his time in the NHL.

probably more importantly, as a prospect he was viewed as a leader and future captain. and his performances at the WJC did nothing to dispel those projections.

here's GM mike gillis on hodgson right after he drafted him:



again, nobody doubted this. seriously, nobody. we all watched him at the WJC, followed him on route to winning CHL player of the year in brampton, he sounded like mike ricci with elite offensive skill. cody wore #19 in junior and i was ready to un-retire naslund's jersey for him so he could join his rightful place in the trottier - yzerman - sakic pantheon.

and then he came into the league, demanded icetime he hadn't earned over the reigning two-time 1st team all-star center and the previous year's selke winner, and demanded a trade from the #1 team in the league. who would have known?

Wow. Looks like someone was over hyped. i know cody hodgson was good but i never thought he was supposed to be great.

 

[seventieslord]

Hodgson is a great example.

If I'm not mistaken, Brad Boyes was supposed to be the consummate all-around player and captain material when he was in junior. I can't check back right now but that's what I recall. In the end, the only part of his game that translated to the NHL well was his scoring, which was decent but not special either.

 

[Hobnobs]

That was a weird one because I don't think most people who really knew what they were talking about actually thought that, and he wasn't even considered a dead lock to go #1 overall. He was obviously considered an excellent prospect who earned some more reasonable Yzerman comparisons ... but the over-the-top hype to me was the product of hockey card and magazine companies looking to duplicate the sales boom they got from Lindros in 1991 (which was then completely missing in a boring 1992 draft). Daigle was an outgoing kid and really easy to market and it ended up being run with far in excess of his actual talent. To me, he was almost a 'created' star in the same way that Hallmark invents new holidays to sell cards. Regardless, though - you're completely right, the hype was stupid.

In terms of looking ludicrous in hindsight, the spirited 2007 discussion about whether Drew Doughty or Yann Sauve was going to be the great defenseman to come out of the 2008 draft has to be right up there.

The 1990 THN draft preview listed Jaromir Jagr as 'not flashy' and Geoff Sanderson as a 'weak skater'. Oops.

Thats true but you could replace Lemieux with Yzerman it would be almost equally ridiculous in hindsight.

I also think Anders Eriksson was compared to Chris Pronger and Ulf Samuelsson.

 

[Howie Hodge]

There is/was a third hockey playing Hull brother. The younger brother of Bobby and Dennis. Gary Hull was reasonably good, but wasn't very competitive, and never made it past Junior Hockey. He did, however get a tryout with both The Blackhawks, and a few years later with a WHA Team; if memory serves me correctly, it was The Chicago Cougars. (Could have been The Ottawa Nationals - I will try and do a search)

Anyhow, the promos for the team featured "Gary Hull; the best of the Hull brothers......"

 

[Killion]

There is/was a third hockey playing Hull brother. The younger brother of Bobby and Dennis. Gary Hull was reasonably good, but wasn't very competitive, and never made it past Junior Hockey. He did, however get a tryout with both The Blackhawks, and a few years later with a WHA Team; if memory serves me correctly, it was The Chicago Cougars. (Could have been The Ottawa Nationals - I will try and do a search)

Gary Hull's "career" if you will.... virtually untraceable. He's listed on hockeydb as a member of the 60/61 Belleville McFarlands along with another Hull; Ron.... and thats about it... then a "Coaching" record, one season early 70's, Alberta Jr. Hockey League..... Rather odd that he'd be playing Jr.B in 60/61 then a gap, nothing until 1969 when that picture was taken. Bizarre in fact. Dates, timelines dont compute. Where was this guy from 61/62 ~ 68/69, and how old was he in 60/61 playing Jr.B (like, 15?) & how old in 69 (maybe 23 or 24?) when he tried out for the Blackhawks? Ive searched high & low, cant find anything more than this.... nothing about the 4th brother Ron either. 11 or 12 kids in the immediate Bobby & Dennis Hull family of Point Anne.

 

[David Bruce Banner]

One of the early scouting reports on Dana Murzyn praised his skating.

 

[Howie Hodge]

Gary Hull's "career" if you will.... virtually untraceable. He's listed on hockeydb as a member of the 60/61 Belleville McFarlands along with another Hull; Ron.... and thats about it... then a "Coaching" record, one season early 70's, Alberta Jr. Hockey League..... Rather odd that he'd be playing Jr.B in 60/61 then a gap, nothing until 1969 when that picture was taken. Bizarre in fact. Dates, timelines dont compute. Where was this guy from 61/62 ~ 68/69, and how old was he in 60/61 playing Jr.B (like, 15?) & how old in 69 (maybe 23 or 24?) when he tried out for the Blackhawks? Ive searched high & low, cant find anything more than this.... nothing about the 4th brother Ron either. 11 or 12 kids in the immediate Bobby & Dennis Hull family of Point Anne.

Oh he was clearly a publicity stunt in both instances of "tryouts." I only heard about him a few years ago when reading about the WHA; could have been online, could have been that book "The Rebel League." Never in conversation with anyone who was immersed in hockey over the years had he even been mentioned.

I did find a good reading about him somewhere, probably online, but I have no idea where it was. He played some Junior, but never really embraced the game, and quit, and got into farming. The WHA tryout, by the account given, was that he actually was fairly skilled. Naturally other players resented him for who he was, and took some liberties with him. He wasn't about to give it back, and his tryout ended rather quietly. He may have played a couple preseason WHA games.

I will try and find that article again.

 

[Killion]

I will try and find that article again.

Huh, fun bit of trivia I'd not heard before either. Totally off-radar. A little bit unusual as often in larger families of earlier generations (Sutters for eg, even the Gretzkys') very often all of the siblings will go on to play Major Junior & at least minor-pro if one or two older brothers do go on to play in the NHL. Not always of course but more often than not if even born far apart, a generation or more as was the case with Maurice & Henri Richard. Regardless. Interesting story.

 

[Howie Hodge]

Yeah, had some quotes from some of the other siblings too; hadn't realized there were so many in that family. Really cool article, and it mentioned the parents as well, and their influence on the kids. Had a picture of a family gathering with all the family in a couple pictures.

Going to bother me if I can't find it now. But if I do, I will post a copy on here.....

edit; I can't find any of the stuff I did a few years back. I did find a book advertised - "The Devil and Bobby Hull" that I will look for though...

 

[alko]

There was time, that brother of Miroslav Satan was higher in the rankings as the Silent Killer self.

But here in Slovakia is very famous the quote from Ernest Bokros (current U20 national team head coach) about Zdeno Chara: It would be better, you play basketball.

After that Chara decided to go to Prague, later to WHL and now we all know, how it ended.

 

[The Panther]

One of the early scouting reports on Dana Murzyn praised his skating.

I was thinking of that one, too! So weird...

It'd be like comparing Brad Marsh's speed to Pavel Bure's...

 

[Howie Hodge]

Zero luck in finding anything else Gary Hull related. I found a few tidbits along my fruitless venture.......

Pretty cool dudes in the day; giddyup! Hull-Mikita-Esposito-Maki.

Bobby Hull's Mother with his baby pic; he was muscular even as a baby!

Chicago Cougars, Ralph Backstrom, Dave Dryden, and Pat Stapleton.

Former Ottawa National Mike Amodeo. These Nats must have been some pretty groovy cats.....

 

[Killion]

^^^ Who, Mike Amodeo there Howie?.... I dont know if "cool" the best characterization, certainly "diverse" and "well traveled". Amodeo a Toronto boy who came up through the Marlies from amateur to Junior at which time he began a sort of Vagabond Journey through hockey, being moved around in Junior a fair amount, signing with Ottawa of the WHA rather than the NHL, moving back home when Ottawa moved to Toronto & were renamed the Toro's where he played for 2yrs paired with Carl Brewer on Defence... Had a falling out with the Toro's, sued them when they tried to demote him & from there he scampered off to Europe (Sweden I believe) for a couple of seasons yet somehow managed to return each year to play a handful of games for the Jets...

Eventually signing with Winnipeg f/t, playing a full season in the WHA yet returning to Europe at the same time & playing handful's of games in Sweden. Did play 19 NHL games for the NHL Jets in 79/80 but demoted. On & on right into the early 80's. Europe, Minor Pro etc. Just bizarre. World Traveler. Total Hockey Nomad. Of Italian heritage (huge Italian population in Toronto) and did play play for Italys' National Team in 'B' Pool World Championship at one point I believe. Very much a sort of "Poster Boy" if you will of the generation of players that came of age around 72/73 & 73/74 on when the WHA came into existence & one suddenly had options, Mike there taking full advantage of all of them. Opting for the WHA over the Seals & the NHL who had Drafted him, not willing to report to the Minors & suing the Toro's.... finished up his career playing in Italy. Brewer I think had a big influence on him, that & being moved around a lot in Junior. Simply wasnt gunna put up with any **** from Mgmnt, Coaches. He'd control his destiny, career, not them.

 

[decma]

Oh he was clearly a publicity stunt in both instances of "tryouts." I only heard about him a few years ago when reading about the WHA; could have been online, could have been that book "The Rebel League." Never in conversation with anyone who was immersed in hockey over the years had he even been mentioned.

I did find a good reading about him somewhere, probably online, but I have no idea where it was. He played some Junior, but never really embraced the game, and quit, and got into farming. The WHA tryout, by the account given, was that he actually was fairly skilled. Naturally other players resented him for who he was, and took some liberties with him. He wasn't about to give it back, and his tryout ended rather quietly. He may have played a couple preseason WHA games.

I will try and find that article again.

The story re Gary Hull being billed as the best Hull as a promotional stunt was in Rebel League.

 

[Howie Hodge]

The story re Gary Hull being billed as the best Hull as a promotional stunt was in Rebel League.

Thank you; I can rest a bit easier. Still can't find the story I found on line before though....

Thanks decma!

 

[DJ Man]

Zero luck in finding anything else Gary Hull related. I found a few tidbits along my fruitless venture.......

Pretty cool dudes in the day; giddyup! Hull-Mikita-Esposito-Maki.
View attachment 80123

...

A local sports reporter said that the linemates called themselves the "The South-of-the-Border Line." This was "Chico" Maki, "Pancho" Esposito and "Roberto" Hull.

Pretty lame, if you ask me!

 

[Howie Hodge]

A local sports reporter said that the linemates called themselves the "The South-of-the-Border Line." This was "Chico" Maki, "Pancho" Esposito and "Roberto" Hull.

Pretty lame, if you ask me!

If only Chicago Management understood Espo; eh DJ Man?

They hated him so much that apparently had they not moved him to Boston for Pit Martin (other parts aside) that they'd have left him available for the expansion draft!

Imagine if Espo had gone to Oakland or elsewhere, what kind of career would he have had?

Imagine if Espo stayed in Chicago and blossomed too; bet Hawks would have at least won 1 Cup in that era!

Ah, hindsight..

 

[SabbathBloodySabbath]

From The Hockey News 2000 Draft Preview. [Spoiler: he put on thirty pounds and learned to hit.]

47. Niklas Kronvall
At 5-foot-11 and 165 pounds, there are fears that Niklas Kronvall's lack of size and strength will prevent him from playing in the pros.
It may not be comforting to the Swedish defenseman to know that at least one scout isn't convinced Kronvall is that big.
"Maybe he's 5-foot-11 in skates," the scout said. "He looks like he's 13 years old. This is not a big kid."
But he is a bright one, a smart, swift-skating puckhandler who, in spite of his physical immaturity, played well enough for Djurgarden in the Swedish Elite League.
"As you might expect, he's not at all physical," said another scout. "But he has great anticipation, skates and passes well. If (an underdeveloped defenseman) can make it, this could be the one."
If he doesn't go in the second round, he becomes a highly attractive third-rounder.
Upside A No. 4 or 5 mobile defenseman.​

 

[Ivo]

Marian Hossa was said to be a one-dimensional offensive player, not interested in helping out with the defensive side of the game. That quickly changed. Look at the kind of stuff that was said about him when he was drafted:

(starts at 15:15)

Gary Green asked Jacques Martin whether he is not concerned that they selected a player known to be bad defensively. Martin had a great reply, saying that it is easier to teach defense than to teach offensive ability. Proved to be right with Hossa.

 

[MS]

Marian Hossa was said to be a one-dimensional offensive player, not interested in helping out with the defensive side of the game. That quickly changed. Look at the kind of stuff that was said about him when he was drafted:

(starts at 15:15)

Gary Green asked Jacques Martin whether he is not concerned that they selected a player known to be bad defensively. Martin had a great reply, saying that it is easier to teach defense than to teach offensive ability. Proved to be right with Hossa.

Sens-ible pick? Zultek

By CHRIS STEVENSON -- Ottawa Sun

Marian Hossa.
Never met the guy; never seen him play.
He was the Senators' first pick, 12th overall in the NHL draft yesterday. Nothing against Mr. Hossa, but hearing his name when it came the Senators' turn to pick was a big disappointment.
To put it bluntly, the Senators blew it yesterday.
The name the Senators should have announced was that of Ottawa 67's winger Matt Zultek.
The Senators need size and scoring up front, two commodities Zultek, who's 6-foot-4 and 218 lbs. (and still growing), has in spades. Maybe he doesn't play as tough as his size might indicate, but he can handle the pushing and shoving.
He's also skilled as witnessed by his 27 goals as a rookie with the 67's last season and his win in the agility portion of the skills competition at the Canadian Hockey League's all-star game.
Since he's coached by Brian Kilrea, you know Zultek is going to come away from his junior career with a good knowledge of how to play a two-way game and what it takes to be a good national leaguer.
Hossa? He apparently has a great offensive flair. But the knock on the smallish (6-foot, 185-lb.) Slovak is he is a completely one-dimensional player, who, one scout told The Hockey News, threw snow on numerous occasions to avoid getting hit.
The Senators blew a chance to pick up a good kid playing right in their own backyard. Zultek already has built-in fans right here in Ottawa and for a team struggling to sell tickets, why not take advantage of that?
That should not be the main reason for taking Zultek, of course. You must take the player you think is going to be the best pro, regardless of where he's from.
That's why the Senators' bypassing of Zultek hurts. The Hockey News and a number of teams rated Zultek ahead of Hossa.
Kilrea has had a little success. One of his little rules to live by at the OHL draft was whenever he was faced with a decision between two evenly matched players, and one of them was from Ottawa or The Valley, he always took the Ottawa kid.
He felt the player would always be motivated, wanting to impress friends and family at the games.
Zultek has impressed some people and made some friends here in Ottawa. Too bad none of them are with the Senators.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

oh man marian, undercut, fat tie, short sleeved dress shirt