Blue Jays Discussion: Now is the winter of our (probable) discontent

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

So what's the value of the future return you stated compared to signing him for 5x125-150m.

Based on projections / opinion etc.

Well, I'm a proponent of the old man Donaldson + da kids (i.e. Turner + Seager\Bellinger) going forward, so I would resign him.

The prospects are hard to quantify. Reyes has ace level stuff (similar to Carlos Martinez), but could never get healthy, and turn into a reliever or nothing. O'Neill might be nothing (or could be Jason Bay reincarnated), and Perez might be nothing (or could be a starting shortstop). Its a roll of the dice.

 

[Jozay]

Cardinals will have to blow their load like they havent busted one in a year to get donaldson if im shapiro

 

[Discoverer]

Well, I'm a proponent of the old man Donaldson + da kids (i.e. Turner + Seager\Bellinger) going forward, so I would resign him.

That's my preference, too. Make it Donaldson and Stroman and the kids and I'm on board.

 

[zeke]

A producing MLB player who stands to increase his offensive output moving to the AL East on a decent contract could further inflate his value if we do end up sucking. Sometimes it's best to go from A->B to finally get to C rather than do all your shopping in one place.

eh.

gyorko will never get you back anything unless you're really able to steal an underrated prospect from someone dumb.

Donaldson is one of the best players in baseball. I wouldn't water down the return with any mediocrities, myself.

 

[Discoverer]

eh.

gyorko will never get you back anything unless you're really able to steal an underrated prospect from someone dumb.

Donaldson is one of the best players in baseball. I wouldn't water down the return with any mediocrities, myself.

3.4 fWAR per 650 plate appearances the last two years. Above average defense at 2B and 3B.

"Will never get you back anything"

 

[hoc123]

eh.

gyorko will never get you back anything unless you're really able to steal an underrated prospect from someone dumb.

Donaldson is one of the best players in baseball. I wouldn't water down the return with any mediocrities, myself.

I mean, he had a WAR of 2.5 the last 2 seasons and can play multiple positions. He would probably be worth a decent amount.

 

[Morgs]

Well, I'm a proponent of the old man Donaldson + da kids (i.e. Turner + Seager\Bellinger) going forward, so I would resign him.

The prospects are hard to quantify. Reyes has ace level stuff (similar to Carlos Martinez), but could never get healthy, and turn into a reliever or nothing. O'Neill might be nothing (or could be Jason Bay reincarnated), and Perez might be nothing (or could be a starting shortstop). Its a roll of the dice.

I'd prefer to re-sign JD as well, but unless we start to take some major steps in attempting to become a contendor: aka another 120wrc+ bat to compliment Donaldson whats the point? I get VGJ and Bichette are coming late 2018 or early 2019, but there are no guarantees in baseball. I mean after JD our best hitter is either Smoak if he keeps it up, or Travis is he can stay healthy. Not exactly a recipe for success. We need to make a JD Martinez type splash, or go after a Yelich/Ozuna for me to think this is for real.

Hard decision for management to make, but I do think based on that Shapiro quote they're looking to make us contenders 3-5 years from now, not next season. My guess is JD is gonna get traded.

 

[Nineteen67]

It certainly looks like Jays are going to keep Donaldson
If they are not in contention at the deadline maybe they can do something then.

 

[Hoverhand]

We have a roster that could easily make the playoffs

No, we do not.

 

[Muston Atthews]

It certainly looks like Jays are going to keep Donaldson
If they are not in contention at the deadline maybe they can do something then.

How do you figure? There’s been multiple reports this week about how hard the Cardinals have been pushing for Donaldson. Where there’s Smoak there’s Fiers.

Im totally gonna use that as my fantasy name this year too

 

[Hoverhand]

This better be some elaborate scheme to fleece the Cardinals and not "If we keep Donaldson fans will like us"

 

[Morgs]

No, we do not.

Yes we absolutely do.. as long as JD is here and we can get full strong seasons out of Sanchez and Stroman.

 

[TootooTrain]

Yes we absolutely do.. as long as JD is here and we can get full strong seasons out of Sanchez and Stroman.

"easily"? No. Even if you have a star-studded lineup, the team has to claw their way in.
To make the mlb post-season you need strong seasons from ~80% of your roster.
I know what you're saying though. The 'chances' of making it are far greater with what you listed, but alas, it requires everyone to pull their weight and have good seasons.

 

[Morgs]

"easily"? No. Even if you have a star-studded lineup, the team has to claw their way in.
To make the mlb post-season you need strong seasons from ~80% of your roster.
I know what you're saying though. The 'chances' of making it are far greater with what you listed, but alas, it requires everyone to pull their weight and have good seasons.

Yeah I said "could easily" - as in there's no reason to count us out because we'll be in the hunt for the wild card. Definitely not easy to make the playoffs.

 

[Nineteen67]

Yes we absolutely do.. as long as JD is here and we can get full strong seasons out of Sanchez and Stroman.

I hope Sanchez and Stroman can be great but they have never done it before.

If there were only 1 or 2 questions going into the season I’d have some confidence. But, there are too many IFs and too much hoping guys do things they’ve never done before.

Typically that doesn’t bode well, however, every now and then a dark horse prevails.

 

[Garlando]

With the Cardinals acquiring Yairo Munoz and Max Schrock in the Stephen Piscotty deal, perhaps either player could be in play in potential discussions with the Cardinals and Jays over a Donaldson deal. Max Schrock is of interest to me as one of the best contact/approach players in the minors (minors career worst K% is 9.2% and his batting average has always been well above .300). He plays quality D at 2nd too. As a secondary piece in a potential Donaldson deal, he's a guy I would target over a lottery ticket type SS like Delvin Perez.

 

[theaub]

I still can't quite get over this quote, even though it's no surprise. It's like all my anti-shapkins posts were me building up an epic case against them and then them just coming out and proudly admitting everything:

Alex Seixeiro @alexfan590
57m
Mark Shapiro: If we were running this team without a fan base, we probably would've started a rebuild a year ago. We're trying to remain competitive for those fans. #BlueJays #BlairShow


Not only does he show a completely lack of appreciation for how rare it is to own a roster capable of going to back to back ALCS, and not only does he baldly admit that his moves of the last few years have been a fake attempt to "contend"..... but worse he just comes right out and calls us fans ignorant dummies who need to be treated like children and who are getting in the way of his precious rebuild.

Gah. This guy.

Haha I honestly can't believe that's a real quote.

fml

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Haha I honestly can't believe that's a real quote.

fml

Yep, that's a ridiculous quote for several reasons.

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Lmao

Hockeywiz to Zeke: "**** your webpage viewing experience"

 

[Discoverer]

Yep, that's a ridiculous quote for several reasons.

I generally put little stock in what front offices say, but this one was just stupid.

 

[hockeywiz542]

​

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

I smell opportunity with the JD Martinez situation.

 

[Clark4Ever]

I'm glad we've stayed out of bidding wars. We are not in the position to be dangling the precious few legitimate prospects we have for immediate help.

 

[hockeywiz542]