News Article: Stempniak Wanted to Return, Jets Chose Youth Movement

[KingBogo]

This is a recent quote from Glencross but it seems to me it is a really good fit for Stemp's situation as well:

"I thought something would be done by now, but obviously, the market is not there, and everyone is against the cap," he said. "Teams are paying the top two lines so much money that all they can do is fill with entry-level guys who are going to not cost much.

"We've talked to a few teams. They want to do a trade before camp, but it seems like no team wants to make the first move. So I'm just waiting. There's still got to be something out there. I still want to play. I'm only 32 and thinking I have a few more years left in me. "

 

[10Ducky10]

Ladd - Little - Wheeler
Perreault - Scheifele - Stafford
Ehlers - Lowry - Burmistrov
Thorburn - Petan - Armia

... Copp, Peluso ...

Buff-Trouba
Enstrom-Myers
Chiarot/Stuart-Postma

Pavs/Hutch

 

[DeepFrickinValue]

I doubt the Jets sign anyone 9 games into the season

Would be a good way to get some rookies to play 9 games before sending them down.

 

[Whileee]

Another way to look at the line-up is to have a "top-6" and "bottom-6" grouping, with some interchange within and between.

Top-6:

Ladd-Little-Ehlers-Perreault-Scheif-Wheeler

Bottom-6:

Burmi-Lowry-Stafford-Petan-Copp-Thorbs

(Armia, Hali)

Depending on match-ups, Maurice can mix and match within the bottom-6, and move Stafford, Perreault and Ehlers up and down.

In the bottom 6 you could then see....

Petan-Burmi-Stafford (if you want a bit of offense)
Copp-Lowry-Thorbs (if you want a "heavy" line)

What I think the youth brings is a lot more roster flexibility that could give Maurice some options that he hasn't had before.

He'll also have a lot more options for the PK and PP than he used to. Lowry became a force on the PK by the end of the year, and Burmi should be strong there. By later in the year, we might see Copp as a PKer as well. Ehlers and Petan could give Maurice more options on the PP as the season progresses. It's interesting to note that Ehlers played quite a bit on the point on the PP last season. He might be a good option for the second PP in the "umbrella" formulation. Same with Petan. The Jets' PP looked pretty bad when Perreault was out.

 

[BigZ65]

I don't think Hali is the alternative to Stemp. If he is then sign Stemp now!

My point is that they are going to need more than 12 forwards. How many games did the Jets play last season with their "pencilled" in roster? Depth is necessary. I think we'd be much better off having Stempniak sliding into onto the gamesheet and into the top 9 or even top 6 when necessary than a guy like Halischuk.

I can't believe that they'd have a lineup, in pencil or pen, with all of Petan, Ehlers, Copp and Armia on the NHL roster opening day. Ideally 2 of those guys would make it, with the others in reserve gaining pro experience. Let them earn the job and bump a Stempniak off the team. Trade him to some floor team for a conditional 7th rounder if you eventually need to get rid of him. I just don't see the downside to having a guy like Stempniak here, assuming he's willing to take a one year deal.

 

[KingBogo]

Would be a good way to get some rookies to play 9 games before sending them down.

But the 9 games only matters for Ehlers. The others are all turning pro anyways. With the Moose down the hall, my guess is by season's end 5-6 of the rookies will have had some NHL game experience and I wouldn't be surprised if 3-4 are everyday NHLers by then.

 

[Aavco Cup]

Would be a good way to get some rookies to play 9 games before sending them down.

Which rookies? Only Ehlers is really affected by the 9 game rule. The others that young enough to go back to Junior don't have any chance of sticking with the Jets. Petan DeLeo Morrissey Kostalek are on their 1st year of ELC no matter how many NHL games they play

 

[KingBogo]

My point is that they are going to need more than 12 forwards. How many games did the Jets play last season with their "pencilled" in roster? Depth is necessary. I think we'd be much better off having Stempniak sliding into onto the gamesheet and into the top 9 or even top 6 when necessary than a guy like Halischuk.

I can't believe that they'd have a lineup, in pencil or pen, with all of Petan, Ehlers, Copp and Armia on the NHL roster opening day. Ideally 2 of those guys would make it, with the others in reserve gaining pro experience. Let them earn the job and bump a Stempniak off the team. Trade him to some floor team for a conditional 7th rounder if you eventually need to get rid of him. I just don't see the downside to having a guy like Stempniak here, assuming he's willing to take a one year deal.

I don't necessarily disagree with your thoughts on Stenpniak, but rather trying to analyze what the Jets appear to be doing. The players signed to date are either guaranteed roster players (Stafford, Burmi) or NHL/AHL tweeners. Peluso is Maurice's pet thug but the other guys (Hali, Cormier, Fraser) are on 2-ways and are at best 13/14 guys, but more likely vets on the Moose. What the Jets haven't signed are depth NHLers (Slater, Stemp, Tlusty) that are very likely wanting 1 way contracts above NHL minimum. Not that none of them will be signed, but it appears like the Jets aren't willing to lock in a roster spot on this type of player.

On the surface it looks like these spots are being reserved for the prospects. Which I believe to be mostly true. I think Ehlers is penciled in and Armia would have to play himself off the roster. IMO they likely also see Petan as a very intriguing prospect who they want to be able to add if ready, and Copp as an ideal replacement for Slater as 4th line center if ready. So there is a strong chance the Jets can fill all the vacancies and take a step forward. Certainly in terms of offensive gifted players.

But there is also the unknowns of Ladd and Buff. I think Ladd gets signed soon, but IMO there is a greater likelihood than not that Buff gets moved. At this point Chevy has likely had many preliminary discussions with other teams on what they would offer for him. It very well could be that Chevy is looking for a young cost controlled forward that has proved himself to some extent in the NHL.

This is a lot of speculation, but it does appear the Jets have plans for the vacant roster spots and aren't wanting to muddy things up by signing depth players to 1 way contracts. My guess is come training camp and things don't work out as Chevy has planned a guy like Stemp/Boyes/Tlusty/Glencross will be added late to fill out the roster.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Would be a good way to get some rookies to play 9 games before sending them down.

By the time the season is 9 games old there will be no one left who would be of any benefit.

 

[truck]

My point is that they are going to need more than 12 forwards. How many games did the Jets play last season with their "pencilled" in roster? Depth is necessary. I think we'd be much better off having Stempniak sliding into onto the gamesheet and into the top 9 or even top 6 when necessary than a guy like Halischuk.

I can't believe that they'd have a lineup, in pencil or pen, with all of Petan, Ehlers, Copp and Armia on the NHL roster opening day. Ideally 2 of those guys would make it, with the others in reserve gaining pro experience. Let them earn the job and bump a Stempniak off the team. Trade him to some floor team for a conditional 7th rounder if you eventually need to get rid of him. I just don't see the downside to having a guy like Stempniak here, assuming he's willing to take a one year deal.

To your point, Thor spent more time with Lowry than Slater last year.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

My point is that they are going to need more than 12 forwards. How many games did the Jets play last season with their "pencilled" in roster? Depth is necessary. I think we'd be much better off having Stempniak sliding into onto the gamesheet and into the top 9 or even top 6 when necessary than a guy like Halischuk.

I can't believe that they'd have a lineup, in pencil or pen, with all of Petan, Ehlers, Copp and Armia on the NHL roster opening day. Ideally 2 of those guys would make it, with the others in reserve gaining pro experience. Let them earn the job and bump a Stempniak off the team. Trade him to some floor team for a conditional 7th rounder if you eventually need to get rid of him. I just don't see the downside to having a guy like Stempniak here, assuming he's willing to take a one year deal.

Just leave Hali out and you make your point better. He is going to be playing for the Moose.

It is highly unlikely that all 4 of those rookies make the team out of TC. There are 3 vacancies not 4 unless you expect one of them to be kept as the 13th man.

If we signed Stemp then 2 of those rookies would make the team opening day. That is not a youth movement by any stretch of the imagination. I agree with you though that we would likely be better with him than without him. Start with 2 rookies. More will get their chance when we have injuries. Halischuk still never enters the conversation.

I expect we go with 13 F and 8 D. Peluso is the 13th F, unfortunately. Halischuk, Cormier, Fraser and MacWilliam are all in the A. They are not high on the call up list either.

 

[truck]

I don't necessarily disagree with your thoughts on Stenpniak, but rather trying to analyze what the Jets appear to be doing. The players signed to date are either guaranteed roster players (Stafford, Burmi) or NHL/AHL tweeners. Peluso is Maurice's pet thug but the other guys (Hali, Cormier, Fraser) are on 2-ways and are at best 13/14 guys, but more likely vets on the Moose. What the Jets haven't signed are depth NHLers (Slater, Stemp, Tlusty) that are very likely wanting 1 way contracts above NHL minimum. Not that none of them will be signed, but it appears like the Jets aren't willing to lock in a roster spot on this type of player.

On the surface it looks like these spots are being reserved for the prospects. Which I believe to be mostly true. I think Ehlers is penciled in and Armia would have to play himself off the roster. IMO they likely also see Petan as a very intriguing prospect who they want to be able to add if ready, and Copp as an ideal replacement for Slater as 4th line center if ready. So there is a strong chance the Jets can fill all the vacancies and take a step forward. Certainly in terms of offensive gifted players.

But there is also the unknowns of Ladd and Buff. I think Ladd gets signed soon, but IMO there is a greater likelihood than not that Buff gets moved. At this point Chevy has likely had many preliminary discussions with other teams on what they would offer for him. It very well could be that Chevy is looking for a young cost controlled forward that has proved himself to some extent in the NHL.

This is a lot of speculation, but it does appear the Jets have plans for the vacant roster spots and aren't wanting to muddy things up by signing depth players to 1 way contracts. My guess is come training camp and things don't work out as Chevy has planned a guy like Stemp/Boyes/Tlusty/Glencross will be added late to fill out the roster.

Why is the assumption that a 2-way deal means a player will land with the Moose?

Pardy and Halischuck have spent a great deal of time here and they've done it on two-way deals.

 

[Bob E]

I don't necessarily disagree with your thoughts on Stenpniak, but rather trying to analyze what the Jets appear to be doing. The players signed to date are either guaranteed roster players (Stafford, Burmi) or NHL/AHL tweeners. Peluso is Maurice's pet thug but the other guys (Hali, Cormier, Fraser) are on 2-ways and are at best 13/14 guys, but more likely vets on the Moose. What the Jets haven't signed are depth NHLers (Slater, Stemp, Tlusty) that are very likely wanting 1 way contracts above NHL minimum. Not that none of them will be signed, but it appears like the Jets aren't willing to lock in a roster spot on this type of player.

On the surface it looks like these spots are being reserved for the prospects. Which I believe to be mostly true. I think Ehlers is penciled in and Armia would have to play himself off the roster. IMO they likely also see Petan as a very intriguing prospect who they want to be able to add if ready, and Copp as an ideal replacement for Slater as 4th line center if ready. So there is a strong chance the Jets can fill all the vacancies and take a step forward. Certainly in terms of offensive gifted players.

But there is also the unknowns of Ladd and Buff. I think Ladd gets signed soon, but IMO there is a greater likelihood than not that Buff gets moved. At this point Chevy has likely had many preliminary discussions with other teams on what they would offer for him. It very well could be that Chevy is looking for a young cost controlled forward that has proved himself to some extent in the NHL.

This is a lot of speculation, but it does appear the Jets have plans for the vacant roster spots and aren't wanting to muddy things up by signing depth players to 1 way contracts. My guess is come training camp and things don't work out as Chevy has planned a guy like Stemp/Boyes/Tlusty/Glencross will be added late to fill out the roster.

Completely agree, King.

Only question may be, in a Buff trade, do we have to take a player (salary) back for a team to be able to fit him in? That tends to be a more seasoned player, moving to UFA status within a couple of years. It may not be a young, cost controlled player. Ideally it is, but we may be looking at taking on a contract.

For instance, a Buff deal with say Boston, may include 2016 1st (they have 2), McQuaid and a guy like Eriksson to make the salary work. Not saying we do that deal, just a dollars example. We may want Pasternak, but Bruins will want to keep him for the same reasons we want him.

 

[mcpw]

For instance, a Buff deal with say Boston, may include 2016 1st (they have 2), McQuaid and a guy like Eriksson to make the salary work.

...this is a very funny way to put it...

 

[Bob E]

...this is a very funny way to put it...

Ya, it's not a realistic deal, but trying to make the point a Buff deal will probably include a player and salary we will complain about.

 

[KingBogo]

Why is the assumption that a 2-way deal means a player will land with the Moose?

Pardy and Halischuck have spent a great deal of time here and they've done it on two-way deals.

A 2-way contract doesn't necessarily mean a player will land with the Moose but IMO when a player signs a 2-way contract it is pretty apparent that they player is agreeing to and fully aware that playing in the AHL is a strong likelihood.

 

[mcpw]

Ya, it's not a realistic deal, but trying to make the point a Buff deal will probably include a player and salary we will complain about.

"1st, McQuaid, and a guy like Eriksson to make the salary work"
"1st, Sbisa, and a guy like Vrbata to make the salary work"
"1st, Emelin, and a guy like Plekanec to make the salary work"
"1st, Stuart, and a guy like Ladd to make the salary work"

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I don't necessarily disagree with your thoughts on Stenpniak, but rather trying to analyze what the Jets appear to be doing. The players signed to date are either guaranteed roster players (Stafford, Burmi) or NHL/AHL tweeners. Peluso is Maurice's pet thug but the other guys (Hali, Cormier, Fraser) are on 2-ways and are at best 13/14 guys, but more likely vets on the Moose. What the Jets haven't signed are depth NHLers (Slater, Stemp, Tlusty) that are very likely wanting 1 way contracts above NHL minimum. Not that none of them will be signed, but it appears like the Jets aren't willing to lock in a roster spot on this type of player.

On the surface it looks like these spots are being reserved for the prospects. Which I believe to be mostly true. I think Ehlers is penciled in and Armia would have to play himself off the roster. IMO they likely also see Petan as a very intriguing prospect who they want to be able to add if ready, and Copp as an ideal replacement for Slater as 4th line center if ready. So there is a strong chance the Jets can fill all the vacancies and take a step forward. Certainly in terms of offensive gifted players.

But there is also the unknowns of Ladd and Buff. I think Ladd gets signed soon, but IMO there is a greater likelihood than not that Buff gets moved. At this point Chevy has likely had many preliminary discussions with other teams on what they would offer for him. It very well could be that Chevy is looking for a young cost controlled forward that has proved himself to some extent in the NHL.

This is a lot of speculation, but it does appear the Jets have plans for the vacant roster spots and aren't wanting to muddy things up by signing depth players to 1 way contracts. My guess is come training camp and things don't work out as Chevy has planned a guy like Stemp/Boyes/Tlusty/Glencross will be added late to fill out the roster.

Good post KB.

I don't agree with every detail but you have summed up the general picture quite well IMO.

I don't think 'if ready' is the right way to look at Petan. He was 'ready' last TC but there was no space for him. That could be the case again this year. Unless he is an option for 4C if Copp is not ready he will have to wait for an injury call up to get his chance. Or he is an option behind Ehlers or Armia. He appears to me to be 2nd choice everywhere.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Why is the assumption that a 2-way deal means a player will land with the Moose?

Pardy and Halischuck have spent a great deal of time here and they've done it on two-way deals.

Halischuk, Cormier, Fraser and MacWilliam were all offered large AHL salaries. Those are usually given to solid AHL players who are no longer considered NHL prospects I believe. They are told to expect to play in the AHL for a salary that most of us would love to get. They are given a 2 way so that they can retain hope for another chance at the show. AFAIK that is the pattern with those kinds of contracts. If they are kept around they transition to AHL only contracts in another year or two.
Halischuk AHL 200k
Fraser AHL 325k
Cormier AHL 150k
MacWilliam AHL 150k
Contrast to Scheifele, Lowry, Armia, Hellebuyck and Trouba, all 70k AHL.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Ya, it's not a realistic deal, but trying to make the point a Buff deal will probably include a player and salary we will complain about.

Who is the big salary, bad player in that group that we are going to complain about?

 

[EastRiver]

I doubt the Jets sign anyone 9 games into the season

I agree. If Chevy wanted to sign anyone else he would have back in July.

 

[KingBogo]

Good post KB.

I don't agree with every detail but you have summed up the general picture quite well IMO.

I don't think 'if ready' is the right way to look at Petan. He was 'ready' last TC but there was no space for him. That could be the case again this year. Unless he is an option for 4C if Copp is not ready he will have to wait for an injury call up to get his chance. Or he is an option behind Ehlers or Armia. He appears to me to be 2nd choice everywhere.

I don't think we need to get into a debate if Petan was ready or not last year. I will meet you in the middle and agree he looked good, and it seemed pretty evident that he will be an NHler one day soon. But I think this whole discussion is about the Jets wanting to leave room for their most ready prospects rather than fill the roster spots with depth veterans.

I don't know if Petan is necessarily the 2nd choice every where. As of today there looks like 3 roster spots available for rookie forwards and this could change any minute. While I see Ehlers and Armia the 2 most likely, Petan may very well take the 3rd roster spot ahead of Copp. Or Ehlers or Armia if he pushes the door open. The thing is it is likely the prospects are in competition with each other which is a no lose situation for the Jets since they don't risk losing any of them due to their ELC status. IMO if the Jets deem less then 3 ready they will add a depth forward prior to the start of the season.

 

[Board Bard]

I don't think we need to get into a debate if Petan was ready or not last year. I will meet you in the middle and agree he looked good, and it seemed pretty evident that he will be an NHler one day soon. But I think this whole discussion is about the Jets wanting to leave room for their most ready prospects rather than fill the roster spots with depth veterans.

I don't know if Petan is necessarily the 2nd choice every where. As of today there looks like 3 roster spots available for rookie forwards and this could change any minute. While I see Ehlers and Armia the 2 most likely, Petan may very well take the 3rd roster spot ahead of Copp. Or Ehlers or Armia if he pushes the door open. The thing is it is likely the prospects are in competition with each other which is a no lose situation for the Jets since they don't risk losing any of them due to their ELC status. IMO if the Jets deem less then 3 ready they will add a depth forward prior to the start of the season.

I very much like the idea of three roster spots for rooks, and I hope Petan and Ehlers truly earn two of them. But for the bolded, if that happens I have a feeling they are going to dump Halischuk in there, to their own detriment.

 

[BigZ65]

Why is the assumption that a 2-way deal means a player will land with the Moose?

Pardy and Halischuck have spent a great deal of time here and they've done it on two-way deals.

Bang on. At this time last year we were saying Pardy and Halischuk weren't part of the plan for the NHL roster too. Neither of them played an AHL game last season. The sunshine and rainbows of summer often make some here forget the cold hard reality of winter.

Neither of those guys would have re-signed with the Jets if they didn't feel like they had an excellent opportunity to stick on the NHL roster, two-way or not. NHL coaches prefer veterans, always. Especially veterans they've worked with and had some success with. Halischuk has an upper hand on a roster spot over the young wingers with Maurice.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I don't think we need to get into a debate if Petan was ready or not last year. I will meet you in the middle and agree he looked good, and it seemed pretty evident that he will be an NHler one day soon. But I think this whole discussion is about the Jets wanting to leave room for their most ready prospects rather than fill the roster spots with depth veterans.

I don't know if Petan is necessarily the 2nd choice every where. As of today there looks like 3 roster spots available for rookie forwards and this could change any minute. While I see Ehlers and Armia the 2 most likely, Petan may very well take the 3rd roster spot ahead of Copp. Or Ehlers or Armia if he pushes the door open. The thing is it is likely the prospects are in competition with each other which is a no lose situation for the Jets since they don't risk losing any of them due to their ELC status. IMO if the Jets deem less then 3 ready they will add a depth forward prior to the start of the season.

Agree with the bold. I'm not sure if Petan gets an equal shot at 4C with Copp. I think he should be clearly more talented and able but not seen as 4th line type whereas Copp is. I think Petan could slot in there but only if Copp fails. Really I see the same situation with Ehlers and Armia. They have to fail for Petan to get the shot. His best chance might be to beat out Ehlers for the top 9 spot. Just my feel for the situation. Nothing concrete.

As for the last sentence I may be getting overly optimistic but I think more than 3 ready is more likely than less. That's why Chevy didn't sign anybody.