nobody imp0rtant
Registered pessimist
- May 23, 2018
- 10,812
- 17,977
Ooh yeah, that whole rocks and scrub brush for a "lawn" thing they have going on really makes it worth living in the 40C heat.
News Article: The Athletic writers rank Bell MTS Place as 4th best arena in the league
- Thread starter Yukon Joe
- Start date
Ooh yeah, that whole rocks and scrub brush for a "lawn" thing they have going on really makes it worth living in the 40C heat.
- Jun 10, 2014
- 57,410
- 29,251
Ooh yeah, that whole rocks and scrub brush for a "lawn" thing they have going on really makes it worth living in the 40C heat.
110F = 43C
Where do the Las Vegans spend the summers?
Skidooboy
Registered User
No I've never been. But i have family who lived there for years. My niece is still there. The Vegas they describe is a very different place than the people who visit Vegas.
It's not like a lot of cities...It's pretty much just a giant service community for the casino industry...the citizens don't have tons of cash, they have a high poverty rate, a high rental/vs homeowner rate, and the income average isn't great....
In short the NHL will be almost entirely reliant on tourists to fill the stands, especially when the locals start to choose to put the small amount of entertainment dollars they have into NFL tickets.
The tourism market is largely driven by non hockey loving states and nations if you look to the breakdowns...
People go to Vegas to gamble and see shows..not to watch hockey. The snowbirds and Hockey tourists never showed up in Phoenix ...I have yet to see a reason why Vegas will be different.
nobody imp0rtant
Registered pessimist
- May 23, 2018
- 10,812
- 17,977
Also, the success of the Knights and presumably the Raiders will just make the Vegas market more attractive to MLB and NBA. I think franchises in those leagues could threaten the Knights livelihood more than a handful of NFL games. Filling the stands could be the Knights undoing in the end.
Well, as I said, we have a campus in Vegas, so not only do I have many work colleagues who live there (many moved from our other locations) but I have spent considerable time in Vegas, off the strip.
There is not only a high visibility and buzz for the Knights around 'real Vegas', but hockey fans there are actually knowledgeable about the sport. I'd say moreso than even here in Tampa, with a cup winner and fairly long history of pro hockey in the city. The team is engrained into bars and other gathering places (a very concerted effort by the ownership group). The team will be far less reliant on tourists to fill seats than you are imagining.
A lot of Las Vegans are transplants (think New York area, Minnesota, Ohio, Illinois). There is a very strong foundation of lifelong hockey fans that grew up with not only hockey, but the NHL.
Yes, there is a high amount of work servicing tourism in Vegas, but the city has really morphed into much much more than that.
You cannot compare Phoenix to Vegas as they are two different tourist bases, AND the Vegas rink is very accessible to the strip. Phoenix' rink is very difficult to get to, and people who go to Phoenix are more interested in golfing or resting than doing stuff. There are tons of visitors to Vegas from Canada and the northern US - so, even though filling seats will not be largely placed on tourism, there are plenty of people who visit who are (and will be) interested in going to a game.
Obviously, we can't say for sure whether you or I am right, but let's stick a pin in this convo for 20 years and come back to it
I have been to the following:
San Jose, LA, Anaheim, Tampa, Sunrise, Chicago, Montreal, Ottawa and Buffalo
Sunrise is the worst arena I have been to, very dirty, drinks super expensive. We had seats on the side row 7 Jets attack zone and were asked twice to show our tickets. The second time I got pretty pissed off with the usher and we had a few words.
Anaheim would be second worst, the rest were good
San Jose, LA, Anaheim, Tampa, Sunrise, Chicago, Montreal, Ottawa and Buffalo
Sunrise is the worst arena I have been to, very dirty, drinks super expensive. We had seats on the side row 7 Jets attack zone and were asked twice to show our tickets. The second time I got pretty pissed off with the usher and we had a few words.
Anaheim would be second worst, the rest were good
- Jun 10, 2014
- 57,410
- 29,251
I don't think it is about the number of games. NFL will use up a lot of the money that Las Vegans have available for entertainment. Avg incomes in Las Vegas are low.
How could filling the stands be their undoing. Surely not filling the stands would be more likely to be their undoing.
I think what he is saying is that the success of the Knights could lead to other pro sports coming to town and further eroding the available sports entertainment dollar.
- Jun 10, 2014
- 57,410
- 29,251
The Blue Baron
Registered User
AlphaLackey
Registered User
Stumbledore
Registered User
110F = 43C
Where do the Las Vegans spend the summers?
It not just the summers. We were there last October as part of our "See the USA while you still can" tour and all three days the temperature hit 42C.
In October! 42C!
I'll take the temperate taiga any day.
Stumbledore
Registered User
[QUOTE="Mortimer Snerd, post: 172528316, member: 229787" Avg incomes in Las Vegas are low.[/QUOTE]
Maybe you live in a different tax bracket than the moose family, but the last time I checked the average household income in LV was running about $110,000 per annum.
All numbers are pre-Covid, of course. YKMV.
Maybe you live in a different tax bracket than the moose family, but the last time I checked the average household income in LV was running about $110,000 per annum.
All numbers are pre-Covid, of course. YKMV.
- Jun 10, 2014
- 57,410
- 29,251
Maybe you live in a different tax bracket than the moose family, but the last time I checked the average household income in LV was running about $110,000 per annum.
All numbers are pre-Covid, of course. YKMV.[/QUOTE]
Last I checked LV avg income was well below US avg. How many wage earners in that household?
From Wikipedia, based on 2010 census:
"The median income for a household in the city was $53,000 and the median income for a family was $58,465.[54] Males had a median income of $35,511 versus $27,554 for females. The per capita income for the city was $22,060. About 6.6% of families and 8.9% of the population were below the poverty line, including 5.4% of those under age 18 and 6.3% of those age 65 or over."
US avg figures are harder to come by, for some reason.
Stumbledore
Registered User
Last I checked LV avg income was well below US avg. How many wage earners in that household?
From Wikipedia, based on 2010 census:
"The median income for a household in the city was $53,000 and the median income for a family was $58,465.[54] Males had a median income of $35,511 versus $27,554 for females. The per capita income for the city was $22,060. About 6.6% of families and 8.9% of the population were below the poverty line, including 5.4% of those under age 18 and 6.3% of those age 65 or over."
US avg figures are harder to come by, for some reason.[/QUOTE]
Sorry, I don't know what the US average is. And, being a moose, I compare in Canadian dollars.
According to the 2018 American Community survey as published at Las Vegas Population & Demographics, Median Income - Point2, the average household income in Las Vegas was U$76,473 which at 1.43 RBC/DS conversion rate for 2018 will average out at about $109,356 which for a Canadian family is a pretty sizeable chunk of cash. Last time I checked, this year's annualized conversion rate is somewhat lower, about 1.39, which still has the mythical family pulling in more than a hundred grand a year.
Another 10-12 days and we can start talking about something that actually matters to hockey fans....
Section 325
Registered User
I have no idea if this is relevant or not, but Vegas does not have any state income tax so maybe that makes a big difference to these numbers? From what I recall also, there are a lot of really high income earners in Vegas but it is balanced by a huge amount of the living poor. That also could work to skew those numbers a bit.
Overall I would say that they can easily support the NHL but we will see once the Raiders hit the scene, I guess.
Ad
Upcoming events
-
-
-
-
GAME 3 - Drummondville Voltigeurs @ Victoriaville Tigres - Drummondville Voltigeurs leads series 2-0Wagers: 2Staked: $80.00Event closes- Updated:
-
