Prospects Game -q Players Slighted

Discussion in 'NHL Draft - Prospects' started by pei fan, Jan 20, 2005.

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  1. pei fan

    pei fan Registered User

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    There's been some talk after the prospects game that there is no way Brule
    should have been ranked only 6th by central scouting(ranked 2nd & 3rd by others),
    but what about some of the Q players.First of all only 9 played,yet 6 of the
    7 skaters scored points and ALL 4 Q forwards had multiple point games when
    only 7 players had more than 1.(so 3 from the other leagues)
    Alex Bourret ranked 19th NA skaters-1g 1a major hits
    Marek Zagrapan ranked 27 NA skaters- 1g 1a
    Slava Trukhno ranked 40th NA skaters -1g 1a
    Guillaume Latendresse ranked 67th NA skaters-1g 1a
    IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S A BIAS AGAINST THE Q.
     
  2. Form and Substance

    Form and Substance Registered User

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    I anticipate this thread to turn into another 'q players get no respect' 'what are you talking about?!' debacle which is entirely true but sort of pointless. Then again, it can't really be avoided.
     
  3. Rageinthecage

    Rageinthecage Registered User

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    I don't think there's any intentional slights being made by Central Scouting, keep in mind it's only one group's opinion and each NHL team's lists differ somewhat. I'm sure they have their reasons for the rankings, and I'm sure they'll alter significantly before the draft occurs (whenever that may be).

    Zagrapan, Trukhno, and Bourret should all rocket up the rankings based on their play in this game. Trukhno pretty much had the best hands of any player I watched in the game, typical skilled Russian. Bourret was a force with his tenacious hits, forechecking, and seemed to have excellent hockey sense. Zagrapan also appeared to be one of the more pro-ready type prospects on the ice with his on-ice vision. It was only one game however, but it was nice witnessing the play of these O and Q players we don't get to see out here on the westcoast.
     
  4. pei fan

    pei fan Registered User

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    What about Latendresse?Ranked 67 for NA skaters,would that put him about
    100th overall once you add the goalies and the Europeans.He has the speed,size
    and skills the NHL are usually looking for.He's had some injury problems but I
    still don't see him going anywhere near 100th overall.I would doubt VERY HIGHLY
    that he goes later than round 1.
     
  5. Rageinthecage

    Rageinthecage Registered User

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    Agreed. Forgot to mention Latendresse. Should be a late 1st rounder, early 2nd rounder at worst.
     
  6. Mess

    Mess Global Moderator

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    Well they could rank those Q goalies lower then they are now after some of those goals against.. The majority of the Q player points Ironically came against Q goalies ...

    Some ones going to claim they let them in on purpose ... Or they are modeling their games after Montoya's WJC performance perhaps ... :)
     
  7. LaLaLaprise

    LaLaLaprise lalalaprise -twitter

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    Or it was ONE game :)

    In games like this goaltenders are under the microscope. They have a so/so game and everyone notices. They stand on their head and everyone notices. Players can hide a lot more.

    Lavasseur had a horrible game. But I am sure the scouts there have seen Lavasseur play better than that almost 90% of the time.
     
  8. Chief

    Chief Registered User

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    Exactly. One good (or bad) game could stick in some scout's craw but what these players do for the rest of the season will matter much more than what happened in this game.

    On the question of Q players. Although still a longshot, I could see as many as 5 Q players going top 15 and as many as 7 going Top 20! - Zagrapan, Bourret, Bourdon, Levasseur, Vincent, Latendresse...and , oh yeah, that Crosby kid! :D
     
  9. LaLaLaprise

    LaLaLaprise lalalaprise -twitter

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    Good point. I think locks for the 1st round from the Q are:

    Crosby
    Latendresse (Despite his low ranking)
    Bourret (Despite his low ranking)
    Zagrapan (Despite his low ranking)
    Bourdon (Despite a bad Prospects game)

    The 2 goalies could sneak in. Right now with the goaltenders it is really hard to say out of the Main 4 what the order will be.

    The Main 4 in my opinion are:

    Price, Lavasseur, Vincent and Rask.
     
  10. Mess

    Mess Global Moderator

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    Realistically Crosby obviously

    Bourret was excellent .. he is ranked lower because SIZE matters in scouts eyes..but he proved that against the Top rank players he can really throw his weight around

    Zagrapan was one of the best players in the game and had a great WJC .. I have no doubt he will be a 1st round next draft

    Latendresse - has skill as a stick handler ..but I highly doubt he will crack the 1st round .. He is very timid and it will not take long before he will get blasted by a few Dmen and he may shy away from going in traffic again .. His goal should hardly even count in that game, but he did have good chemistry with Bourret but none of that will make him a first rounder ... Not sure scouts are going to see enough in his game to make him a 1st rounder .. he may sneak in but I would think it would be in the bottom 5 -8 picks of the first round ..I thought a player like Radek Smolenak game would project better at higher levels by his style then Latendresse ..

    Bourdon - had a terrible game ...If front of the scouts and they will question that about that against his piers he projected poorly and GM's that usually do not get a chance to join their scouts at games but do take this game in .. Come draft day if a scout is pushing for this player to be drafted I could easily see a GM say pick someone else .. That performance likely knocked him out of the 1st round ..

    The Goalies play in this game and some of the goals they let in will leave a lasting impression on everyone's minds .... You can't make light of this game as just one game as people are doing while technically it is ... This one means far more then just the next league game against much weaker opponents ... In value wise it is weighted far higher than a regular league game IMO .. and we will see .. Unless you are considered Franchise goalies they often drop anyways .. Look at Marek Schwarz last season .. I think his potential is higher then any goalie in this upcoming draft and he fell to St. Louis at 17th ... If the Q goalies do make it they will be near the last portion as well ... I think Rask has the best chance of all availabe to go in the TOP 15 picks perhaps .. His WJC play will help his draft position, as he had a up and down tourney but did play some good hockey as well ..
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2005
  11. markov`

    markov` Registered User

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    Get real man. Nobody is going to get knocked off the first round because of one game.
     
  12. Jason MacIsaac

    Jason MacIsaac Registered User

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    Messanger.....you do know Latendresse was considered a top 5 pick (#3 by many) for the upcomming draft before his injury. Any smart GM/Scout will have known how he performs at top level. Latendresse will go in the first round easy. I also don't think one bad game will push Bourdon out of the first round. He is smooth and usually reliable on the blueline. I'm sure it was tough for dmen to play with different partners who I'm sure they couldn't comminicate well with.

    Goaltenders are too much of a crap shoot and I don't think any of those two should be first round material.
     
  13. Mess

    Mess Global Moderator

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    What is the purpose of the game then ??.. it bring all the top eligible kids in the CHL together and all the scouts and Gm's ... to view them and then everyone says ..

    Doesn't matter if a player has a bad or good game ... It just one game .. Players rise and fall for all sorts of reasons and this does so count in the eyes of many .. More then a regular season game ... IMO

    I guarantee you if this was Montoya's draft year that he would drop in the rankings and where he was selected based on the last WJC .. Or was that just a few bad games as well??

    All these events count .. and the tourney and Special games like a Prospect game certainly counts ...

    Watch the rankings .. You will see players rise and fall on list as a result of the performaces ..
     
  14. Mess

    Mess Global Moderator

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    I am no fan of Latendresse but I have limited viewings ... I personally would take the lower ranked Alex Bourret first if given the choice ..

    Correct me if I am wrong but .., Marc-Antoine Pouliot was also ranked very high and dropped down to Edmonton at 22 ... I see the skill sets IMO similar of the 2 players and predict a similar drop by Latendresse .. That puck on a string move to the crease with his head down he made in yesterdays game might work here and in the CHL but that would get him killed at higher levels by a dman that will knock him into next tuesday ..

    Is Latendresse still playing wiht his high scoring teammates Derick Brassard and Louis-Philippe Martin ??? Often Scouts look at things like that ..

    I will always say and believe that Andrew Ladd got drafted 4th overall last year and he owes Ryan Getzlaf the Credit .. Crosby linemate Dany Roussin is a better player on paper stats wise then his abilities are as a prospect ...
     
  15. Jason MacIsaac

    Jason MacIsaac Registered User

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    I don't think Pouliot was ever ranked inside the top 10, may have been 9th. Maybe I am wrong. I will actually agree with you, I am not all that impressed with his game but he will surely go in the top round. His game actually seemed better last year. Seems like he lost a little speed.
     
  16. Form and Substance

    Form and Substance Registered User

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    Actually many people were surprised when Pouliot was picked 22nd, he was projected as a very late 1st rounder. 25-30 ish
     
  17. Mess

    Mess Global Moderator

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    I do not think that is right ..

    I do not have my Hockey news handy .. but he was scheduled to go early and his concussion got him to drop ... I remember watching the entry draft and they kept mentioning he was still not drafted ..
     
  18. Hobey Baker

    Hobey Baker Registered User

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    Yes, rankings conducted by services that do not draft players for teams. Any scout worth a lick knows that you can't possible judge a player from an all-star game setting. It's one of about 200 games in the viewing spectrum. Let's not put too much value in what happened last night.
     
  19. Form and Substance

    Form and Substance Registered User

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    Well to each his own
     
  20. Mess

    Mess Global Moderator

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    I guess your own then .. I went and pulled my 2003 The Hockey News draft Preview and Marc-Antoine Pouliot was ranked 14th ..

    Jeff Carter was ranked 16th, Ryan Kessler 17th, Anthony Stewart 19th, Pat O'Sullivan 20th, Steve Bernier 24th and Mike Richards 31st,,, so you an idea of what that meant in a strong draft ..

    Point was I see the skill sets IMO similar of the 2 players and predict a similar drop by Latendresse ...
     
  21. Jeffrey

    Jeffrey Registered User

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    where is kostitsyn ? :D
     
  22. Mess

    Mess Global Moderator

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    he was ranked #13 in the guide right in front of Marc-Antoine Pouliot
     
  23. Mess

    Mess Global Moderator

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    Isn't Latendresse now # 67 on the latest CSB listing. ??

    That as you know is North American skaters only ..

    http://nhl.speedera.net/futures/cssrankings/2005midterm/naskaters.pdf

    Evan McGrath , Wes O' Neill etc are also players that started early in the previous draft very high and look what happened to them in their draft year and position..

    So I am not sure ... scouts do not like his game at least CSB that is ...
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2005
  24. LaLaLaprise

    LaLaLaprise lalalaprise -twitter

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    The Messenger...LP Martin is hurt. And i dont think Latendresse is playing with Brassard.
     
  25. Jason MacIsaac

    Jason MacIsaac Registered User

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    Central Scouting is allways off on a few players. They seem to like raw strong forwards rather then skilled ones.
     
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