Proposal: No to Gibson

[attackfan71]

I don’t want to see the leafs give up the assets needed to acquire Gibson along with having his cap hit. I honestly don’t believe he is as good as campbell. Three years of declining numbers show this. If I’m dubas and giving up assets to pay a goalie in the 6 m range I’m seriously trying to figure out what it takes to get binnington out of St. Louis. To me he is one if the top 5 clutch goalies when it matters. Just curious what others think and what goalies (other then Gibson) would uou like to see dubas go after

Click to read more...

 

[Phion Keneuf]

Gibson is definitely better than both Campbell and Binnington.

I’d give up a 1st+ for him easily. Hard to judge him solely on numbers because of the team he’s on, but he’s a top 10 goalie for sure.

 

[AvroArrow]

I don't really like the idea of Gibson either, I'm just not confident enough in him.

 

[leafsfan5]

He's worth a deep inquiry and analysis.

A trade for him could potentially makes us the best team in the NHL (on paper). But, it could also close our contending window. Dubas and co need to figure out if his decline is team related or due to a decline in abilities

 

[LeafEgo]

I don’t want to see the leafs give up the assets needed to acquire Gibson along with having his cap hit. I honestly don’t believe he is as good as campbell. Three years of declining numbers show this. If I’m dubas and giving up assets to pay a goalie in the 6 m range I’m seriously trying to figure out what it takes to get binnington out of St. Louis. To me he is one if the top 5 clutch goalies when it matters. Just curious what others think and what goalies (other then Gibson) would uou like to see dubas go after

Looking at the past three years how are we differentiating goalie performance from team? Very hard to do.

It would be interesting to hear from a few of the goalie experts on here as Gibson has always had strong brand value, which is intriguing.

Binnington sounds fun, maybe a good fit for the Leafs, but hasn't he struggled to keep the starter position last couple years? That could be concerning.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I don’t want to see the leafs give up the assets needed to acquire Gibson along with having his cap hit. I honestly don’t believe he is as good as campbell. Three years of declining numbers show this. If I’m dubas and giving up assets to pay a goalie in the 6 m range I’m seriously trying to figure out what it takes to get binnington out of St. Louis. To me he is one if the top 5 clutch goalies when it matters. Just curious what others think and what goalies (other then Gibson) would uou like to see dubas go after

If you think Jack Campbell is better than John Gibson you haven't watched enough John Gibson you are dead wrong

 

[VanW27]

Looking at the past three years how are we differentiating goalie performance from team? Very hard to do.

It would be interesting to hear from a few of the goalie experts on here as Gibson has always had strong brand value, which is intriguing.

Binnington sounds fun, maybe a good fit for the Leafs, but hasn't he struggled to keep the starter position last couple years? That could be concerning.

Indeed he has.

Husso took over the starter role by the end of the season and was the starter for game 1 of the payoffs, and with good reason.

Last season
Husso - 2341 mins, 2.56GAA, .919sv%
Binnington - 2145 mins, 3.13GAA, .901sv%

Obviously he had that magical rookie year run, and then for the 5 games in the playoffs this year he was terrific again. But on the "clutch" flipside the Blues 2 previous playoffs:

Binnington - 0 wins and 9 losses, 4.19GAA, .875sv%
Allen - 2 wins and 2 losses, 1.89GAAm .935sv%

Binnington still appears to be a capable 1A/1B caliber goalies but a steady decline over the last 3 years has him trending quickly toward Matt Murray territory.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Gibson is risk/reward situation… risky because of his contract and assets required to get him.. but there is certainly elite upside.

All depends on cost for me

 

[Morgs]

Binnington? lmao

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

Looking at the past three years how are we differentiating goalie performance from team? Very hard to do.

It would be interesting to hear from a few of the goalie experts on here as Gibson has always had strong brand value, which is intriguing.

Binnington sounds fun, maybe a good fit for the Leafs, but hasn't he struggled to keep the starter position last couple years? That could be concerning.

I dont watch a ton of games from the west so I can't really speak as to how he has looked. When he is on, he is definitely a top 10 goalie maybe even top 5 but if he was truly a top tier goalie I would expect him to have averaged better than a .904sv% even on a ducks team that has been declining hard the last 3 years. Look at Price for example. Before his injury issues, that guy was single handedly carrying a very mediocre Habs team for years and would have no problem boasting a .915sv% or higher.

I'm a no to Binnington. He has shown the ability to come up clutch in playoffs but he is incredibly inconsistent and is a head case. I dont think he would be a good fit here, especially on a team that may already have character flaws and the media would be all over him here.

Gibson would be what I would consider high risk, high reward kind of gamble. He might be that top goalie to take us to the promiseland or he could be no better than Campbell and have a horrible contract on our books for the next 4 years as he goes into his 30s.

If we were to Gamble on a goalie I would maybe look at Blackwood. He would come here at a cheaper cost to acquire, be less than half the cap hit and is a few years younger with some potential to maybe be like another Kuemper. He is only a few years removed from having a season where he put up a .918sv% on a mediocre Devils team. Having Blackwood instead of say Gibson on a cheaper contract would allow us to have more money to spend on Defense or to sign a forward like a Perron to give us more depth throughout the lineup.

 

[Advanced stats]

There's a lot to analyze with Gibson, and our front office is smart enough to figure out if it's worth it or not and if it's worth paying the ducks to retain.

 

[Duke16]

It is just too risky of a deal to take on in tandem with paying top dollar.

The Leafs could trade Mrazek and two of their better but not best prospects and come out fine in the long run. Even if Gibson doesn't really take a step forward again, he's likely movable because of his name value and the fact that the contract carries one less year of term by the end of next season.

Paying the price for an elite goalie (ie. Robertson, 1st+) and him not being elite would pretty devastating though.

I'd cap my offer at something like Mrazek, Abruzzese and Hirvonen. I don't even love that, but it doesn't handicap the Leafs in a great way in terms of taking on massive risk in terms of contract + assets given up. Those are good prospects, but ones the Leafs seems to be able to add with in pretty much every Draft. If the Leafs were to move down this year in the Draft, they likely replace those two in the system and then some.

Edit: and some team likely beats the offer, so I doubt we get him

 

[613Leafer]

Gibson is definitely better than both Campbell and Binnington.

I’d give up a 1st+ for him easily. Hard to judge him solely on numbers because of the team he’s on, but he’s a top 10 goalie for sure.

Stolarz stats were much better this year and better last year on the same team.

There were also 6 teams that gave up more shots per game than Anaheim this year, including goalies with better stats than Gibson (eg Forsberg in Ottawa, Wedgewood in Arizona, Merzlikins in Columbus, etc).

So I keep hearing that his stats are bad because of the team he was on, but there are certainly several examples of no-name or lesser-name goalies in similar situations putting up better stats. And if Gibson were a top 5-10 goalie, wouldn't you expect him to be well ahead of the pack relative to goalies in similar situations? Like an off year in a bad situation is fine, but three straight down years, even on a bad team, seems like a trend.

 

[Magic Man]

My top options are probably Kuemper, Varlamov and Fleury. There is a group of about 7 goalies in the league that are obvious ranks at the top, though Kuemper may have broken into that tier. I think these guys would be ranked pretty closely after that. 2 are FA's and one is an expensive backup behind one of the previously mentioned top-7.

There isn't the risk with Kuemper that there is with Gibson because he has played at a high level and been on a bottom feeder in Arizona. Kuemper is a guarantee, similar to the top-7. Varlamov only has 1 year, which could be a good thing, they can try him before they decide to sink a couple more years into him. I imagine it will be the same with Fleury and he will sign a one year deal.

 

[Kurtz]

I dont watch a ton of games from the west so I can't really speak as to how he has looked. When he is on, he is definitely a top 10 goalie maybe even top 5 but if he was truly a top tier goalie I would expect him to have averaged better than a .904sv% even on a ducks team that has been declining hard the last 3 years. Look at Price for example. Before his injury issues, that guy was single handedly carrying a very mediocre Habs team for years and would have no problem boasting a .915sv% or higher.

I'm a no to Binnington. He has shown the ability to come up clutch in playoffs but he is incredibly inconsistent and is a head case. I dont think he would be a good fit here, especially on a team that may already have character flaws and the media would be all over him here.

Gibson would be what I would consider high risk, high reward kind of gamble. He might be that top goalie to take us to the promiseland or he could be no better than Campbell and have a horrible contract on our books for the next 4 years as he goes into his 30s.

If we were to Gamble on a goalie I would maybe look at Blackwood. He would come here at a cheaper cost to acquire, be less than half the cap hit and is a few years younger with some potential to maybe be like another Kuemper. He is only a few years removed from having a season where he put up a .918sv% on a mediocre Devils team. Having Blackwood instead of say Gibson on a cheaper contract would allow us to have more money to spend on Defense or to sign a forward like a Perron to give us more depth throughout the lineup.

Price had a save percentage of .900% in 17-18 season, then bounced back with .918%, then fell down to .909% the following season, and back down to .901% the season after (before taking his team to the finals).

Good goalies can have some mediocre years on paper when the team in front of them sucks.

Stolarz stats were much better this year and better last year on the same team.

I asked ANA fans about this fact, they said Stolarz tended to get his starts against weaker teams.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

I don’t want to see the leafs give up the assets needed to acquire Gibson along with having his cap hit. I honestly don’t believe he is as good as campbell. Three years of declining numbers show this. If I’m dubas and giving up assets to pay a goalie in the 6 m range I’m seriously trying to figure out what it takes to get binnington out of St. Louis. To me he is one if the top 5 clutch goalies when it matters. Just curious what others think and what goalies (other then Gibson) would uou like to see dubas go after

Pro teams tend to want to trade tenders once they get too expensive and old and have developed a younger tender to take over .. trading for tenders very rarely works to win Cups .. it has happened here and there but odds are extremely LOW

 

[attackfan71]

I guess my point in suggesting binnington is we don’t need a goalie to get us into the playoffs. We need one that is cool as a cucumber once we are there and can steal a game or two when our offence gets shut down. Changes the way the other team plays against us. I like Kuemper as well. Never thought of wedgewood. Maybe he would be good fit. Goalies are such a fickle position one year great next year confidence goes down and they struggle.

 

[GrizzGreen]

There were also 6 teams that gave up more shots per game than Anaheim this year, including goalies with better stats than Gibson (eg Forsberg in Ottawa, Wedgewood in Arizona, Merzlikins in Columbus, etc).

The high quality scoring chances are abundant out here... Anaheim's team defense was bad, regardless of their ability to suppress shots. Source: see Ducks games fairly often in person

 

[hamzarocks]

Gibson no gibson it doesn't matter

When your team scores 3 goals in 3 straight do or die games your not winning the game most of the time

 

[Clark4Ever]

Goalies are a difficult breed to gauge for the most part. It would definitely be a risk to give up the assets required and assume the cap hit for Gibson based on his recent track record.

Then again, he could flourish with a change of scenery and potentially get us over the hump in the playoffs.

It's a very tough call.

 

[TheDoldrums]

Price had a save percentage of .900% in 17-18 season, then bounced back with .918%, then fell down to .909% the following season, and back down to .901% the season after (before taking his team to the finals).

Good goalies can have some mediocre years on paper when the team in front of them sucks.

Gibson isn't bouncing around though. He's had the same consistently mediocre SV% for three seasons in a row.

.904
.903
.904

He might have been the best goalie in the world from 2015-2018 but this is who he is now.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

For those who want Gibson - you do realize he's the 4th highest paid goalie in the NHL, right?

5 more years at 6.4m.

It would be a huge risk considering how thin our depth is already.

 

[ITM]

Gibson is risk/reward situation… risky because of his contract and assets required to get him.. but there is certainly elite upside.

All depends on cost for me

I think we would have to exhaust all free options first. Then shake cages and see what best options via trade and rank them accordingly.

If Oettinger was in some rare circumstance an available option...

 

[leafsfan5]

Gibson no gibson it doesn't matter

When your team scores 3 goals in 3 straight do or die games your not winning the game most of the time

In their last 5 clinching games Tampa has scored a total of 8 goals, or 1.6 a game

An elite goalie certainly changes the outlook of your chances in games like that. Question is can Gibson still be elite

 

[PROUD PAPA]

Haven't Binningtons numbers been on the decline for a few years?
Between Gibson and Binnington i'd choose Gibson.