Proposal: (VAN) Virtanen, 10th - (MIN) Brodin, Zucker

[Canadian Canuck]

It depends if you see Zucker as a 1st or 2nd liner, he has great potential from my perspective and I am no MIN fan. I am arguing the price will be around a 1st + a prospect, i.e. that some team will be willing to acquire him for that and that most likely MIN won t let him go for less. As to his intrinsic value, once again that is harder to gauge !

Not a top ten first though! I’m Sure he can get a late teens pick though!

 

[Cogburn]

I'm happier with Virtanen and the 10th overall.

Minnesota fans seem happier with Zucker and Brodin.

 

[Canucks1096]

It depends if you see Zucker as a 1st or 2nd liner, he has great potential from my perspective and I am no MIN fan. I am arguing the price will be around a 1st + a prospect, i.e. that some team will be willing to acquire him for that and that most likely MIN won t let him go for less. As to his intrinsic value, once again that is harder to gauge !

If this is your personal opinion that Zucker is worth a 1st and a top prospect. I complete respect your opinion on this however if you look at past trades a player with Zucker production do not normally get a 1st and a top prospect. That is a fact, GM don't usually pay that price for a player like Zucker production? You saying he is worth that, You don't have any facts support that.

Is it fair for me that this is just your personal opinion and you don't have evidences to support your argument?

 

[Cquant]

I concur with what's been said so far. Yes to Virtanen+ for Brodin. No to 10OA for anything. It may have made more sense if Zucker fit in to the team composition, but I would hardly know where to play him. Prefer the cost controlled asset by far.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

Seems bad for both teams.

Minnesota could get a better return if they moved those players in separate deals. I don’t see the upside to Virtanen over Zucker.

Vancouver doesn’t really need Brodin as they can resign Edler instead, least I expect they would prefer that to moving the 10th pick.

Value aside they aren’t the best trading partners.

 

[RationalExpectations]

If this is your personal opinion that Zucker is worth a 1st and a top prospect. I complete respect your opinion on this however if you look at past trades a player with Zucker production do not normally get a 1st and a top prospect. That is a fact, GM don't usually pay that price for a player like Zucker production? You saying he is worth that, You don't have any facts support that.

Is it fair for me that this is just your personal opinion and you don't have evidences to support your argument?

Sorry if I have expressed myself poorly but I said a 1st + a non top prospect (or a young 3/4 liner). I actually said the opposite to what you just said, I mentioned I do not want to gauge the value, but that I am sure that MIN won t let Zucker go for less than a 1st+ B prospect, and that the current market price for a 1st liner with term. You may feel like a TDL rental has always a positive effect on price, but I argue that this effect should be counterbalanced by the remaining term, hence the Hayes (or the Tatar trade to Vegas where the late first was complemented by a 2nd) example.

I am very well aware that these deals happen quite rarely because you need the buyer to be willing to put up with these conditions. I answered to this thread proposal stating that 10th OA + 3rd/4th liner = 1/2nd line winger + top 4 Dman, and said this was undervaluing MIN package. As mentionned by another Canucks fan (and I also am one btw), maybe Zucker does not get the 10OA but a later (16th-20th) one but then the OP would value Brodin as the diffence between 10th and max 20th OA, which is a massive undervaluation of his capabilities and of the price MIN could get for him on the market on a standalone basis.

My point to be clear : MIN does not do that

 

[Digitalbooya]

No thanks. I’d love something around Virtanen+ for Brodin though

Yeah, and I'd love something around Greenway+ for Boeser.

 

[AJ Thelen]

Don't want anything to do with Zucker and his disappearing act.

How many times have you actually seen him play?

Yeah, and I'd love something around Greenway+ for Boeser.

Sold.

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

I’d like to see Greenway and Virtanen on the same line. Maybe Ek down the middle. If Greenway can gain a bit of a mean streak that line could beat on people.

 

[nt3005]

Don't want anything to do with Zucker and his disappearing act.

Atleast Zucker shows up enough to disappear. Virtanen still needs to go pick his act up from juniors.

 

[Love]

I don’t like the deal although I respect the effort because it’s not that bad. Just doesn’t make sense for the Canucks. 10th is too valuable of a piece for us, and trading Virtanen would be stupid imo. He’s getting better and brings the speed/size/physicality that Benning is constantly talking about. He’s really not a bad player. Maybe one of the most mid-represented players in the NHL because of his draft position of terrible WJC all those years ago.

 

[Dickie Dunn]

I don’t see the Wild going all in on futures.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Nah.

 

[57special]

Virtanen is not a player that has much trade value, at least to the Wild, who need scoring forwards- don't ask me why our Gm has convinced himself that he needs to trade on of our very few legit 20 goal scorers.

 

[57special]

Not a top ten first though! I’m Sure he can get a late teens pick though!

Yeah, that's about right. In this particular year With the players available at #10 Zucker is likely not worth a 10 OA, unless a team is under pressure to get results NOW, rather than a few years down the road.

Brodin is what you get when you're tenth pick works out really well. MN doesn't have cap problems, and he has a good contract, and they don't have a replacement for him in the system. Doesn't make a lot of sense to trade him...he will probably still be a top 4 player 10 years from now.

 

[absolute garbage]

I've been saying for a while that it could be smart for the Wild to move Brodin for good value with them possibly having an inside track to replace him with Gardiner. Would be rough if they can't sign him though.

I'm not sure if this the right trade though. It's not an outrageously terrible trade or anything, but I don't think the Wild should do that. Those are two good roster players in their primes who aren't on bad contracts. Virtanen has little value, and 10th pick is not exactly a homerun type of pick.

Zucker and Brodin should have more value than Stepan and Raanta who returned 7th and Deangelo, who have more value than 10th and Virtanen.

 

[redwings25]

mn should not trade brodin, they are gonna need there d intact after trading 3 2 way forwards for 3 forwards that do nothing in the dzone

 

[thefutures]

This is probably bad value for Min

 

[Luck 6]

Not even a chance I make this move as a Canucks fan.

Brodin has two years left until he is a UFA, unless we can re-sign him he is a stop gap. Zucker is signed for longer, and I like him, but I don't see him as being worth the 10th OA.

I am still confident that Virtanen is going to break out at some point... He seems to get better every year. I could see him being a very valuable middle six forward for us in a few years.

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

The top of this draft reminds me of 2015 in its depth. The 10th pick could easily return a top 5 quality player. If Fenton believes we can get Gardiner at a reasonable AAV this summer, we should make this move.

 

[Halla]

Not a fan.

Wouldn’t trade Virtanen for Zucker—Zucker is obviously a better offensive winger, but Virtanen has improved and will close the gap a bit given he’s improved the last two seasons and is a couple years younger.

And I sure as hell wouldn’t trade the 10th overall for Brodin.

lol wouldnt trade virtanen for zucker

4 years in the league and virtanens career season is 25 pts....

zucker three straight 20+g seasons, including a 30+. Virtanen will never be as good as zucker.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Virtanen is not a player that has much trade value, at least to the Wild, who need scoring forwards- don't ask me why our Gm has convinced himself that he needs to trade on of our very few legit 20 goal scorers.

I get the feeling that Fenton wants to tank. 21-23 year old players are generally not as good as the 27 year old prime players. While the Wild wait for the 21-23 year old to reach their prime, they could be picking in the top 10 for 1-2 years. Fenton could sell it to Leipold as the growth of the team is coming with the 21-23 year old players and the playoffs will happen soon. In 2-3 years a lineup like this could be pretty good:

Fiala-Newhook-Kaprizov
Donato-Top 10 pick-Virtanen
Parise-Kunin-Greenway

Suter-Dumba
Top 10 pick*-Spurgeon
Soucy-Belpedio

*-Could be Brodin if he's not in a trade. Would be worried about expansion and he would need a contract going into that season.

Goalies would need to be addressed. It's not a horrible plan, if that is what Fenton is doing. Just wish he would get more picks to even the value of his trades (Granlund).

 

[PetterssonSimp]

Just unbelievably awful for Vancouver! Exact opposite of what they should be doing. Just terrible

 

[FOurteenS inCisOr]

lol wouldnt trade virtanen for zucker

4 years in the league and virtanens career season is 25 pts....

zucker three straight 20+g seasons, including a 30+. Virtanen will never be as good as zucker.

You very well could be correct. But I’m not really a fan of Zucker—he’s closer to the 20-20ish player he was last season.

If Virtanen improves 5-10 more points a season to a 30-35-point, 15ish goal scorer, while continuing to be fast, physical, and excellent on the defensive side, not to mention he’ll be a much cheaper cap hit, I’ll take that over Zucker.

Disagree if you want.

 

[PetterssonSimp]

I don’t see the Wild going all in on futures.

The Canucks would be awfully stupid to try and compete with only a core of 4 players.