Value of: This package for a top pairing D to the Leafs

[Dache]

Petry would be only be traded if we get a Patch or Lucic return. There you go, it's our prerogative to use a previous example in trade comparisons. Don't like it? That's not our problem. Above average top 4 RD on value contracts are harder to acquire than LD. You can fight that logic all you want.

Finding teams that would pay the price has a lot to do with circumstance. Neither you or I can predict that as fans

I’m not fighting anything, and thats totally understandable if that’s all you would trade him for. That doesn’t mean there will be the so called “line up” that you think there will be. That also doesn’t mean there won’t be any suitors, but with the age of Petry I’d doubt there’s any willing to give what you’re asking. Which from the sounds of it you are fine with so that’s win win for you

 

[Menzinger]

I’m not fighting anything, and thats totally understandable if that’s all you would trade him for. That doesn’t mean there will be the so called “line up” that you think there will be. That also doesn’t mean there won’t be any suitors, but with the age of Petry I’d doubt there’s any willing to give what you’re asking. Which from the sounds of it you are fine with so that’s win win for you

Hes also been getting more sheltered usage this season than ever before.

Im having a hard time seeing the justification of him returning this near unprecdented return.

 

[Habs Halifax]

The fact he has 38 SHL games, 127 AHL games and 11 NHL games while being a fresh 21 years old should say enough.

So far you've used AHL +/- and NHL points to judge a 20 year old defenceman. And a blanket statement like Footes shot as his argument.

Nothing indicates he is a solid grade A at this point.

 

[4thline]

Nothing indicates he is a solid grade A at this point.

Except for pretty much everything about his career to date, capstoned by a U21 season as an All-Star worthy all situations AHL dman

10 G 37 P 76 GP (.49)
3G 22P 57GP (.39)
17G 29P 54GP (.54)
9G 38P 50GP (.76)
5G/30P 40GP (.75)

That's Liljegren, Sanheim, Morrisey, Pulock, Theodore at U21 in the AHL

 

[Habs Halifax]

Except for pretty much everything about his career to date, capstoned by a U21 season as an All-Star worthy all situations AHL dman

10 G 37 P 76 GP (.49)
3G 22P 57GP (.39)
17G 29P 54GP (.54)
9G 38P 50GP (.76)
5G/30P 40GP (.75)

That's Liljegren, Sanheim, Morrisey, Pulock, Theodore at U21 in the AHL

You think Liljegren is on track to be a Sanheim, Morrisey, Pulock, or Theodore? Yeah, the Leafs need RD and Sandin the younger LD has played more NHL games so far. Let me guess, Sandin is the next Karlson and Liljegren is the next Pulock?

Liljegren could be a good top 4D someday but he has a lot of work to do to get there. He needs to get better in his own end which is the most important thing and so many guys have struggled in that area

 

[4thline]

You think Liljegren is on track to be a Sanheim, Morrisey, Pulock, or Theodore? Yeah, the Leafs need RD and Sandin the younger LD has played more NHL games so far. Let me guess, Sandin is the next Karlson and Liljegren is the next Pulock?

Liljegren could be a good top 4D someday but he has a lot of work to do to get there. He needs to get better in his own end which is the most important thing and so many guys have struggled in that area

Sandin had a better camp, and then injuries hit LD more than RD this year. In any case, Sandin's excellence has nothing to with Liljegren (though the gap between them is overstated due to Sandin's confidence leading to shorter adjustment periods. Liljegren did get much better in his own zone this season. He's a dominant two way defender at the AHL level, at 20. That bodes very well for an NHL career.

Do I think he's on track? That's pretty evident to anyone that looks at things objectively rather than from the perspective of "Leafs can't have any more nice things" But being on track is not a guarantee of staying on track.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Sandin had a better camp, and then injuries hit LD more than RD this year. In any case, Sandin's excellence has nothing to with Liljegren (though the gap between them is overstated due to Sandin's confidence leading to shorter adjustment periods. Liljegren did get much better in his own zone this season. He's a dominant two way defender at the AHL level, at 20. That bodes very well for an NHL career.

Do I think he's on track? That's pretty evident to anyone that looks at things objectively rather than from the perspective of "Leafs can't have any more nice things" But being on track is not a guarantee of staying on track.

B+ prospect. Nothing wrong with that. He could turn into a top 4D. I don't have him as a Grade A. Maybe you can make a argument that he is a A- but then were talking a very minuscule gap and your sensitivity between B+ and A- comes into full effect

 

[4thline]

B+ prospect. Nothing wrong with that. He could turn into a top 4D. I don't have him as a Grade A. Maybe you can make a argument that he is a A- but then were talking a very minuscule gap and your sensitivity between B+ and A- comes into full effect

Restating an opinion is not defense of that opinion. Just like rhyming off inane truism's that apply to any prospect isn't a substitute for analysis.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Restating an opinion is not defense of that opinion.

Closing statement to make the point clear

 

[therealkoho]

Leafs fans are delusional ir just funny. Minnesota says hell no with laughter.

Wild dont need another winger in Nylander much less a joke of bracco & Andrea's Johnson.

To think wild trade Dumba, el,, such & 2nd for those other junks is funny

I was joking. No chance I move Nylander for Dumba

you may want to talk with this Wild fan I quoted above

btw Nylander is a valuable piece, but what do the Leafs need more, a real upgrade on the blueline or goals up front? I mean other then cap space that is

as it stands right now the blueline looks like this Rielly, Muzzin, Dermott, Sandin, Holl, and borderline guys like Marincin, Rosen and the unproven Liljegren

 

[CatchyTune]

Nothing indicates he is a solid grade A at this point.

I'll make it simple. Since you said Brannstrom was an A+, theres no reason why Sandin shouldnt be an A+. Then slide Liljegren to an A. Sandins still above him, and hes where he should be.

 

[therealkoho]

I’m not a huge Dumba fan, but I appreciate he does exhibit hard to play against skill, and can also eat hard (and big) minutes. If the Wild trade Dumba for a forward it should be for hard skill, and not soft skill. The Wild GM is too smart to bring in soft skill, that eats huge cap dollars, especially at the cost of Dumba.

whether it be hard or soft(highly subjective qualities btw) the Wild need more goals up front

ftr by the end of the season Nylander isn't a forward I'd describe as being soft, also he would have led the Wild in scoring

 

[Fatass]

whether it be hard or soft(highly subjective qualities btw) the Wild need more goals up front

ftr by the end of the season Nylander isn't a forward I'd describe as being soft, also he would have led the Wild in scoring

Is Nylander hard or easy to play against? Clearly the answer is easy. He’s soft skill. He’s good, but not worth Dumba.

 

[therealkoho]

okey dokey lucky larry as long as you say so

 

[Fatass]

okey dokey lucky larry as long as you say so

Agreed. Soft v hard to play against is subjective.

 

[57special]

What are we talking about, Chinese martial arts?

Agree with poster above who says that Dumba needs to re-prove himself before he is worth Nylander. Also agree that Dumba isn't the cure to what ails the Leafs Blue line.
My main objection to the proposed deal between TOR and MN is that Nylander is a luxury, not a need, and that JEE is a need, not a luxury that can be disposed of lightly. I know his stats haven't been impressive, but he is a terrific shutdown defender in the mold of Mikko Koivu, and I anticipate him getting better production this year once Koivu retires and Staal slows down even further, finally giving him some PP TOI.

Now, if I was convinced that Nylander could be a perennial 60+ point C, then a Dumba + JEE return for him wouldn't be out of the question. I just haven't seen that from him, and likely won't, with TOR's lineup. I also understand TOR not being crazy about the deal till Dumba gets back on track. I will tell you that JEE would be PERFECT for them, though, and just what they need.

 

[Mick Jagr]

Didnt your team give Brandon Tanev 6 years with a 10 team NTC?

You mean my team, the only team in the modern cap era to win back to back Stanley Cups?

 

[Meeqs]

Is Nylander hard or easy to play against? Clearly the answer is easy. He’s soft skill. He’s good, but not worth Dumba.

Its been really interesting to see your comments throughout threads this past lil bit as you are so obsessed on how hard and soft players are that I would assume you get some of the most hilarious targeted adds on here.

You have to listen to a lot of old boys Canadian radio right? The only other person I have ever heard worry about those phrases are like the Burkes of the world

 

[CatchyTune]

You mean my team, the only team in the modern cap era to win back to back Stanley Cups?

Yeah, if Tanev has one, why are you laughing Muzzin has one? Its the color of his sweater.

 

[HyPnOtiK]

2021 1st
2022 2nd
Kerfoot
Lilejgren
Dermott
Robertson

What could this buy us?

A bunch of pieces doesn't get you a top pair D. Furthermore you aren't losing nearly enough cap space to afford a top pair D

 

[HyPnOtiK]

Done. Doubt Toronto would want to do that though. I would consider doing even like a first, a prospect and some salary for Burns. Sharks just cant handle three elite offense only D on the team

Umm I'm failing to see a 3rd elite offensive defensemen

 

[Conbon]

As much as it literally kills me as a Flames fan but I'd do Gio for a collection of those parts. It's short term but he is about as steady as you can get and great leader. He deserves a cup.

 

[TheImpatientPanther]

As much as it literally kills me as a Flames fan but I'd do Gio for a collection of those parts. It's short term but he is about as steady as you can get and great leader. He deserves a cup.

Just curious what his cost would be as a FLA fan?
2 years left but 36 years old.

 

[Conbon]

Just curious what his cost would be as a FLA fan?
2 years left but 36 years old.

I genuinely don't know how to gauge his value. Half expect to be ripped to shreds for even suggesting it in this thread. Hes worth more to the Flames than what teams are willing to give up, but hes absolutely a top end two way defenceman and his NTC loosens up to 19 teams next season. Flames really should learn from their mistakes with Iginla and move Gio while he is still near the top of the game.

 

[the Chad Kilger]

B+ prospect. Nothing wrong with that. He could turn into a top 4D. I don't have him as a Grade A. Maybe you can make a argument that he is a A- but then were talking a very minuscule gap and your sensitivity between B+ and A- comes into full effect

Ridiculous comment showing anti leaf bias. A 21 year old defence prospect who is a virtual lock to be an NHLer and has top 4 upside only a B prospoect