Next Years Team

TealManV

A man has said
Oct 12, 2011
727
83
California
Although I still have hope that we'll find a way to beat the Pens, I can't pass up an opportunity to rosterbate.

I believe that DW will hand out bridge deals for Hertl (2-3yrs for $3mil per) and Nieto (2 years for $1.5mil per) and sign Demelo for 1 year for $1-1.25mil. I also believe he'll try to sign Burns to an extension to avoid any distractions next season. I honestly don't know what kind of deal we should expect. I also believe it would be wise to get an extension for Thornton. Hopefully he will go the Jagr path for 1 year deals.

I don't think that we'll resign Polak nor Reimer. I'm hopeful that DW won't resign Spaling, but I think he'll be back. Hopefully nothing over 2 years at $1.5mil per. Pete favors him too much for my liking. Not to mention we finally got out of all the bloated/unnecessary 4th line contracts (Burish, Brown, Smith, Torres, etc.). Zubrus is an unknown, but I don't imagine he'll be back, unless it's for a 1 year league minimum deal as a 13th forward and Pete & DW want a vet for the bottom 6.

I do believe/hope that Wingles will be traded and I would be perfectly fine with that. Ideally, we would trade him to Buffalo for one of their four '16 3rd rounders. I'd also love to trade Dillon but I don't see that happening. Marleau is the only other real trade candidate, but I doubt he waives at this stage. Maybe he could be a draft day trade for a mid-to-late 1st rounder.

I'm hopeful that a couple of Meier, Goldobin, Sörensen, Goodrow and some of the other youngsters will get a shot next season.

This how I predict our roster will look:

Hertl-Thornton-Pavs
Meier-Logan-Donskoi
Goldobin-Patty-Ward
Nieto-Tierney-Karlsson
13th:Spaling/Zubrus/Sörensen

Vlasic-Braun
Martin-Burns
Dillon-Demelo
7th: Mueller or a cheap vet

Jones
Real Backup Goalie (Montoya?)

Carry over the momentum and chemistry from this season while adding some young talent. Also, it will maintain some of cap space moving forward into '17-'18 for the Burns and Thornton extensions, as well as new deals for Tierney and Donskoi.
 
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Juxtaposer

Outro: Divina Comedia
Dec 21, 2009
48,038
17,766
Bay Area
The team has earned one last year to compete. Also, the 2017 draft is looking like straight garbage as of now. So in my ideal world:

Let Polak, Spaling, Zubrus, Tennyson, and Haley walk.

Trade Dillon, Karlsson, and Wingels to recoup picks (2nds/3rds). In particular, I see absolutely 0% chance Wingels is still on the team come October.

Re-sign Hertl to a two or three year deal, whatever money he wants. Comparables: Bjugstad ($4,100,000), Lee ($3,750,000), Toffoli ($3,250,000), Huberdeau ($3,250,000), Coyle ($3,200,000).

Resign Nieto to a one or two year deal around $1.5M and resolve that he shouldn't be playing anywhere but the 4th line unless there are injuries.

If there is money and his ask isn't unreasonable, re-sign Reimer. If it is, then find a real actual NHL backup. Do NOT simply hand the job to Troy Grosenick or Aaron Dell.

Trade for Brendan Smith out of Detroit. I've discussed with Wings fans and they're amenable to either our 2016 2nd or to Joakim Ryan as return. Personally, I don't think Ryan will ever get a shot in the NHL here and I want him to succeed (and Detroit's a great place for a small Swedish PMD to develop), so I'd be okay with it. Smith certainly seems on the outs with the Wings' coaches and front office, but he's actually a very good player. He's an elite skater and a solid puck mover. He could anchor the third pair as well as providing the ability to move up the lineup if Martin falters. He's a much better LHD option than anyone in the system, and makes less than Dillon does right now. 27 years old means he's entering his prime too.

Give DeMelo the third pairing RHD spot. Not only has he earned it on the merit of his play, but he is a good compliment to Smith's style.

If Marleau still wants out, move him for whatever. That said, do not take back a cap dump. If that means retaining some of Marleau's salary, do so, but do not take wasted money back.

If Marleau goes, softly pursue Loui Eriksson in FA. Definitely don't overpay for him but if his ask is reasonable (and it should be considering the nearly flat cap), go for it. The Finals trip will make us a more desirable signing destination, one would think.

I know offersheets aren't a thing that people do, but there are some very interesting names out there. Ryan Strome, Kevin Hayes, and Mike Hoffman are forwards I would love to acquire, whether by offersheet or by trade. Ryan Strome is a player I would go after hard. I truly think he is a borderline #1C right now. We have our 2017 1st and 2017 3rd, meaning we could offersheet someone in the range of $3,652,659 to $5,478,986. I'd be happy handing Ryan Strome $5M for three years. But again, unfortunately people don't do offersheets, which is just dumb as hell.

Make no one in the whole organization untouchable, just to see if anyone severely over-values our players. That's just smart business.

A player I would seriously look at trading is Chris Tierney. His value is likely inflated and he's young and cheap, so someone will likely be willing to overpay for him. He's not a good enough #3C for a Sharks team with ambition, but he's also kind of a waste on the 4th line when there are always cheap #4C's around in free agency and we also have Ryan Carpenter whom I think could do the job well. Whether we trade him for futures (a late 1st?) or for an "equivalent" winger from a team who thinks more highly of him, we would maximize the talent of our team by trading him.

Either move Hertl to C or find a real Cup-caliber #3C. As we've found out the hard way, neither Marleau nor Tierney is a good enough #3C for this team. Mikael Backlund would be a great option, but failing that I don't hate Peter Holland as a cheap option and last resort.

Lastly, go bargin hunting for a quality 4th line veterans. Someone like Matt Cullen. Zubrus was good for his role, but I want someone who is a high-end 4th liner.

Have camp be a true free for all for the forwards. Anyone, no matter their age or draft status or NHL experience should honestly be able to earn a spot, and veterans, with the exception of Thornton, Pavelski, and Couture, should not be complacent.

A minimalist skeleton, including only current assets (aka things I would set in stone to begin every attempt at roster building, assuming no one offers me something I cannot possibly turn down for one of these players):

XXX-Thornton-Pavelski
XXX-Couture-Donskoi
XXX-Hertl-Ward
Nieto-XXX-XXX
XXX

Vlasic-Braun
XXX-Burns
XXX-DeMelo
XXX

Jones
XXX


- I think there is a 99% chance Martin is still around, but I wouldn't not put his name out just to see if anyone wanted him.

- The LW1 spot would be open competition between kids like Meier and Goldobin, unless we aquired a player for that role (ie Mike Hoffman) or acquired a real #3C and so Hertl remained there.

- The LW2 spot would likely be given to Marleau, assuming he sticks around, but would be open for kids like Meier or Goldobin to grab from him. If we managed to sign a UFA like Eriksson, there's where he would slot. Keep in mind that Donskoi can play LW too so if the right player for that duo were actually a RW, it wouldn't be a problem.

- The LW3 (or RW3, given that Ward can play either wing) spot would additionally be open to anyone, in theory, so not limited to Meier or Goldobin but also, in theory, given to Sorensen or LaBanc or Carpenter or whoever honestly earns it. Or alternatively, a B-caliber UFA like Lee Stempniak wouldn't be a bad idea.

- As mentioned, I would like to acquire Brendan Smith, so he would be the LHD3 spot.

- The 7th D can be Heed, Ryan, Mueller, whoever earns it. Failing that, there are a gazillion cheap #7D out there.

- For a backup, obviously Reimer is ideal. But I admit I feel more confident about Jones after this playoffs, when he has been very solid. Otherwise, Kari Ramo, Anton Khudobin, Jonas Enroth, etc. would be fine cheaper options.

- I strongly believe Nik Goldobin should be on the roster in a scoring role for the full season next year. He's definitely shown the offensive chops and from all accounts he's become a more responsible player. I want to say that Meier is NHL-ready, but probably not for the role I want him in. I'm thinking a 50/50 AHL/NHL split, a la William Nylander this year, would be best, assuming he performs well enough in the AHL to warrant a call-up.

- I am really interested to know what Eric Staal will command on the open market. He had a horrible playoffs and was never a good fit with NYR, but I honestly still think pretty highly of him. If he'd take a 4 year (or less) deal for an AVV of $4M or less, I'd scoop him up.

- If we keep Marleau, I wouldn't hate moving him down to #3LW. He'd still play #1PP and minor PK duties, could play #3C in a pinch or move up the lineup in case of injuries

A hyper realistic, yet Jux-influenced full roster:

Goldobin-Thornton-Pavelski
Marleau-Couture-Donskoi
Stempniak-Hertl-Ward
Nieto-Tierney-Goodrow

Vlasic-Braun
Martin-Burns
Smith-DeMelo

Jones
Enroth



My ideal summer, semi-realistically and specifically:

Let Roman Polak, Nick Spaling, Danius Zubrus, Matt Tennyson, and Micheal Haley walk.

Brenden Dillon for a 2nd/3rd (to Colorado, Buffalo, Boston, Vancouver, etc.)
Melker Karlsson for a 3rd (to Buffalo, Colorado, Carolina, New Jersey, etc.)
Tommy Wingels for a 2nd (to Calgary, Boston, Colorado, Edmonton, Columbus, etc.)
Chris Tierney for a late 1st

Re-sign Tomas Hertl @$3.5M, 2 years (bridge deal)
Re-sign Matt Nieto @$1.5M, 1-2 years
Re-sign Dylan DeMelo @$1M, 2 years
Re-sign Ryan Carpenter @$1M, 1-2 years

Acquire Brendan Smith for Joakim Ryan (or 2016 2nd)
Offersheet Ryan Strome @$5M for 3 years (giving up 2017 1st and 2017 3rd)
Sign Jason Chimera @$1.5M for 1 year (although it might take more)
Sign Jonas Enroth (or whoever) @$1M 1 year

Logan Couture/Tomas Hertl - Joe Thornton - Joe Pavelski
Joel Ward - Tomas Hertl/Logan Couture - Joonas Donskoi
Nikolay Goldobin - Ryan Strome - Patrick Marleau
Matt Nieto - Ryan Carpenter - Jason Chimera
some 13th forward (Barclay Goodrow?)

Marc-Edouard Vlasic - Justin Braun
Paul Martin - Brent Burns
Brendan Smith - Dylan DeMelo
Tim Heed

Martin Jones
Jonas Enroth

That's $72,191,668 in cap space. Cap will be around $73M I think. I'm sure we could shave around the edges if need be.

The major fixes here are: the third line is now a high-end 2nd line, potentially; the third pairing is MUCH better. These are the two biggest issues. Additionally, the 4th line is better. And that's a team of ++skaters with the exception of the first line (which we know works) and Ward.


Out: Polak, Spaling, Tennyson, Zubrus, Haley, Dillon, Karlsson, Wingels, Reimer, Ryan or 2016 2nd for Smith, 2017 1st and 2017 3rd for Strome
In: Goldobin, Strome, Chimera, Smith, Heed, Enroth, Carpenter, 2nd/3rd for Dillon, 3rd for Karlsson, 2nd for Wingels
Signed: Hertl for three more years, Strome for three more years, Nieto for 1-2 more years, Chimera for a year, Carpenter for 1-2 years, Enroth for a year
Picks: LOL (basically over the next three years we'd have our 2018 1st, our 2016 2nd (if Ryan is the Smith return), Detroit's 2017 3rd, a bunch of 4th-7th rounders, and then any picks we manage to get from Dillon/Karlsson/Wingels)
Call-ups: Meier, Sorensen, Mueller

'Future' pieces-
Top-6 forwards: Hertl, Donskoi, Strome, Goldobin, Meier + Couture/Pavelski.
Top-4 D: none under 27 except maybe DeMelo (I think it's possible) or Heed, but Vlasic and Braun are both under 30 and Burns should play for a while longer.


The 2018 entry draft looks incredible so far. Obviously it's two years away but it's not too early to take that into consideration. Keep our 2018 1st, and then deal with potentially "re-building" in the summer of 2017, depending on how the 2016-2017 team does.
 

Levie

Registered User
Mar 15, 2011
14,606
4,320
Won't matter if the gm keeps bringing in guys like him. He needs to be fired.

Dillon isn't like the guys before him. DW clearly thought he would be more offensive. Polak, sure. But Dillon was brought in to hopefully grow into a top 4 PMD, or at the very least a solid bottom pairing PMD. DW used to only get physical bottom pairing guys just because they are gritty. You can tell he was hoping Dillon turned into more. He was wrong but I don't think he's a retread like Polak is.
 

Juxtaposer

Outro: Divina Comedia
Dec 21, 2009
48,038
17,766
Bay Area
Dillon isn't like the guys before him. DW clearly thought he would be more offensive. Polak, sure. But Dillon was brought in to hopefully grow into a top 4 PMD, or at the very least a solid bottom pairing PMD. DW used to only get physical bottom pairing guys just because they are gritty. You can tell he was hoping Dillon turned into more. He was wrong but I don't think he's a retread like Polak is.

I would agree too. Dillon isn't good, but at the time this was not a bad trade at all. He isn't a Hannan, Stuart, C. White, Wallin, etc. He's just not a very good player who happens to be stylistically kinda similar. I don't think the process of targeting and acquiring Dillon was bad. It just ended up being some bad luck.

Thejuxtaposer

I would agree too. ;)
 

magic school bus

***********
Jun 4, 2010
19,415
494
San Jose, CA
So who replaces Wilson and doesn't bring in any bad players?

The great players are already here. The next guy just needs to not completely sabotage the bottom 3 defenseman, backup goaltender and bottom six. I.e. Issues Dougie's struggled with for years. The next gm doesn't have to be better overall. Just better at picking the lesser players since, ya know your coach likes to roll his lines don't give him the option of playing trash a few mins less than your best players.

This is the best team in Sharks history and he still couldn't help himself from picking up his precious pylons. He's broken, beyond fixable. If we lose this series, I'm done with the guy. I won't even speak his name again.

Dillon isn't like the guys before him. DW clearly thought he would be more offensive. Polak, sure. But Dillon was brought in to hopefully grow into a top 4 PMD, or at the very least a solid bottom pairing PMD. DW used to only get physical bottom pairing guys just because they are gritty. You can tell he was hoping Dillon turned into more. He was wrong but I don't think he's a retread like Polak is.

He's always been bad. People tried to say he was a top-4 defenseman because he played on a bad Dallas team's top pairing. Yet he never put up more than 17 pts in a season there. He lacks the requisite puck skills to be top-4 defenseman. I don't see why you'd even be interested in such a player. Despite his size, he's not overly physical and he's a poor skater despite possessing good straight line speed. He was resigned to a pricey long-term extension long after we'd seen him in teal. He doesn't get it. He never will, until he's neutered or unemployed. (Even then hockey lifers are slow learners -- Burke, Torterella for ex haven't shown they've learned anything).

Doug Wilson was a high end point producing defenseman. The fact that he doesn't value this type of player in the year 2016 reflects more poorly on him than most.
 
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choi

The Moment
Jul 27, 2010
371
18
Seoul
What happened to wingels and why is he excluded from all lieups?
-from an outsider
 

Juxtaposer

Outro: Divina Comedia
Dec 21, 2009
48,038
17,766
Bay Area
What happened to wingels and why is he excluded from all lieups?
-from an outsider

Been passed up by younger/better/cheaper options on the depth chart, plus we have to excellent winger prospects who have good chances to make the big team next year in Meier and Goldobin.
 

SactoShark

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
May 1, 2009
12,483
1,054
Sacramento
Wingels had a significant impact in drawing penalties during the regular season. I think he still has a lot of value during that 82 game grind. Management and coaches needs to utilize resources differently in the playoffs when those whistles are put away.
 

TomasHertlsRooster

Don’t say eye test when you mean points
May 14, 2012
33,361
25,425
Fremont, CA
Trade Wingels and Karlsson, let Spaling go. If Zubrus wants to come back at league min and be #13 let him.

Meier-Thornton-Pavelski
Goldobin-Couture-Donskoi
Marleau-Hertl-Ward
Nieto-Tierney-Karlsson
Zubrus

Vlasic-Braun
Martin-Burns
Dillon-Demelo/Heed

Jones
Grosenick

I would offer Reimer a nice contract, 2 years 6M, he and Jones will have the same contract. Realistically though he will want more despite being worse than Jones. Backup will likely be Grosenick.

DW tried to win this year, and they still have a chance to win next year. I still believe they have a chance to win rn. With that said, the youth movement is still in effect. Gotta think they'll give spots to Meier and Goldobin. I could see them trading Dillon and bringing up Mueller permanently as the #6D but I doubt it happens. Can't see them bringing Polak back as he has been legitimately terrible.

This is what I expect. What do I want?

Dillon traded for a solid 3rd/elite 4th line winger. Basically what Wingels was for a couple years. Trade a pick or go to UFA for a solid left handed defenseman with good foot speed that moves the puck well. Don't care for toughness and in-zone play isn't that important but foot speed and puck moving is extremely important. Let Heed and DeMelo battle for that 3rd pairing RHD. Try to bring back Reimer but if not, get a solid experienced backup that can play 20-30 games a year.

Meier-Thornton-Pavelski
Goldobin-Couture-Donskoi
Marleau-Hertl-Ward
Nieto-Tierney-(Winger acquisition)

Vlasic-Braun
Martin-Burns
LHD acquisition-DeMelo/Heed

Jones
Reimer/Backup acquisition

I would agree too. ;)

Problem is that you have a grass is always greener mentality outside of Dylan DeMelo. In your lineup, you have us trading Tierney for a late first, and then offer sheeting Ryan Strome at 5M over 3 years? You're suggesting we offer sheet a forward that had 28 points this year at the rate of a guy that scores about 50 with great defense or 60 with decent defense. Wat.

Tierney has made a lot of improvements these playoffs too. Again, grass is always greener; his biggest flaw is he is not very strong on the puck and that can be changed. He is a great PK'er with solid vision who stepped up his game in the playoffs. I see no reason to get rid of him, especially with how cheap he is. Plus, trading Tierney and offer sheeting Strome would be terrible for the organizational culture but I'm also not convinced it would help the team, especially not in the long term when contracts come up. I know Strome had 51 points last season but I'm fairly confident Tierney will break out soon and he was .5PPG last year and has been one of our best players in the playoffs. Plus, he's homegrown talent and is actually the #1 product of the youth movement outside of potentially Timo Meier. I guess if we get a solid 2nd pairing LHD with upside offered for him I would take it, but I would rather keep him. Youre acting like he will never improve when his biggest issue is something that is easily fixed.

Also, you're underestimating Timo Meier. I get he's not Barzal or any of the other players you wanted but he's going to be a solid player next year. He's strong enough to play against men and played great in the CHL playoffs. I see no reason not to give him the Hertl treatment. Again, the grass is always greener issue, assuming Meier won't be able to step up and do well. Not sure how you're so high on DeMelo, but so low on Meier and Tierney.

If Meier and Goldobin come up, and play like what we expect (Meier a 2nd line level power forward with a solid defensive game, Goldobin an elite offensive player that struggles in the defensive zone), and get a new winger to replace one of our 4th liners, we have a Pittsburgh level forward group. The place I would sink 5M into, if anywhere, is defense. Get an elite 3rd pairing guy and see which of DeMelo/Heed is good to go, and we'll be solid.
 
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DonskoiDonscored

Registered User
Oct 12, 2013
18,642
9
I feel so bad for Wingels. The dudes building a new house here and he's always been one of my favorites...

I don't know how much longer he'll be in the league though. His style of play will wear down his body very quickly.
 

Sharksfan83

Registered User
Jul 27, 2010
3,495
812
We are still so very deep. I kept looking at the lineups seeing Tierney on the 4th line. He needs to be on the third line, but Hertl needs to be a center also. Neither are replacing Thornton or Couture. I guess good problems to have.

Tierney has impressed me so very much in the SCF.
 

Sharksrule04

Registered User
Jul 23, 2010
3,698
1,232
New York, NY
Hate that this thread is already being created but I enjoy talking about rosters so here's what I'm hoping for next season.

Hertl-Thornton-Pavs
Donskoi-Couture-Ward
Marleau-Tierney-Goldobin/Meier
Sorenson-Spaling-Nieto/Karlsson

Burns-Martin
Vlasic-Braun
Dillon-Demelo/Heed
Mueller

Jones
Reimer

-Trade Wingels at the Draft and our 2nd to move into the early 2nd or late first.
-I actually really liked Polak as a bottom pairing guy in the first 3 rounds but we can't afford him and he is too much of a liability against speedy teams so let him walk.
-Trade Karlsson or Nieto for a 2nd rounder at the draft if we think Meier or Goldy is definitely ready to play NHL minutes.
-Re-sign Reimer if possible but most likely he's gone.
-Re-sign Spaling. I'm a big fan of what he's done in the post season.
 

T0uGh C0oki3

Goodbye Jumbo Joe
Dec 19, 2014
3,863
100
Imagine Hampus Lindholm sign an offer sheet. (6X5)

Hertl - Thornton - Pavelski
Goldobin - Couture - Donskoi
Marleau - Tierney - Ward
Nieto - Spaling - Sorenson
Karlsson

Vlasic - Braun
Lindholm - Burns
Martin - Heed

Jones
Reimer

That's NHL2k16 level madness. LOL
Theoretically speaking, it could be possible.

Realistically speaking (Assuming Marleau leave):
Resign Hertl for 3.5 X 4
Sign Boedker in FA / Demers in FA
Try to resign Reimer
Trade Wingels
Trade Marleau+ to NYR for Hayes.

Ultra-optimistic lineup

Boedker - Thornton - Pavelski
Donskoi - Couture - Hayes
Goldobin - Hertl - Ward
Nieto - Tierney - Sorenson

Vlasic - Braun
Martin - Burns
Dillon - Heed

Jones
Reimer
 

Sharksrule04

Registered User
Jul 23, 2010
3,698
1,232
New York, NY
The great players are already here. The next guy just needs to not completely sabotage the bottom 3 defenseman, backup goaltender and bottom six. I.e. Issues Dougie's struggled with for years. The next gm doesn't have to be better overall. Just better at picking the lesser players since, ya know your coach likes to roll his lines don't give him the option of playing trash a few mins less than your best players.

This is the best team in Sharks history and he still couldn't help himself from picking up his precious pylons. He's broken, beyond fixable. If we lose this series, I'm done with the guy. I won't even speak his name again.



He's always been bad. People tried to say he was a top-4 defenseman because he played on a bad Dallas team's top pairing. Yet he never put up more than 17 pts in a season there. He lacks the requisite puck skills to be top-4 defenseman. I don't see why you'd even be interested in such a player. Despite his size, he's not overly physical and he's a poor skater despite possessing good straight line speed. He was resigned to a pricey long-term extension long after we'd seen him in teal. He doesn't get it. He never will, until he's neutered or unemployed. (Even then hockey lifers are slow learners -- Burke, Torterella for ex haven't shown they've learned anything).

Doug Wilson was a high end point producing defenseman. The fact that he doesn't value this type of player in the year 2016 reflects more poorly on him than most.

DW acquired the best offensive d-man in the league in Burns. Before Burns he Acquired Boyle and Blake 40-60 point d-men. No he doesn't value offensive d-men. Our d-men out-produced Pittsburgh's this year.

I will never understand why people can't separate hatred and logic.

For example, I absolutely hate Sidney Crosby. Will not make a statement that Sidney Crosby is a bad player.
 

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