Tanner Jeannot trade

[WarriorofTime]

HF always overvalues draft picks. There's no guarantee that any of those kids will ever see a minute of ice time in the NHL. Jeannot, on the other hand, already plays 7 minutes every other night. Drafted kids can only dream of that.

If anything, HF undervalues draft picks. Not to say there isn't value in what Tampa tries to do with skipping the 4-5 years of developing for late picks that may not even get there and jump right into savory RFA years with smart trading, but that obviously depends on where a team is within a cycle. And as this shows, that isn't exactly foolproof either if the development curve isn't as they hope.

The number of "well there's only a such and such chance that a late 1st becomes a player as good as so and so" completely misses the mark of draft picks and their value.

 

[Raistlin]

HF always overvalues draft picks. There's no guarantee that any of those kids will ever see a minute of ice time in the NHL. Jeannot, on the other hand, already plays 7 minutes every other night. Drafted kids can only dream of that.

draft picks are currency. you dont judge it based on what the drafted kid may one day become, you judge it for its utility. If I give you a wad of bills, you dont look at it as paper and use it to blow your nose. Its worth is what it can net you in the trade market if you are a contending team.

 

[Ace Card Bedard]

It happens.

The Blackhawks made some very bad trades in an effort to win more cups.

Weise and Fleishmann for Danault and a 2nd (Romanov.)
Horrible trade in hindsight but it was an attempt to win one more with vets.

 

[yeaher]

Honestly, I think they thought they could turn him into a Val Nichuskin after he lit them up in the Finals.

 

[Stelio Kontos]

I think the rangers trading .. McDonagh and JT Miller for Namestnikov, Brett Howden, Hajek +1st & 2nd Round picks was worse.

Jeannot trade is still pretty bad but most forwards who get traded to tampa suck the first year.

 

[Osprey]

If anything, HF undervalues draft picks. Not to say there isn't value in what Tampa tries to do with skipping the 4-5 years of developing for late picks that may not even get there and jump right into savory RFA years with smart trading, but that obviously depends on where a team is within a cycle. And as this shows, that isn't exactly foolproof either if the development curve isn't as they hope.

The number of "well there's only a such and such chance that a late 1st becomes a player as good as so and so" completely misses the mark of draft picks and their value.

draft picks are currency. you dont judge it based on what the drafted kid may one day become, you judge it for its utility. If I give you a wad of bills, you dont look at it as paper and use it to blow your nose. Its worth is what it can net you in the trade market if you are a contending team.

I can't tell if you noticed, but I was joking and hid a sarcasm emoji at the end of my post. I actually agree with both of you.

 

[Outl4w]

I think you're overvaluing draft picks. You can't acquire multiple good players with a bunch of mid-round picks, unless they're A) soon-to-be free agent due a big raise, or B) significantly underperforming their current contract. Basically you can only make those kind of acquisitions if you have a lot of cap space to spend, which Tampa obviously doesn't.

Teams have no reason to let good, cost-controlled players go, especially to teams like Tampa that have only draft capital to spend. So if they're traded for picks only, it's gonna be a lot of picks.

Obviously, Jeannot wasn't worth that. But you don't have to squint too hard to understand why a guy that scored 24 goals in his rookie season, signed to a 800K salary for another year, would have a fair amount of value for a contender.

He was extended and rewarded for being a nonfactor in the leaf series loss. His cap counts for 2.665 million for this year his second in TB and third year wherever he is. Guy was worse than watson,essymont,glendenning,maroon,perry and motte. The only other nhl veteran forward that has been worse here is sheary. They were a one two combo of pure suck this year.

 

[Gnashville]

That is not true, it defers one year.

I have looked everywhere and have not seen anything about it becoming another pick if it’s too 10.

 

[StreetHawk]

I have looked everywhere and have not seen anything about it becoming another pick if it’s too 10.

Can't imagine it would disappear into nothing. Info has to be available somewhere. I mean, it's been pushed pretty far down the line from when the deal was made.

On Capfriendly, no additional info aside from it being top 10 protected. But Colorado owes Phi a 2025 first as well and it's also top 10 protected without any other comment in the event it lands in the top 10. I have to bet that Nash/Phil will get something else if they don't get the 2025 first. Just haven't see what that would/could be.

 

[ItWasJustified]

What the hell was TB GM thinking with this trade?

Their GM pretty much said exactly what he thought in the press conference after that trade. If I remember correctly and paraphrasing: ''We're in a win now mode and those draft picks won't have an impact at all during Stamkos, Hedman, Vasilevsky and Kucherov's best years''

 

[SpezDispenser]

You must be thinking of the wrong other trade. He's a solid player and they gave up nothing for him (Mathieu Joseph who's JAG and a 4th round pick).

There is nothing wrong with Joseph as a player.

 

[KevinRedkey]

Jeannot had 24g and 41p as a rookie the year before Tampa aquired him. It's pretty clear Tampa thought they could get him back to that level, instead of where he's been since then.

I personally like when teams go for home runs once in a while - even if they swing and miss sometimes.

So far the trade has become:
Cal Foote (bust)
2023 3rd round pick (83rd - Dylan MacKinnon)
2023 4th round pick (115th - Jayson Shaugabay)
2023 5th round pick (147th - Kevin Bicker)
2024 2nd round pick (53rd - TBD)
2025 1st round pick (TBD - Top 10 protected)

Sure, one of those players could be useful in 2026+, but I don't think Tampa really cares about that and they are all magic beans either way. The only valuable asset they gave up was the 1st and arguably the 2nd - which likely won't contribute till 2027+ if at all.

It was a bad trade, but to call it one of the worst ever, when no one on Nashville's side is even remotely known (yet?) is just silly. Forsberg for Erat is much worse for example.

 

[Outl4w]

Jeannot had 24g and 41p as a rookie the year before Tampa aquired him. It's pretty clear Tampa thought they could get him back to that level, instead of where he's been since then.

I personally like when teams go for home runs once in a while - even if they swing and miss sometimes.

HE also had an unsustainable high shooting percentage his first two seasons. He already showed signed of major regression over the next season. He just looks slow, doesn't win enough 1 on 1 battles to play in the top 9, can't finish for anything , and is only useful when he is fighting. He should be making about half of what he is getting.

 

[SympathyForTheDevils]

He was extended and rewarded for being a nonfactor in the leaf series loss. His cap counts for 2.665 million for this year his second in TB and third year wherever he is. Guy was worse than watson,essymont,glendenning,maroon,perry and motte. The only other nhl veteran forward that has been worse here is sheary. They were a one two combo of pure suck this year.

I know; that's why I mentioned that extending him early was just as much a mistake as trading for him in the first place.

That said, it's easy to see the logic behind it, trying to find a Killorn replacement for a much lower price. It's the same kind of swing JBB took for Coleman and Goodrow, paying big for low-cap players with solid performance. JBB just targeted the wrong guy (and the wrong position; Tampa could really use a solid #4 right now).

The people calling it one of the worst trades in history, or the trade that closed the Bolts' window are just being overdramatic. Those picks just aren't that valuable. Ultimately, the decline of the Bolts has little to do with Jeannot: it's just the cap doing its thing, just like with every post-Cup team (with the added effect of the COVID flat cap).

 

[Outl4w]

I know; that's why I mentioned that extending him early was just as much a mistake as trading for him in the first place.

That said, it's easy to see the logic behind it, trying to find a Killorn replacement for a much lower price. It's the same kind of swing JBB took for Coleman and Goodrow, paying big for low-cap players with solid performance. JBB just targeted the wrong guy (and the wrong position; Tampa could really use a solid #4 right now).

The people calling it one of the worst trades in history, or the trade that closed the Bolts' window are just being overdramatic. Those picks just aren't that valuable. Ultimately, the decline of the Bolts has little to do with Jeannot: it's just the cap doing its thing, just like with every post-Cup team (with the added effect of the COVID flat cap).

Kilhorn at the same age looked much better at 26 skating , playing defense, and being in the right areas compared to Jeannot. You can't win every trade and sometimes they don't work out. A good gm should never reward a guy financially who isn't performing and know when to cut ties .

 

[Filthy Dangles]

There is nothing wrong with Joseph as a player.

Being 'just a guy' or rather average doesn't mean you're bad.

 

[SympathyForTheDevils]

A good gm should never reward a guy financially who isn't performing and know when to cut ties .
View attachment 862596

The risk with that is that If you wait for every player to show sustained high performance before paying them, you'll end up overpaying for everyone, which is a problem for a cap-strapped contender. Ideally, a good GM accurately predicts future performance, and pays (or lets go) his players in function of that. Of course, that can backfire.

But I agree he should know when to cut ties. That extension was a mistake.

 

[bleedgreen]

two **

No such thing.

 

[Gnashville]

Can't imagine it would disappear into nothing. Info has to be available somewhere. I mean, it's been pushed pretty far down the line from when the deal was made.

On Capfriendly, no additional info aside from it being top 10 protected. But Colorado owes Phi a 2025 first as well and it's also top 10 protected without any other comment in the event it lands in the top 10. I have to bet that Nash/Phil will get something else if they don't get the 2025 first. Just haven't see what that would/could be.

San Jose’s pick from Pittsburgh for Karlsson is also like that with no information on what happens if it’s a top ten pick. It’s currently 14th but could become 4th if the lottery plays out in a wild way (nod nod wink wink)

 

[Gnashville]

Jeannot had 24g and 41p as a rookie the year before Tampa aquired him. It's pretty clear Tampa thought they could get him back to that level, instead of where he's been since then.

I personally like when teams go for home runs once in a while - even if they swing and miss sometimes.

So far the trade has become:
Cal Foote (bust)
2023 3rd round pick (83rd - Dylan MacKinnon)
2023 4th round pick (115th - Jayson Shaugabay)
2023 5th round pick (147th - Kevin Bicker)
2024 2nd round pick (53rd - TBD)
2025 1st round pick (TBD - Top 10 protected)

Sure, one of those players could be useful in 2026+, but I don't think Tampa really cares about that and they are all magic beans either way. The only valuable asset they gave up was the 1st and arguably the 2nd - which likely won't contribute till 2027+ if at all.

It was a bad trade, but to call it one of the worst ever, when no one on Nashville's side is even remotely known (yet?) is just silly. Forsberg for Erat is much worse for example.

The 2023 Forth round pick was traded back to Tampa for Chicago’s 4th this year and the 5th was sent to Detroit to move up and take Felix Nilsson
The Predators have so far gotten
Cal Foote for a few games
Felix Nilsson
Dylan MacKinnon
Chicago’s 4th #98
Tampa 2nd #53
and a Conditional 1st next year
So far only Nilsson seems to be of any value.
But Predators got all of that for an undrafted Free Agent no one wanted

 

[Outl4w]

The risk with that is that If you wait for every player to show sustained high performance before paying them, you'll end up overpaying for everyone, which is a problem for a cap-strapped contender. Ideally, a good GM accurately predicts future performance, and pays (or lets go) his players in function of that. Of course, that can backfire.

But I agree he should know when to cut ties. That extension was a mistake.

I agree

 

[DFF]

HF always overvalues draft picks. There's no guarantee that any of those kids will ever see a minute of ice time in the NHL. Jeannot, on the other hand, already plays 7 minutes every other night. Drafted kids can only dream of that.

Picks are like cash. They could have spent it on someone better.

Anyway, Coleman would have helped them if they have figured out how to keep him?

 

[Fire Sweeney]

in history? like its bad but I could argue trading Rask for Raycroft was worse

One could argue that Pogge had upside. Jeannot has always sucked as a hockey player and/or enforcer and will never amount to anything. There is no argument for overpaying as much as Brisebos did.

 

[CapSpace]

Put that trade on a t-shirt and gift it to Kucherov.

 

[Dr Salt]

Brisebois played with fire and got unpunished with previous TDL moves, Coleman and Hagel boomed in Tampa and became worth it while Goodrow was covered up by cup wins. Was bound to crash and burn continuing with the formula and that was Jeannot.