Round 2, Vote 5 (HOH Top Defensemen)

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Before we begin, just a recap on how Round 2 will operate:

Round 2

• The top ranked players from the aggregate list will be posted in a thread
• Players will be listed in alphabetical order to avoid creating bias
• Voters will rank their top 10 of the available defensemen
• Final results will be posted and the top 5 vote getters will be added to the final list in order.
• The process will be repeated for the next 5 places with remaining players until a list of 60 players is obtained

These might be tweaked to allow longer or shorter debating periods depending on how the process moves along.

Additionally, there are a couple guidelines we'd ask that everyone agree to abide by:

• Please try to stay on-topic in the thread
• Please remember that this is a debate on opinions and there is no right or wrong. Please try to avoid words like "stupid" "dumb" "wrong" "sophistry" etc. when debating.
• Please treat other debaters with respect
• Please don't be a wallflower. All eligible voters are VERY HIGHLY encouraged to be active participants in the debate.
• Please maintain an open mind. The purpose of the debate is to convince others that your views are more valid. If nobody is willing to accept their opinions as flexible there really is no point in debating.

Eliglible Voters (23):
BiLLY_ShOE1721; Canadiens1958; chaosrevolver; DaveG; Dennis Bonvie; Der Kaiser; Dreakmur; Epsilon; Hardyvan123; Hawkey Town 18; Hockey Outsider; intylerwetrust; JaysCyYoung; McNuts; MXD; overpass; pappyline; reckoning; seventieslord; TheDevilMadeMe; tarheelhockey; tony D; VanIslander

All posters are encouraged to participate in the debates and discussions, but only those listed above will be eligible for the final votes.

On that note, we hope everyone is ready to wrack their brains and debate against some of the best hockey minds on the 'net! Have fun!

Click to read more...

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Vote 5 will begin now. Votes must be submitted between 9PM EST on Tuesday 12/13 and 9PM EST on Thursday 12/15. Votes received outside this time frame will not be accepted unless you make prior arrangements with me via PM. Voting will run until the deadline or until all voters have sent their vote in, whichever comes first. THESE DEADLINES ARE SUBJECT TO CHANGE SO PLEASE READ THROUGH THE ENTIRE THREAD.

Please PM me your votes during the above timeframe.

PLEASE NOTE THAT YOU WILL VOTE FOR YOUR TOP 10 OUT OF THE POOL OF ELIGIBLE PLAYERS.

Vote 5 will be for places 21 through 25 on the Top 60 list.

Here are the candidates, listed alphabetically:

Dit Clapper
Bill Gadsby
Mark Howe
Rod Langway
Guy Lapointe
Brian Leetch
Scott Niedermayer
Bill Quackenbush
Borje Salming
Serge Savard
Jack Stewart
Valeri Vasiliev

Please note that you are voting for your top 10 of the 12 available candidates. Because we added 6 names to the list of candidates this round, the discussion period has been extended from 5 to 6 days before the 2 day voting period.

 

[MXD]

Vote 5 will begin now. Votes must be submitted between 8PM EST on Tuesday 12/13 and 8PM EST on Thursday 12/15. Votes received outside this time frame will not be accepted unless you make prior arrangements with me via PM. Voting will run until the deadline or until all voters have sent their vote in, whichever comes first. THESE DEADLINES ARE SUBJECT TO CHANGE SO PLEASE READ THROUGH THE ENTIRE THREAD.

Please PM me your votes during the above timeframe.

PLEASE NOTE THAT YOU WILL VOTE FOR YOUR TOP 10 OUT OF THE POOL OF ELIGIBLE PLAYERS.

Vote 5 will be for places 21 through 25 on the Top 60 list.

Here are the candidates, listed alphabetically:

Dit Clapper
Bill Gadsby
Mark Howe
Rod Langway
Guy Lapointe
Brian Leetch
Scott Niedermayer
Bill Quackenbush
Borje Salming
Serge Savard
Jack Stewart
Valeri Vasiliev

Please note that you are voting for your top 10 of the 12 available candidates. Because we added 6 names to the list of candidates this round, the discussion period has been extended from 5 to 6 days before the 2 day voting period.

First thoughts :

* I actually thought Mark Howe would have been available last round.

* Guy Lapointe? Well, I thought it would be this one or the other. Best comparable is Salming. Salming has something of a lead, though.

* I actually expected the quadrifecta of 2nd half of the 40ies Habs/Wings D getting available for voting at the exact same time... But only the Wings are here this round. Strange, to say the very least. Not a knock on Stewart or Quackenbush, though (unless the voting pattern made it possible).

* My sixth sense tells me that Langway vs. Howe will spark some kind of debates in regards to their Norris voting results...

* Right now, I'm a bit mad at the fact that one guy is not available for voting (and no, it not Ken Reardon... yet. Even if the prospect of having Clapper in before Reardon is actually available for voting somewhat infuriates me)

EDIT : Italics added

 

[canucks4ever]

I would be interesting to do a comparison between stewart, quackenbush and thier contemporary reardon. Considering that they were the dominant defenseman of a 5 year period, it would be nice to see how thier game was described, which one would have the most success if they were to have played in the post-bobby orr era.

 

[MXD]

I would be interesting to do a comparison between stewart, quackenbush and thier contemporary reardon. Considering that they were the dominant defenseman of a 5 year period, it would be nice to see how thier game was described, which one would have the most success if they were to have played in the post-bobby orr era.

... Let's throw in Bouchard as well.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Not surprised to see Niedermayer is up, because I think he's generally overrated on HF (especially on the main board), but he's my "easy last" this round.

I wouldn't have him in my top 5 this round, but I was expecting to see Lionel Conacher available.

 

[Hardyvan123]

First thoughts :

* I actually thought Mark Howe would have been available last round.

* Guy Lapointe? Well, I thought it would be this one or the other. Best comparable is Salming. Salming has something of a lead, though.

* I actually expected the quadrifecta of 2nd half of the 40ies Habs/Wings D getting available for voting at the exact same time... But only the Wings are here this round. Strange, to say the very least. Not a knock on Stewart or Quackenbush, though (unless the voting pattern made it possible).

* My sixth sense tells me that Langway vs. Howe will spark some kind of debates in regards to their Norris voting results...

* Right now, I'm a bit mad at the fact that one guy is not available for voting (and no, it not Ken Reardon... yet. Even if the prospect of having Clapper in before Reardon somewhat infuriates me)

I know that you are not counting any of the time that Clapper spent as a forward but why such high praise for Reardon?

He has 5 very good years after WW2 but the late 40's isn't exactly the golden age of Dmen.

But maybe that's better asked when and if he comes up.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Norris Trophy records:

The usual disclaimers:

• The Norris only came into existence in 1953-54
• The Norris doesn't take into account playoff performances
• Finishes under 5th or 6th place are often with only a handful of votes
• The Norris is probably biased towards offense after expansion (except for the special case of Langway, which I'm sure will be discussed)

Bill Gadsby: 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 10th, 11th (plus a 4th in AS voting pre-Norris)

Guy Lapointe: 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 4th, 5th, 5th, 6th
Serge Savard: 4th, 5th, 5th, 5th, 6th, 8th
Borje Salming: 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 4th, 5th, 10th, 14th

Rod Langway: 1st, 1st, 3rd, 5th, 5th, 9th, 10th, 11th
Mark Howe: 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 5th, 6th, 9th, 11th

Brian Leetch: 1st, 1st, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 5th, 8th, 11th, 11th

Scott Niedermayer: 1st, 2nd, 2nd, 5th, 9th, 10th, 12th

Stewart played before the Norris Trophy. Quackenbush played 2 seasons after the Norris was introduced but was no longer elite. Vasiliev did not play in the NHL.

 

[Hardyvan123]

Not surprised to see Niedermayer is up, because I think he's generally overrated on HF (especially on the main board), but he's my "easy last" this round.

I wouldn't have him in my top 5 this round, but I was expecting to see Lionel Conacher available.

You have Quackenbush ahead of Nieds?

I wonder if Nieds will be the Leetch of this round, a guy that drops quite a bit.

 

[BillyShoe1721]

I did not have Niedermayer this high. I agree HT18, he's very likely last for me.

 

[MXD]

I know that you are not counting nay of the time that Clapper spent as a forward but why such high praise for Reardon?

He has 5 very good years after WW2 but the late 40's isn't exactly the golden age of Dmen.

But maybe that's better asked when and if he comes up.

Well, yeah.
But such a point can be made for Stewart as well.

Reardon was really good... when he played, and he didn't play long, but he's certainly the guy that was hurt the most by WWII (...by, not being in the league).

Stewart? Well, it's sortof different, as he had a pretty long career. again, one has to wonder how much did he lose to the war. Not as much as Reardon, obviously (something like 1/3 or Reardon's careeer was lost to the war), but he still lost a few years in which he could have made a bigger splash.

But the thing with Clapper/Reardon is that those two guys are extremely easy to compare, with the exception that Reardon was certainly way more reckless.
EDIT : See my edit on my post. Much more faithful to what I meant.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Norris Trophy records:

The usual disclaimers:

• The Norris only came into existence in 1953-54
• The Norris doesn't take into account playoff performances
• Finishes under 5th or 6th place are often with only a handful of votes
• The Norris is probably biased towards offense after expansion (except for the special case of Langway, which I'm sure will be discussed)

Bill Gadsby: 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 10th, 11th (plus a 4th in AS voting pre-Norris)

Guy Lapointe: 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 4th, 5th, 5th, 6th
Serge Savard: 4th, 5th, 5th, 5th, 6th, 8th
Borje Salming: 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 4th, 5th, 10th, 14th

Rod Langway: 1st, 1st, 3rd, 5th, 5th, 9th, 10th, 11th
Mark Howe: 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 5th, 6th, 9th, 11th

Brian Leetch: 1st, 1st, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 5th, 8th, 11th, 11th

Scott Niedermayer: 1st, 2nd, 2nd, 5th, 9th, 10th, 12th

Quackenbush and Stewart played before the Norris Trophy and Vasiliev did not play in the NHL.

Top 5 All-Star voting finishes for Bill Quackenbush and Jack Stewart, to give somewhat of a comparison.

Quackenbush: 1, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5
Stewart: 1*, 2, 2, 3, 4, 5, 5*

*these 2 finishes came during the LD/RD voting period, determined place by who had the most voting points between both LD and RD players.

 

[Hardyvan123]

I did not have Niedermayer this high. I agree HT18, he's very likely last for me.

I guess a Norris, Conn Smythe and 4 1st team and 1 2nd team all star selections in an integrated NHL isn't worth as much as it used to be.

I'm not sure if he is in my top 5 but there is no way he is in the basement either.

 

[MXD]

While I'll probably have Nieds in the basement (or in the bottom tier, actually), I don't see him as just way below everyone else in this round.

I mean...

Leetch entered the league right in his peak, in way. Nieds, on the other hand, didn't hit in prime until 1997, but he was/could have been a 1st D in the league until his retirement, even if, at the end of his career (past the Cup), he wasn't really a Norris threat anymore.

Is there some data about approximate TOI for Nieds for the first few years of his career?

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Not surprised to see Niedermayer is up, because I think he's generally overrated on HF (especially on the main board), but he's my "easy last" this round.

I wouldn't have him in my top 5 this round, but I was expecting to see Lionel Conacher available.

Niedermayer is a candidate for last on my list, but he's definitely not an easy last. I would have to compare him to Jack Stewart, Guy Lapointe and Rod Langway, at least.

And look how similar the Norris records of Niedermayer and Mark Howe are. It's a battle between Niedermayer's short peak and Howe's longer but injury-riddled one.

First time since round 1 I don't have an "easy last."

Don't get me wrong, Nieds definitely won't be in my top 5.

(An unrelated note: Lionel Conacher sure gets a lot of mileage out of being voted the Canadian athlete of the half century).

Gadsby, Leetch, and Salming will definitely be in my top 5. I'm very flexible about the order though.

Vasiliev has a good shot at my top 5, but I'm not sure where. He'll likely be below Salming though.

How far can Clapper fall because he was multi-positional? I'm pretty sure I'm going to rank him ahead of Niedermayer, at least. Possibly some others. Enough to make my top 5? Not sure.

Serge Savard will definitely be ranked above Guy Lapointe on my vote, but not far above.

Other Interesting debates I can see:

Mark Howe vs. Rod Langway - did Langway really deserve those Norrises?
Bill Quackenbush vs. Jack Stewart - who was the best defenseman of the late 40s?
Rod Langway vs. Serge Savard - regular season trophy case vs. playoff success

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

I guess a Norris, Conn Smythe and 4 1st team and 1 2nd team all star selections in an integrated NHL isn't worth as much as it used to be.

I'm not sure if he is in my top 5 but there is no way he is in the basement either.

Niedermayer only has 3 1st Team All Star selections, and they were all very well deserved.

He has the one 2nd Team in 1998 and as a Devils fan, I can say that while it was a very good season, it wasn't good enough to deserve being a 2nd Teamer - it was a "stats" award.

 

[Dreakmur]

Quackenbush and Stewart played before the Norris Trophy and Vasiliev did not play in the NHL.

You can use all-star voting as a substitute for some. Bill Quackenbush and Jack Stewart have almost identical voting records - it's kind of creepy.

Quackenbush - 1st, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 7th, 9th

Stewart - 1st, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 8th, 11th

(I ignored seasons where they received single votes)

 

[VanIslander]

I remember the Big Three Hab blueliners as being Big Bird, Serge ... and a distant third Lapointe. There was a GAP between Lapointe and the duo of Robinson and Savard. Is there any reason to think Lapointe belongs ahead of - or even close to - Savard? (And, there's no way in hell Lapointe>Langway I hope)

The Soviets were dominant at the time and Vasiliev seems a natural fit between Robinson and Savard in my esteem. His leadership qualities as captain of USSR's best during the greatest stretch of Soviet hockey success gives him a clear edge over Savard imo.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Vasiliev footage

I'm generally not a fan of using highlight reels to evaluate players, but Vasiliev is a guy that has a lot less information out there than most others, so I think it will help. The first video should be most useful, it's mostly defensive plays/hits, but there are a few offensive plays and penalties on there as well. Go to 4:42 to see a rush against the Habs where he runs right through Larry Robinson.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Good grief, what a hip checker!

 

[Dreakmur]

I remember the Big Three Hab blueliners as being Big Bird, Serge ... and a distant third Lapointe. There was a GAP between Lapointe and the duo of Robinson and Savard. Is there any reason to think Lapointe belongs ahead of - or even close to - Savard? (And, there's no way in hell Lapointe>Langway I hope)

Don't kid yourself - it was Robinson, then a gap, then Savard and Lapointe. Robinson and Savard made each other look good, while Lapointe played with a carousel of marginal NHLers.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Dit Clapper

FROM THE PREVIOUS THREAD

Quotes by hfboards posters are all from the two previous top 100 projects:

Dit Clapper: The first player in NHL history to play 20 seasons. Excelled at both forward and defence. A three-time first-team all-star at defence before the league's best went to war. A two-time all-star at RW (when Conacher and Cook were the competition) and would have earned a third selection in 1930 if all-star teams were around at that point. Three-time Cup champion. Excellent two-way forward who played a tough, physical game.

In ten years as a forward, he had just two top-ten scoring finishes, and one of them was in the fluky 1930 campaign (due to bizarre, one-time rule changes that were adjusted mid-season). He had two 2nd-team all-star spots and no Hart consideration. Not bad, of course, but this certainly isn't top-50 material.

As a defenseman, Clapper earned four all-star spots (three 1st, one 2nd) and two Hart nominations (2nd and 3rd place) in just eight full years. He was the #1 defenseman on two Cup-winning teams. That's a great resume, even if we take into account the fact that one of those all-star spots came during the talent-depleted war years, and that his competition was a bit weak by all-time standards. Clapper sounded like Bourque: great defensively, not overless aggressive, but he could play tough when needed.

Basically I agree with Nalyd's earlier point. Clapper's decade as a forward doesn't add very much to his legacy (relative to top 50 players).

A lot of Dit Clapper's case rests on his three consecutive first team all-star years from 38-39 to 40-41. It seems to me that his competition at defense in those years was relatively weak, with the defensive stars of the 1930s winding down their careers and a lack of young defensemen stepping up.

Here are a list of prominent NHL defensemen born in the 20-year period from 1903 to 1922 (HHOFers in bold).

1903 | King Clancy
1904 | Babe Siebert
1905 | Cy Wentworth
1907 | Dit Clapper
1907 | Ebbie Goodfellow
1908 | Georges Mantha
1909 | Art Coulter
1909 | Red Horner
1910 | Ott Heller
1910 | Tom Anderson
1911 | Earl Seibert
1912 | Flash Hollett
1914 | Bucko McDonald
1916 | Babe Pratt
1916 | Jack Crawford
1917 | Jack Stewart
1918 | Pat Egan
1919 | Wally Stanowski
1920 | Butch Bouchard
1921 | Ken Reardon
1921 | Glen Harmon
1922 | Bill Quackenbush
1922 | Bob Goldham

In the period from 1938 to 1941, the very strong group of defensemen born between 1907 and 1911 were turning 30 and generally winding down their careers. Among HHOFers, Goodfellow and Coulter were still playing well but would retire soon. Red Horner retired in 1940. Only Seibert was still in the middle of his prime.

After Seibert, only 2 defensemen born from 1912 to 1919 would make the HHOF, meaning that Clapper had very little competition from defensemen in their twenties. Neither Pratt nor Stewart would hit their stride until a couple of years later, so Clapper was basically competing against a group of defensemen that was past their best years, with little young talent coming up to replace them.

It should be noted that Dit Clapper was the first player for whom the Hockey Hall of Fame committee waived the mandatory waiting period.

The Player category has been in existence since the beginning of the Hall of Fame and the first players were inducted in 1945. Since then, 238 players have been inducted. For a person to be inducted to the Hockey Hall of Fame as a player, they must have been retired for a minimum of three years and must be nominated by an elected 18-person selection committee.[3] The waiting period was waived for ten players deemed exceptionally notable: Dit Clapper (1947), Maurice Richard (1961), Ted Lindsay (1966), Red Kelly (1969), Terry Sawchuk (1971), Jean Beliveau (1972), Gordie Howe (1972), Bobby Orr (1979), Mario Lemieux (1997) and Wayne Gretzky (1999).[9] Following Wayne Gretzky's retirement, it was announced that the waiting period would no longer be waived for any player except under "certain humanitarian circumstances".[2]

It should also be noted that in the 3 straight seasons during which Clapper was a 1st Team All Star, the Bruins won 2 Stanley Cups. Then the Kraut line went off to war and the team declined. Hart voting among Bruins in those 3 seasons:

38-39 (won Cup): Eddie Shore (5th). This is only the 2nd Cup of Shore's career.
39-40: Dit Clapper (3rd), Milt Schmidt (4th)
40-41 (won Cup): Bill Cowley (1st), Dit Clapper (2nd). This was a close vote with Cowley winning 88-81 in voting points.

In Clapper's 3 straight 1st Team seasons, he ranked:

• 2nd in scoring among defensemen, 1 point less than Flash Hollett, an offensive specialist
• Tied for 1st in scoring among defensemen with Flash Hollett and Hart-winner Ebbie Goodfellow
• 1st in scoring among defensemen, 1 point more than Flash Holett (and Alex Mottler, who is listed as D on hockey reference, but I don't think was)

Then he got the serious injury BM67 was talking about.

And he did this with a reputation for being a very physically strong man who played a very good defensive game.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Bill Gadsby

FROM THE LAST THREAD

His Norris record stacks up against anyone that is still up for voting, and he had some very stiff competition with Harvey (runner-up to him twice) and for part of the time Kelly (one 3rd place finish is behind Harvey/Kelly)

Norris Record: 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 4, 4*, 5, 6

*one 4th place finish based on All-Star team voting before Norris existed

He doesn't have much to look at in the playoff department as he spent his prime years on some bad teams that either didn't make the playoffs or only lasted one round. He does have a 3 year stretch (57'-59') where he scored 10pts in 16 playoff games.


More info can be found here: Bill Gadsby

Note in the linked post that Gadsby placed Top 2 in defenseman scoring 8 times, and at the same time Stan Mikita names Gadsby as the defenseman who gave him the most trouble.

Scoring finishes among defensemen:

Harvey points: 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, 5, 5, 7, 8
Gadsby points: 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 4, 4, 6, 7, 7

Harvey goals: 2, 3, 4, 4, 4, 5, 6, 8, 8, 9, 9, 9, 10
Gadsby goals: 1, 1, 2 ,2, 2, 3, 3, 4, 6, 6, 9

Harvey assists: 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 4, 4, 7, 8
Gadsby assists: 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 3, 4, 4, 4, 7, 8

If you look at their points-per-game numbers, they are very similar - both behind Kelly, but well ahead of the pack.

If you look at consecutive 40 point seasons (an extremely rare feat for a defenseman of the era), both Harvey and Gadsby have 4 of them.

I think it's fair to say that Gadsby and Harvey were close to equal offensively.

Gadsby was an elite shot blocker and a very physical player

Nothing more to add here, except to see his profile that has been linked a couple of times in this thread.

I think I would actually say that Gadsby was better offensively than Harvey.

Both guys were in their primes between 1950 and 1963. It's actually odd that their careers peaked and dropped off during the same seasons, but it worked out perfectly. Either way, that's the time I looked at.

Harvey had 492 points and 70 goals in 937 games.
Gadsby had 474 points and 106 goals in 907 games.

In terms of points, it is dead even, but goals is a distinct advantage to Gadsby.

One important aspect here is strength of teammates. Since Harvey was part of the best team of all time, I think it's fair to say he had a lot more help than Gadsby. I don't want to say the word "leach", but Harvey definately benefitted from passing to all-time fowards - especially compared to the messes that Gadsby worked with. Taking that into consideration, I think Gadsby's 0.52 PPG is much more impressive than Havey's 0.53.

Gadsby wasn't close overall to Harvey/Kelly post:
http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=40265425&postcount=52

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Valeri Vasiliev

FROM LAST THREAD

Why Vasiliev is the 2nd best Soviet defenseman of all-time and should be recognized as such: http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=40357699&postcount=183
Hawkey Town earlier posted his ATD bio of Vasiliev: http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=30841708&postcount=51

Following quotes from 2008 Top 100 project.

Ironically, despite being the biggest supporter for Russian players on this list, Bobrov will not be making the cut for me. For reasons others have covered. If he is available, why not Hobey Baker of Vlad Zabrodsky? The competition they faced just is not up to par. Petrov, Larionov, Maltsev, Holecek, Nedomansky and Martinec would come far ahead of any of them for me.


Valery Vasiliev. The best Russian Defenseman after Fetisov. More of a stay at home guy, but what a talent. I absolutely loved watching him play. In fact, When Vlad Konstantinov started to peak, I was under the eerie impression he had returned in a younger body

Valeri Vasiliev was a slick skater and passer, but also known for his physical play, which was sometimes frowned upon back in the Russian leagues. That opinion seemed to change after 1972.

"We knew that Vasiliev was a rough and tough player. he had been criticized by the media for some 'dirty tricks,' " commented Russian sports writer Yuri Vanjat. "But comparing him with Canadian players, he looked like one of the cleanest hitters in the world."

Vasiliev scored one goal in the tournament. It proved to be the final Soviet goal of the tournament. He most often teamed with defense partner Yuri Liapkin, and both were on the ice when Henderson scored "The Goal."

Considered by many to be the toughest and most physical defenseman in Russian hockey history, Valeri Vasiliev was a punishing hitter who loved the physical play. Valeri reminded people of Hall of Famer Tim Horton.

He didn't have the offensive flair like Alexei Kasatonov or Vyacheslav Fetisov but was better defensively. Opponents hated to play against him because it could be painful. As a surprise to many opponents Valeri was only 6'0" and 190 Ibs but played like a much bigger player. He put several opponents on the injury list during his career.
...
Valeri was a born leader and was a longtime captain of the national team. He was a two time Olympic Gold medalist (1972 and 1976). He was a eight time World Champion, being voted the best defenseman three times (1973, 1977 and 19 79) and being named to 5 WC All-Star teams. Valeri represented his country 284 times and scored 44 goals. He was a member of the "super five" together with his partner on the blue line Vladimir Lutchenko and behind the troika of Kharlamov-Petrov-Mikhailov, the predecessors of the Makarov-Larionov-Krutov unit with Kasatonov and Fetisov.

Yet he never experienced a Russian league championship. He was one of very few players on the Soviet national team who never played for the Red Army team CSKA. The Red Army team dominated the home league because it was essentially comprised of the national team. Only a few players like Vasiliev were brought in to join those players for the national team. Valeri played a total of 617 games and scored 71 goals. His 617 games is still a league record.

Because of his physical style he loved to play against NHL opposition. He thrived in that environment, and because of that the Russian Strongman was one early Russian player who likely would have excelled in the NHL.

He played in the 1972 Summit Series as well as the 1979 Challenge Cup. Valeri had a big part in neutralizing Wayne Gretzky, Guy Lafleur, Marcel Dionne and the other Canadian superstars in the 1981 Canada Cup final. That was the only year the Soviets won the Canada Cup. Vasliev, as team captain, accepted the famous trophy.

Vasiliev was also a very efficient and speedy skater, despite looking quite awkward. He had an unusual way of propelling himself down the ice. He did not lift his skates off the ice while rapidly accelerating. This allowed him incredible stability. He was almost impossible to knock him off his feet.
...
Valeri has never been replaced on the national team by someone who could match his physical play and toughness. It's an element that has been sorely missed on the Russian national team over the years.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Coaching Polls

We have coaching polls for NHL players from 1971, 1973, 1976, 1979, 1981*, 1984, 1993, 1994. Not all years had the same categories. Here are the relevant results.

*Player's poll

(We also have coaching polls from 1934 and 1965 but they don't have any defenseman specific categories)

BORJE SALMING

Best defensive defenseman | 2nd | 1974
Best defensive defenseman | 3rd | 1979
Best passer | 4th | 1979
Best playmaker | 4th | 1979
Best skater | 2nd | 1979
Most natural ability | 4th | 1979

BRIAN LEETCH

Best offensive defenseman | 4th | 1993
Best offensive defenseman | 1st | 1994
Best powerplay point-man | 1st* | 1994

*tied with Bourque and MacInnis

ROD LANGWAY

Best bodychecker | 5th | 1984
Best defensive defenseman | 1st | 1984

SERGE SAVARD

Best defensive defenseman | 2nd | 1979
Best defensive defenseman | 2nd | 1981

It's unfortunate there is a 9 year gap between 1984 and 1993 and no polls after 1994