Speculation: Senators Attendance This Season So Far

[Buck Aki Berg]

Well I'm a season ticket holder since 1999 and I'm nowhere near being rich. Not by a longshot. I just have a strict budget that lets me save enough money for the tickets...in the nosebleeds.

This is getting harder and harder by the year and this year might actually be my last year because of the cost.

I think we might be defining "rich" differently. If you can afford to purchase tickets to 41 hockey games a year, you're definitely rich in a global context, regardless of your definition of "rich".

On a more municipal level, you definitely don't need to be Ottawa's answer to Bill Gates to afford season tickets, but $150 per month per seat (upper corners), plus cost of transportation/parking, plus concessions, requires a certain level of affluence. I think we can agree that someone who can afford such a luxury may not necessarily be "rich", but they're certainly "rich enough".

 

[Holdurbreathe]

There's a big difference between a person being cheap, and someone who has a difficult time affording premium prices.

Like another poster said a bit earlier, most of the incomes in Ottawa have not kept up with inflation. There simply isn't the same amount of disposable income here as Toronto or Montreal.

I would suggest a market filled with public servants have in general kept up with inflation.

Fact is Ottawa is a small market with a fairly high transient population that likely supports a team in some other city or has little interest in general.

 

[Mingus Dew]

What I'm saying is that inadequate transit and lack of urban density is what makes us a "car city". You take away subway from Toronto and Montreal and it also becomes more of a car city. You bring density and LRT into Ottawa and it becomes less of a car city.
Saying that in 10 years no one will ride LRT train to games in Downtown because no one rides OC Transpo bus to games in Kanata today just doesn't make any sense.

It's almost a cultural issue at this point. Public transit is pretty much ingrained in the lifestyle of most people in Toronto (even those who, like myself, still drive on occasion). This is true even though the subway system here is deficient relative to other big cities.

I never got that sense in Ottawa, and it's likely a product of differences in city-planning and design. This might change, but it will take a long time (I'm honestly skeptical that 10 years is enough).

 

[Flip_4]

I think we might be defining "rich" differently. If you can afford to purchase tickets to 41 hockey games a year, you're definitely rich in a global context, regardless of your definition of "rich".

On a more municipal level, you definitely don't need to be Ottawa's answer to Bill Gates to afford season tickets, but $150 per month per seat (upper corners), plus cost of transportation/parking, plus concessions, requires a certain level of affluence. I think we can agree that someone who can afford such a luxury may not necessarily be "rich", but they're certainly "rich enough".

I understand what you're saying, but at the same time, I find a way to save the money elsewhere. I don't drink alcohol (allergic), I don't smoke, I don't go out to restaurants very much (once a month maybe), I don't go to movies, I don't buy the latest and greatest in electronics or in clothes. All these little things that people who aren't rich do more regularly - easily equal the money I spend on season tickets.

I don't do much else when it comes to "entertainment". I go to hockey games. I do drive from Orleans every game, so that's a big cost, but again, I cut elsewhere to make it work. When it stops working, I'll stop doing it.

I will still not be rich, I'll just be able to do more of what my friends do on a regular basis.

All that to say that people who aren't rich can get season tickets, but yes, the majority of season ticket holders - unless they split packs with friends/families - need to be a certain level of "rich" to afford these tickets. They're starting to lose the "Regular Joe" fans that want to come to games, but the prices are just getting so ridiculous that they can't.

The attendance isn't any different than more years at the beginning of the season anyway. Announced attendance doesn't seem close to actual attendance and it will all get better at some point this season. Early weeknight games are notoriously bad for attendance in Ottawa.

 

[Holdurbreathe]

OK.

Toronto is not car city.
GTA is car city.

Ottawa within Greenbelt is not car city.
Ottawa with Kanata and Barrhaven is car city.

Ottawa is a car city with few exceptions.

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

I think of all Canadian cities Ottawa is the weakest in terms of attendance and fan support in general.

Short history is probably why

 

[Hullois]

As a Habs fan living in Gatineau, it is all about location. I would pay to go see weekday games if the arena was at Lebreton because I could get there in 10 minutes and be back home in 20 minutes. But no way I'll drive an hour each way and pay 20$ parking on top of that.

 

[Holdurbreathe]

It's almost a cultural issue at this point. Public transit is pretty much ingrained in the lifestyle of most people in Toronto (even those who, like myself, still drive on occasion). This is true even though the subway system here is deficient relative to other big cities.

I never got that sense in Ottawa, and it's likely a product of differences in city-planning and design. This might change, but it will take a long time (I'm honestly skeptical that 10 years is enough).

I think you are right to be skeptical!

Even if the city complete Stage 2 of the LRT by 2023, a large area of the city would not be covered by the planned east-west line or the south leg extension.

While I do believe it should make a significant difference for daily commuters, I don't believe a majority of people attending downtown events will wish to take a car to a park'n ride, a bus to the LRT, then the LRT to downtown, specially in the dead of winter.

IMO a majority would wish for the convenience their car offers.

 

[Bileur]

As a Habs fan living in Gatineau, it is all about location. I would pay to go see weekday games if the arena was at Lebreton because I could get there in 10 minutes and be back home in 20 minutes. But no way I'll drive an hour each way and pay 20$ parking on top of that.

I have a not of trouble not thinking "Pataterie Hulloise" when I read your username.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

36$ got me a fine seat and two slices of pizza

People complaining about ticket prices are either very poor (which blows, I don't mean to offend) or super cheap

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

36$ got me a fine seat and two slices of pizza

People complaining about ticket prices are either very poor (which blows, I don't mean to offend) or super cheap

Or don't care about the Sens which is a large contingent of the population

 

[Holdurbreathe]

I think of all Canadian cities Ottawa is the weakest in terms of attendance and fan support in general.

Short history is probably why

Less to do with history and everything to do with this city having a relatively small private sector.

People on this board complain about location, cost, just about everything to do with the Senators!

Fact is the Senators have the lowest average prices of any Canadian team and quite frankly the time it takes to get anywhere in this city is relatively short in comparative terms.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Or don't care about the Sens which is a large contingent of the population

Yeah but if they don't care they shouldn't be complaining about ticket prices

 

[Upgrayedd]

I would suggest a market filled with public servants have in general kept up with inflation.

Fact is Ottawa is a small market with a fairly high transient population that likely supports a team in some other city or has little interest in general.

Working in the public service in Ottawa i can tell you over the last few years our salaries have not kept up with inflation....0% raises will do that to ya! I did get a raise in the percentage of work i am now expected to perform though if that counts lol

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

Yeah but if they don't care they shouldn't be complaining about ticket prices

Was speaking more for the general population of Ottawa but yes I agree, ticket prices are relatively cheap compared to other markets

 

[Ohhh Franco]

36$ got me a fine seat and two slices of pizza

People complaining about ticket prices are either very poor (which blows, I don't mean to offend) or super cheap

Or just dont pay attention to the MANY promotions the Sens have or know how to navigate the web and find the deals. Lots and lots of promotions and deals out there - almost too many in my opinion.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Was speaking more for the general population of Ottawa but yes I agree, ticket prices are relatively cheap compared to other markets

Not only cheap but great value too

There are no bad seats at the CTC

 

[Ohhh Franco]

Working in the public service in Ottawa i can tell you over the last few years our salaries have not kept up with inflation....0% raises will do that to ya! I did get a raise in the percentage of work i am now expected to perform though if that counts lol

But that pension though!

Seriously, try working in the private sector...

 

[Smash88]

But that pension though!

Seriously, try working in the private sector...

I'm pretty sure most public servants have worked in the private sector at some point.

 

[Upgrayedd]

But that pension though!

Seriously, try working in the private sector...

Spent more than half my career in the private and am currently looking to return to make more $ to be honest.

 

[Smash88]

Spent more than half my career in the private and am currently looking to return to make more $ to be honest.

That's the trade off. There is no commission in the Public Service.

Make less money for a better pension vs. make more money with a weaker pension.

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

That's the trade off. There is no commission in the Public Service.

Make less money for a better pension vs. make more money with a weaker pension.

I've seen salaries of employees in the public vs private and public pays much more. They have fixed incremental stages of salary increases as well.

 

[Upgrayedd]

That's the trade off. There is no commission in the Public Service.

Make less money for a better pension vs. make more money with a weaker pension.

Agreed, many still view the public service as what i am led to believe it formally was....nice pension and more than competitive salaries....times have changed in that aspect though, for the better of the country imo

personally i haven't seen a raise (typically 0.5-1%) in 3-4 years

 

[Smash88]

I've seen salaries of employees in the public vs private and public pays much more. They have fixed incremental stages of salary increases as well.

Maybe for low levels, but for what I do, I could get probably double what I make in the private sector, just with commissions.

Also private salaries don't have to be disclosed. There are so many perks that you can get in the private that you can't in the public.

Don't get me wrong, I get paid well, it's just I could get paid a lot more in the Private and it's really not close at all.

 

[Mingus Dew]

I think you are right to be skeptical!

Even if the city complete Stage 2 of the LRT by 2023, a large area of the city would not be covered by the planned east-west line or the south leg extension.

While I do believe it should make a significant difference for daily commuters, I don't believe a majority of people attending downtown events will wish to take a car to a park'n ride, a bus to the LRT, then the LRT to downtown, specially in the dead of winter.

IMO a majority would wish for the convenience their car offers.

I can't say I blame them.

I remember having to drive to Fallowfield Station (my house was like 10 minutes away yet there wasn't a bus option in sight), only to search for parking for 5 minutes before biting the bullet and parking in the neighborhood across the street (fingers crossed for no tickets!). Then it was only a quick hour on a crowded bus to get downtown. I ended up caving and just dealing with the traffic on the 417 (and I'm infinitely grateful that this was a possibility for me).

I'm now intimately familiar with the TTC, and it can be pretty terrible (Eglinton Station at rush hour, my God), but I have never felt that same level of exhaustion and futility. I can't say I've ever been "happy" about having to drive here - public transit is just so much easier and more efficient.

I guess it's all to say that Ottawa desperately needs better transit options. The problem is that people have been conditioned to prefer driving (for a number of reasons, not just the unpleasantness I've described above) and will be slow to make any kind of meaningful change in their behavior.