Speculation: Tavares Tells Toronto, "I'm YOUR Huckleberry Now". Fans leaguewide mourn.

[Brian39]

Teams wont pay more then rental price. Given who Tavares is, that's a 1st+a good prospect. No ones gutting their pool for a guy thats going to walk. Now if there are multiple teams he's willing to sign with....well then things will get ugly

We're going to have to agree to disagree that rental Tavares is worth just slightly more than rental Shatty or rental Hanzal. I realize that Sanford is worth less than the 'good prospect' you intend and the same can be said about the 2nd rounder and conditional 3rd the Wild included for Hanzal.

However, the difference between those add ons and the prospect you are talking about is not the difference between Shatty/Hanzal and Tavares.

If Tavares is traded as a rental, he will probably be the best and most sought after rental ever. Ray Bourque, Ron Francis, and Gretzky to the Blues are up there too, but Gretzky was 35 and Bourque was almost 40. Regardless of whether he is the best rental or just up there, this would be a way better player than the average top 6 guy who is available at the deadline. Hossa to the Pens is probably the closest comparable in the cap era and he garnered a 1st, A Esposito (20th overall a year earlier), and 2 legitimate roster players with some upside in Colby Armstrong and Erik Christensen (the Thrashers also traded Dupuis to the Pens, so probably cancel out Christensen to a degree since Christensen's production was just a bit better than Dupuis' at the time).

As great as Hossa was, I think most people would agree that a 27 year old Tavares should have more value than a 29 year old Hossa.

A 1st and a team's best or 2nd best prospect will likely be the base of the trade, but you're also going to have to throw in a piece or two that can contribute to the Isles in some way immediately. Maybe that's a 3rd line forward and your 4th or 5th best D man. Maybe it's a couple depth forwards. Maybe it's 1 roster player and a B level prospect who is a bit older. But it will be more than just a 1st and a good prospect.

 

[Dbrownss]

We're going to have to agree to disagree that rental Tavares is worth just slightly more than rental Shatty or rental Hanzal. I realize that Sanford is worth less than the 'good prospect' you intend and the same can be said about the 2nd rounder and conditional 3rd the Wild included for Hanzal.

However, the difference between those add ons and the prospect you are talking about is not the difference between Shatty/Hanzal and Tavares.

If Tavares is traded as a rental, he will probably be the best and most sought after rental ever. Ray Bourque, Ron Francis, and Gretzky to the Blues are up there too, but Gretzky was 35 and Bourque was almost 40. Regardless of whether he is the best rental or just up there, this would be a way better player than the average top 6 guy who is available at the deadline. Hossa to the Pens is probably the closest comparable in the cap era and he garnered a 1st, A Esposito (20th overall a year earlier), and 2 legitimate roster players with some upside in Colby Armstrong and Erik Christensen (the Thrashers also traded Dupuis to the Pens, so probably cancel out Christensen to a degree since Christensen's production was just a bit better than Dupuis' at the time).

As great as Hossa was, I think most people would agree that a 27 year old Tavares should have more value than a 29 year old Hossa.

A 1st and a team's best or 2nd best prospect will likely be the base of the trade, but you're also going to have to throw in a piece or two that can contribute to the Isles in some way immediately. Maybe that's a 3rd line forward and your 4th or 5th best D man. Maybe it's a couple depth forwards. Maybe it's 1 roster player and a B level prospect who is a bit older. But it will be more than just a 1st and a good prospect.

The salary cap is a big issue today though. No ones going to give up a blue chip prospect plus their first. That's a desperation gamble. Its unlikely we'll actually see this scenario play out either way

 

[Brian39]

The salary cap is a big issue today though. No ones going to give up a blue chip prospect plus their first. That's a desperation gamble. Its unlikely we'll actually see this scenario play out either way

At 50% retained, a team only needs $2.75 mil in space at the deadline to acquire Tavares. We're one of the most cap strapped teams in the league and we are currently projected to have $2 mil in deadline cap space without factoring in LTIR. Remember, when you take on a contract mid season, you only take on the remaining cap hit. So being able to take on a $2.75 mil contract at the deadline really means that you need to have about $500k or 600k of actual cap space. We're currently less than $400k below the cap. If we maintain that all year, we could take on a contract worth $2 mil at the deadline before factoring LTIR.

We could afford to take on Tavares (at 50% retained) without shedding a dime of salary if we left our roster as it is today for the rest of the season (beside moving Bergie and J-Bo from the IR to the active roster). We'd have about $2 mil in deadline space and could exceed the cap via LTIR relief due to Fabbri's injury. Most teams are in similar situations or could make the cap work by including a roster player going the other way to the Islanders. The Isles have every incentive to retain salary, just like we did with Shatty.

Tavares' insanely team friendly contract makes him incredibly easy to move at the deadline from a cap perspective. There are probably fewer than 5 teams who flat out couldn't take on the Tavares cap hit without sending a $2ish mil player the other way.

 

[Dbrownss]

At 50% retained, a team only needs $2.75 mil in space at the deadline to acquire Tavares. We're one of the most cap strapped teams in the league and we are currently projected to have $2 mil in deadline cap space without factoring in LTIR. Remember, when you take on a contract mid season, you only take on the remaining cap hit. So being able to take on a $2.75 mil contract at the deadline really means that you need to have about $500k or 600k of actual cap space. We're currently less than $400k below the cap. If we maintain that all year, we could take on a contract worth $2 mil at the deadline before factoring LTIR.

We could afford to take on Tavares (at 50% retained) without shedding a dime of salary if we left our roster as it is today for the rest of the season (beside moving Bergie and J-Bo from the IR to the active roster). We'd have about $2 mil in deadline space and could exceed the cap via LTIR relief due to Fabbri's injury. Most teams are in similar situations or could make the cap work by including a roster player going the other way to the Islanders. The Isles have every incentive to retain salary, just like we did with Shatty.

Tavares' insanely team friendly contract makes him incredibly easy to move at the deadline from a cap perspective. There are probably fewer than 5 teams who flat out couldn't take on the Tavares cap hit without sending a $2ish mil player the other way.

No im talking about moving forward, not just the rental season. Ill use the Blues for example.

Let's say were not on his no trade list, but he's not interested in signing an extention. Do you think Armstrong would trade a 1st+Thomas(if hes our top guy) and maybe something else for a guy thats only going to be around for a few months? Now i dont know if Thomas would be considered blue chip, but lets say he is that by the time of the deal. Thats a cost controlled potentially elite asset for a rental, even though he's elite himself.


I can only see a desperate GM doing something like that. He doesn't care about the future. Does that make any sense?

 

[Brian39]

No im talking about moving forward, not just the rental season. Ill use the Blues for example.

Let's say were not on his no trade list, but he's not interested in signing an extention. Do you think Armstrong would trade a 1st+Thomas(if hes our top guy) and maybe something else for a guy thats only going to be around for a few months? Now i dont know if Thomas would be considered blue chip, but lets say he is that by the time of the deal. Thats a cost controlled potentially elite asset for a rental, even though he's elite himself.


I can only see a desperate GM doing something like that. He doesn't care about the future. Does that make any sense?

I gotcha. I misunderstood what you meant.

I do think that the cap has caused GMs to value futures more than in the past, but that line of thinking had already come into play in 2008 when the Pens traded for Hossa. The Pens were about to see Sid make $8.7 mil per year and they were just a few months away from negotiating a deal with Malkin that they had to know was going to be at least $7 mil (turned out being $8.7 mil). They knew darn well that they needed cost controlled assets to manage the cap, but were still willing to move a 1st and their undisputed top prospect for a chance to go all in for the Cup.

If he is available, the team who gets Tavares mid season becomes immediate Cup favorites. I think someone is going to be willing to trade 2 of their best 3 or 4 future assets (prospects or picks) plus a couple decent roster pieces in order to take that chance, especially if they believe that they can sell him on the city enough to re-sign him before he hits UFA.

Assuming he isn't an Islander next year, I'd still put the Blues chances of landing Tavares via UFA at less than 10%. Maybe he signs with the team who trades for him at the deadline, maybe he hits UFA and we don't convince him to come to STL.

Even without an agreed upon extension, that number goes way up if we're the team who acquires him at the deadline. Besides a chance at the Cup this year, it is an extended sales pitch for our organization. rather than a 1 hour presentation in his agent's office, he gets to know the guys in the locker room, adjust to the system a little bit, and play a few months with a winger who is substantially better than anyone he has ever played with. Even if you don't win a Cup with him this year, a good playoff run probably goes a long way towards selling him on your team. This is a guy who has won a single playoff series in his entire career. A trip to the Conference Final very well could be enough to convince him that your city is the best fit.

It's not a guarantee, but even without an extension, you are getting more than just a pure rental for your trade. You are getting the very, very rare chance to sell an elite player on your franchise over a several month period. Him and Petro have that youth connection. We have an amazing alumni group within the organization who didn't grow up here but call St. Louis home. That stuff is difficult to sell at the end of June when there are 9 other teams who have appointments to make the same sales pitch. It's easier to sell over several months via 5 minute conversations here and there.

It is still a heck of a gamble when you talk about giving up 2 high end futures and a couple other quality pieces. But I don't think it is a desperation move at all. I don't think you need a guaranteed extension to make it worth the steep price. I think you need an assurance from his representation that he is willing to discuss an extension and negotiate in good faith.

 

[Dbrownss]

I gotcha. I misunderstood what you meant.

I do think that the cap has caused GMs to value futures more than in the past, but that line of thinking had already come into play in 2008 when the Pens traded for Hossa. The Pens were about to see Sid make $8.7 mil per year and they were just a few months away from negotiating a deal with Malkin that they had to know was going to be at least $7 mil (turned out being $8.7 mil). They knew darn well that they needed cost controlled assets to manage the cap, but were still willing to move a 1st and their undisputed top prospect for a chance to go all in for the Cup.

If he is available, the team who gets Tavares mid season becomes immediate Cup favorites. I think someone is going to be willing to trade 2 of their best 3 or 4 future assets (prospects or picks) plus a couple decent roster pieces in order to take that chance, especially if they believe that they can sell him on the city enough to re-sign him before he hits UFA.

Assuming he isn't an Islander next year, I'd still put the Blues chances of landing Tavares via UFA at less than 10%. Maybe he signs with the team who trades for him at the deadline, maybe he hits UFA and we don't convince him to come to STL.

Even without an agreed upon extension, that number goes way up if we're the team who acquires him at the deadline. Besides a chance at the Cup this year, it is an extended sales pitch for our organization. rather than a 1 hour presentation in his agent's office, he gets to know the guys in the locker room, adjust to the system a little bit, and play a few months with a winger who is substantially better than anyone he has ever played with. Even if you don't win a Cup with him this year, a good playoff run probably goes a long way towards selling him on your team. This is a guy who has won a single playoff series in his entire career. A trip to the Conference Final very well could be enough to convince him that your city is the best fit.

It's not a guarantee, but even without an extension, you are getting more than just a pure rental for your trade. You are getting the very, very rare chance to sell an elite player on your franchise over a several month period. Him and Petro have that youth connection. We have an amazing alumni group within the organization who didn't grow up here but call St. Louis home. That stuff is difficult to sell at the end of June when there are 9 other teams who have appointments to make the same sales pitch. It's easier to sell over several months via 5 minute conversations here and there.

It is still a heck of a gamble when you talk about giving up 2 high end futures and a couple other quality pieces. But I don't think it is a desperation move at all. I don't think you need a guaranteed extension to make it worth the steep price. I think you need an assurance from his representation that he is willing to discuss an extension and negotiate in good faith.

Thats different from my scenerio though as there may be a pathway to an extention. In mine, there's no chance for an extention. This is based on he has a couple teams he wants to go to Via FA if that team doesnt trade for him

 

[Halak Ness Monster]

Instead of acquiring Stanton, the Cards could go after a lesser upgrade in RF, pick up a guy like Santana at 1B and move Carpenter to a super-utility everyday role, shore up the bullpen and the back of the rotation, and ultimately end up improving the team just as much. Instead of acquiring Tavares, the Blues could go for a lesser upgrade and then also look to fill other holes in the lineup.

Pittsburgh showed this last year by winning without an elite defenseman--I don't see why you have to have an elite center, either, provided that you are at least above average and have talent at other positions.

The Cardinals and Blues have tried this approach. The Cardinals tried winning with the depth and above average players all-around recently. It hasn't worked. Having superstars like Pujols and Chris Carpenter and Edmonds and Rolen carried us to titles in 2006 and/or 2011. A lineup that features 8 true starters(2+ WAR) but no superstars hasn't done much the last two seasons. The high impact guys are missing.

For the Blues, they tried rolling out 3 scoring lines with players like Perron, Oshie, Backes, Berglund from 2012 to 2014. Lacking was the 2-3 elite players that can get the job done when the game tightens in the playoffs. We really only had Tarasenko and surprise, surpise...we've actually won some playoff series since Tank turned into a star.

You mentioned the Penguins winning without a superstar d-man last year(they had Letang the year before but he was hurt last season). Well, to make up for that, the Penguins had the two best centers in the game in Crosby and Malkin and they had a superstar winger in Phil Kessell.

It's not an exact science. Championship building never is. I'm just not a fan of the depth argument anymore. I think I'd rather have a shorter roster with some superstars more than than I'd want depth from above average guys.

But clearly it's a sliding scale. Can't just have 3 superstars and no depth. Gotta have some mixture of both. I think the Blues would have it perfectly if they added Tavares to this roster.

 

[Stealth JD]

It’s starting to look like we already acquired our PPG #1C in Schenn. Tavares would be a luxury that absolutely should be pursued to the fullest if the opportunity to acquire him presented itself...but a legit 2RW seems to be the biggest gaping hole at the moment. What a steal Schenn is starting to look like.

 

[The Note in MI]

The Cardinals and Blues have tried this approach. The Cardinals tried winning with the depth and above average players all-around recently. It hasn't worked. Having superstars like Pujols and Chris Carpenter and Edmonds and Rolen carried us to titles in 2006 and/or 2011. A lineup that features 8 true starters(2+ WAR) but no superstars hasn't done much the last two seasons. The high impact guys are missing.

For the Blues, they tried rolling out 3 scoring lines with players like Perron, Oshie, Backes, Berglund from 2012 to 2014. Lacking was the 2-3 elite players that can get the job done when the game tightens in the playoffs. We really only had Tarasenko and surprise, surpise...we've actually won some playoff series since Tank turned into a star.

You mentioned the Penguins winning without a superstar d-man last year(they had Letang the year before but he was hurt last season). Well, to make up for that, the Penguins had the two best centers in the game in Crosby and Malkin and they had a superstar winger in Phil Kessell.

It's not an exact science. Championship building never is. I'm just not a fan of the depth argument anymore. I think I'd rather have a shorter roster with some superstars more than than I'd want depth from above average guys.

But clearly it's a sliding scale. Can't just have 3 superstars and no depth. Gotta have some mixture of both. I think the Blues would have it perfectly if they added Tavares to this roster.

Penguins also had supporting wingers that were capable of scoring big time in the playoffs like rust hornquist hagelin bonino sheary and hornquist in 16 and in 17 had the big three dominate + a coming out party from Jake geuntzel. That coupled with elite goaltending, biased officiating (opinion) and really good puck luck despite not impressive underlying numbers they managed to win the cup. Certainly last year was not a dominating performcance. It could have gone any other way they could have lost to the caps easily and been out in the second round. They could have lost to the sens in that game 7 but they just found ways to win. I don’t consider them to be the perfect recipe in team makeup for a Stanley cup. They can make up for blemishes with their 1/2 punch down the middle.

 

[Dbrownss]

It’s starting to look like we already acquired our PPG #1C in Schenn. Tavares would be a luxury that absolutely should be pursued to the fullest if the opportunity to acquire him presented itself...but a legit 2RW seems to be the biggest gaping hole at the moment. What a steal Schenn is starting to look like.

Does anyone else have this feeling with Schenn being our legit 1c?

If our top line is a legitimate 70-80pt per player line, then we don't NEED Tavares, and salary could become an issue. Although....

Human Tavares Tarasenko
Schwartz Schenn Human

 

[Linkens Mastery]

My problem with Tavares comes down to two things.

1) He's gonna be expensive, and we are already having problems with the cap

and

2)Even if we do get him, how do we know he's gonna mesh well with Tarasenko, hell, we went and got Stastny to Center him and Schwartz and Tarasenko and Stastny never truly clicked.

Right now we are in a good spot with Schenn and Schwartz being able to make room for Tarasenko. The only glaring hole in the lineup is the 2nd line wingers. (Fabbri should be able to take over the 2nd line LW next season if his rehab goes better than last season and Steens more than Capable of holding that position this season). We just need that 2nd line RW IMHO.

 

[Dbrownss]

My theory is how JT plays. He's a set up and finish guy, similar to Vladi. Both excel at long distant setups and finishing ability. Similar to Stamkos and Kucherov. Even if they dont click...you still have Tarasenko and Tavares on the ice at the same time. Thats a hand ful of sniping to deal with.

Stastny was never much of a finisher. He can score but he always defers. He also likes to set up behind the net. He would gel more with a stationary 1 timer guy. Someone who likes to sit in the soft spots

 

[Bye Felicia]

The Cardinals and Blues have tried this approach. The Cardinals tried winning with the depth and above average players all-around recently. It hasn't worked. Having superstars like Pujols and Chris Carpenter and Edmonds and Rolen carried us to titles in 2006 and/or 2011. A lineup that features 8 true starters(2+ WAR) but no superstars hasn't done much the last two seasons. The high impact guys are missing.

For the Blues, they tried rolling out 3 scoring lines with players like Perron, Oshie, Backes, Berglund from 2012 to 2014. Lacking was the 2-3 elite players that can get the job done when the game tightens in the playoffs. We really only had Tarasenko and surprise, surpise...we've actually won some playoff series since Tank turned into a star.

You mentioned the Penguins winning without a superstar d-man last year(they had Letang the year before but he was hurt last season). Well, to make up for that, the Penguins had the two best centers in the game in Crosby and Malkin and they had a superstar winger in Phil Kessell.

It's not an exact science. Championship building never is. I'm just not a fan of the depth argument anymore. I think I'd rather have a shorter roster with some superstars more than than I'd want depth from above average guys.

But clearly it's a sliding scale. Can't just have 3 superstars and no depth. Gotta have some mixture of both. I think the Blues would have it perfectly if they added Tavares to this roster.

I don't disagree with that, and I did note that you can be above average at every position and still not be good enough. But I think that (1) it is generally a better value to shore up multiple weak spots, if they are there, than to go for one huge upgrade, and (2) to the extent that you do go after elite talent, you don't need to focus on a particular position in a vacuum--you should be looking to make the biggest upgrade you can, regardless of position.

If Schenn sticks at C, I'm not sure if C is the Blues' biggest weakness anymore. I'd be as thrilled as any fan to see Tavares or another superstar C on the Blues. But would spending the money Tavares be a bigger upgrade than, say, signing a cheaper option and then also filling the hole at RW? I'm not so sure about that. Though whatever the case, there are certainly a lot of moving parts in this organization in the near future, with the strong prospects that it has.

 

[Dbrownss]

The Blues are in an interesting spot. If Schenn is what he is....then we can potenially rely on youth to fill in.

2-3C: Thomas, Barbashev, Fabbri
2-3RW Thonpson, Kyrou, Kostin, Blais

 

[Ranksu]

 

[Vincenzo Arelliti]

I couldn't agree more with the Stastny analysis. Stastny was brought in when we didn't have the ability to rush the zone and make sick plays. Now his skillset offensively doesn't fit the system. Stastny's playstyle doesn't allow for his wingers to utilize their speed and playmaking abilities. Instead, Stastny requires a winger that can roof it, find soft areas of the ice, and scores from 10 ft out of the net. While I do believe that Yeo loves to change the strategy on a line-to-line basis and player-to-player basis, I don't think this particular strategy utilizes any of our defensemen well. I don't see Yeo willing to cater to that.

So we'll need to acquire a center that can work more off the rush and have the ability to finish himself. Can we find a cheaper option than Stastny that allows us to get a RW as well? I doubt we are able to trade for both of those, so that really limits us. But, if we ignore the need to find a cheaper center that can fit better than Stastny, I think it becomes obvious that Tavares+whomever is more realistic? than cheaper-and-better-than-stastny+Super-Rattie.

Paul is either going to have to accept a 3C/backup 2C role with a pay-cut, or we are just going to have to look elsewhere, imo.

Here's a cap and trade breakdown of what I think we should do if Tavares is involved:

When Bouwmeester and Berglund return:

Gustav Nyquist (4.75M)


Carl Gunnarsson (2.9M)
Jordan Schmaltz (.925M)


At the deadline (we will have roughly 5.5M in deadline space):

John Tavares (5,5M) possibly retention


Jake Walman (.925M) or Tage Thompson (.925M)
Ivan Barabashev (.741M) or Sammy Blais (.673M)
Petteri Lindbohm (.650M)

Going into the playoffs:

Steen Tavares Tarasenko
Schwartz Schenn Nyquist
Berglund Stastny Sobotka
Upshall Brodziak Jaskin/Paajarvi

Edmundson Pietrangelo
Bouwmeester Parayko
Dunn Bortuzzo

Then in the off-season sign Tavares and let Stastny walk. Fabbri and Edmundson get raises, and one of Berglund or Sobotka is traded and replaced by one of the kids.

Fabbri Tavares Tarasenko
Schwartz Schenn Nyquist
Sobotka XXX XXX

 

[2 Minute Minor]

Please don’t post offers for Tavares like that on the main board. That’s pretty bad. Don’t say it’s “rental prices”.

 

[KirkOut]

Please don’t post offers for Tavares like that on the main board. That’s pretty bad. Don’t say it’s “rental prices”.

yeah exactly...

what is this, gamestop?

 

[Vladdy the Impaler]

At this point I honestly think we don't even need a guy like Taveras when we have Schenn.

Before this season started, I was wondering if Schenn could take his game to a whole new level with the Blues, and he has exceeded my expectations in every possible manner. He is the #1C the Blues have been looking for for so long, and his chemistry with Schwartz and Tarasenko is just incredible to watch.

 

[Evocable Manager]

20 games of unsustainable scoring does not make a player a 1C. This is the same stretch that lead people to believe Lehtera was a 1C.

Schenn has been great, but he will cool off and probably end up around his usually 55-60 points. He's also shown that the wing would be a better spot for him.

Still a great player and I like him, but 1C? That's pushing it. This team could definitely use John Tavares.

 

[The Note in MI]

I think he's a #1C. On this team. He's not an elite #1C. He's a low to mid 65pt #1C. But that's such a step up for us that it's paying dividends. We always needed one more player to fit with Schwartz and Tarasenko. Theyre doing what we expected Stastny to do with them.

 

[tfriede2]

20 games of unsustainable scoring does not make a player a 1C. This is the same stretch that lead people to believe Lehtera was a 1C.

Schenn has been great, but he will cool off and probably end up around his usually 55-60 points. He's also shown that the wing would be a better spot for him.

Still a great player and I like him, but 1C? That's pushing it. This team could definitely use John Tavares.

He's shown that the wing is a better spot for him in Philly, not St. Louis. Any team could use John Tavares, and I agree we should still pursue him. But Schenn is absolutely a 1C "right now." It's anyone's guess how long he can sustain ppg numbers.

 

[Dbrownss]

20 games of unsustainable scoring does not make a player a 1C. This is the same stretch that lead people to believe Lehtera was a 1C.

Schenn has been great, but he will cool off and probably end up around his usually 55-60 points. He's also shown that the wing would be a better spot for him.

Still a great player and I like him, but 1C? That's pushing it. This team could definitely use John Tavares.

While he's not going to score 100pts. It would be just as shocking to see him slip back to 50-60pts. Two major differences is Schenn can skate and shoot, Lehtera could do neither. If the Blues have the chance to get Tavares, its a no brainer. Tavares and Schenn down the middle is better then Schenn and whoever down the middle

 

[Vincenzo Arelliti]

I'm skeptical about Schenn as well, and you are all welcome for not preemptively changing my username before we got to see what we had in him like I did for Lehtera. If he can manage a 70+ pt season, then Schenn is, until proven otherwise, a 1C. Until then, Schenn is just on a hot streak, imo. I would be shocked however if Schenn somehow doesn't become a 70pt C for the remainder of his contract however. His playstyle and skill meshes too well with Yeo and the Blues to do anything but that, imo. But you still have to make a play for John Tavares. We have the cap, the need, and the pieces to get a potential deal done.

What other team is going to be in the playoffs, have the need for JT, have the space, the pieces, the surrounding cast, the wide window, and not be on his NT list? Not to mention that NYI would likely want him out of conference, let alone out of division. Just by that standard NYI has 8 teams to trade him to - and that's before citing the previous requirements. If the Blues want JT, they'll find a way to get him given those odds.

 

[JoshFromMO]

Its silly to say we don't need Tavares because of Schenn. It's like saying we don't need another RW cause we have Tarasenko.
I am fully on the Tavares train if he becomes available