Prospect Info: Ryan Poehling Part 2

[Belial]

Poehling was clearly ready physically to make the jump but I have no problem with him taking his time.

 

[Mrb1p]

Poehling was clearly ready physically to make the jump but I have no problem with him taking his time.

He needs to gain some speed to be really ready, leaving him is just going to let him hone his skills even more. Wouldnt even be against a fourth year in college.

 

[Belial]

He needs to gain some speed to be really ready, leaving him is just going to let him hone his skills even more. Wouldnt even be against a fourth year in college.

Didn't look slow at all during that camp...

 

[Goldenhands]

He needs to gain some speed to be really ready, leaving him is just going to let him hone his skills even more. Wouldnt even be against a fourth year in college.

His speed is quite fine already, could jump Pro as soon as next season to play for Laval and be a very good player, so there is no doubt he turns Pro for 2019-2020...

 

[HOPE]

Montreal is currently a shitshow. imagine Kotkaniemi having an amazing season, grow up physically, Poehling tearing up the NCAA and winning it all. Both Joins the team next year. and we start from scratch!

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Didn't look slow at all during that camp...

playing scrimmage and playing against leafs and tampa is not the same.

 

[jaffy27]

playing scrimmage and playing against leafs and tampa is not the same.

That goes for all the prospects in the league, not just our prospects.

 

[Belial]

playing scrimmage and playing against leafs and tampa is not the same.

Speed is speed... Playing against whoever won't change anything.

Poehling can skate, it was never a problem.

 

[S Bah]

Now that I'm on my computer, everything will be easier.

From the article you posted, here a copy and paste of the full section of the CBA about NCAA players


8.6 (c) (iv)

If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19, who had received a Bona Fide Offer in accordance with Section 8.6(a)(ii) above, becomes a bona fide college student prior to the second June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft and does not remain a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain exclusive rights for the negotiation of his services until the later of:

(a) the fourth June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft,
or
(b) thirty (30) days after NHL Central Registry receives notice that the Player is no longer a bona fide college student;

provided that **IF** the Player ceases to be a bona fide college student on or after January 1 of an academic year and the Player:

(1) is in his fourth year of college and has commenced his fourth year of NCAA eligibility,
or
(2) is in his fourth year of college and is scheduled to graduate from college at the end of his fourth year,

then in the circumstances described in (1) or (2), the Club shall retain the exclusive right of negotiation for such Player's services through and including the August 15 following the date on which he ceases to be a bona fide college student.


the first section is about players that graduate, second section (after the **IF** ) is about players that stop college before graduation.

In the case Poehling graduate, that he complete 4 years in NCAA and have his degree, it's the first section that apply. I bolded the section and underligned the key words "graduation" and "until the later of".

If Poehling graduate at the end of season 2019-2020 the later of the 2 options is the 4th june 1st folliwing his selection at the entry draft, and that 4th june 1st is june 1st 2021.

If Poehling start season 2019-2020 but not complete it, it would be the second part of the article that would apply, having to sign before june 1st 2020.

Unless I totally missunderstand the "does not remain a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain exclusive rights for the negotiation of his services until the later of: Poehling is part of the 1% of NCAA players that can be sign up to 1 year after graduation.

Smart young man Ryan Poehling definitely Captain material, this may be bad news for Habs fans. Ryan might finish his degree 1st then sign with the Habs in 2020, his vision for his career (Both careers) should be long and distinguished. (Timmins made a great draft choice IMHO!!!... the wait will be well worth the finished product.) Go Ryan Go!!!...

 

[MarkovsKnee]

Poehling is getting signed at the end of this season. I have absolutely no concern about that. Like none.

Only reason he's going back to play this year is to play one more year with his brothers & get one more kick at the can for a Championship. Otherwise, Montreal probably would've signed him this year & have him play in Laval. He's physically ready for pro hockey.

The 2020 season St. Cloud won't be as good, his brothers won't be there & he'll be too good for college hockey.

Going UFA as an amateur doesn't mean squat financially. The ELC has a maximum value & Poehling will get that. There's no reason for that to be delayed.

And, while I get people hate Bergevin, the fact Evans signed with the organization despite the fact he could've gone the UFA route in a few months, shows that the organization does track & communicate with our prospects.

If anything the fact we severely lack center depth means players like Evans & Poehling will likely be given every opportunity to get to the NHL faster than on other teams. I'm sure they, their advisors & their agent are well aware of that.

 

[justafan22]

Keep him and Jesper away from this team until 2019-20

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

Montreal is currently a ****show. imagine Kotkaniemi having an amazing season, grow up physically, Poehling tearing up the NCAA and winning it all. Both Joins the team next year. and we start from scratch!

And draft Bowen Byram

 

[CHarlie]

Poehling is getting signed at the end of this season. I have absolutely no concern about that. Like none.

Only reason he's going back to play this year is to play one more year with his brothers & get one more kick at the can for a Championship.

 

[MarkovsKnee]

he has one more year of college thats why hes going back.

He has 2 more years of college eligibility. I have no concern with him not signing with Montreal at the end of this season.

 

[CHarlie]

He has 2 more years of college eligibility. I have no concern with him not signing with Montreal at the end of this season.

yeah realized that after i posted

 

[montreal]

The 2020 season St. Cloud won't be as good, his brothers won't be there & he'll be too good for college hockey.

Ryan and his brothers both have 2 years left.

 

[Redux91]

Poehling is getting signed at the end of this season. I have absolutely no concern about that. Like none.

Only reason he's going back to play this year is to play one more year with his brothers & get one more kick at the can for a Championship. Otherwise, Montreal probably would've signed him this year & have him play in Laval. He's physically ready for pro hockey.

The 2020 season St. Cloud won't be as good, his brothers won't be there & he'll be too good for college hockey.

Going UFA as an amateur doesn't mean squat financially. The ELC has a maximum value & Poehling will get that. There's no reason for that to be delayed.

And, while I get people hate Bergevin, the fact Evans signed with the organization despite the fact he could've gone the UFA route in a few months, shows that the organization does track & communicate with our prospects.

If anything the fact we severely lack center depth means players like Evans & Poehling will likely be given every opportunity to get to the NHL faster than on other teams. I'm sure they, their advisors & their agent are well aware of that.

Well said

perfect explanation why he's NOT being forced to go pro this year, and why he is pretty much 100% turning pro after this season

 

[montreal]

The 1% ... that's for the players that play at 17 years old in NCAA. Usually those never do their last year in college, they turn pro before. But if they would complete their scholarity, their drafting team would gain a "bonus" year. Such player would graduate 3 years after being drafted while drafting team retain rights 4 years after draft.

A player that start college at 18 or 19 will need to be sign the summer he graduate if he haven't turn pro before his final year. Those are the 99% *

That said, I would be extremly surprise if Poehling don't sign after next season so we should not see this hypothetical scenario to happen. Any players in the NCAA at 17 years old is more likely to sign before graduating anyway.

Confirm with capfrendly, If I'm wrong about that exception for 17 years old that would graduate before signing, I pay you a beer while whe watch the Habs having a, most likely, terrible opening game. You chose the place, as long as it's not 1 of the 2 taverne 1909 (that offer is made under the assumption that you live Montréal or Montréal area) **


* It's not exactly 1% - 99% the ratio 17 years old to 18-19 years old, it's never the same each year also.
** I'm damn serious when it come to bet a beer... if I wrong I really intend to buy you 1, if I'm right you don't have to but I won't say no if you offer it.

on the prospect board they had,

If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19, who had received a Bona Fide Offer in accordance with Section 8.6(a)(ii) above, becomes a bona fide college student prior to the second June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft and remains a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain the exclusive rights of negotiation for his services through and including the August 15 following the graduation of his college class.
​

Since Poehling was already a college student when he was drafted, he meets the criteria of being a college student prior to the second June 1st following his selection. And as such once he graduates from college, which is the stipulation, there is no 4 year term stipulation, it is actually graduating from college that is the stipulation. He will be free to venture to FA on the 15th of August following his graduation. But the key word is that he has to graduate from his college term. If he doesn't graduate then he Habs retain his rights.

 

[Sorinth]

His speed is quite fine already, could jump Pro as soon as next season to play for Laval and be a very good player, so there is no doubt he turns Pro for 2019-2020...

It's not really a question of whether he could play, it's what is best for his development. Poehling took a huge step last season, he needs to take another one this year, and that's most likely to happen if he doesn't turn pro.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Keep him far far away

 

[Le compétiteur]

on the prospect board they had,

What you posted is the last version of CBA that expired september 2012... the new version say team retain rights until the later of (a) 4 year or (b) graduation.

The later of because some player are drafted at 18, start college at 19 and after 3 years in college team would lose rights as it's beer 4 years that the player was drafted.

In Poehling the later is the 4th year as he will graduate at D+3. That said, only if he don't turn pro after his this year.


Edit : Here the old and new version of CBA

Here is how it looked in the CBA that expired in September 2012:

8.6(c) College Players
(iii) If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19, who had received a Bona Fide Offer in accordance with Section 8.6(a)(ii) above, becomes a bona fide college student prior to the second June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft and remains a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain the exclusive rights of negotiation for his services through and including the August 15 following the graduation of his college class.

The exact same thing that you posted.

Here is how it look now

8.6 (c) (iv)
If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19, who had received a Bona Fide Offer in accordance with Section 8.6(a)(ii) above, becomes a bona fide college student prior to the second June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft and does not remain a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain exclusive rights for the negotiation of his services until the later of:
(a) the fourth June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft,
or (b) thirty (30) days after NHL Central Registry receives notice that the Player is no longer a bona fide college student;

Now it's until what came the latest between graduation or D+4. As Poehling would graduate at D+3 (if he don't turn pro before), the latest is the 4th june 1st following draft, at D+4. And this only because Poehling started as under-age in NCAA.​

 

[HOPE]

Keep him and Jesper away from this team until 2019-20

yeah but he might not want to stay with montreal after the 2019 season... he'll be behind Kotkaniemi and Hughes in the Center Depth :S

 

[Goldenhands]

It's not really a question of whether he could play, it's what is best for his development. Poehling took a huge step last season, he needs to take another one this year, and that's most likely to happen if he doesn't turn pro.

I agree that another year in the NCAA is probably whats the best for him at this point, Im only saying that his skating is good enough to play in the AHL right now, so there is no doubt he will be ready to turn Pro for 2019-2020...

 

[NotProkofievian]

And draft Bowen Byram

Nope, name's not european enough.

 

[BaseballCoach]

What you posted is the last version of CBA that expired september 2012... the new version say team retain rights until the later of (a) 4 year or (b) graduation.

The later of because some player are drafted at 18, start college at 19 and after 3 years in college team would lose rights as it's beer 4 years that the player was drafted.

In Poehling the later is the 4th year as he will graduate at D+3. That said, only if he don't turn pro after his this year.


Edit : Here the old and new version of CBA

Here is how it looked in the CBA that expired in September 2012:

The exact same thing that you posted.

Here is how it look now



Now it's until what came the latest between graduation or D+4. As Poehling would graduate at D+3 (if he don't turn pro before), the latest is the 4th june 1st following draft, at D+4. And this only because Poehling started as under-age in NCAA.​

You guys are fixated on subsections (ii), (iii) and (iv) but those are the exceptions. It seems to me that Subsection (i) covers the rule

8.6
c) College Players.
(i) If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19 is a bona fide college student at the time
of his selection in the Entry Draft, or becomes a bona fide college student
prior to the first June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft, and
remains a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college
class, his drafting Club shall retain the exclusive right of negotiation for
his services through and including the August 15 following the graduation
of his college class. The Club need not make a Bona Fide Offer to such
Player to retain such rights.

So I believe that Montreal is right. But BOY, there are a lot of words over this!