Proposal: Tanev to NYI for 2nd +3rd

[Ace of Hades]

You're remarkably dense. I'm joining the others from this thread who've stopped conversing with you.

Once again, you didn't have anything to say. All you can do is simply watch as I destroy your arguments infront of you.

Aso, my post seemed to be go over your head, learn how to concede. Btw, you shown how extremely dense you were the moment you blabbered inaccuracies about Tanev, and hypocritically told others to watch the player of your team play first, when you should've taken your own advice.
Others? The only other person was an isles fan. Good work in failing.

 

[Ace of Hades]

People should stop taking Flamesjustwin seriously. Tanev must've pissed in his cereals.

Tanev and Hamonic are extraordinary close in value considering their ages, positions, and skill sets. You could not find a more direct comparison to point to, in the same way when a young defenseman signs his RFA contract, agents across the league use it as a reference point for their own negotiations. My guy is just as good as him, we want similar AAV, etc.

But instead of accepting that Hamonic and Tanev are pretty darn comparable, they insist Tanev is far better and will certainly return a top young prospect like Barzal, and maybe a pick on top of that. Not because the stats favor Tanev, in fact nearly every statistical category supports Hamonic, but because Canuck fans say he's far better.

They aren't comparable, because one player is significantly ahead of the others. There's a reason why truthful Isle fans last season said Hamonic was their worst D-man, I rather take their opinion over your biased ones.

 

[Breakers]

Again proven to wrong on all accounts.
Shot suppression = Bottom of the league
High dangerous scoring chances against = Bottom of the league
CF% = 38.9
CF% rel = -15.1

So if by beast you mean one of the worst players in the NHL, then yes he is a beast.
Its a shooting gallery when he is on the ice.

Engelland is soooooo bad. Why do you think calgary exposed him

I still remember when it was free agency 3 years and Bob Mckeznie was announcing Deryk England's contract on that Free Agency segment and he said it was a "Engelland to the Flames on a $3 million 3 year contract. $1 million AAV"

Then someone on TSN corrected him, and said the $3million was his AAV, and it was a $9 million contract
Bobby Mac responded with "That"s impossible"

 

[member 105785]

I may be completely wrong here but aren't most Elite top pairing defensemen getting like 23-25 minutes a game? Seems to me like Tanev is getting 20-22 minutes a game like most good 2nd pair defensemen. Most of his extra value as a shutdown guy is negated by his injury history.

63rd in the league for TOI among skaters, 58 for defenders. but he doesn't have to play too much more than that at the moment as the Canucks have been on the road and are already down Edler and Stetcher. Ice time is on the coach though, not the player. Just because he plays less time than some of them, doesn't mean he's worse than Nate Schmidt, Goligoski, Phaneuf, Hutton, Lindell, Forbort, Hainsey, Gardiner, Orpik, Brett Pesce, Daley, Scandella, Seabrook, Zaitzev, Byfuglien, Orlov, Del Zotto, Klingberg, Faulk or Slavin.

As for injury history, losing handfuls of games to food poisoning and the mumps isn't the same as having a knee explode.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

63rd in the league for TOI among skaters, 58 for defenders. but he doesn't have to play too much more than that at the moment as the Canucks have been on the road and are already down Edler and Stetcher. Ice time is on the coach though, not the player. Just because he plays less time than some of them, doesn't mean he's worse than Nate Schmidt, Goligoski, Phaneuf, Hutton, Lindell, Forbort, Hainsey, Gardiner, Orpik, Brett Pesce, Daley, Scandella, Seabrook, Zaitzev, Byfuglien, Orlov, Del Zotto, Klingberg, Faulk or Slavin.

As for injury history, losing handfuls of games to food poisoning and the mumps isn't the same as having a knee explode.

This 100%..do people realize those have nothing to do with being injury prone or do they just see games missed?

 

[firstemperor]

You have seriously proved you have no idea what you are talking about.

Tanev is one of the single best pure defensive defensemen in the game. He is one of the best shot/chance suppressors, with the likes of Vlasic, Lindholm and Hjalmarsson. He absolutely is a top-pairing guy, just like the other names mentioned are.

Lindholm and Vlasic are #1D IMO......Vlasic is probably the undisputed best defensive player in hockey based on pedigree over the last few years. Some of the best gap control I've seen.

Lindholm can carry a pairing on both ends of the ice. Hard to quantify how good he is in the crease and puck battles. Some D can be very good at supressing shots (i.e. Demers) but cancel out their worth defensively completely because there's more elements to defense...winning puck battles and preventing sustained zone time is one of the biggest aspects to a good defender (also breakouts is arguably the most important facet in today's NHL but I digress).

Lindholm is not too far off from Piets when healthy, which has been uncommon these days.

What the **** lol. You can get like a Brandon Smith player for that but not Tanev. Wait which Tanev is this about?

When did Tanev go back to being underrated lmao. He is a Stralman-level player.

Stralman is a good comparison IMO...can fill in as a defensive D on the top pairing and look very good. Just a defensive purist type who is very good at his job.

 

[Puckstuff]

Tanev is SO undervalued in the league, it's pretty insane honestly. I'm not even a Canuck fan

 

[member 105785]

This 100%..do people realize those have nothing to do with being injury prone or do they just see games missed?

They just see games missed and assume injury prone status.

 

[dlawong]

Tanev is great but Isles depth is actually D but not their forward group, especailly considering there is a possiblity they may lose Tavares, Bailey and Nelson and Eberly is also on a short contract. They need to keep Barzal badly unless they can land another top forward prospect or young player in the trade. They had not much success in the UFA market to sign elite goal scorers or play makers unless they are way past their prime. Barzal will have way more value to the Isles and they need to keep Beau and Ho Sang as well for at least another year before decide to keep or trade. Besides Barzal and JHS are the most exciting young forwards on the Isles roster and it is a treat just watching them play almost each game.

I do have one D on my mind which will cost way less in return - Dunn from St. Louis who I believe have a lot upside and with good coaching will develop into a solid two way D and he is cheap on an entry contact and a great skater. He would be the one I will be eyeing as I do not think McVoy or Chabot will be available in a trade.

 

[Flamesjustwin]

Why haven't the flames won the cup yet with their incredible defense?

Well even with a great D it is hard to win a SC and we are still young. We have one a Cup though, how many do the Canucks have?

 

[firstemperor]

They just see games missed and assume injury prone status.

As for injury history, losing handfuls of games to food poisoning and the mumps isn't the same as having a knee explode.

Um no, it's not just mumps or food poisoning, that's very much the minority of his man games missed. He's had a number of lower body injuries, right foot and ankle injuries that took him out for extended periods at various times, and a back injury + broken hand after blocking shots.

You can argue that his playstyle is inherently commendable, given some degree of his injuries are due to putting his body on the line. But what you are trying to perpetuate here is blatantly false and muddies the opinions of other Canuck fans, who have been pretty fair for the most part.

 

[Detelethisaccount]

63rd in the league for TOI among skaters, 58 for defenders. but he doesn't have to play too much more than that at the moment as the Canucks have been on the road and are already down Edler and Stetcher. Ice time is on the coach though, not the player. Just because he plays less time than some of them, doesn't mean he's worse than Nate Schmidt, Goligoski, Phaneuf, Hutton, Lindell, Forbort, Hainsey, Gardiner, Orpik, Brett Pesce, Daley, Scandella, Seabrook, Zaitzev, Byfuglien, Orlov, Del Zotto, Klingberg, Faulk or Slavin.

As for injury history, losing handfuls of games to food poisoning and the mumps isn't the same as having a knee explode.

Thanks for proving me right. He is a low end #2 or a good #3 defensemen and his points per game coupled with his TOI bear that out.

Call it whatever you want in 4 full seasons at the NHL the guy has never played more than 70 games. Has been on IR 4 times in the last 3 seasons.

I am not trying to say he doesn't have value, but if you use Hamonic as an yardstick then I believe Tanev would be worth slightly less Hamonic.

 

[member 105785]

Tanev is SO undervalued in the league, it's pretty insane honestly. I'm not even a Canuck fan

So undervalued on here, pretty sure most GM's get it.

Thanks for proving me right. He is a low end #2 or a good #3 defensemen and his points per game coupled with his TOI bear that out.

Call it whatever you want in 4 full seasons at the NHL the guy has never played more than 70 games. Has been on IR 4 times in the last 3 seasons.

I am not trying to say he doesn't have value, but if you use Hamonic as an yardstick then I believe Tanev would be worth slightly less Hamonic.

Did you hear that wooshing over your head? My entire post was about how ice time isn't relevant to how good of a defender someone is. PPG and TOI don't tell the whole story at all. As for IR, once again, the mumps and food poisoning.

 

[Ciao]

If Tanev is so useless, why do posters from other teams keep trying to pry him loose in a trade?

There’s lots of mediocre defencemen, like say, Roman Polak, that would be available.

Done.

 

[ddawg1950]

Done.

They called me just after I posted it.

I have the tapes.

 

[Detelethisaccount]

Did you hear that wooshing over your head? My entire post was about how ice time isn't relevant to how good of a defender someone is. PPG and TOI don't tell the whole story at all. As for IR, once again, the mumps and food poisoning.

Just so I am clear your argument is the TOI means nothing for defensemen because teams don't give their best defensemen the most ice time? As for PPG with more teams wanting D to drive the play from the back-end, him never putting up over 20 points in a season is a worry especially when compared to the other defensive specialists out there.

Again not saying he is crap or anything like that just that he is a not a top pairing defensemen. A very good second pair guy, and will still probably fetch either a 1st and a decent prospect or a better prospect and a 2nd.

Looks to be a lot of entries for things other than mumps and food poising but I'm sure your right.

2017
3/18/2017	Missed 3 games (food poisoning).
3/11/2017	Food poisoning, day-to-day.
3/02/2017	Missed 2 games (mumps).
2/25/2017	Mumps, injured reserve.
1/10/2017	Missed 1 game (upper body injury).
1/07/2017	Upper body injury, day-to-day.
2016
12/16/2016	Missed 20 games (lower body injury).
11/05/2016	Lower body injury, injured reserve.
11/03/2016	Lower body injury, day-to-day.
11/02/2016	Missed 3 games (lower body injury).
10/28/2016	Lower body injury, injured reserve.
10/25/2016	Lower body injury, day-to-day.
3/31/2016	Missed 6 games (undisclosed).
3/19/2016	Undisclosed, day-to-day.
3/14/2016	Missed 3 games (upper body injury).
3/07/2016	Upper body injury, day-to-day.
1/01/2016	Missed 2 games (lower body injury).
2015
12/28/2015	Lower body injury, injured reserve.
12/26/2015	Undisclosed, day-to-day.
12/03/2015	Missed 1 game (undisclosed).
12/01/2015	Undisclosed, day-to-day.
11/10/2015	Missed 1 game (upper body injury).
11/08/2015	Upper body injury, day-to-day.

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

 

[skyo]

10 pages? christ, if a team really wants Tanev it's gonna cost a pretty penny, not a couple mediocre picks.
& some Leafs fans sure like to chime in on every Tanev offer on HF.

 

[member 105785]

Just so I am clear your argument is the TOI means nothing for defensemen because teams don't give their best defensemen the most ice time? As for PPG with more teams wanting D to drive the play from the back-end, him never putting up over 20 points in a season is a worry especially when compared to the other defensive specialists out there.

Again not saying he is crap or anything like that just that he is a not a top pairing defensemen. A very good second pair guy, and will still probably fetch either a 1st and a decent prospect or a better prospect and a 2nd.

Looks to be a lot of entries for things other than mumps and food poising but I'm sure your right.

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

While good players often get more ice time, Tanev is better than both Edler and Del Zotto but Del Zotto is getting 25 mins a night and Edler was playing 24 mins a night last year. There are plenty of factors, the Canucks have been on a long. He's definitely top pairing on most teams in the league.

 

[Detelethisaccount]

While good players often get more ice time, Tanev is better than both Edler and Del Zotto but Del Zotto is getting 25 mins a night and Edler was playing 24 mins a night last year. There are plenty of factors, the Canucks have been on a long. He's definitely top pairing on most teams in the league.

The guy has played for three different head coaches who apparently all agree he works best playing second pair minutes, why do you think that is? I'm going to go out on a limb and say its because they thought he was a second pair player. I'm pretty sure every coach would feed him 24-25 minutes a night if he thought he could handle it, because it makes the coaches job so much easier.

 

[bossram]

Lindholm and Vlasic are #1D IMO......Vlasic is probably the undisputed best defensive player in hockey based on pedigree over the last few years. Some of the best gap control I've seen.

Lindholm can carry a pairing on both ends of the ice. Hard to quantify how good he is in the crease and puck battles. Some D can be very good at supressing shots (i.e. Demers) but cancel out their worth defensively completely because there's more elements to defense...winning puck battles and preventing sustained zone time is one of the biggest aspects to a good defender (also breakouts is arguably the most important facet in today's NHL but I digress).

Lindholm is not too far off from Piets when healthy, which has been uncommon these days.


Stralman is a good comparison IMO...can fill in as a defensive D on the top pairing and look very good. Just a defensive purist type who is very good at his job.

I wasn't saying Tanev is as good as Lindholm and Vlasic. He's not. I was saying in terms of comparing their pure defensive abilities, he's in the same class in that category.

More to make a point that anyone saying Tanev is not a top-paring defenseman are simply wrong. Watched the Minny game today, and he's just a quiet, defensive machine. Hardly think the Wild had a single controlled entry on Tanev's side.

 

[firstemperor]

More to make a point that anyone saying Tanev is not a top-paring defenseman are simply wrong. Watched the Minny game today, and he's just a quiet, defensive machine. Hardly think the Wild had a single controlled entry on Tanev's side.

Saw the Wild game as well, honestly, the game was pretty chippy and uneventful...possibly even boring as a hockey purist. Most of the defense looked solid on both team, save Gudbranson who I thought looked horrible at times.....and the forwards on both teams, for the most part,were pretty underwhelming. I thought the refs let more obstruction go than usual.

 

[CREW99AW]

People should stop taking Flamesjustwin seriously. Tanev must've pissed in his cereals.



They aren't comparable, because one player is significantly ahead of the others. There's a reason why truthful Isle fans last season said Hamonic was their worst D-man, I rather take their opinion over your biased ones.

Hamonic had several very good seasons before last season .
One bad season does not wipe away several strong seasons.
I would take Hamonic over Tanev seven days a week.

 

[CREW99AW]

10 pages? christ, if a team really wants Tanev it's gonna cost a pretty penny, not a couple mediocre picks.
& some Leafs fans sure like to chime in on every Tanev offer on HF.

Just imagine if some credible source actually reported the isles wanted Tanev.
This long thread, based on nothing more then a few Canuck fans hoping some team badly overpay for Tanev.

 

[Ace of Hades]

Hamonic had several very good seasons before last season .
One bad season does not wipe away several strong seasons.
I would take Hamonic over Tanev seven days a week.

Good for you, you have seen Hamonic the entire duration of his career and have not seen Tanev as much, hence you feel that way.

 

[CREW99AW]

Good for you, you have seen Hamonic the entire duration of his career and have not seen Tanev as much, hence you feel that way.

Instead of offering Tanev to a fan base and organization(NYI), that shows zero interest in him,why not start a Tanev mega thread where fans of ANY team can make offers?