Confirmed with Link: TNSE considering AHL move to Thunder Bay

[McDrailers]

This makes me sad.

the BEST atmosphere ive ever been at in ANY stadium at ANY level. That game was something else and that fans stayed for so long after the game. That was easily the best moment for Newfoundland hockey in a long long time. The Fables in the background the fan white out and the standing O for something like the last 3 minutes was amazing. Sad to see this team go, feels like this squad has a real special connection with NL. That video gave me goosebumps

 

[McDrailers]

What about a QMJHL team if they can't get another Ahl team? Sure that would be preferred over a ECHL team

Too hard to get into and out of NL for that level of hockey. No real revenue coming out and the prices to fly in and out of here are outrageous. Seriously look it up, just too much cost for a Jr. team. Really the only leagues that makes sense are the AHL or NHL. I'm even unsure the ECHL would work

 

[scelaton]

... there are probably about 15-20 better markets for the AHL in Canada than Thunder Bay.

That's what many doubters said about Winnipeg's NHL potential relative to big American cities. I suspect there is way more to the TB game plan than is evident by the population numbers. If this happens, there will be busloads of people going back and forth from Wpg to TB and many other economic spinoffs. Who knows, maybe NW Ontario will finally do the right thing--secede and join Mb?

This whole idea makes very little sense to me. First of all, Thunder Bay is in the middle of nowhere and is a city in decline. It presents all the same issues as StJohns. I've heard the scheduling concerns, but it would be possible to put an AHL franchise in the MTS center. Perhaps that would be a better idea.
Personally I think Mr Chipman perhaps doesn't realize how hard it will be to sell AHL hockey outside of markets like Winnipeg or St Johns. I would keep the team where it is. The AHL is no win situation for most franchises, get used to it.

See my response above. The same old 'city in decline in the middle of nowhere' is still being said by many about Winnipeg. Just a sneaking suspicion that Chipmen has done his DD and has a business plan.

Too hard to get into and out of NL .... and the prices to fly in and out of here are outrageous.

Apologies to have cut out a chunk of your post, but I think what remains is the bottom line for a Western-based team.
I was in NFLD 2 years ago on a biking trip and I simply cannot say enough about the beauty of the province and the people. But St Johns is closer to Ireland than to Vancouver! For a Western Conf NHL team, it is simply too impractical and for most Jets fans it would be prohibitively expensive to visit more than once in a blue moon, if ever.

 

[SCP Guy]

I think the plan is to have TBay be a mini Winnipeg......The team will only move there if a new arena is built.....TNSE will own the building that would be built with a mixture of private and public money (like the MTS center) TNSE will run and make all the profits the building generates from hockey and non hockey events. They know what they are doing when it comes to this kid of operation. I'm sure they will purchase adjacent land and start other profitable ventures in the area just like they have in downtown Winnipeg. Is it a risk? Yes. Is that how you can make lots of money? Yes.

 

[McDrailers]

Apologies to have cut out a chunk of your post, but I think what remains is the bottom line for a Western-based team.
I was in NFLD 2 years ago on a biking trip and I simply cannot say enough about the beauty of the province and the people. But St Johns is closer to Ireland than to Vancouver! For a Western Conf NHL team, it is simply too impractical and for most Jets fans it would be prohibitively expensive to visit more than once in a blue moon, if ever.

Agreed, It is too impractical for us to be involved with a Western Conference team. I have no anger towards the move. It sucks but it makes total sense. Were better suited for The Quebec teams/Ontario. Maybe New York's, Boston. Teams that are In a sense closer. Can I ask you Scelaton. Were you biking on the West Coast or the East? I'm a west coaster born and raised but living in St.John's now. I have to say nature wise West Coast is the spot

 

[BigZ65]

I think the plan is to have TBay be a mini Winnipeg......The team will only move there if a new arena is built.....TNSE will own the building that would be built with a mixture of private and public money (like the MTS center) TNSE will run and make all the profits the building generates from hockey and non hockey events. They know what they are doing when it comes to this kid of operation. I'm sure they will purchase adjacent land and start other profitable ventures in the area just like they have in downtown Winnipeg. Is it a risk? Yes. Is that how you can make lots of money? Yes.

Chipman specifically said in the intermission interview last night that the city would own the arena.

I really don't believe this is about money, because if it were the team would stay in St. John's. They are probably hoping to draw 3500-4000 and breakeven or take a small loss while having their prospects close by.

Worth noting that the majority of an AHL team in Thunder Bay's games would be played west of Michigan (as are Jets games in the West), while the majority of Ice Cap games are played within spitting distance of the Atlantic Ocean. This is what this whole thing is about. Nobody is operating a professional hockey team in Thunder Bay and expecting to make money.

 

[trouty]

Interesting assumption. I suppose it depends on whether the IceCaps local group finds a new affiliate for 2015/16. Not many franchises looking to move, so if they find one, they'll need to act on it.

Id assume it has to do with the Icecaps not wanting to stuck in anymore lameduck seasons,even without another team the Icecaps can just sit idle and not lease the farm for a extra year

 

[scelaton]

Agreed, It is too impractical for us to be involved with a Western Conference team. I have no anger towards the move. It sucks but it makes total sense. Were better suited for The Quebec teams/Ontario. Maybe New York's, Boston. Teams that are In a sense closer. Can I ask you Scelaton. Were you biking on the West Coast or the East? I'm a west coaster born and raised but living in St.John's now. I have to say nature wise West Coast is the spot

Just got called away to a work emergency, so I'll have to be quick and maybe elaborate later.
We flew into an airport near Corner Brook and bicycled up the NW penninsula, through Gros Morne to l'anse aux meadows--absolutely spectacular!

 

[Chungo]

Being from Thunder Bay I feel that if we keep going forward with the event centre this makes a lot of sense.

Travel
- 8 hours driving from Winnipeg to Thunder Bay for fans of both teams
- 5 Direct flights (1 Westjet, 1 Air Canada, 3 Bearskin)
- 14 with one connection (to Toronto)
- Probably more.
- Easy travel for Execs to see development of their players

Increasing Jets Fanbase
- Some Thunder Bay fans supported the Jets when they moved back.
- The NWO region will probably take to the Jets in a smooth transition. If you're watching the AHL team, might be a good chance that you'll start supporting the NHL team.
- Also if TNSE is willing to support our community, I'd probably have 2 favorite team in each conference or jump ship right out.
- Increase in merchandise sales

Thunder Bay Support
- Have had strong support for the University Thunderwolves hockey team of approx 3,500 seating. AHL team should easily garner 5,500 seating support.


Already waiting for season tickets. Go Jets/Moose/Giants w/e

 

[Wolf357]

I'm not sure why it is so freaking expensive to fly within Canada. It is silly cheap to fly in Europe I flew from London to Amsterdam for around 50 bucks Canadian a couple of years ago on British Airways all taxes included.
Here is an example of how cheap you can fly in Europe.
https://www.ryanair.com/en/cheap-flights/london-stansted-to-bremen
The cost of airtravel is of course the main reason the Ice Caps are leaving NFLD and why they will have a hard time getting a QMJHL or ECHL team.

Its actually cheaper to fly to London England than it is to fly to St.Johns Newfoundland from Winnipeg.
http://www.flightnetwork.com/flight...te2=01/27/2014&adult=1&child=0&infant=0&cls=0
https://www.google.ca/flights/#sear...=winnipeg+to+london;d=2014-02-08;r=2014-02-12

 

[Grind]

Being from Thunder Bay I feel that if we keep going forward with the event centre this makes a lot of sense.

Travel
- 8 hours driving from Winnipeg to Thunder Bay for fans of both teams
- 5 Direct flights (1 Westjet, 1 Air Canada, 3 Bearskin)
- 14 with one connection (to Toronto)
- Probably more.
- Easy travel for Execs to see development of their players

Increasing Jets Fanbase
- Some Thunder Bay fans supported the Jets when they moved back.
- The NWO region will probably take to the Jets in a smooth transition. If you're watching the AHL team, might be a good chance that you'll start supporting the NHL team.
- Also if TNSE is willing to support our community, I'd probably have 2 favorite team in each conference or jump ship right out.
- Increase in merchandise sales

Thunder Bay Support
- Have had strong support for the University Thunderwolves hockey team of approx 3,500 seating. AHL team should easily garner 5,500 seating support.


Already waiting for season tickets. Go Jets/Moose/Giants w/e

This is big a part of it. In an interview at intermission during the Anaheim game Chipmen actually mentioned that they'd like to put the team there because they see North western ontario and thunder bay as part of the jets market and their base.

Being able to add to their existing presence within the region seems to be another large component for TNSE.

It definitly doesn't feel like what true north does with their AHL team will ever merely be an afterthought, but will be treated like a valuable part of the organization. They seem legitimately interesting in building that presence in Thunder Bay, which is great.

 

[GJF]

I'm not sure why it is so freaking expensive to fly within Canada. It is silly cheap to fly in Europe I flew from London to Amsterdam for around 50 bucks Canadian a couple of years ago on British Airways all taxes included.
Here is an example of how cheap you can fly in Europe.
https://www.ryanair.com/en/cheap-flights/london-stansted-to-bremen
The cost of airtravel is of course the main reason the Ice Caps are leaving NFLD and why they will have a hard time getting a QMJHL or ECHL team.

Its actually cheaper to fly to London England than it is to fly to St.Johns Newfoundland from Winnipeg.
http://www.flightnetwork.com/flight...te2=01/27/2014&adult=1&child=0&infant=0&cls=0
https://www.google.ca/flights/#sear...=winnipeg+to+london;d=2014-02-08;r=2014-02-12

Ryanair, on the other hand, is a budget-airlaine which can't be compared to actual real airlines. You don't even get a water for free on the plane and every kg of baggage you have over the limit is like a ****ing fortune to pay for. You don't have any space and you're in a pretty cheap seat. I think most NA wouldn't want that kind of comfort level (overall spoken) You're too comfy for that.

But it's perfect for short weekend trips to Madrid, London, Paris and so on. You'll fly for 2 hours, no need for any free drinks or comfy feelings.

 

[Wolf357]

Ryanair, on the other hand, is a budget-airlaine which can't be compared to actual real airlines. You don't even get a water for free on the plane and every kg of baggage you have over the limit is like a ****ing fortune to pay for. You don't have any space and you're in a pretty cheap seat. I think most NA wouldn't want that kind of comfort level (overall spoken) You're too comfy for that.

But it's perfect for short weekend trips to Madrid, London, Paris and so on. You'll fly for 2 hours, no need for any free drinks or comfy feelings.

I agree Ryan air is o'cheapo but lets take a look at flying British Airways anywhere in Europe from London Heathrow

http://www.britishairways.com/travel/low-price-finder/public/en_gb
its in Brit pounds so pretty much double it but still. London to Barcelona for 78pounds
Are flights in Europe subsidized?

 

[cheswick]

Too hard to get into and out of NL for that level of hockey. No real revenue coming out and the prices to fly in and out of here are outrageous. Seriously look it up, just too much cost for a Jr. team. Really the only leagues that makes sense are the AHL or NHL. I'm even unsure the ECHL would work

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure junior teams just bus everywhere. ButI'm guessing geting to St. Johns by bus would require a ferry and an order of magnitude longer than beteen other cities withing the QMJHL

 

[cheswick]

I agree Ryan air is o'cheapo but lets take a look at flying British Airways anywhere in Europe from London Heathrow

http://www.britishairways.com/travel/low-price-finder/public/en_gb
its in Brit pounds so pretty much double it but still. London to Barcelona for 78pounds
Are flights in Europe subsidized?

Not subsidized. Quite the opposite. Taxes and fees make up a greater proportion of the ost in Europe than it does in North America. The reason its so cheap is competion. Which is a result of the higher demand for flights due to the denesely populated natue of the region. Also playing a part in competition is any airline can pick up ad drop off passengers in any country. In Canada and US this isn't the case. A US carrier can only pick up or dop off in Canada, not operate a flight from Toronto to Winnipeg, and vice versa. Also Unionized workforces increase the operational costs for North American airlines.

 

[canadiancreed]

Sucking that St. Johns is moving, but like many, I get why business wise. Thunder Bay always seems to be this isolated speck of civilization in NWO, and having the nearest NHL team have their farm team right there is perfect for marketing. Assuming everything goes well, you could see the Jets market be almost to the Soo in ten to twenty years.

As for St. Johns, someone mentioned that it'd be too much for flights and what not (I get busing it would be a drag, twelve hours on the boat, especially in winter), but seeing that it's about 225 a flight to Halifax, 450 to Quebec City....I mean I don't know what kind of coin Q teams draw, but if they had longer road trips on the mainland, and longer homestands, I'd assume it'd be doable? Lord knows the Rock wants hockey.

 

[McDrailers]

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure junior teams just bus everywhere. ButI'm guessing geting to St. Johns by bus would require a ferry and an order of magnitude longer than beteen other cities withing the QMJHL

As for St. Johns, someone mentioned that it'd be too much for flights and what not (I get busing it would be a drag, twelve hours on the boat, especially in winter), but seeing that it's about 225 a flight to Halifax, 450 to Quebec City....I mean I don't know what kind of coin Q teams draw, but if they had longer road trips on the mainland, and longer homestands, I'd assume it'd be doable? Lord knows the Rock wants hockey.

In order for a Q team to get a bus into St.John's they would A) have to drive the required hours to get to North Sydney. Pay a **** ton of money per person and for the bus to get on and off the rock.

B) Take a sometimes 8 hour boat ride (not to mention the damn thing doesn't sail if there's enough wind to take a leaf off a tree, ((seriously google marine atlantic and check the reviews)).

C) After getting off the worst ride any of the young men will take in. They then have to get on the bus for 9-10 hours in order to reach St.Johns. So basically, you're looking at a potential 3-4 day trip too and from St.John's.

Think the Q will be all over that?

 

[canadiancreed]

In order for a Q team to get a bus into St.John's they would A) have to drive the required hours to get to North Sydney. Pay a **** ton of money per person and for the bus to get on and off the rock.

B) Take a sometimes 8 hour boat ride (not to mention the damn thing doesn't sail if there's enough wind to take a leaf off a tree, ((seriously google marine atlantic and check the reviews)).

C) After getting off the worst ride any of the young men will take in. They then have to get on the bus for 9-10 hours in order to reach St.Johns. So basically, you're looking at a potential 3-4 day trip too and from St.John's.

Think the Q will be all over that?

Yes I alluded to that being a drag, and why I mentioned flights being an option, and their costs, which were surprisingly low considering (used to cost me almost 600 bucks to fly from C-Town to Toronto)

 

[McDrailers]

Yes I alluded to that being a drag, and why I mentioned flights being an option, and their costs, which were surprisingly low considering (used to cost me almost 600 bucks to fly from C-Town to Toronto)

Really depends what flight company you go with. Porter Airlines flys into here and is DIRT cheap. Flying across the province (i.e, Deer Lake (My hometown) to St.John's runs you about 600 bucks one way) is the most expensive

 

[canadiancreed]

Really depends what flight company you go with. Porter Airlines flys into here and is DIRT cheap. Flying across the province (i.e, Deer Lake (My hometown) to St.John's runs you about 600 bucks one way) is the most expensive

Porter is indeed awesome. It's why I was thinking if a bulk deal could be arranged, that's the geography bit taked out of the equation. Of course then theres the "your'e being downgraded from AHL to QHL level play." thing and if there would be any interest.

 

[McDrailers]

Porter is indeed awesome. It's why I was thinking if a bulk deal could be arranged, that's the geography bit taked out of the equation. Of course then theres the "your'e being downgraded from AHL to QHL level play." thing and if there would be any interest.

The transition from the Leafs to the Fog Devils was good. There were very well received from what I remember

 

[trouty]

The transition from the Leafs to the Fog Devils was good. There were very well received from what I remember

that transition was terrible,the Leafs pulled out in May,and the Devils played a preseason game in August,half the stuff still had Leaf logos on it,it was erie and looked like the Junior team had rented the building

the crowds for junior were different,was not the exact same fan base,and becides selling out the first game,attendence slipped,part of the reason the junior team failed was cause it came in way too soon after the Leafs when most were very upset

 

[McDrailers]

that transition was terrible,the Leafs pulled out in May,and the Devils played a preseason game in August,half the stuff still had Leaf logos on it,it was erie and looked like the Junior team had rented the building

the crowds for junior were different,was not the exact same fan base,and becides selling out the first game,attendence slipped,part of the reason the junior team failed was cause it came in way too soon after the Leafs when most were very upset

Far Trouty, I was basing it off of what I seen from the other end of the island. So it wasn't good? I can see that. You think it would be the same now if we get a QMJHL team instead of another AHL team?

 

[IceCapsFanNL]

It is a moot point. Travel subsidies for the Q will be nearly identical as now, so travel expenses stay the same. Revenue will be much less as ticket prices will be much less, and the building will be far from full.

The Q will not work here and Danny knows it.

All of the above is, of course, IMO. YMMV

 

[IceCapsFanNL]

I am optimistic about the future of the AHL here. I'd give it 90-10 or at worst 80-20 that we have a team here, and I'd give it 70-30 that a team is purchased.

You just had to see the look in Danny eyes when interviewed the other day. When he gets the pit bull look about him, watch out. Danny likes a certain amount of limelight, and this is his "fix".