Oshawa Generals 2018 Offseason Thread

[NOA]

My ideal lineup is:

F Lines:
Krastenbergs-McShane-Noel
Henderson-Studnicka-Antropov
Huether-Commisso-Wong
McCool-Kohn-MacLean
Others: Hewitson, Resnick, Kadlec

D Pairings:
Brewer-Stillman
Gross-Brassard
Ennis/Allen-Blacker



Those first 3 lines are going to score a ton and that 4th line you can put on the other teams stars and you'll see them get shut down more times than not. I love the balance of that lineup. No knock on Di Carlo, I think he's been great but we have too many young D-men who I don't want to see out of the lineup so he's my odd man out. I'd still keep him around though because Brewer will be gone at U17s in November and Gross will be gone at the World Juniors in Dec/Jan

having a 4th line is overrated in the ohl. sure they can play D and maybe "shutdown" the opposing top 2 lines. But you do realize that means they will play 20-25 mins a night? because that is what opposing 1st/2nd lines play. Your 4th line isnt going to play that much. its a win for the other team if thats what you decide - to roll your 4th line often enough that it takes away shifts from line 1/2

look at london last year. everyone raved about their 3rd /4th lines. Can only play 1 line at a time. Unless you plan on splitting 10-20mins more evenly, 4th lines are not that meaningful. and if you are splitting like that, like london last yr, usually means you dont really have 1 or 2 top lines imo

 

[bobber]

having a 4th line is overrated in the ohl. sure they can play D and maybe "shutdown" the opposing top 2 lines. But you do realize that means they will play 20-25 mins a night? because that is what opposing 1st/2nd lines play. Your 4th line isnt going to play that much. its a win for the other team if thats what you decide - to roll your 4th line often enough that it takes away shifts from line 1/2

look at london last year. everyone raved about their 3rd /4th lines. Can only play 1 line at a time. Unless you plan on splitting 10-20mins more evenly, 4th lines are not that meaningful. and if you are splitting like that, like london last yr, usually means you dont really have 1 or 2 top lines imo

Ottersguy although I appreciate your point of view not many OHL coaches would agree with your " fourth line over rated" comment. Having a good fourth line can help wear down opposing teams that have ran three lines consecutively for two periods. It ill show up huge in the third if the opposing coach fails to respond .

 

[Oshawa8181]

Does anyone know why Noel didn't play the 2nd or 3rd on Sunday? Saw him sitting up in the owners box after the first.

 

[ohloutsider]

Does anyone know why Noel didn't play the 2nd or 3rd on Sunday? Saw him sitting up in the owners box after the first.

Out of the game for a "staged" fight - not sure if he gets more games for that as well.

 

[Generalsupdates]

Out of the game for a "staged" fight - not sure if he gets more games for that as well.

No the "staged fight" was the game before in Owen Sound. Noel played the next night in Oshawa and scored 43 seconds in but left injured after the 1st period

 

[Generalsupdates]

having a 4th line is overrated in the ohl. sure they can play D and maybe "shutdown" the opposing top 2 lines. But you do realize that means they will play 20-25 mins a night? because that is what opposing 1st/2nd lines play. Your 4th line isnt going to play that much. its a win for the other team if thats what you decide - to roll your 4th line often enough that it takes away shifts from line 1/2

look at london last year. everyone raved about their 3rd /4th lines. Can only play 1 line at a time. Unless you plan on splitting 10-20mins more evenly, 4th lines are not that meaningful. and if you are splitting like that, like london last yr, usually means you dont really have 1 or 2 top lines imo

The 4 lines I put in my last post are all extremely balanced and could play the same # of minutes if needed. It's more that you put McShane or Studnicka's line out for offensive draws and the Kohn "4th line" out for defensive draws and when you're winning with the other teams stars out there. In junior hockey a 4th line that can contribute is very valuable, especially when the other team only has 3 lines that they trust and you can really wear them down with depth. When the Gens won the Mem Cup in 2015 it was largely because the had 12 high level forwards and you spent the whole game defending because the Gens never took a shift off.

 

[NOA]

The 4 lines I put in my last post are all extremely balanced and could play the same # of minutes if needed. It's more that you put McShane or Studnicka's line out for offensive draws and the Kohn "4th line" out for defensive draws and when you're winning with the other teams stars out there. In junior hockey a 4th line that can contribute is very valuable, especially when the other team only has 3 lines that they trust and you can really wear them down with depth. When the Gens won the Mem Cup in 2015 it was largely because the had 12 high level forwards and you spent the whole game defending because the Gens never took a shift off.

u bring up a good point 2015 gens had those 12 guys. i just dont think its "needed" so to speak. 2014 guelph was ok, 2016 london certainly didnt have one, erie last yr not so much. if you have 3 good lines its all you need. those teams won because of their top 3. their 4th line could have been worse and they still would have won because of the top 3. gens could take advantage more in 2015 imo because erie didnt even have a 3rd line that could play D or score. Guelph had a great 3rd line in 2014 that could score, erie didnt. London had at least a shutdown 3rd line in 2016, erie didnt have any 3rd line. Last year Missy had no 3rd line, which is why they were toast vs erie. Erie finally had a 3rd line that could possess and create/play defense

so i totally get it. certainly a benefit to have basically a 3rd line on your 4th line. I think im just saying you dont necessarily need it if you have 3 good lines. obviously oshawa has 3 good lines in order for them to have a good 4th. but that 4th line makes no difference unless the lines in front do the job first - if that makes any sense. very difficult to explain lol. erie was worn down in 2015 because they only had 2 lines. if you have 3 that can play 15-25 a night, they wont really get worn down. the key is the 3rd line putting in a legit 15 a night in all situations. Erie finally got it last year.
london tried to be a roll 4 line team last year. just doesnt make a difference if another team can match or be better on 3 of those lines. 3 lines are needed. 4th line is just gravy.

that being said - appears osh has the best 4th line in league - may not be close. not a bad thing but not needed by other teams to win vs them or win title. but you better have a dang good 3rd line

 

[Generalsupdates]

u bring up a good point 2015 gens had those 12 guys. i just dont think its "needed" so to speak. 2014 guelph really didnt have it if i remember correctly, 2016 london certainly didnt, erie last not so much. if you have 3 good lines its all you need. gens could take advantage more in 2015 imo because erie didnt even have a 3rd line that could play D or score. Guelph had a great 3rd line in 2014 that could score, erie didnt. London had at least a shutdown 3rd line in 2016, erie didnt have any 3rd line. Last year Missy had no 3rd line, which is why they were toast vs erie. Erie finally had a 3rd line that could possess and create/play defense

so i totally get it. certainly a benefit to have basically a 3rd line on your 4th line. I think im just saying you dont necessarily need it if you have 3 good lines. obviously oshawa has 3 good lines in order for them to have a good 4th. but that 4th line makes no difference unless the lines in front do the job first - if that makes any sense. very difficult to explain lol. erie was worn down in 2015 because they only had 2 lines. if you have 3 that can play 15-25 a night, they wont really get worn down. the key is the 3rd line putting in 15 a night.
london tried to be a roll 4 line team last year. just doesnt make a difference if another team can match or be better on 3 of those lines. 3 lines are needed. 4th line is just gravy.

The only having 3 good lines thing works when you have the elite of the elite talent like Guelph did with Fabbri/Bertuzzi/Rychel/Mitchell/Kosmachuk etc. and like Erie did with Strome/Cirelli/DeBrincat/Foegele/Raddysh etc. The Gens best players are mostly young right now and will develop into some of the best players in the league (Studnicka/McShane as soon as next year and Antropov/Noel probably the year after that) but in the mean time having 4 good lines will help a ton

 

[NOA]

The only having 3 good lines thing works when you have the elite of the elite talent like Guelph did with Fabbri/Bertuzzi/Rychel/Mitchell/Kosmachuk etc. and like Erie did with Strome/Cirelli/DeBrincat/Foegele/Raddysh etc. The Gens best players are mostly young right now and will develop into some of the best players in the league (Studnicka/McShane as soon as next year and Antropov/Noel probably the year after that) but in the mean time having 4 good lines will help a ton

makes sense for them this year - no doubt.
find diffeent ways to win, teach the young guys that. nothing but helpful. i think my overrated statement was it being that its not needed to win - probably me thinking more along the win a title lines. but its never a bad thing to have. like no coach or GM would turn away a veteran, big, defensive 4th line lol. but focus on the 3 lines first or you cant have a good 4th. Osh realizes this though. more balance for them - considering how dang young they are, probably the best option.

 

[ohloutsider]

No the "staged fight" was the game before in Owen Sound. Noel played the next night in Oshawa and scored 43 seconds in but left injured after the 1st period

Sorry - got the games messed up.

 

[Naz]

I like what Roger Hunt in rebuilding this team since the memorial cup and liked these last two trades, but do think we need a vet coach behind the bench & hopefully Bob Jones returns to provide this if not I would thing Mr Hunt has to find one temporally or permanent as Mclver & Nemisz are not ready yet to coach but I think they will be, just not now.

 

[Oshawa8181]

I too like what Hunt is doing... But we need a coach! IF Jones is not coming back. Need to get someone to get this group together. McIver & Nemisz are no where near ready to lead the ship. Some of the vets need to step up as well. Henderson and Dom haven't played well at all and seem kind of lost, so has Stillman

 

[Naz]

Some of the vets need to step up as well. Henderson and Dom haven't played well at all and seem kind of lost, so has Stillman

And that's why we need a vet coach to light a fire under some vets to get them going if not bench them. DJ Smith did & I'm sure Bob Jones did as the players knew if they didn't play they would be not playing, I don't think the vets fear Mclver & Nemisz.

 

[Generalsupdates]

I too like what Hunt is doing... But we need a coach! IF Jones is not coming back. Need to get someone to get this group together. McIver & Nemisz are no where near ready to lead the ship. Some of the vets need to step up as well. Henderson and Dom haven't played well at all and seem kind of lost, so has Stillman

I couldn't possibly disagree more in the "Dom hasn't played well and seems kind of lost". What makes you say that? He's averaging nearly a point per game despite being on the 3rd line and in the past my knock on him has been his motor (or lack thereof at times) but this year I've seen a complete switch from him and especially the last 3 games he's consistently one of the Gens hardest working forwards out there. I agree that Henderson/Stillman (although Stillman was good vs SBY) need more from, but I'm really happy with what I've seen from Commisso this year and that's why I think he's a lock to be an OA next year

 

[Generalsupdates]

And that's why we need a vet coach to light a fire under some vets to get them going if not bench them. DJ Smith did & I'm sure Bob Jones did as the players knew if they didn't play they would be not playing, I don't think the vets fear Mclver & Nemisz.

To further my last post, the shift after the timeout against HAM when Nemisz screamed at the team was by far the hardest working shift I've seen Commisso take in his OHL career. Went full tilt the entire time and threw 4 big hits which isn't normally his game at all. So I think just saying "oh the vets don't listen to the young coaches" is an easy excuse for a young team being off to a mediocre start but when you look deeper, that doesn't seem to actually hold any ground.


I do agree that if Jones isn't coming back they should go get a new head coach just because then Nemisz and McIvor can get back to what they were hired to do (Coach D and O separately). Wonder if we'll see the Wellwood rumours heat up

 

[Generalsupdates]

Former 1st rounder Brady Lyle asked for a trade out of NB. Ennis and picks for him? I’d think about it depending on how many picks

 

[Naz]

Former 1st rounder Brady Lyle asked for a trade out of NB. Ennis and picks for him? I’d think about it depending on how many picks

Personally I wouldn't this year make any moves on the D but 1 OA has to go. If the need next year is there go for It, I think Lyle is not much of an upgrade just looking @ his +/- the last 2 season. Next year should be our year do the trades that need to be done.this year just tinker as Hurt has done so far getting a reliable back-up, some tuffness without give up too much. Just my opinion.

 

[Generalsupdates]

Personally I wouldn't this year make any moves on the D but 1 OA has to go. If the need next year is there go for It, I think Lyle is not much of an upgrade just looking @ his +/- the last 2 season. Next year should be our year do the trades that need to be done.this year just tinker as Hurt has done so far getting a reliable back-up, some tuffness without give up too much. Just my opinion.

+/- is not a good stat at all to determine a players worth. If he's on a bad team, he'll be on the ice for a lot of goals against. If he's on a good team he'll be on for a lot of goals and be a big +. Cam Dineen was a minus last year and he's a minus so far this year but he's one of the top 5 (maybe top 3) D-men in the league, but he's on a bad team

 

[Naz]

This is odd just read on the Windsor post that Adam Kaldic who we pick up last week is going to Windsor? he is not on our roster anymore,says trade details to follow.

 

[ohloutsider]

This is odd just read on the Windsor post that Adam Kaldic who we pick up last week is going to Windsor? he is not on our roster anymore,says trade details to follow.

On the OHL website Kaldic appears on the Windsor roster and not on the Oshawa roster. Somebody jumping the gun at the OHL head office?

 

[Generalsupdates]

On the OHL website Kaldic appears on the Windsor roster and not on the Oshawa roster. Somebody jumping the gun at the OHL head office?

It would just be like Kadlec for a 15th. He was never really a part of the Gens (1 game for about 10 minutes of ice time) and he isn't going to get you any kind of real return. Also completely likely that the Gens put him on waivers and Windsor claimed him


Update: He was put on waivers and Windsor claimed him. So he doesn't take up a card for the Gens since it was less than 5 games

 

[Generalsupdates]

Also sounds like Kohn might be the odd man out and might go to university. Too bad, I like him

 

[Jaycro]

It would be a shame to lose Kohn considering what was paid/overpaid for him; 2nd in 2019 and 3rds in 2021 and 2022 (condtional but now payable I believe!) Haven't seen enough this year to judge him. And...I would guess that's why Kadlec is in Windsor, on waivers so that's why no paperwork trail.

 

[Generalsupdates]

I'll go:

5-3 OSH
GWG: McShane

 

[PEPSIHEAD]

Friday Night


Gens 5
(OT/SO)

67’s 4


GWG: Commisso