Blue Jays Discussion: The "Let's blow up the team" edition

[dredeye]

Seeing as I believe the white sox would like to get away from Robertson. I'd look at a swap with them of Smoak for Robertson with a couple little kicker prospects maybe. I suppose it depends on the value they attach to him but I think the cost would be minimal if we take on the full contract. If they picked up all of Smoak's contract Robertson would only cost us an additional 8 million in the first year and 9 million in the second year of his remaining contract. Not bad value if they take back Smoak.

If I'm doing the math correctly the jays should have about 35 million left to spend.

Jose 2/30
Valbuena 2/12
Robertson - Smoak 7.9 million with the reduction
Stroman getting a little over 3 next year.
That would leave about 1.5 million. Although sportrac has upton at 5 million so that could be an additional 4 million so 5.5 million left. I doubt we could get Blevins with that who I'd like to get.

 

[Cor]

They might have been a little further apart in negotiations before that. They file numbers that have to be realistic because in baseball the arbitrator choose 1 number of the other.

So the Jays could have been asking for 2.8 and Stroman 3.8 in negotiations but the numbers they file become closer because getting an extra 300k or so(the don't know what number each other are going to file when they file) is better than asking for 600k more and getting none more.

I'm hoping they come to an agreement on something longer. That buys up free agent years.

Nah, that can't be it

 

[theaub]

Shapiro purposely angering Stroman so he can trade him for Cleveland front office executives

 

[ShaneFalco]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/blue-jays-faq-whats-free-agency-holdup/

Q. Dude, we’ve been patient like you suggested last month and still nothing but Kendrys Morales and Steve Pearce. What the hell is everyone waiting for?


A. First, I feel your pain, and know that your bewilderment over how long things are dragging is shared by some in the industry, as well. The impression I’ve gotten is that several teams remain reluctant to dive in and address their needs, preferring to wait things out a bit longer to get a better sense of how the market is valuing the remaining players.

That being said, I get the sense the Blue Jays are entering the end game of their process and the expectation is we’ll start seeing some things go down relatively soon, maybe even next week. The trades involving Seth Smith and Jarrod Dyson plus the free-agent signing of Colby Rasmus with the Tampa Bay Rays may act as catalysts that lead to other moves.

. So outfield help, right? Jose Bautista, obviously?


A. Yes, and maybe, but probably not. The market’s primary area of surplus is in outfield bats with Michael Saunders, Brandon Moss and Angel Pagan believed to be among the Blue Jays’ preferred options. The New York Mets are going to have to move either Curtis Granderson or more likely Jay Bruce at some point, you’d figure, too, but the guess here is they dip into free agency before making a trade.

Dialogue continues with Bautista, who is still prioritizing a return to Toronto, but you would think if he was really in their plans, he’d be signed already. After all, the Blue Jays made near immediate pitches for Edwin Encarnacion and Brett Cecil in unsuccessful attempts to retain them, while the extent of their known pursuit of Bautista is the extension of a qualifying offer, which he rejected. A one-year deal at that $17.2 million or a bit higher in all likelihood brings him back.

But the question to ask yourself is whether that’s better than a reallocation of the money more equitably on an outfielder, a backup catcher and a bullpen lefty, with the bonus of a compensatory draft pick when Bautista signs elsewhere. That’s likely the equation the Blue Jays are weighing right now, unless the price for the franchise icon drops.

That leaves them about $23 millon to work with on a payroll of $160 million, which is roughly what is believed they have to work with.

Q. Is that enough to patch all their holes?


A. Sure, but then it goes back to the reallocation debate from earlier and whether the Blue Jays are better off spending big on one spot (an outfielder like Bautista) and skimping elsewhere, or spreading the wealth around more evenly. Either way, I’d expect the focus for the Blue Jays to be on adding run creation as opposed to run prevention, as that’s probably what they need most right now.

That goes at backup catcher, too, as my sense is they’d prefer a backup catcher who wouldn’t be a black hole at the plate in the event something happened to Russell Martin (a nightmare scenario for them). Now that Chris Iannetta has reached agreement with Arizona according to Jon Heyman of Fan Rag, Kurt Suzuki, Dioner Navarro and Hank Conger make varying degrees of sense in that way.

 

[Paladin2799]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/blue-jays-faq-whats-free-agency-holdup/

I would 100% be for a Navarro return to Toronto.

Also, People go "well budgets are fixed! cant go over 160m!" I'm pretty sure if they convinced Bautista to sign for a 1 year deal, that rogers might spring for 1-2m more for the season if it meant getting the players they wanted for the bullpen/bench etc. The reason they haven't signed Bautista is how much they want that 1st round pick and how much they value it. I'm sure the negotiation with JB is putting the 1st round value into the contract talks and him wanting length.

Rogers won't overspend for LONG TERM commitments, but they sure as **** might throw a couple pennies into the well.

 

[Leafin]

Seeing as I believe the white sox would like to get away from Robertson. I'd look at a swap with them of Smoak for Robertson with a couple little kicker prospects maybe. I suppose it depends on the value they attach to him but I think the cost would be minimal if we take on the full contract. If they picked up all of Smoak's contract Robertson would only cost us an additional 8 million in the first year and 9 million in the second year of his remaining contract. Not bad value if they take back Smoak.

If I'm doing the math correctly the jays should have about 35 million left to spend.

Jose 2/30
Valbuena 2/12
Robertson - Smoak 7.9 million with the reduction
Stroman getting a little over 3 next year.
That would leave about 1.5 million. Although sportrac has upton at 5 million so that could be an additional 4 million so 5.5 million left. I doubt we could get Blevins with that who I'd like to get.

This would be a good offseason imo.

I don't think White Sox need to take on salary to "dump" Robertson. The guy is still an elite arm and has value. I think our hope to dump Smoak is in a Jay Bruce deal or for a reliever that got paid recently but hasn't lived up to expectations.

Robertson would solidify our bullpen though. He'd be a huge add.

 

[dredeye]

This would be a good offseason imo.

I don't think White Sox need to take on salary to "dump" Robertson. The guy is still an elite arm and has value. I think our hope to dump Smoak is in a Jay Bruce deal or for a reliever that got paid recently but hasn't lived up to expectations.

Robertson would solidify our bullpen though. He'd be a huge add.

Robertson makes 12 this year and 13 next. He should have value but anytime I've seen his name come up this off season it was in a dump style trade. Not sure why because he has been good. I'd like another solid pen arm and usually shy away from heavy dollar pen arms. With this off season market for relievers his hit actually isn't bad. Anyway, I'd have no real issue adding a couple of good not great prospects to get him. As long as Smoak goes the other way

 

[Walshy7]

I was wondering this today, now the score makes it seem possible. What happens if the Indians sign Bautista? Obviously they don't have a 1st round pick but do we still get a 2nd compensation pick?

 

[dredeye]

I was wondering this today, now the score makes it seem possible. What happens if the Indians sign Bautista? Obviously they don't have a 1st round pick but do we still get a 2nd compensation pick?

We would but it would be a second round pick. Or just after the 2nd round. Comp picks fall after the full round.

 

[Walshy7]

We would but it would be a second round pick. Or just after the 2nd round. Comp picks fall after the full round.

Oh ok thanks. So if another team who still has a 1st after pick 10 signed him would it still be after the 2nd round or after the 1st round?

 

[theaub]

The comp pick would still be after the first round

 

[AllDay28]

We would but it would be a second round pick. Or just after the 2nd round. Comp picks fall after the full round.

the compensation picks are after the 1st round. Cleveland would lose their 1st and 2nd round picks tho.

 

[Walshy7]

the compensation picks are after the 1st round. Cleveland would lose their 1st and 2nd round picks tho.

Oh ok. So we would get say picks 26 and 30 (just random numbers). Cool thanks I think I would rather that than jb back but that's personal opinion I don't like jb

 

[dredeye]

the compensation picks are after the 1st round. Cleveland would lose their 1st and 2nd round picks tho.

I thought there was the 2nd round of sandwich picks.

 

[no13matssundin]

Indians potentially chasing Bautista. At that point, Cleveland is just trolling Shapiro and co.

 

[Canada4Gold]

I thought there was the 2nd round of sandwich picks.

Under the old system of A and B free agents there was. Under the current system(but now it's change again, this is the last year) you offer the QO and if the player declines and signs somewhere else that team loses it's highest pick that's not in the top 10, and the team who lost the player is compensated with a pick betwen the 1st and 2nd rounds.

Doesn't matter who Jose signs with, as long as he signs somewhere prior to the draft and it's not with us we'll get a pick between the first and 2nd round.

 

[Canada4Gold]

See the 2016 MLB draft. Cubs signed both Lackey and Heyward, Cubs lost their 1st round pick and their 2nd round pick, but the Cards got 2 picks between the 1st and 2nd round for them.

 

[Canada4Gold]

Oh ok. So we would get say picks 26 and 30 (just random numbers). Cool thanks I think I would rather that than jb back but that's personal opinion I don't like jb

the picks would be back to back as the compensation picks are ordered based on the same order as the rounds, reverse order of finish in the regular season. So if we get 2 comp picks they're back to back.

Assuming both Jose and Trumbo signs with teams that current have picks in the 1st round(but not top 10) then those picks would be 27 and 28. If Trumbo were to sign back with the O's then it'd be 26 and 27, if both sign with teams who do not have 1st round picks outside the top 10 it would be 29 and 30, and so on and so on there are many scenarios. We also have our own 1st rounder currently at 22nd that could improve if any teams in front of us forfeit their pick for Jose or Trumbo. The current order is at the link below.

http://m.mlb.com/draft/2017/order

 

[ShaneFalco]

Imagine seeing both EE and JB in an Indians uniform

It just ain't right.....

 

[ShaneFalco]

 

[ShaneFalco]

I'd want him back but he just isn't good in the field......

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/michael-saunders-still-hopeful-return-blue-jays/

"Quite honestly I think I got tired," he said. "Not trying to look for an excuse but I was wondering (why). I know that I didn't have a great second half, but I finished strong in the playoffs and that helped me going into the off-season. It's all about having a short memory. Going to the playoffs we didn't go as deep as we wanted to, but having a strong post-season helped propel me into the off-season."

Saunders still finished the year with 24 home runs and an .815 OPS before hitting .381 with a .981 OPS in eight playoff games. That said, there were times when his struggles caused him to press at the plate.

"I was trying to go four-for-four before the game even started to try and dig myself out of that whole," he recalled. "Instead I was digging it deeper."

Saunders says he now feels 'great' physically, partly because he’s been able to follow a relatively normal off-season workout regimen. A year ago this time, he had just recovered from the bone bruise that cost him much of the 2015 season. That meant his workouts didn’t begin until December. Now that he’s on a normal off-season training program, he expects to be strong enough to produce for the entire 2017 season.

"My knee’s fully healthy," he said. "I played an entire year on turf with no issues with my knee. That to me was a sign that going forward it wasn't (a concern)."

 

[Cor]

Jose signing in CLE too would be hilarious.

Imagine that in the ALCS

 

[BertCorbeau]

Jose signing in CLE too would be hilarious.

Imagine that in the ALCS

"I've decided to take my bat flipping talents to..."

 

[schenneuf]

If Jose signs with a team after a certain date, we don't get that pick. That seems to be the other teams' strategy. Then Shapiro will be left with his finger stuck up his a$$.

 

[Eyedea]

If Jose signs with a team after a certain date, we don't get that pick. That seems to be the other teams' strategy. Then Shapiro will be left with his finger stuck up his a$$.

Well that would be a terrible strategy for Bautista.