Series Talk: Toronto vs Boston - Round #1 - PGDT (NOT for other series' discussion)

[Sypher04]

None of this changes that Bergeron is the best player for either team, he is on par with any offensively the past few seasons and far ahead on defense. We still have the better centers and forward group overall though.

I disagree offensively, but defensively no argument whatsoever

 

[Sypher04]

I see the top 3 Centers of each team as follows:
1. Bergeron

2. Tavares
3. Matthews



4. Krejci

5. Kadri
6. Coyle

I see it more like this personally:

Bergeron/Matthews
Tavares


Kreijci
Kadri


Coyle

 

[TMLeafer]

I think Muzzin will be a key factor, good or bad.

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

That means the fans can't have fun and enjoy the ride?

Is there any chance we can revive the rules from the tank season? Where all comments in a GDT had to be cheering on the team?

We don’t need to see a flood of negative posts from the same people who only post when bad things happen. Or who hope we lose the series so Babcock/Dubas will be fired.

We have threads for being negative, GDT in the playoffs should just be about cheering for the team.

 

[authentic]

I disagree offensively, but defensively no argument whatsoever

He has more points and points per game than Matthews in the past two seasons combined. Yeah I get he plays with better linemates, but I don't even believe Matthews stats would hardly be better if they switched places this season.

 

[diceman934]

I think Bracco will eventually become trade bait after he's showcased on the Leafs because

A) I don't think we can afford to have another small winger unless he absolutely kills it in the NHL.
B) Can be an attractive piece for many rebuilding teams looking to trade. Can make a Muzzin like trade again next season.

You trade for size and keep skill. Unless he fails to shine i see him in our long term plans and we move away from another skilled guy with more value.

I do not want another Muzzin trade giving away 1st round picks is crazy. I want us to trade redundant players for picks and prospects.

 

[IPS]

We're gonna get shafted with Wes Mcauley again, aren't we?

Just FYI, he's the one responsible for that insane shitshow of 6 consecutive penalties against us in game 5.

Edit: I am mistaken, it was Francis Charron #6 Brad Watson #23

 

[Jozay]

He has more points and points per game than Matthews in the past two seasons combined. Yeah I get he plays with better linemates, but I don't even believe Matthews stats would hardly be better if they switched places this season.

Not trying to discredit Bergeron, but Matthews offensive stats would be WAY better if he got to play with Marchand and Pastrnak on his wings.

 

[AllHeartNoSkill]

Not trying to discredit Bergeron, but Matthews offensive stats would be WAY better if he got to play with Marchand and Pastrnak on his wings.

A line like that would be unholy.

 

[Frelimo]

That is because we have not drafted well after Hunter left. Dubie is soft as butter. Smart guy really smart but soft as butter. So with Hunter we got guys like Dermott who can play with an edge. Now we got Sandin. I love Sandin don't get me wrong. He will be our #1 for many years. But he has no edge. We need to draft guys who have some edge to their game. Dubie can bring is skill and lift a team up which he has done. But to get over the edge you need guys with edge to take you there. I don't think he is that kinda guy. I hope I am wrong here too. I really do. I think that is the issue between him and Babs. Everyone wants skill and speed yes but where is the edge. Where is the eye of the tiger?

There's only been one draft since Hunter left, and according to you we drafted our future #1 Defensemen, and yet we haven't drafted well?

 

[Sypher04]

He has more points and points per game than Matthews in the past two seasons combined. Yeah I get he plays with better linemates, but I don't even believe Matthews stats would hardly be better if they switched places this season.

Well that's just ridiculous.

Matthews was on an 88 point pace playing with a revolving door of wingers but most often Marleau, Nylander, Kapanen and Johnsson. The highest of whom finishing with 44 points

Bergeron was on a 100 point place playing consistently with 2 players who both had 100 point paces as well

 

[Brown Dog]

I think Muzzin will be a key factor, good or bad.

I agree. Also think Hyman and Brown will be big in this series. Hopefully Kadri makes his mark too.

 

[Menzinger]

Not trying to discredit Bergeron, but Matthews offensive stats would be WAY better if he got to play with Marchand and Pastrnak on his wings.

Bergeron is an amazing player, but he plays on an absolutely stacked top line, AND he also averaged more than a minute more than Matthews last season (and got more favourable PP usage).

 

[Sypher04]

Not trying to discredit Bergeron, but Matthews offensive stats would be WAY better if he got to play with Marchand and Pastrnak on his wings.

To be clear, I'm in no way trying to discredit either. I just don't think it's remotely a hot take to say Matthews is the superior offensive player and Bergeron defensively.

 

[Kamiccolo]

I think there’s a difference between overall having a critical eye for team decision making and also trying to at least enjoy the playoffs.

I’ll be joining in along with everyone else dissecting the decisions made during the Boston series during the the summer, but I think part of fandom is at least trying to have fun during what could prove to be some of the most exciting hockey of the year. I don’t think some folks around here are capable of having fun watching the Leafs sometimes

You are right. We are fans first to have fun and I have been letting these issues get in the way of that lately. I actually appreciate the perspective.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

We're gonna get shafted with Wes Mcauley again, aren't we?

Just FYI, he's the one responsible for that insane ****show of 6 consecutive penalties against us in game 5.

Edit: I am mistaken, it was Francis Charron #6 Brad Watson #23

Isn't Jean Hebert also atrocious?

 

[authentic]

Not trying to discredit Bergeron, but Matthews offensive stats would be WAY better if he got to play with Marchand and Pastrnak on his wings.

WAY better than Bergeron's? Doubtful.

 

[Bluelines]

I don't think so, Bergeron is the best center for either team quite comfortably.

Bergerons reputation casts a bigger shadow than his actual value to a team. It's closer than you think, Bergeron is a first ballot HOFer, not dismissing his great career but in 277 less games Tavares has scored 2 less goals and 102 less assists and he did that mostly in a dumpster fire of a franchise. Keep that in mind.

If we look at just points per game, Tavares is a better player at .94 (0.42G, 0.52A) PPG to Bergeron's .79 (0.31G, 0.48A) . Bergeron 99 Power Play goals (in 277 more games), Tavares 96.

Players of their ilk get paid to produce points, Tavares is easily much better.

Bergeron probably has the edge in faceoffs and defensive play.

 

[authentic]

Well that's just ridiculous.

Matthews was on an 88 point pace playing with a revolving door of wingers but most often Marleau, Nylander, Kapanen and Johnsson. The highest of whom finishing with 44 points

Bergeron was on a 100 point place playing consistently with 2 players who both had 100 point paces as well

So what do you think Matthews point pace would have gone up to? If you think way more than 100 then I don't know what to tell you.

 

[TheBigThree]

I hope we win but man I have zero confidence

 

[authentic]

Bergerons reputation casts a bigger shadow than his actual value to a team. It's closer than you think, Bergeron is a first ballot HOFer, not dismissing his great career but in 277 less games Tavares has scored 2 less goals and 102 less assists and he did that mostly in a dumpster fire of a franchise. Keep that in mind.

If we look at just points per game, Tavares is a better player at .94 (0.42G, 0.52A) PPG to Bergeron's .79 (0.31G, 0.48A) . Bergeron 99 Power Play goals (in 277 more games), Tavares 96.

Players of their ilk get paid to produce points, Tavares is easily much better.

Bergeron probably has the edge in faceoffs and defensive play.

Lol well faceoffs are irrelevant, Bergeron has been better except before he became a dominant 2-way player, which he has been for quite some time now. It's one thing to be amazing defensively, and it's another to be the best matchup center in the world who is now producing well above a point per game.

 

[Bluelines]

That's what happens when one guy has to play against Hainsey and the other against Chara.

Bergeron is good but we saw how ineffective that entire line was against Tampa when they got destroyed in 5 games.

It's our job to do a better job this time around and not nap for the first two games.

B's coach made a good point that TB was able to get inside position, Toronto will have to take off their ballet shoes and put on their workboots if they want to play in the slot area.

 

[Bluelines]

Lol well faceoffs are irrelevant, Bergeron has been better except before he became a dominant 2-way player, which he has been for quite some time now. It's one thing to be amazing defensively, and it's another to be the best matchup center in the world who is now producing well above a point per game.

Ya can't deny the offensive stats are in Tavares favor, it makes the debate much closer than you originally implied and Tavares for the record has been above average defensively this year. Like I said before its debatable who is the best player. I would take either one. Both are HOFers, both are elite players, both make a difference.

 

[Jozay]

WAY better than Bergeron's? Doubtful.

I think you're underrating how much Marchand and Pastrnak do offensively for Bergeron.

 

[authentic]

Ya can't deny the offensive stats are in Tavares favor, it makes the debate much closer than you originally implied and Tavares for the record has been above average defensively this year. Like I said before its debatable who is the best player. I would take either one. Both are HOFers, both are elite players, both make a difference.

Only to you is it debatable though that's all I'm saying. I never mentioned anything about their careers to begin with, I was talking about currently. Go make a poll Tavares vs. Bergeron or view any past ones, they are not close, it's really not just my opinion. 31/31 GMs take Bergeron for a playoff run over any of our centers.