Seth Jones vs John Klingberg

[jballa95]

Absolutely unreal how underrated Klingberg is. People who suggest that he is purely offensive needs to get a grip. Dallas fans do tend to overrate him a little but that is likely due to the ignorant assumptions of his defensive play. If he was playing in a Canadian or major market, the rhetoric would likely be much different. Very Zubov-esque in terms of his league wide reception.

 

[Mrb1p]

Absolutely unreal how underrated Klingberg is. People who suggest that he is purely offensive needs to get a grip. Dallas fans do tend to overrate him a little but that is likely due to the ignorant assumptions of his defensive play. If he was playing in a Canadian or major market, the rhetoric would likely be much different. Very Zubov-esque in terms of his league wide reception.

Dont think so. Subban, markov were both top ds in the league offensively and defensively and people still called them bad defensively. Dont underrate the hate a big market generates.

 

[rent free]

jones. kling looks uncomfortable when he controls the puck

 

[Sasso09]

Absolutely unreal how underrated Klingberg is. People who suggest that he is purely offensive needs to get a grip. Dallas fans do tend to overrate him a little but that is likely due to the ignorant assumptions of his defensive play. If he was playing in a Canadian or major market, the rhetoric would likely be much different. Very Zubov-esque in terms of his league wide reception.

not really. the guy is subpar defensively, this is fact not rhetoric.

he has bad defensive numbers.

- He's on the wrong side of CA/60 and rel despite only starting 30% of the time in the defensive zone.
- Middle of the pack on his team there which isn't great given Dallas has d-men being specifically deployed to eat some of that.
- HIGH danger corsi against, of which he's the worst regular defenseman on the team
- given the quality of shots and volume of shots given up, he's not playing stellar defensively. Despite starting away from the d-zone 70% of the time, he's the worst on the team at preventing high-danger shots against.

 

[Sasso09]

Crazy.

elite rebuttal

 

[jballa95]

not really. the guy is subpar defensively, this is fact not rhetoric.

he has bad defensive numbers.

- He's on the wrong side of CA/60 and rel despite only starting 30% of the time in the defensive zone.
- Middle of the pack on his team there which isn't great given Dallas has d-men being specifically deployed to eat some of that.
- HIGH danger corsi against, of which he's the worst regular defenseman on the team
- given the quality of shots and volume of shots given up, he's not playing stellar defensively. Despite starting away from the d-zone 70% of the time, he's the worst on the team at preventing high-danger shots against.

Umm... excuse me where did you get these numbers from? Always cite your information

According to Hockey-Reference and Naturalstattrick.com and NHL.com and Sean Tierney's Charting hockey

Klingberg has around a 49.5% starting rate in the Defensive Zone. (Hard to debate cemented starting rates)
And has around a 53 Corsi+% (so arguing with his CA/60 is pretty useless).

Let me know what website you got your strange statistics from.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

You don't watch ghost and your weak attempt to qualify your brother proves that. Clearly you're biased for your guy, you can't even admit he's not good defensively which is hilarious

The other guy is a brutal Dallas homer, but I think most myself included, would take Klingberg pretty easily over Ghost

 

[SotasicA]

Seth, then Hampous.

 

[MrHeiskanen]

jones. kling looks uncomfortable when he controls the puck

Yes, very uncomfortable leading PP1..

very uncomfortable leading all D men in scoring..

very uncomfortable dancing the blueline every night..

lol

 

[rent free]

Yes, very uncomfortable leading PP1..

very uncomfortable leading all D men in scoring..

very uncomfortable dancing the blueline every night..

lol

and definitely uncomfortable in his own zone

 

[MrHeiskanen]

and definitely uncomfortable in his own zone

Yes, very uncomfortable in his own zone with a career +42 and never a minus player in his four seasons.

 

[rent free]

Yes, very uncomfortable in his own zone with a career +42 and never a minus player in his four seasons.

yah +/- is a great way of telling how good someone is in their own zone...
thats probably the only good defensive thing about him...

 

[MrHeiskanen]

yah +/- is a great way of telling how good someone is in their own zone...
thats probably the only good defensive thing about him...

Heck of a lot better than your analysis of a player. Anything that you post can't be taken seriously ever since you said Klingberg is uncomfortable controlling the puck considering he is one of the best in the entire league.

 

[Kcb12345]

Heck of a lot better than your analysis of a player. Anything that you post can't be taken seriously ever since you said Klingberg is uncomfortable controlling the puck considering he is one of the best in the entire league.

If Klingberg is uncomfortable controlling the puck, then no one in the league is comfortable with it lmao. Literally some of the only times he gets in trouble defensively is when he is TOO comfortable and patient with the puck. Pretty much never uncomfortable with it

and definitely uncomfortable in his own zone

 

[Cotton]

Seth Jones all day everyday, Jones is on another tier compared to everybody listed imo.

 

[Fatty McLardy]

Love me some Seth Jones. Insanely good at both ends of the ice.

 

[CBJx614]

Jonesy. I expect him to have at least an A on his jersey next season.

Elite offensively and defensively.

 

[bsu]

Lindholm is underrated...literally is one of the best defensemen in the entire NHL by every metric as well as eye test. He is one of the best in the league at going into a battle, dislodging the puck and skating or passing the puck out of the zone with ease. It's not surprise Lidstrom said he was the best young defensemen. (Maybe because he is Swedish lol)

 

[Unspecified]

[mod] Klingberg is well below average defensively

Actually he is not but thanks for coming out.

 

[Sasso09]

Actually he is not but thanks for coming out.

He is by every metric, eye test, stats, everything. He's not good defensively, easily the worst of the options on the poll defensively

 

[Regal]

Umm... excuse me where did you get these numbers from? Always cite your information

According to Hockey-Reference and Naturalstattrick.com and NHL.com and Sean Tierney's Charting hockey

Klingberg has around a 49.5% starting rate in the Defensive Zone. (Hard to debate cemented starting rates)
And has around a 53 Corsi+% (so arguing with his CA/60 is pretty useless).

Let me know what website you got your strange statistics from.

I don't know the sites he was using, but some ignore neutral zone starts and some don't, which is likely the reason for the zone start discrepancy. Klingberg would start at his number in the defensive zone when all starts are included, and yours when just looking at offensive and defensive.

And CF% isn't a defensive stat, it's an effectiveness stat. The "against" stats would point to defensive ability or at least suppression ability, whereas % just shows that his shot generation outweighs his shot suppression. Effectiveness is of course the most important it it's not very good if we want to isolate his defense

 

[TheGoldenGod]

Pretty shocked Parayko is tied for last on this. I think the offensive side is important but defense is the name of the game at that position and to me, he's the best on this list as far as defending goes. I cannot find it but I saw a tweet breaking down his metrics and they are pretty insane (if someone sees please post). The way this guy separates stick from puck and then goes coast to coast with total ease is so impressive. His size, speed, and stick has broken up too many odd man rushes to count.

Not many in STL doubt Parayko can be a #1 defender but STL already has one of the top #1's in Pietrangelo so a lot of the important zone starts go to AP27. If Colton was "the guy" in STL you can expect bigger numbers like you see with Jones.

Jones's stats are impressive but:
Jones offensive zone starts: 58.3%
Parayko offensive zone starts: 46.2%.

Jones has been playing on Columbus' top PP unit with the likes of Panarin, Wennberg, Atkinson, and Dubois.
Parayko playing on the 2nd with players like Berglund, Sobotka, Stastny and/or one of the rookies in the 2nd pairing.

Found this on another forum and stats per 60 minutes are very close and there's a huge gap in terms of zone starts:

CP Goals/60: .0229
SJ Goals/60:. 0487

CP Points/60: 1.220
SJ Points/60: 1.670

CP PIM/60: 0.496
SJ PIM/60: 0.835

CP BLK/60: 4.612
SJ BLK/60: 3.617

CP HIT/60: 3.583
SJ HIT/60: 2.957

I agree stats can be very telling but I think the casual fan relies too much the on basic stats to evaluate players. I don't believe these guys are that much better than Colton because they have a flashier stat sheet and I'd say he's definitely the better defender than at least 3 others on this list.

 

[Kington91]

Pretty shocked Parayko is tied for last on this. I think the offensive side is important but defense is the name of the game at that position and to me, he's the best on this list as far as defending goes. I cannot find it but I saw a tweet breaking down his metrics and they are pretty insane (if someone sees please post). The way this guy separates stick from puck and then goes coast to coast with total ease is so impressive. His size, speed, and stick has broken up too many odd man rushes to count.

Not many in STL doubt Parayko can be a #1 defender but STL already has one of the top #1's in Pietrangelo so a lot of the important zone starts go to AP27. If Colton was "the guy" in STL you can expect bigger numbers like you see with Jones.

Jones's stats are impressive but:
Jones offensive zone starts: 58.3%
Parayko offensive zone starts: 46.2%.

Jones has been playing on Columbus' top PP unit with the likes of Panarin, Wennberg, Atkinson, and Dubois.
Parayko playing on the 2nd with players like Berglund, Sobotka, Stastny and/or one of the rookies in the 2nd pairing.

Found this on another forum and stats per 60 minutes are very close and there's a huge gap in terms of zone starts:

CP Goals/60: .0229
SJ Goals/60:. 0487

CP Points/60: 1.220
SJ Points/60: 1.670

CP PIM/60: 0.496
SJ PIM/60: 0.835

CP BLK/60: 4.612
SJ BLK/60: 3.617

CP HIT/60: 3.583
SJ HIT/60: 2.957

I agree stats can be very telling but I think the casual fan relies too much the on basic stats to evaluate players. I don't believe these guys are that much better than Colton because they have a flashier stat sheet and I'd say he's definitely the better defender than at least 3 others on this list.

SJ more than doubles his G/60 and has a better P/60. PIMs, Blk, Hit/60 isn't that indicative of who is the better defensive player. Jones clearly is the better offensive player, but would want to see more about their advanced stats. What is their Corsi / RelCorsi / Close Fenwick?

 

[Captain97]

Lindholm