OHL Expansion

[chlfan98]

With the Brampton Battalions moving to North Bay and the Mississauga Steelheads having the the second lowest game attendance i think they should move to Chatham-Kent or possibly Brantford and my bad earlier about the Otters i made a mistake

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[PhlyerPhanatic31]

EXPANSION is the word you're looking for

With the Brampton Battalions moving to North Bay and the Mississauga Steelheads having the the second lowest game attendance i think they should move to Timmins,ON who as the same population as North Bay and the Erie Otters should move to Hamilton,On or Chatham-Kent,On and who ever doesn't get the Otters will have an OHL expention team and also Cornwall,On should get an OHL team also.

Cornwall had a team..it moved.
So did Hamilton...failed miserably
Timmins wouldn't support a team in my opinion or they'd have already been mentioned or at least on the map.
Chatham is an interesting thought as I feel they could make a team work.

 

[OHLFan8771]

With the Brampton Battalions moving to North Bay and the Mississauga Steelheads having the the second lowest game attendance i think they should move to Timmins,ON who as the same population as North Bay and the Erie Otters should move to Hamilton,On or Chatham-Kent,On and who ever doesn't get the Otters will have an OHL expention team and also Cornwall,On should get an OHL team also.

Why should the team just simply move out of Erie? They have shown a stronger fan base than all the cities you mentioned ever have.

 

[JetsColts13]

Why should the team just simply move out of Erie? They have shown a stronger fan base than all the cities you mentioned ever have.

That's what I was thinking. Attendance in Erie seems pretty good.

 

[ckg927]

Plus they're now in the second and final stage of renovating the EIA(which will ALWAYS be the Tullio to me). Why would the state, county and city put forth so much money to rebuild the place if the Otters are going to pack up the vans and head out?

 

[mike bowman]

Timmins can't support a Tier 2 team as the lost it to Iroquois Falls a decade ago . Also the southern teams wouldn't agree because of the travel . They already hate going to the Soo . I don't think you'll see any OHL expansion into Ontario . There is a moratorium on new junior teams and AAA midget teams . Both levels are contracting actually subtracting teams . That means fewer players to fill out rosters and will lead to a more watered down product in the O . The only way would be if they opened up more import spots but I doubt that there is much support for such a move at this time .

 

[Kingpin794]

Don't know if the OHL would add another American team but As far as those options go:

Upstate New York would be cool. A Niagara-NY rivalry

Flint, MI maybe. Although the arena isn't in the best shape.

 

[Ward Cornell]

Don't know if the OHL would add another American team but As far as those options go:

Upstate New York work be cool. A Niagara-NY rivalry

Flint, MI maybe. Although the arena isn't in the best shape.

I also thought Toledo would be great!

 

[lax018]

I live in Timmins and I can tell you that, although I would go to every game, Timmins can in no way support an OHL team. Firstly, there's no rink here with the seating capacity enough to bring in revenues. Secondly, population wise we are as big as northbay but its spread out over a huge area and in the winter people wouldn't make the trek on our terrible highways. Plus the players would be absolutely miserable here. Please don't force a team here OHL, you will immediately regret it. Put one in Huntsville and cal them the Muskoka _____. You'd have a better financial team than Timmins.

 

[Gensfan9]

Why should the team just simply move out of Erie? They have shown a stronger fan base than all the cities you mentioned ever have.

Agreed! Also with the CMD hype over the next two seasons, the attendence shouldn't be a problem. The otters will be a good team next year and very good in 2 years. This is a market that draws attendence based on performance on the ice. This is Bassin and Brown's job; to fill the seats! Further, when this rink draws fans, it gets rocking!

 

[Dadof3]

While new to the board, I have been reading for a while now and I'd like to throw in my 2 cents regarding expansion.

While I don't think the league has expansion on their minds, it is always good to have a few markets researched in case teams want to move.

Here are some markets that have been thrown around....

ONTARIO

1. Chatham - need a new arena, not sure the community would support the team. Location is fantastic though as Sarnia, London, Windsor and other geographical rivals will bring fans to the arena. Memorial Arena (jam packed) sits about 3,100.
2. Brantford - Arena is OK, unsure of the community. Proximity to Hamilton could bring fans in. Fans from Kitchener, London, Guelph, Niagara will help fill the arena. Had the Alexanders in the 80's but they moved out of town. Brantford Civic Center seats about 4,000 when full
3. Cornwall - Everything in place here. Arena is big enough (seats 5,000), just unsure if the team will be supported by the community. The Royals have a great history in the QMJHL and were in the OHL after that........would be a perfect fit in the East.
4. Thunder Bay - if a team ever did move into TBay, the owner would have to have huge pockets as teams would have to fly in, and travel costs would have to be subsidized by the home team. I think it is too costly a venture.......Fort Williams Gardens is a good barn from what I have heard (seats around 4,000), but some improvements to host an OHL team would be necessary.
5. Waterloo - has been talked about everywhere, and would need to jump through some hoops to get this done. KW has always been Ranger Country, and both Guelph and Kitchener would need to OK the team there. Arena seats over 4,000 and has the population to support the team.

USA

1. Toledo, OH - brand new arena downtown that is amazing, geographically speaking would tie into a road trip to Saginaw and Plymouth. Everything yells move to this city, but the ECHL has a team here and infringing on the territory might be difficult.
2. Youngstown, OH - new arena (seats over 5,100) and while this market would be a perfect fit for the league (tie in as a 2 game road trip with Erie) there are obstacles. USHL has a franchise there, but the thought is interesting.
3. Buffalo, NY - if a team would go here, where they would play would be interesting. First Niagara Center seats over 19,000 which is obviously too much for the OHL, but just look to Edmonton and Calgary to see that a franchise can flourish if they work with the big club. Again, tie in a trip here with Erie (and possibly Youngstown) and it eases the travel burden.
4. Elmira, NY - This would be a longshot at best IMO. An ECHL franchise exists in this market, the arena seats just under 3,800, but it does fit into the geographic footprint of the league. Current owners would have to be replaced as they have been 'shady' at best since their pro team, the Jackals, came into existence in 2001.
5. Flint, MI - Flint has a few things in place...arena size is about 4,400, but need some repairs (reportedly). Has always been a pro hockey town, so I'm not sure how will this would go over. Flint is a town that is very depressed due to the economy and the fanbase may not support a team due to financial situations in the city.

These are just some of the top markets I have thought of off the top of my head...many things factor into a new market, education possibilities for the players, population of the city and local area, news outlets etc.

Are there any other markets suitable to mention here........

 

[Dadof3]

more.....

Hamilton is obvious as the population is huge, but given the AHL is there for a while, I don't see this as something that will happen.

I have heard, and don't shoot the messenger here, that Port Hope or Cobourg has been talked about. Anyone hear anything similar??

 

[ckg927]

I live in Timmins and I can tell you that, although I would go to every game, Timmins can in no way support an OHL team. Firstly, there's no rink here with the seating capacity enough to bring in revenues. Secondly, population wise we are as big as northbay but its spread out over a huge area and in the winter people wouldn't make the trek on our terrible highways. Plus the players would be absolutely miserable here. Please don't force a team here OHL, you will immediately regret it. Put one in Huntsville and cal them the Muskoka _____. You'd have a better financial team than Timmins.

When St. Catharines got the OHL back in 2007, the first(and IMO, best)move they made was to name the team the Niagara IceDogs. St. Kitts and Niagara Falls have a bit of a long-standing rivalry and if it was named the St. Catharines IceDogs, they wouldn't have been as successful as they are now(with a new arena on the way in the next 2 years or so).

That's a roundabout way of saying "I agree with this post."

 

[ckg927]

Dadof: Just a note on Buffalo...they'd HAVE to play in First Niagara. There's no other option in the area, arena-wise. Niagara U's Dwyer Arena only seats 2,000 or so, as does Buffalo State's Ice Arena. Even the HarborCenter's main rink(which will be the new home for Canisius' team as well as a junior team when it opens next year)can only seat 1,800.

Also, Elmira of the ECHL has new owners, so that obstacle has been cleared.

 

[PITTNERIE]

Jamestown, NY. There is an arena there that house the Ironmen of the NAHL and has a seating capacity of 4568. But there is a failing attendance there. Erie used to go to camp there before the season started

 

[PITTNERIE]

I also find it funny that Brampton is getting Central Hockey League team??????

 

[NHL Fanatic]

I also find it funny that Brampton is getting Central Hockey League team??????

That's the biggest joke, and they are actually expecting a good attendance... don't know what world they are living in. Have to give them credit on the logo though, it's not bad.

 

[NHL Fanatic]

If any team moves next I would assume it would be Mississauga unless there is an improvement in attendance. They do have a great arena, and the team will be improving. That Memorial Cup pretty much damaged their future stock, and the failure to trade their veterans for assets. It's unfortunate to see attendance issues in the OHL, especially because of the price and talent.

David Branch has made it clear that his goal to make as much money as possible. This is the only reason I can see Erie moving. Bringing McDavid to Ontario for viewership, marketing etc. The New OHL poster boy. Pretty sad the money some of these owners are making off of young players for a mere $50 a week. These players should be paid more IMO, at least minimum wage for their efforts.

 

[big papa]

Hamilton is obvious as the population is huge, but given the AHL is there for a while, I don't see this as something that will happen.

I have heard, and don't shoot the messenger here, that Port Hope or Cobourg has been talked about. Anyone hear anything similar??

i heard awhile bacl they will be moving to Quebec when the new arena is done in 2-3 years so that Montreals prospects have a shorter trip when getting called up much like with the Marlies with the Leafs so Hamilton might be an option down the road for the OHL

 

[big papa]

Brampton was given an expansion team in the NBLCanada, its like the ECHL of basketball and is very entertaining went to a few Windsor Express games this year

 

[Friendly Fan]

If any team moves next I would assume it would be Mississauga unless there is an improvement in attendance. They do have a great arena, and the team will be improving. That Memorial Cup pretty much damaged their future stock, and the failure to trade their veterans for assets. It's unfortunate to see attendance issues in the OHL, especially because of the price and talent.

David Branch has made it clear that his goal to make as much money as possible. This is the only reason I can see Erie moving. Bringing McDavid to Ontario for viewership, marketing etc. The New OHL poster boy. Pretty sad the money some of these owners are making off of young players for a mere $50 a week. These players should be paid more IMO, at least minimum wage for their efforts.

They get billetted, sticks, food money, equipment, sticks, tickets, etc.... Approximately $35k-$45k of benefits per year. Thats not bad for 16-20 year old amateurs.

Not every owner makes money in the OHL.

 

[Friendly Fan]

Buffalo, Chatham and Newmarket would be top considerations for OHL expansion.

Mississauga doesnt spend the money to market the team. Having a couple of guys on the phone trying to sell tickets, and some chinzy intermission gigs, just wont do it. THey need to get into the city highschools and elementary schools and promote tickets with packages and incentives.

They have a small crappy gift shop.

You get what you put out.

 

[ckg927]

While having Buffalo in the OHL would be nice, I really don't see it happening-though the city does have a history of supporting hockey. The ONLY place they could do it, though, is the First Niagara Center. No other rink in the area can even come close, capacity-wise(not even the one the Sabres are building next door as part of the Harbor Center project).

Chewer: True, but I'd love to know how many teams in major junior are making money or-at worst-breaking even. Compare that to players who play college basketball or football in the U.S. They get NOTHING for what they do, and there has been a long-standing debate over whether they should get some form of a stipend. (Another debate for another board, before anyone gets too excited. )

 

[Friendly Fan]

College BB or Football players will make a tonne of money as pros, if they are good enough.. Same with hockey players.

We cant be paying Amateur players, especially when owners cant charge what they want. NOt every OHL team is like London. I know for a fact that Missy was dropping blood every year they were owned by Melnyk. Maybe only the Mem Cup year, they may have broken even.

Battalion must have lost money every year.

There should be a program in the OHL that allows for the rich teams to help the poor teams. It is clearly not an even playing field.

 

[Pilky01]

I don't think Chatham is a good idea. It cannibalizes the London, Windsor and Sarnia markets.

As far as I am concerned Branford is the most glaring omission of the southern ontario, Windsr-Ottawa + 401/403/GTA corridor. I do a TON of driving, and Branford just seems like such a great, isolated, yet accessible and populous enough location that, if done right, could be a huge.

I am skeptical of Hamilton and the OHL, especially if the Bulldogs remain.