Post-Game Talk: Pre-Season | Game 4 | Sharks 3 @ Canucks 2 OT
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Is he though? He runs around and looks busy, but everything dies on his stick and his d-zone awareness isn't as great as people claim. Hits are nice, but his aren't big or game-changing, they're just stat lines. If he were on a sub million dollar contract and playing as the 13th forward, then sure, we could use him against the heavier teams, but man, I'm sick of seeing him in the lineup every night with his momentum killing shifts.
Callhee
Embrace the hate.
- Aug 24, 2009
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Was at the game, some thoughts:
Stecher - was smooth as silk, the most dynamic defensemen on our roster. Was invisible in the defensive zone, which is pretty good for a defensemen.
Dorset and Etem - were both largely ineffective. Dorset was able to use his speed to some effect but his obvious lack of IQ and skill holds him back. Etem was just hopeless, can't see how he isn't cut.
Gaunce - was solid, an extremely smart and tenacious forechecker, was able to break up several rushes with timing and an active stick. Bad change in OT on the game winning goal though.
Edler - was physically dominant, steady, waited a little too long to shoot on the PP though.
Biega - mixed bag, tried hard to be a dynamic offensive presence but seems to make the wrong decision most of the time. The Sharks first goal was a goal scoring opportunity that he fumbled and it went the other way and in the net. Definitely below Stecher on the ladder IMHO.
Juolevi - makes a lot of extremely smart decisions, saw him break up several chances with simple active stick, and had it moving in the other direction right away. Physically outmatched in the corners though, but definitely see great potential in this pick. Still think he is and will be a significantly more impactful player then Tkachuk.
Labate - wheverer there was after the whistle activity, he would be at the center of it. Made several big hits, not terrible cycljng the puck either.
Rendulic - continues to surprise me with his decent hands, good speed and size. Not ready for the NHL, but there is something here, excited to see what Travis Green can do with him in Utica.
Ruutu - made several big hits, skated miles, but like some said, I don't see him being signed.
Megna, Sheppard - warm bodies, Sheppard especially was completely invisible.
Horvat - a huge upgrade on that line, over Granlund, one of the best forwards on either team tonight. Although, I would like to see him improve in the dot, to get possession for his line. His line had one extremely dominant shift, but had trouble cycling due to Baertschi's lack of effort this game.
Baertschi - weakest player on his line by far, probably in preseason mode, but would like to see more from him. Made some good passes though. We will probably see him improve as the regular season starts.
Rodin - another great night for him, clicked with bo and bae. His ability to come out of board battles with the puck greatly lightens Bo's load. Definitely have him penciled in on 2RW over Virtanen, his puck retrieval ability is underrated.
Miller - decent night for him, but he needs to stop playing the puck, passed to the opposition multiple times, putting his defensemen in trouble on multiple occasions.
Stecher - was smooth as silk, the most dynamic defensemen on our roster. Was invisible in the defensive zone, which is pretty good for a defensemen.
Dorset and Etem - were both largely ineffective. Dorset was able to use his speed to some effect but his obvious lack of IQ and skill holds him back. Etem was just hopeless, can't see how he isn't cut.
Gaunce - was solid, an extremely smart and tenacious forechecker, was able to break up several rushes with timing and an active stick. Bad change in OT on the game winning goal though.
Edler - was physically dominant, steady, waited a little too long to shoot on the PP though.
Biega - mixed bag, tried hard to be a dynamic offensive presence but seems to make the wrong decision most of the time. The Sharks first goal was a goal scoring opportunity that he fumbled and it went the other way and in the net. Definitely below Stecher on the ladder IMHO.
Juolevi - makes a lot of extremely smart decisions, saw him break up several chances with simple active stick, and had it moving in the other direction right away. Physically outmatched in the corners though, but definitely see great potential in this pick. Still think he is and will be a significantly more impactful player then Tkachuk.
Labate - wheverer there was after the whistle activity, he would be at the center of it. Made several big hits, not terrible cycljng the puck either.
Rendulic - continues to surprise me with his decent hands, good speed and size. Not ready for the NHL, but there is something here, excited to see what Travis Green can do with him in Utica.
Ruutu - made several big hits, skated miles, but like some said, I don't see him being signed.
Megna, Sheppard - warm bodies, Sheppard especially was completely invisible.
Horvat - a huge upgrade on that line, over Granlund, one of the best forwards on either team tonight. Although, I would like to see him improve in the dot, to get possession for his line. His line had one extremely dominant shift, but had trouble cycling due to Baertschi's lack of effort this game.
Baertschi - weakest player on his line by far, probably in preseason mode, but would like to see more from him. Made some good passes though. We will probably see him improve as the regular season starts.
Rodin - another great night for him, clicked with bo and bae. His ability to come out of board battles with the puck greatly lightens Bo's load. Definitely have him penciled in on 2RW over Virtanen, his puck retrieval ability is underrated.
Miller - decent night for him, but he needs to stop playing the puck, passed to the opposition multiple times, putting his defensemen in trouble on multiple occasions.
Mr. Canucklehead
Kitimat Canuck
^Dorsett has a role, too - he's a decent fourth liner. I still feel that. He's a gifted skater who works very hard and is willing to go with anyone. The problem is that that type of player should make about $1+ million less a year, and probably see less than ten minutes of ice time a night. Certainly no special teams / overtime ice time.
BloatedGuppy
Registered User
Seems pointless to talk about the veterans. Veterans seldom get up to much in the preseason and usually seem content to use it as a warm-up to work out the kinks in their game. Lots of motions being gone through. Let's hope that's the case with Baertschi, because he looked pretty woeful tonight. Shades of the player we saw at the beginning of last year. Lost every single puck battle he had.
The bubble guys...
STETCHER - I thought he played a super high-impact game. It wasn't all perfect, but you noticed the guy almost every time he was on the ice. Shows some zip and offensive creativity. You have to think this strong showing is ultimately going to make a similar (and thus far more problematic) player in Subban expendable. You can never have too many good prospects, but you might actually be able to have too many pint-sized swashbuckling offensive defensemen. Stetcher is probably too raw and too risky to get anything more than a cup of coffee with the big club this year, and his waiver situation almost cements that fate, but lord he isn't making the decision easy for anyone.
LABATE - Busted his butt on every shift and was almost always doing something productive or helpful. Looked like the very picture of the prototypical 4th line energy winger, which is exactly the job he should have his sights set on. Unfortunately, there's some aging garbage in his way.
RUUTU - Also looked decent, although it needs to be kept in mind he's a desperate veteran, not a shiny kid taking his first steps on NHL ice. Made some nice little veteran plays, a blocked shot here, an agitated opponent there. His goal was a gorgeous snipe. Probably too small and too slow to realistically make a bid for a lineup spot though.
ETEM - An absolute ghost tonight. He better have some tricks up his sleeve for the remaining games. I realize he just had a kid, but the clock is running on this guy.
PEDAN - Still seems to have troubles pivoting and dealing with faster forwards. Looked like an unhinged lunatic during his fight, which is refreshing, but still seems like he might be a bit too raw for NHL duty. Big, offensively challenged bottom pairing defensemen are ideally steady, and I'm not sure he's there yet.
BIEGA - Speaking of steady, I still like Biega's game. He skates very well and battles hard. Was the victim of some ill timed penalties tonight but I think he has a far more NHL ready game then most of his competition.
JUOLEVI - Not really a "bubble guy" as his return to juniors was as sure a thing as sure things get, but I liked what I saw of his game in flashes tonight. You can see the offensive instincts and creativity are there, but he needs time to adapt to the speed of the pro game and another 2-3 years worth of muscle on his scrawny frame. A long term project but I think the ceiling is super high.
RODIN - Seems dangerous every time he has the puck in a scoring position. Has made a few nice plays with very little time and space, passes and shoots the puck extremely quickly. His feet, however, need to catch up to his hands. He looks sluggish, and easily gassed. Clearly still needs time to get accustomed to NHL action. If he makes the roster, and he almost certainly will, his minutes are going to need to be carefully managed.
DORSETT - Not a bubble guy but probably should be. Everyone is piling on, and as a veteran we should probably expect very little from Dorsett in these games, but as a marginal veteran with a lot of young players knocking at the door coming off a league-bottom finish Dorsett should be looking to make a statement. He was useless in almost every facet of the game. Fudged his offensive looks, was ineffective defensively, and got turned inside-out in his pointless momentum draining fight. Dorsett did a lot more to earn his ridiculous contract than Sbisa did...he was actually pretty decent the season he signed it. Close to 30 points, fightin' all the time, skating hard. Since that time he's been an absolute void, and he's starting to get in the way of younger, cheaper, better players already. Frustrating.
GAUNCE - Had some issues later in the game but early on especially I thought he looked good almost every time he had an opportunity to make a difference. Seems to be using his big frame with a lot more authority than last season. Would be nice to assess this player without two players playing dreadful hockey sagging on either side of him.
Given our coach already treats Baertschi and Horvat like an old married couple, I'd rather see Rodin playing elsewhere in the lineup. Perhaps on Sutter's wing, or Granlund, or Gaunce. I've always liked Virtanen on that line because his speed and north/south game gives Horvat both a net front presence and someone speedy to work with off the rush.
The bubble guys...
STETCHER - I thought he played a super high-impact game. It wasn't all perfect, but you noticed the guy almost every time he was on the ice. Shows some zip and offensive creativity. You have to think this strong showing is ultimately going to make a similar (and thus far more problematic) player in Subban expendable. You can never have too many good prospects, but you might actually be able to have too many pint-sized swashbuckling offensive defensemen. Stetcher is probably too raw and too risky to get anything more than a cup of coffee with the big club this year, and his waiver situation almost cements that fate, but lord he isn't making the decision easy for anyone.
LABATE - Busted his butt on every shift and was almost always doing something productive or helpful. Looked like the very picture of the prototypical 4th line energy winger, which is exactly the job he should have his sights set on. Unfortunately, there's some aging garbage in his way.
RUUTU - Also looked decent, although it needs to be kept in mind he's a desperate veteran, not a shiny kid taking his first steps on NHL ice. Made some nice little veteran plays, a blocked shot here, an agitated opponent there. His goal was a gorgeous snipe. Probably too small and too slow to realistically make a bid for a lineup spot though.
ETEM - An absolute ghost tonight. He better have some tricks up his sleeve for the remaining games. I realize he just had a kid, but the clock is running on this guy.
PEDAN - Still seems to have troubles pivoting and dealing with faster forwards. Looked like an unhinged lunatic during his fight, which is refreshing, but still seems like he might be a bit too raw for NHL duty. Big, offensively challenged bottom pairing defensemen are ideally steady, and I'm not sure he's there yet.
BIEGA - Speaking of steady, I still like Biega's game. He skates very well and battles hard. Was the victim of some ill timed penalties tonight but I think he has a far more NHL ready game then most of his competition.
JUOLEVI - Not really a "bubble guy" as his return to juniors was as sure a thing as sure things get, but I liked what I saw of his game in flashes tonight. You can see the offensive instincts and creativity are there, but he needs time to adapt to the speed of the pro game and another 2-3 years worth of muscle on his scrawny frame. A long term project but I think the ceiling is super high.
RODIN - Seems dangerous every time he has the puck in a scoring position. Has made a few nice plays with very little time and space, passes and shoots the puck extremely quickly. His feet, however, need to catch up to his hands. He looks sluggish, and easily gassed. Clearly still needs time to get accustomed to NHL action. If he makes the roster, and he almost certainly will, his minutes are going to need to be carefully managed.
DORSETT - Not a bubble guy but probably should be. Everyone is piling on, and as a veteran we should probably expect very little from Dorsett in these games, but as a marginal veteran with a lot of young players knocking at the door coming off a league-bottom finish Dorsett should be looking to make a statement. He was useless in almost every facet of the game. Fudged his offensive looks, was ineffective defensively, and got turned inside-out in his pointless momentum draining fight. Dorsett did a lot more to earn his ridiculous contract than Sbisa did...he was actually pretty decent the season he signed it. Close to 30 points, fightin' all the time, skating hard. Since that time he's been an absolute void, and he's starting to get in the way of younger, cheaper, better players already. Frustrating.
GAUNCE - Had some issues later in the game but early on especially I thought he looked good almost every time he had an opportunity to make a difference. Seems to be using his big frame with a lot more authority than last season. Would be nice to assess this player without two players playing dreadful hockey sagging on either side of him.
Given our coach already treats Baertschi and Horvat like an old married couple, I'd rather see Rodin playing elsewhere in the lineup. Perhaps on Sutter's wing, or Granlund, or Gaunce. I've always liked Virtanen on that line because his speed and north/south game gives Horvat both a net front presence and someone speedy to work with off the rush.
biturbo19
Registered User
- Jul 13, 2010
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Agree that Gaunce was a bit underwhelming tonight. He wasn't bad by any stretch...but completely blended into the woodwork outside of one really nice shot. Which is the issue with Gaunce really. Tonight he looked less like a guy who deserves to be on the team. Capable of playing in the NHL, absolutely...but when he can still go down to Utica without waivers, that threat always has to be looming, and the intensity and engagement have to always stay up at max.
As far as Miller playing the puck...It's preseason. He's actually a pretty useful puckhandler to have back there in normal circumstances. But with the lineup a revolving door from night to night, it's no surprise he's made a bunch of strange gaffes. Most of them seem to come when not on the same page as a young/new player he's not familiar with - a bit of a theme.
I'm not worried about it come the real season. He'll get things sorted out and get used to the guys who are actually going to be playing with him.
In the meantime, he's going to continue to have goofy moments with the puckhandling. It happens.
WTG
December 5th
His possession metrics aren't much better then a enforcer, and his sub 20 points are easily replaced. Cracknell last year out preformed Dorsett IMO, and this year he's getting out preformed by both Silke and Ruutu.
Whoever is paired with Dorsett their possession numbers absolutely tank.
But you are right, as a guy that gets paid 1m 2-way he'd be pretty decent.
Shareefruck
Registered User
Seriously, the fact that Rodin's weakness seems to be his skating so far and that he's actually good at board battles is super promising, considering that the former was one of his few dynamic strengths initially and before the injury and the latter was the only real deal-breaking concern.
When he gets back up to speed, he should be among the best skaters on the team.
When he gets back up to speed, he should be among the best skaters on the team.
Cupless44
Registered User
- Jun 25, 2014
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RobertKron
Registered User
- Sep 1, 2007
- 15,521
- 8,665
I'm not sure I'm enthused about a line where Hansen is basically the puck distributor, but given the personnel available this likely makes the most sense.
WTG
December 5th
Honestly, I think the biggest deterrence against dirty play is having a good PP.
If teams are afraid to take penalties against you then they back off.
Having Dorsett in the line up as a deterrent against tough teams just isn't worth it.
If teams are afraid to take penalties against you then they back off.
Having Dorsett in the line up as a deterrent against tough teams just isn't worth it.
Result is irrelevant ... not a terribly exciting game but some good stuff happened and a few good performances.
- was Rodin's best game. Puck followed him around all night and he looks like a player. Was better than Baertschi on that line. Horvat had dangerous moments but has another gear yet.
- Gaunce was excellent again despite crap linemates. Noticeable all night, so good on forecheck and breaking up passes. Etem was a ghost - insipid performance for a guy on the bubble. Dorsett ... ugh, go away. Did nothing all night. Pointless fight. Overplayed. Waste of space.
- Labate and Ruutu both had good games. Perhaps Ruutu has more in the tank than I thought. Labate has had a great camp and CB hopefully build on it in Utica and earn a callup this year. Megna has been disappointing this preseason - expected more from a guy on a one-way deal.
- like Labate, Rendulic has had a good camp and looks like a decent callup option. Sheppard works hard but is skating in sand. Just not quick enough. Wish there was a stat for board battles won because Zalewski would be off the charts - as unflashy as it gets but constantly gaining possession for his team.
- Stecher was very good again, generated lots of offence 5-on-5. Doesn't look nearly as polished on the PP as Larsen but more dangerous at ES.
- Tanev had a huge game, was terrific especially with a teenager next to him. Juolevi is positionally sound and makes a good first pass but is tentative, lacks upper body strength, and could use some work on his first step. Probably time for him to go down.
- Pedan occasionally looks impressive but processes the game too slowly and struggles moving the puck. Biega worked hard but was a bit sloppy at times.
- Miller was ... ok. Not much to say there.
- was Rodin's best game. Puck followed him around all night and he looks like a player. Was better than Baertschi on that line. Horvat had dangerous moments but has another gear yet.
- Gaunce was excellent again despite crap linemates. Noticeable all night, so good on forecheck and breaking up passes. Etem was a ghost - insipid performance for a guy on the bubble. Dorsett ... ugh, go away. Did nothing all night. Pointless fight. Overplayed. Waste of space.
- Labate and Ruutu both had good games. Perhaps Ruutu has more in the tank than I thought. Labate has had a great camp and CB hopefully build on it in Utica and earn a callup this year. Megna has been disappointing this preseason - expected more from a guy on a one-way deal.
- like Labate, Rendulic has had a good camp and looks like a decent callup option. Sheppard works hard but is skating in sand. Just not quick enough. Wish there was a stat for board battles won because Zalewski would be off the charts - as unflashy as it gets but constantly gaining possession for his team.
- Stecher was very good again, generated lots of offence 5-on-5. Doesn't look nearly as polished on the PP as Larsen but more dangerous at ES.
- Tanev had a huge game, was terrific especially with a teenager next to him. Juolevi is positionally sound and makes a good first pass but is tentative, lacks upper body strength, and could use some work on his first step. Probably time for him to go down.
- Pedan occasionally looks impressive but processes the game too slowly and struggles moving the puck. Biega worked hard but was a bit sloppy at times.
- Miller was ... ok. Not much to say there.
Sedin sedin Erkisson
Baertchi Bo Rodin
Granlund Gaunce Labate
Burrows Sutter Hansen
Dorset
Edler Tanev
Hutty Goober
Sbisa Stretchy
Trammer Biega
Marky
Millsy
Baertchi Bo Rodin
Granlund Gaunce Labate
Burrows Sutter Hansen
Dorset
Edler Tanev
Hutty Goober
Sbisa Stretchy
Trammer Biega
Marky
Millsy
Callhee
Embrace the hate.
- Aug 24, 2009
- 942
- 76
Personally, I prefer Rodin on this line because of his ability to win board battles, and cycle more effectively. I don't quite remember how Virtanen fares in this regard, but I get the feeling we will see them competing for this spot soon enough.
Stecher is our #5 already. That didn't take long. He's so smart in all zones. Really didn't expect this from him.
We have to be realistic with Willie as our coach - Dorsett will be in the lineup and Labate will not play ahead of him.
TruGr1t
Proper Villain
- Jun 26, 2003
- 23,386
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Also he's shaping up to be perhaps our most effective winger after the top line. Rodin may well be better than Baertschi if he stays healthy.
I think this was more true his first season than his second season. I don't know if it was the contract extension or what but I thought he was mailing it in a lot more often last year.
Last year the only positive I could think to say about him was that he was better than Prust. I would waive him right now frankly and go with Zalewski or someone.
Soups On
Registered User
- Apr 27, 2012
- 3,797
- 2,017
Ended up only watching the first 30 minutes due to a family dinner so I can't comment in the last half of the game. Gonna leave some comments on a few players.
Pedan used his skating to open up some ice and enter the fray which is something I think he's pretty good at. Did like how he was shoving people by the boards and actually gaining possession (take note Sbisa). I would like to see him not take a 10 minute misconduct and get more ice time. It's only preseason but I like him a lot more than last season.
Zalewski is a great option for a 4th liner. He always seems to win board battles and get possession, especially in the offensive zone.
Gaunce had that post but I thought he was really good on the forecheck too. His positioning in all 3 zones is really good. Even if he's not scoring, he's a player that can make an impact.
Baertschi had some good looks in the first period but after that kinda dialed away. Not too worried about him though.
Rodin... I've been rooting for him for a long time and it's awesome to see and hear him put up another really good game. It'll be really exciting once his skating is back.
Etem was not noticeable in the slightest. Really needs to up his game or he's gone. Disappointing effort.
Juolevi had some really sweet passes and the poise he demonstrates is great for an 18 year old. Obviously needs to fill his body out but he's an exciting prospect.
Pedan used his skating to open up some ice and enter the fray which is something I think he's pretty good at. Did like how he was shoving people by the boards and actually gaining possession (take note Sbisa). I would like to see him not take a 10 minute misconduct and get more ice time. It's only preseason but I like him a lot more than last season.
Zalewski is a great option for a 4th liner. He always seems to win board battles and get possession, especially in the offensive zone.
Gaunce had that post but I thought he was really good on the forecheck too. His positioning in all 3 zones is really good. Even if he's not scoring, he's a player that can make an impact.
Baertschi had some good looks in the first period but after that kinda dialed away. Not too worried about him though.
Rodin... I've been rooting for him for a long time and it's awesome to see and hear him put up another really good game. It'll be really exciting once his skating is back.
Etem was not noticeable in the slightest. Really needs to up his game or he's gone. Disappointing effort.
Juolevi had some really sweet passes and the poise he demonstrates is great for an 18 year old. Obviously needs to fill his body out but he's an exciting prospect.
BenningHurtsMySoul
Unfair Huggy Bear
Zalewski has quietly had a good preseason. The guy is so underrated, he's positionally sound and great along the boards.
biturbo19
Registered User
- Jul 13, 2010
- 25,957
- 11,019
This is where i really think Hansen would be the best fit alongside Bae-Bo. Hansen is a master of what that Bae-Bo duo really needs in terms of puck-retrieval and cycling effectively.
Which would indeed put Rodin on his own line. Though with Sutter, i'm still not sure how that's going to work, as "terrific puck distributor" just isn't part of Sutter's repertoire.
Which is where i like the idea of a Granlund-Rodin duo as a #3c type line that would give them both at least one skilled linemate to work with.
Though it could be tough to legitimately get the minutes sorted between all 4 centers, with enough leftover for that 4th unit to play a real skill game like that.
Maybe something like:
Bae - Bo - Hansen
Gaunce - Sutter - Burrows
Virtanen/Dorsett - Granlund - Rodin
or if Gaunce does tail off again, or can't keep the pace and intensity up when shifted to the wing...
Bae - Bo - Hansen
Burrows - Sutter - Dorsett
Virtanen - Granlund - Rodin
Looking forward to seeing how some of these guys actually look together on the ice though. I'd like to see Gaunce with Rodin in particular, as well as Gaunce on the Wing with Sutter. Play Gaunce in every single preseason game i guess.
Soups On
Registered User
- Apr 27, 2012
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Definitely. Really like his speed and understanding of the game too. Both he and Labate have outshone Dorsett and Etem.
Wonder how on the bubble Etem is at this point. Remember last year Vey was waived and sent to Utica after a poor pre-season. Took a lot of us by surprise considering his WillieD Golden Boy status and his 1M contract; Etem getting the same treatment would be less surprising.
BenningHurtsMySoul
Unfair Huggy Bear
Dorsett is a useless plug, has been since he got that contract. He has the occasional nice shot or burst of speed but the majority of his time on the ice is spent scrumming at ill-advised times and acting like a heavyweight.
Etem...blegh. Just nothing there. He's like David Booth without the physical tools.
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