Post-Game Talk: | Pens vs Jets | Shootout win | I hate day games

[Tender Rip]

What time is it in China?

Well, it was 4AM... so, stupid .


Winning/losing does funny things to the mind and how you evaluate.
There were many things not to like in this one, and ultimately quite a few to like as well.

Like liking Jarry (duh!), the push-back to deal with adversity, knocks and having trailed throughout, Matheson being a straight up stud these days, Geno's line ES for the majority, the LOL's on Carter's goal and of course appreciating what a giant horse shoe we had up our ass in this one.

On the negative side of things, you cannot escape that this was an utter abomination for the PP. The first PP against the Kings was similar, and CDS allowed a softie due to another SH breakaway against Otttawa, but at least in the other games the PP collected/corrected itself.

In this one it was all-out stupidity from the nr.1 group all the time. Geno and Sid are both guilty of attempting too many and too obvious cross ice passes. Geno more so than Sid on the PP, and the more dangerous because he plays the point. Sid adds to the discontent by completely dogging it on most the occasions the puck was lost.
The PP right now is first line plus Malkin and Letang. That's fine for talent, but if you agree that the 1st line has its issues when it comes to battling for pucks and you add the two biggest risk takers on the roster to that.... then you are to some extent asking for it. We will be in trouble with breakaway's and shorties if Malkin is on the point - and more so with Letang being ultra aggressive like that.
Geno does not have the speed to cover for these situations, never mind if it is his pass causing a breakaway or that of someone else.
As an aside, other than that great move where he almost won it in OT, you also see that his declining speed is a real problem 3 on 3. At the very least in those situations you have to play him with a D-man who skates fast, meaning Letang, Matheson or Marino. Never Dumoulin. Otherwise you are begging to not have the puck.

Anyway, lets not forget the nr. 1 reason the PP looked a complete sieve in this game, which is the same reason that numerous times there was suddenly a blue ocean for Winnipeg in transition 5 on 5 as well. Kris Letang!
What an amazingly moronic game from him! Just absolutely no accept for structure or picking his spots in this one and it was like it got progressively worse during the game. I really hope they strap him to a chair to watch this game as the first reply to whatever salary demand he makes for a new deal . I mean, I love Letang, but he makes it really hard some times!

Letang's adventures makes it difficult for Dumoulin too of course, but it doesn't help when Dumo himself has a poor game also. He did, and he has had a few of those recently. That pairing then contributes to the first lines troubles, because they play so much together, and it was all Jarry that they didn't concede several more.

Matheson.... awesome game. Again. Interesting also as many noted that he played a lot with Marino in this one. Sullivan is riding him more and he should, and I think it is more that than being dissatisfied with Petterson who is much better this year than last where we ritually slaughtered him (for good reason).

Hope Blueger is OK. He is important for us in many ways. But hopefully he and Jarry can both get a rest when Arizona comes to town. We should really beat them no matter what.

 

[MrBurghundy]

Honestly, thank god for TJ today. Dude's been a beast all year long.

I'm really rooting for him to translate it to the playoffs. I think this year may be different for him than last with all of his accumulated experience.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Well, it was 4AM... so, stupid .


Winning/losing does funny things to the mind and how you evaluate.
There were many things not to like in this one, and ultimately quite a few to like as well.

Like liking Jarry (duh!), the push-back to deal with adversity, knocks and having trailed throughout, Matheson being a straight up stud these days, Geno's line ES for the majority, the LOL's on Carter's goal and of course appreciating what a giant horse shoe we had up our ass in this one.

On the negative side of things, you cannot escape that this was an utter abomination for the PP. The first PP against the Kings was similar, and CDS allowed a softie due to another SH breakaway against Otttawa, but at least in the other games the PP collected/corrected itself.

In this one it was all-out stupidity from the nr.1 group all the time. Geno and Sid are both guilty of attempting too many and too obvious cross ice passes. Geno more so than Sid on the PP, and the more dangerous because he plays the point. Sid adds to the discontent by completely dogging it on most the occasions the puck was lost.
The PP right now is first line plus Malkin and Letang. That's fine for talent, but if you agree that the 1st line has its issues when it comes to battling for pucks and you add the two biggest risk takers on the roster to that.... then you are to some extent asking for it. We will be in trouble with breakaway's and shorties if Malkin is on the point - and more so with Letang being ultra aggressive like that.
Geno does not have the speed to cover for these situations, never mind if it is his pass causing a breakaway or that of someone else.
As an aside, other than that great move where he almost won it in OT, you also see that his declining speed is a real problem 3 on 3. At the very least in those situations you have to play him with a D-man who skates fast, meaning Letang, Matheson or Marino. Never Dumoulin. Otherwise you are begging to not have the puck.

Anyway, lets not forget the nr. 1 reason the PP looked a complete sieve in this game, which is the same reason that numerous times there was suddenly a blue ocean for Winnipeg in transition 5 on 5 as well. Kris Letang!
What an amazingly moronic game from him! Just absolutely no accept for structure or picking his spots in this one and it was like it got progressively worse during the game. I really hope they strap him to a chair to watch this game as the first reply to whatever salary demand he makes for a new deal . I mean, I love Letang, but he makes it really hard some times!

Letang's adventures makes it difficult for Dumoulin too of course, but it doesn't help when Dumo himself has a poor game also. He did, and he has had a few of those recently. That pairing then contributes to the first lines troubles, because they play so much together, and it was all Jarry that they didn't concede several more.

Matheson.... awesome game. Again. Interesting also as many noted that he played a lot with Marino in this one. Sullivan is riding him more and he should, and I think it is more that than being dissatisfied with Petterson who is much better this year than last where we ritually slaughtered him (for good reason).

Hope Blueger is OK. He is important for us in many ways. But hopefully he and Jarry can both get a rest when Arizona comes to town. We should really beat them no matter what.

Regarding the PP I brought up similar concerns and proposed a solution in the salary cap thread.

Would like your thoughts on if it would work.

I should clarify that Rust would be the sacrifice in that scenario. I realize he's been good lately on the unit, but there's only 5 spots and he can't/shouldn't play the point.

Something has to change.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Honestly, thank god for TJ today. Dude's been a beast all year long.

I'm really rooting for him to translate it to the playoffs. I think this year may be different for him than last with all of his accumulated experience.

Honestly believe crowd capacity had an impact on his focus. They played without crowds most of the year, then later partially filled buildings.

Then there were full houses in the playoffs suddenly and Long Island was pretty hostile. The pressure was too much.

This year is different. We have crowds all year. It won't be such a big mental adjustment.

 

[KrisLeturnover]

Jarry's triple pump at the end got me absolutely gas'd

 

[KrisLetAngry]

Jarry's triple pump at the end got me absolutely gas'd

You know he knew that he was MVP and the best player that ice surface that game.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Why no term? We want a back up for the next two years to give Lindberg time in the A.

Mostly to allow the Pens to find a better option without being tied to one if it doesn't work out well.

But that might be tough too. Not sure what the options would be to be honest.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Jarry's triple pump at the end got me absolutely gas'd

He's about that GTL life.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

You know he knew that he was MVP and the best player that ice surface that game.

Jarry seems the type of lad that probably is just happy to be helping his team and would rather be back at his farm with his fiancé doing regular things. He always comes across as really quiet and kind of shy. It's awesome to see him go to his second All Star game in 3 years.

I just hope this team holds up and so does he in the playoffs.

He's just a good person.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Also because it warrants needing to be seen again...

 

[Tender Rip]

Regarding the PP I brought up similar concerns and proposed a solution in the salary cap thread.

Would like your thoughts on if it would work.

I should clarify that Rust would be the sacrifice in that scenario. I realize he's been good lately on the unit, but there's only 5 spots and he can't/shouldn't play the point.

Something has to change.

Don’t have a solution other than our stars recognizing do’s and dont’s, tbh.

Yes Malkin would be better off the right wall, but without him there is no deep threat from the points, and Sid seems unwilling to play the down low role after his concussions.

Our three most talented scorers are all LH shots so with Carter not looking like the right fit for the unit (gets even slower even if he adds some needed size), we’re down to Rust end Erod.

We don’t have a dynamic net front/down low precense for the 1st unit.

So basically, unless a real upgrade is acquired for the left wall, net front or right point, I think the best we can do is implore our guys to be smarter. Starting with Letang understanding that he is D first, and Geno/Sid going behind the net when the play isn’t there rather than attempt 50/50 cross ice passes.

I don’t think we have better player solutions as such.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Don’t have a solution other than our stars recognizing do’s and dont’s, tbh.

Yes Malkin would be better off the right wall, but without him there is no deep threat from the points, and Sid seems unwilling to play the down low role after his concussions.

Our three most talented scorers are all LH shots so with Carter not looking like the right fit for the unit (gets even slower even if he adds some needed size), we’re down to Rust end Erod.

We don’t have a dynamic net front/down low precense for the 1st unit.

So basically, unless a real upgrade is acquired for the left wall, net front or right point, I think the best we can do is implore our guys to be smarter. Starting with Letang understanding that he is D first, and Geno said going behind the net rather than attempt 50/50 cross ice passes.

I don’t think we have better player solutions as such.

I'd argue with the way Matheson is playing he is a point threat though. He is shooting quite accurately this year, and there is some heat on his slapper. Worth testing imo. My concern more would be his chemistry with the top guys. That's an unknown.
He could also be a big asset with controlled zone entries. The confidence has never been higher.

I mentioned Sid being left-wall in that scenario, not necessarily down low. It's just the flip side of where he normally plays. I guess he'd hover there when needed, but he'd more confident with the puck with long range playmaking than Rust. Him being the wrong handedness got off-set by him being a threat from the left side that we aren't used to having over the years, when Kessel wasn't around. For whatever reason it worked very well last year when they did it. Sid was nailing seam passes and the opponents boxes were stretched until they lost their structure.
I liked the look a lot. Sid's pass completion rate went up. We were less predictable.

ERod getting stripped of the job is unfortunate, because he brought a simplicity and ranged threat from the left wall. Having a one-timer option there was refreshing, and highly effective. He'd be my first choice, but it's not gonna happen.
Carter definitely didn't work. His playmaking is pretty poor and he doesn't really have the wheels for retrievals to prevent clears. His long range shot was either neutralized or he just didn't wanna use it much. If his shot's not gonna be a weapon then he has no reason to be on that unit outside of faceoffs.
Kapanen was a little disappointing in that role too.

I don't like the idea of removing Rust from the unit but if the ends would justify the means? Our blue line passing would get safer. We'd have an easier time accessing the zone. There would be more protection against PK units going on offense, since Math can skate like the wind. We'd get a new look from the blue line that opponents aren't used to. Matheson would make unexpected activations into the slot.
I think it'd be an interesting experiment.

Yes, us not having a good net-front guy is problematic, but I've given up on them trying to do something about that. Crosby would be great at it, but they won't use him that way. You'd be sacrificing his passing too.
At least Jake provides good short range passing there and is deft at deflections and finding quiet areas.

 

[Flying Dego]

Also because it warrants needing to be seen again...

Back in the Murray/Jarry debate days I felt like you and I were the few that raved for Jarry while the majority called him a hot streak guy and wanted to stick with the guy that couldn't keep his head right.

The playoffs hit and he blew it bad. I lost a lot of confidence in him and thought I'd understand them trading him or figured at least they bring in a vet backup (still need this). Fast forward to today and I'm stunned at this guy's mental focus. How many goalies could salvage themselves like that?

 

[Peat]

Back in the Murray/Jarry debate days I felt like you and I were the few that raved for Jarry while the majority called him a hot streak guy and wanted to stick with the guy that couldn't keep his head right.

The playoffs hit and he blew it bad. I lost a lot of confidence in him and thought I'd understand them trading him or figured at least they bring in a vet backup (still need this). Fast forward to today and I'm stunned at this guy's mental focus. How many goalies could salvage themselves like that?

It's not that unusual when you look it up. As this Post-Gazette article pointed out, 9 of the top 15 goalies by post-season wins started their post-season career with a .900 series, with 6 worse than Jarry. Jonathan Quick did worse in his first post-season then won a Conn Smythe two years later. Carey Price and Rask both unraveled in the second series of their first post-season. Seems that first post-season is an absolute pressure-cooker.

Just got to bring it this time...

 

[Arianne]

Jarry is a mutant.

 

[wgknestrick]

Pens keep winning despite themselves (minus Jarry). It is critical to bank these points now to prepare for March's schedule.

Crosby had a typical Crosby game where he+his line didn't do much of anything for long stretches, gets scored on at 5v5, looked lazy at times, looked good for a couple of shifts, then wins the game in OT/shootout. We all know what they are capable of and its more than this. He and his line have been our lowest xGF% line for many of the last 4-5 games, and it's a concerning trend despite it not currently costing PIT games.



I never thought this would be a fair comparison (with both playing so well this year) but...

2021-2022
Letang vs Matheson

Our bottom 6 is currently crushing teams and Matheson the reason we win so many games when the top 6 is busy coasting off the ice behind the play. Mikey Math is where that all starts.
^It's probably Jarry though^.

 

[wgknestrick]

It's not that unusual when you look it up. As this Post-Gazette article pointed out, 9 of the top 15 goalies by post-season wins started their post-season career with a .900 series, with 6 worse than Jarry. Jonathan Quick did worse in his first post-season then won a Conn Smythe two years later. Carey Price and Rask both unraveled in the second series of their first post-season. Seems that first post-season is an absolute pressure-cooker.

Just got to bring it this time...

I think it was a wake up call to Jarry to improve areas of his game, and he did. When was the last time you saw him fall backwards after a shot or missed shot? He was doing it 3-4 times a game early season and we all know it's a horrible habit. He also seemed to improve his breakaway stops (in that he's actually making them now) too. A break away on him in the early season seemed to be a goal 70% of the time. He deserves a ton of credit and should be a 3rd finalist for the Vezina, but Shesterkin basically has it wrapped up.

 

[wgknestrick]

Imagine being a fan/broadcaster for a team that got away with an uncalled head shot and another board with nothing called and still arguing the refs cost you the game. It's like you're a Caps fan.

These are the people who run and ref the NHL, unfortunately.

 

[ColePens]

Remember when everyone hated jarry? Ahhh those were the days... Those were the days.... Good times.

I would caution this mindset. Typically fans are not patient enough but the answer is somewhere in the middle.

1) Jarry (and now Sully) has playoff demons to face. We saw this with MAF before. MAF would be elite all season and then hot mess in the postseason. Patience is needed here. Jarry has to face those demons for sure.

2) MAF went years of the playoff woes. Jarry had one bad playoff. I'm willing to be patient. Fans need to be patient, but they typically are not. So while he has those demons, this isn't like a mega issue just yet. Unless he shits the bed again.

 

[spcastlemagic]

Jarry is probably the most technically proficient and consistent goalie in the league - just brilliance from him without it ever looking particularly stressful. In slow-mo, it never looks like he runs out of mobility, always able to stretch just a little more to get a better angle on the puck. He just grabbed another All-Star nod, going to start getting Vezina chatter... all that's left is to prove he can do it in the playoffs. That's a big challenge but I think it's the kid's year. We need to find our structure again and cut down on all the odd man breaks though, I liked it more when we were the most defensively astute team in the league rather than our recent trend.

 

[Gurglesons]

I would caution this mindset. Typically fans are not patient enough but the answer is somewhere in the middle.

1) Jarry (and now Sully) has playoff demons to face. We saw this with MAF before. MAF would be elite all season and then hot mess in the postseason. Patience is needed here. Jarry has to face those demons for sure.

2) MAF went years of the playoff woes. Jarry had one bad playoff. I'm willing to be patient. Fans need to be patient, but they typically are not. So while he has those demons, this isn't like a mega issue just yet. Unless he shits the bed again.

Jarry does have a pedigree of a big time playoff guy in junior.

 

[ColePens]

Jarry does have a pedigree of a big time playoff guy in junior.

I do not think it matters at all. Goalies have an insane job and it's the most insane "What have you done for me lately" demon.

For the record, I'm not on either side of the fence. I like being patient. But I also think it's clear he has to face those demons in Game 1 of the playoffs. And I also think it's clear that it doesn't matter. Even MAF, who struggled for like 6 years, came through CLUTCH in 2017.

So my take - be patient and let's see. Let's watch it.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I would caution this mindset. Typically fans are not patient enough but the answer is somewhere in the middle.

1) Jarry (and now Sully) has playoff demons to face. We saw this with MAF before. MAF would be elite all season and then hot mess in the postseason. Patience is needed here. Jarry has to face those demons for sure.

2) MAF went years of the playoff woes. Jarry had one bad playoff. I'm willing to be patient. Fans need to be patient, but they typically are not. So while he has those demons, this isn't like a mega issue just yet. Unless he shits the bed again.

Not to harp on this, but being a goalie is such a mental/team thing as well. What's helping Jarry now I think is the confidence he's got from the team. Last year, he was struggling a bit going into the post-season, we were in the middle of the worst parts thus far of the pandemic, and he had lost the net to CDS. Plus, the team is just simply playing better, even on bad days. He was a young dude, in a bad situation and he spiraled. It happens. He's always had lots of legit starter potential, so I'm happy he's back on track.

Secondly, I don't know if Chiodo is a great goalie/goalie development coach or anything yet, but it probably helps having a new perspective there from the top.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Also, my eternal caveat: goalies are fundamentally unstable. The positional guys can get beat if they're not constantly staying sharp and shooters get the book on them. Athletic guys are a groin pull and a slow reaction away from melting down into a puddle of goo. And they're all limited by how good the team is playing in front of them.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Jarry is probably the most technically proficient and consistent goalie in the league - just brilliance from him without it ever looking particularly stressful. In slow-mo, it never looks like he runs out of mobility, always able to stretch just a little more to get a better angle on the puck. He just grabbed another All-Star nod, going to start getting Vezina chatter... all that's left is to prove he can do it in the playoffs. That's a big challenge but I think it's the kid's year. We need to find our structure again and cut down on all the odd man breaks though, I liked it more when we were the most defensively astute team in the league rather than our recent trend.

I think it's important to notice that he's also sort of playing a hybrid style this year; his positioning is WAY better, the rebounds aren't being kicked to the slot, but he's still athletic and making those unorthodox saves when he has to. I don't know if that's down to working with Chiodo or just settling into the NHL game, but credit where credit is due.