Prospect Info: Round 1, Pick 2: Nolan Patrick, C, Brandon (WHL)

[BringBackHakstol]

Would love to see Coots on that Simmonds or Schenn slot instead of half wall with Patrick coming in. Hopefully it can work.

Coots doesn't have to be a weak PP player. He's just weak in the role he is used in. It doesn't suit his abilities

 

[Curufinwe]

Putting Patrick in the defensive/shutdown role wouldn't play to his strengths. Plus having linemates such as Simmonds and whoever the LW is would benefit Patrick even more.

Relax. Patrick isn't going to be put in a shutdown role and he will have good wingers.

 

[Hockeypete49]

Relax. Patrick isn't going to be put in a shutdown role and he will have good wingers.

Yep he will not be jerked around in the line-up or be asked to carry the team on his back.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

Because G is as good as he is, he is the top line center for now and probably the next few seasons barring another injury. Couturier is the next center in line. People got to see what he can do over the last half the last season when he has scorers with him. His offensive play is often under appreciated. Putting Patrick on the third line for this season is a good thing for the team and Patrick. It puts him in a position where he won't be exposed to the opponents better defensive players. In a few seasons, that shouldn't matter but for a rookie, it would help him with development. I firmly believe that Patrick is going to be a major player in the League. However he doesn't need to be put into situations where he feels pressure to do more than is expected.

I don't know why you keep bringing up Giroux. No one is suggesting that Patrick is going to unseat Giroux this season or any time soon. The players should go where they are capable of going and can help the team the most. If Patrick can play second scoring line minutes better than he can play third line shut down minutes, that is where he will go. Players don't need shielding or protection just because they are young. Some players definitely do, others do not. If he comes in and plays like a second line center, that's where he should be. We don't need to "ease him in" if he is capable of playing those minutes. Even if Couturier is better on that second line, if Patrick can play those minutes he should play those minutes. Couturier on the third line along with Weise and Filp or the Neck or Raffl is going to be a very tough line to play against and a better line than if Patrick is there due to Couturier's strength on defense.

Obviously, if he comes in to camp and shows he can't hang, then yeah you don't put him there. But to act like people are overhyping the #2 overall pick that has been a known commodity for years because they are putting him on the second line seems very weird. Believe me I am the first to pump the breaks on the hype train, but when you have a legit bluechip prospect like him putting him on the second line does not seem outrageous, especially all the hype that people throw on all our other prospects.

 

[Magua]

From what I noticed Toronto used Marner and Nylander in a similar way last year.

Marner has pretty much always played the right side though, even in junior. I know Gaudreau also plays his natural side on the PP. Usually it requires a different skill-set than someone like Patrick has. Generally more mobility and creativity and playmaking emphasis because you can't just park your butt. Not to say I don't think he could do it because he is a strong passer. And it's not like you can't shoot from that side, minus the one timer. Maybe my favorite Patrick shot is when he snaps it from the right side. I actually wonder if TK could be effective at that right wall. He's not a one-timer threat anyway.

I know you were talking about just this season, but as I've mentioned before, the Simmonds spot makes sense long-term, or as long as Giroux is here. Simmonds is as good a net front as there is, so maybe he's not quite as good there. But how often does Simmonds bounce out with the puck behind the goal line or to the low half-wall and can't do anything with it? He doesn't possess the ability to make plays like that. But Patrick does. It's been an issue that there are only 3 players on the PP who handle the puck in terms of shutting them down and creating too much unused space on the ice. Patrick could solve that. Could even run some fun switch plays with Giroux. Probably all moot though.

 

[Tripod]

I don't know why you keep bringing up Giroux. No one is suggesting that Patrick is going to unseat Giroux this season or any time soon. The players should go where they are capable of going and can help the team the most. If Patrick can play second scoring line minutes better than he can play third line shut down minutes, that is where he will go. Players don't need shielding or protection just because they are young. Some players definitely do, others do not. If he comes in and plays like a second line center, that's where he should be. We don't need to "ease him in" if he is capable of playing those minutes. Even if Couturier is better on that second line, if Patrick can play those minutes he should play those minutes. Couturier on the third line along with Weise and Filp or the Neck or Raffl is going to be a very tough line to play against and a better line than if Patrick is there due to Couturier's strength on defense.

Obviously, if he comes in to camp and shows he can't hang, then yeah you don't put him there. But to act like people are overhyping the #2 overall pick that has been a known commodity for years because they are putting him on the second line seems very weird. Believe me I am the first to pump the breaks on the hype train, but when you have a legit bluechip prospect like him putting him on the second line does not seem outrageous, especially all the hype that people throw on all our other prospects.

Patrick WILL be in a scoring role.

Call it the 2nd line scoring role if you want. Or call it a sheltered 3rd line scoring role. Who cares.

We are FINALLY in a position that we have 3 good centers AND the wingers good enough to play with them in that role. It's not like Patrick is going to get Laughton and Leier here.

Lindblom Simmonds
Weal Voracek
Flip Konecny

Patrick very likely has 2 of those guys as his wingers. His line needs to produce offense....and will IMO.

 

[Tripod]

Marner has pretty much always played the right side though, even in junior. I know Gaudreau also plays his natural side on the PP. Usually it requires a different skill-set than someone like Patrick has. Generally more mobility and creativity and playmaking emphasis because you can't just park your butt. Not to say I don't think he could do it because he is a strong passer. And it's not like you can't shoot from that side, minus the one timer. Maybe my favorite Patrick shot is when he snaps it from the right side. I actually wonder if TK could be effective at that right wall. He's not a one-timer threat anyway.

I know you were talking about just this season, but as I've mentioned before, the Simmonds spot makes sense long-term, or as long as Giroux is here. Simmonds is as good a net front as there is, so maybe he's not quite as good there. But how often does Simmonds bounce out with the puck behind the goal line or to the low half-wall and can't do anything with it? He doesn't possess the ability to make plays like that. But Patrick does. It's been an issue that there are only 3 players on the PP who handle the puck in terms of shutting them down and creating too much unused space on the ice. Patrick could solve that. Could even run some fun switch plays with Giroux. Probably all moot though.

I personally want Patrick and Konecny in the G and Schenn spot....but I want the PP QB to be on the right wall feeding those 2. And ideally, that guy is a LH shot.

I know I said it before but making Voracek the QB of the 2nd unit as the main passer could fix that unit. And then Sanheim could slide into the Ghost spot with Ghost going to Jakes spot. Ghost would be more "goal" orientated than Jake is and would be moving up and down as a target for Giroux more.

And yes, I know Jake gets lots of his points on the 1st unit, but as a team, we could end up with 2 much better units.

 

[Rebels57]

I know we are all assuming on the PP setup but there absolutely will be changes. A new PP coach isnt going to NOT make changes.

 

[Rebels57]

One change id like to see is having Ghost on the right point instead of left. There needs to be more a bigger gap between Giroux and Ghost.

 

[CodyTheHuman]

I wouldn't count on the PP looking the same as years past. Mullen has been let go, Knoblauch will likely want to try his own set up instead of recycling Mullen's.

He may not be better than Couturier out of the gate or even at the end of the season, but yes, it would e beneficial for the flyers to put him as 2C. Couturier hasn't produced well offensively to be a 2C and is an amazing shutdown center. Putting Patrick in the defensive/shutdown role wouldn't play to his strengths. Plus having linemates such as Simmonds and whoever the LW is would benefit Patrick even more.

People can keep repeating this, but that doesn't make it true. Couturier doesn't produce on a power play unit that has been terrible. Even strength he produces very well.

One change id like to see is having Ghost on the right point instead of left. There needs to be more a bigger gap between Giroux and Ghost.

Agreed. They need to make it harder to defend the two best weapons on the PP.

 

[Rebels57]

I wouldn't count on the PP looking the same as years past. Mullen has been let go, Knoblauch will likely want to try his own set up instead of recycling Mullen's.



People can keep repeating this, but that doesn't make it true. Couturier doesn't produce on a power play unit that has been terrible. Even strength he produces very well.



Agreed. They need to make it harder to defend the two best weapons on the PP.

Yup. They need to build the unit around the 2 of them and Simmonds. Jake should not be a PP1 lock. He is good at zone entries and puck retrieval but his shot/pass selection and execution was **** poor last season.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

I'd love to get Voracek off the first PP unit. I think he's a liability there much of the time. Teams can (and do) leave him open so they can cheat toward Giroux and Ghost without much worry.
He's got a lousy shot and surprisingly terrible vision from the right half boards. Plays like he has blinkers on (tunnel vision).

 

[Larry44]

Yep he will not be jerked around in the line-up or be asked to carry the team on his back.

But he will anyway, it's just his nature.

 

[bobbythebrain]

I'd love to get Voracek off the first PP unit. I think he's a liability there much of the time. Teams can (and do) leave him open so they can cheat toward Giroux and Ghost without much worry.
He's got a lousy shot and surprisingly terrible vision from the right half boards. Plays like he has blinkers on (tunnel vision).

What the? 1 bad year and you write him off? Vora is a beast in that position. His reads to Simmonds deserve credit. Did you forget about that year?

He struggled last year. No doubt. But 2 years ago he made that PP work. His decisions were key

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

What the? 1 bad year and you write him off? Vora is a beast in that position. His reads to Simmonds deserve credit. Did you forget about that year?

He struggled last year. No doubt. But 2 years ago he made that PP work. His decisions were key

I would tend to agree. Of all the things that need fixing our top unit isn't one of them.`

 

[Ghosts Beer]

What the? 1 bad year and you write him off? Vora is a beast in that position. His reads to Simmonds deserve credit. Did you forget about that year?

He struggled last year. No doubt. But 2 years ago he made that PP work. His decisions were key

Voracek has had two subpar seasons in a row, and that includes his power play performance.

He absolutely was NOT the driving force behind the Flyers' 1st unit two seasons ago. I have no idea where you'd conclude he was the key cog over Ghost, Giroux, and Simmonds.

At the end of Ghost's rookie season teams started figuring out they could leave Voracek alone and cheat toward stopping Ghost and Giroux, and that strategy continued last season.

I would like to see the right half boards position improved on PP1 so teams cannot overplay the Ghost-Giroux tandem so much.

I would tend to agree. Of all the things that need fixing our top unit isn't one of them.`

The Flyers' PP was 14th in the league last season, and 11th the season before. Sure, some of that is the 2nd unit's fault, but let's not act like the top unit is a flawlesss juggernaut that needs no improvement.

 

[Protest]

One change id like to see is having Ghost on the right point instead of left. There needs to be more a bigger gap between Giroux and Ghost.

If Sanheim makes the team I'd like to see him take Ghost's spot on PP1 and Ghost take Voracek's.

Move Voracek to PP2 and run the same setup as PP1 but flipped with Voracek playing Giroux's role on the right side, Provorov at the middle point, Konecny on the other point/wall, Couturier in Simmonds spot on the right and Patrick in the slot.

 

[Rebels57]

If Sanheim makes the team I'd like to see him take Ghost's spot on PP1 and Ghost take Voracek's.

Move Voracek to PP2 and run the same setup as PP1 but flipped with Voracek playing Giroux's role on the right side, Provorov at the middle point, Konecny on the other point/wall, Couturier in Simmonds spot on the right and Patrick in the slot.

So you want Ghost off of PP1?

Not happening. Hes fantastic at the point. Just needs to hit the net more this season.

 

[BernieParent]

So you want Ghost off of PP1?

Not happening. Hes fantastic at the point. Just needs to hit the net more this season.

No, he means slide Gostisbehere to the right point rather than the left.

(you know I'm just bugging you, right?)

 

[Hiesenberg]

I kind of don't like the PP setup anymore. Seems stagnate and stationary. Would like to see them move a little more.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

I kind of don't like the PP setup anymore. Seems stagnate and stationary. Would like to see them move a little more.

I wouldn't mind seeing Giroux start a little higher in the zone and then creep in when appropriate, like Ovechkin in Wash.

 

[Tripod]

I wouldn't mind seeing Giroux start a little higher in the zone and then creep in when appropriate, like Ovechkin in Wash.

The difference though is Ovi never has the puck, whereas Giroux always does.

That's why guys want Ghost in Jakes spot...to move up and down like Ovi does to create open lanes and for a good shot. Right now, teams are fine if G threads a pass thru to Jake because Jake is way over on the other wall most times. And when he gets it, he cuts to the middle for a weak wrister. Or rings the pucks around the boards to G again.

I said it before, but when Jake gets the puck and DOESN'T shoot, I wish that Simmonds and "Schenn" would switch spots. That would put Simminds in a 1 timer position and G as well. There is no reason Jake can't be like a 2nd QB out there when he gets the puck and no shot is there. It's a simple change to have Simmonds and the slot guy switch roles if Jake becomes the distributor.

 

[Curufinwe]

If Voracek eventually gets replaced on PP1 it should be by Sanheim who I think is the only guy we have who could use his skating to create zone entries with the puck as well as Jake has done for all these years.

The main problem with PP2 last year was not being able to get into the OZ with possession of the puck.

 

[McNasty]

Trying to figure out PP spots is kind of silly right now until we see what their setup looks like. Most good powerplays have some type of rotation and movement to them, so if they abandon the static umbrella, having one timer options up top is no longer a necessity. You're going to see Simmonds near the net, that's about the only thing to be certain about (other than: Giroux and ghost will be on PP1).

 

[Rebels57]

No, he means slide Gostisbehere to the right point rather than the left.

(you know I'm just bugging you, right?)

I was half asleep when I read that post and missed the part about Ghost taking over for Voracek