Player Discussion Next season: JPG or Zibby in the 2nd line center role?

[Benjamin]

I prefer Pageau.

• Higher effort/tenacious
• Better defensively
• Better faceoffs
• Similar offense at even strength
• Better suited for the center role
• Can play with anyone
• Gets better by the year

A complete utility player.


Not to say I think Zibanejad needs to be traded. I'd try him at wing again or wait to see how Pageau looks after 2 months into the season in the new role before looking to trade. Though, I'd have no problem packaging him.

Zibanejad puts up points. Beyond that he seems to just have annoyances in his play. Anyone who plays with him seems to falter. Questionable defense at times. Zoned out. Imo he's a low impact player the majority of games. Has he really improved all that much in the last 3 seasons? He's Fisher without the effort, character and physicality.

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[J0sh]

One has the best work ethic on the team, high hockey IQ, exceptional positioning and hasn't made a mistake in the past 2 years.

The other one is known to come to training camp overweight.

 

[Very Stable Genius]

Zibanejad rather easily. The bigger problem is what Ryan is going to do. If Pageau is in the top6 this team has problems

 

[Boud]

One has the best work ethic on the team, high hockey IQ, exceptional positioning and hasn't made a mistake in the past 2 years.

The other one is known to come to training camp overweight.

Meh, that's a poor evaluation.

Say everything good about one of the players, say something bad about the other ... done deal.

 

[BonkTastic]

2a & 2b.

I see our 2nd and 3rd lines as fairly interchangeable next year. I can't imagine their ice time being so different that we're worrying about what number is next to their name on the 2/3 depth chart up the middle.

I care far more about who they are playing with.

 

[BK201]

I think we could be good enough to role 2 decent second lines, an ok first line and a 4th line.

MacArthur needs to be healthy for that though.

 

[Indrew]

My one main fear about giving Pageau an increased role: he isn't skilled enough offensively to be effective on the powerplay. I'm all for giving JG more even-strength minutes next season if he continues to outplay Zibby, but I really don't want him anywhere near the powerplay if the team is healthy.

 

[BK201]

My one main fear about giving Pageau an increased role: he isn't skilled enough offensively to be effective on the powerplay. I'm all for giving JG more even-strength minutes next season if he continues to outplay Zibby, but I really don't want him anywhere near the powerplay if the team is healthy.

It's funny cause in junior he was a really solid PP QB.

 

[Very Stable Genius]

Pairing Zibanejad with Stone for an extended period would be an excellent decision. Smith can play on his wing if they want as well.

 

[Bileur]

I don't see a team ever winning a cup with Pageau as a 2C.

I also don't see a team winning a cup with the current version of Zibanejad as its 2C, but Zibanejad still has room to grow and a more consistent, fit (mainly mentioning this because of the slow starts), and hardworking Zibanejad could be a 2C on a cup winner. Thankfully, each of those attributes are things that can be "fixed" unlike a lack of skill or speed.

Based on that, I'd rather give the 2C ice time to Zibanejad and see what he can become.

Pairing Zibanejad with Stone for an extended period would be an excellent decision.

I'd love to see that as well.

MacArthur-Turris-Ryan
Hoffman-Zibanejad-Stone
Smith-Pageau-?
Dzingel/Paul-Paul/Lazar-Lazar/?
Neil

 

[Micklebot]

2a & 2b.

I see our 2nd and 3rd lines as fairly interchangeable next year. I can't imagine their ice time being so different that we're worrying about what number is next to their name on the 2/3 depth chart up the middle.

I care far more about who they are playing with.

Agreed.

If we can get a third RW that can produce offense, we could easily have 3 dangerous lines

 

[Super Cake]

Colin White

 

[DJB]

How is this even a debate? Zibanejad simply hasn't been good enough and has Ben surpassed by Pageau.

On the bright side maybe zibanejad will improve playing 3rd line minutes

 

[Boud]

I'd love to see that as well.

MacArthur-Turris-Ryan
Hoffman-Zibanejad-Stone
Smith-Pageau-?
Dzingel/Paul-Paul/Lazar-Lazar/?
Neil

Smith - Pageau - Lazar
Dzingle/Puempel - Paul - Neil

Isn't Puempel waiver eligible next season? That pretty much guarantees his spot unless he's traded.

 

[BonkTastic]

How is this even a debate?

Because people want to talk about it, and people have a variety of opinions on the matter.

Hence: a debate.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Zibanejad is simply more dominant offensively.

His tenacity though has been on decline. I think a new, experienced and tougher coach will change this.

 

[Bileur]

Smith - Pageau - Lazar
Dzingle/Puempel - Paul - Neil

Isn't Puempel waiver eligible next season? That pretty much guarantees his spot unless he's traded.

I'd be ok with this too.

 

[TheDebater]

I think I would like to see Pageau do it again next year before I annoint him a clear #2. I always thought he had potential to be much more than a #4 or #3 centre and he's finally proving me right however if I was management I'd go into next year with the impression that I don't have a #2 centre and that it's up for grabs. I wouldn't annoint anyone the position until after training camp and keep it on a game by game basis until one of Pageau or Zibanejad decide to run away with it.

 

[Sun God Nika]

Pageau is great an elite 3c fringe fill in second line C. If you are ever gonna win a cup you want pageau being clutch from the third line.

Zibby is just so much more dominant on the power player. When Zib turns it on he is up there for most domiannt players in the game. His PK and face offs aren't that far off from pageau just by watching obviously I don't have Stat sheets.

Zibby also has a track record over 3 seasons that Pageau has to overcome. Zibby has also out produced pageau despite him playing with Stone.

When you are talking about playing in the top 6 production is 90% of it

Jesus guys...

 

[starling]

2a 2b 2c

 

[Torso9000]

I'd be interested to revisit this question after (if?) Pageau gets a longer look in a top 6 role next season with everyone healthy.

That aside, if what he's done the past two months is at all representative of what he can bring consistently in the role moving forward, then I don't think it's unreasonable for Pageau to be a #2. I'd argue he's probably already on par with - maybe even better than - Zibanejad at even strength. And while he certainly doesn't have the same one-timer as a scoring threat, I'd be interested to see how he would do if given an extended chance on the PP. As BK201 referenced, Pageau was a really good player on the PP with Gatineau. He only has 2 PPP this season, but that's with only about 45 seconds of average PP time per game.

 

[ChocolateLeclaire]

Zibanejad is simply more dominant offensively.

His tenacity though has been on decline. I think a new, experienced and tougher coach will change this.

I don't think it will. I think Zibby is just one of those guys whose intensity ebbs and flows in the moment because I don't think he's 100% committed to hockey. He has all the tools to be a dominant player, and we've seen it in spurts, but we've also seen the guy come to a lot of games where it looks like he'd rather be anywhere else but playing hockey. 82 games of hockey seems to be too much for him to keep his "give a ****" levels at high.

I think that's just who he is.

Pageau, on the other hand, he knows at his size, he's got to give it his all every game, because he's at a size disadvantage that makes coaches and GMs question his ability. He's had to do that his whole career, prove himself. That's why he always looks like every game is his last. He plays that way.

 

[Erik Alfredsson]

Whoever wants it more.

 

[Sensinitis]

2a & 2b.

I see our 2nd and 3rd lines as fairly interchangeable next year. I can't imagine their ice time being so different that we're worrying about what number is next to their name on the 2/3 depth chart up the middle.

I care far more about who they are playing with.

Pairing Zibanejad with Stone for an extended period would be an excellent decision. Smith can play on his wing if they want as well.

Pageau's emergence shouldn't slot him up a spot for these reasons.

It's a great thing even if he just stays on our 3rd line (or 2B line, if you will).

He's getting more and more comfortable in the NHL, and his offensive game is still blossoming. That doesn't mean we should slot him as 2C though.

Give him good linemates. He seems to do good with Smitty and having LH and RH centers on the same line is excellent for possession. Keep that duo, add a good RW (Colin White? Mike Santorelli?) on that line, OTHER THAN ALEX CHIASSON. And we'd be good.

I still have lots of faith in Zbad. He's a 20 goal 50 point two way center right now. If he shows just a little bit more growth, he starts entering 1B territory...

Really, if Zbad just comes into camp in better shape than the past 2 seasons and doesn't go through a bad beginning season slump like the past 2 seasons, he's a 60 point forward.

Next season is really important for Zbad, but as it stands he's a very good 2C, and we have two other great centers in Turris and Pageau. If Zbad takes that next step like Turris and Pageau did, watch out. I like that center depth very much.

 

[DrunkUncleDenis]

I don't think it will. I think Zibby is just one of those guys whose intensity ebbs and flows in the moment because I don't think he's 100% committed to hockey. He has all the tools to be a dominant player, and we've seen it in spurts, but we've also seen the guy come to a lot of games where it looks like he'd rather be anywhere else but playing hockey. 82 games of hockey seems to be too much for him to keep his "give a ****" levels at high.

I think that's just who he is.

Pageau, on the other hand, he knows at his size, he's got to give it his all every game, because he's at a size disadvantage that makes coaches and GMs question his ability. He's had to do that his whole career, prove himself. That's why he always looks like every game is his last. He plays that way.

We seem to say every year that if Zibby applies himself this offseason, he can be a good 2C coming into next year. But it's really his style of play that needs tweaking. He's young, it can still happen.

I agree with the MacTuryan and Hoff-Zib-Stone combos.