MLB off-season News & Notes thread (Phils sign Kingery to 6 year deal)

[robert terwilliger]

i'm not because i'd rather the skill get the money, not the guy who owns the team.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

I'd much rather see money in the hands of labor over ownership. Owning a baseball team is a license to print money, and franchises only go up in value. Nobody should be striking when everybody is making so much damn money though. Negotiate a better contract/agreement when it comes up.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

I think it's more a question of years than AAV. Owners are willing to pay for talent but these 20M deals are suicide if it's for length. So many cases of bad contracts in recent years I can see why owners have basically said enough. And with the analytics there's a more accurate valuation of both talent AND shelf life. Personally I'm pretty happy to see these little bítches whine and complain that 10 million will leave them in the poor house and watch them have no contract heading into spring training

In the 'real' world when the profits rise but the wages for the employees fail to rise as well people complain. What's the difference here??

 

[tony d]

Heard about this possible strike during spring training. To me the players could have an issue but it's best to still play while ironing out some changes to the CBA. Having a strike or walking out won't make the players look good.

 

[GordonGecko]

In the 'real' world when the profits rise but the wages for the employees fail to rise as well people complain. What's the difference here??

Firstly, the owners are getting their cut no matter what. When player salaries go up, they make up the difference by jacking prices on everything. But the real problem is the junk contracts like Ellsbury and Jason Bay where the team is stuck for many many years with a dud of a player. No fans want to see that, so F em for not being able to get 5+ years anymore I'm happy to finally see the owners finding some responsibility

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Firstly, the owners are getting their cut no matter what. When player salaries go up, they make up the difference by jacking prices on everything. But the real problem is the junk contracts like Ellsbury and Jason Bay where the team is stuck for many many years with a dud of a player. No fans want to see that, so F em for not being able to get 5+ years anymore I'm happy to finally see the owners finding some responsibility

I don't think anyone is disputing there was a time when teams were giving out bad contracts. The players being hurt now are the middle tier players who paid their dues to get to this point where they should be offered a fair contract and they aren't. 1 year deals and invites to camp for a lot of these guys is just an insult.

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

If Players strike then MLB owners should put up united front of not making peace until guaranteed contracts end

if Players want to try and destroy MLB then so be it ,, Make them pay dearly for it in next CBA

 

[Nurmagomedov]

If Players strike then MLB owners should put up united front of not making peace until guaranteed contracts end

Would be very interesting to see how it would work if one of these leagues was "just a job". Complete free agency and you can get fired/quit whenever.

 

[Voight]

Players are the ones who agreed to this CBA. Maybe Mr Tony Clarke did not do a good job of explaining how the new tax penalties would limit even the financial giants like the Yankees & Dodgers.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

If Players strike then MLB owners should put up united front of not making peace until guaranteed contracts end

if Players want to try and destroy MLB then so be it ,, Make them pay dearly for it in next CBA

I'm legitimately blown away by your continued desire to blame the labor pool for everything and blindly support billionaires. Every lockout. Every strike.

 

[GordonGecko]

I'm legitimately blown away by your continued desire to blame the labor pool for everything and blindly support billionaires. Every lockout. Every strike.

Why would you support these pre-madonnas ? I'd rather support 1 rich a-hole than 25 of them

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

Why would you support these pre-madonnas ? I'd rather support 1 rich a-hole than 25 of them

Because they're entertaining. They're who I'm paying/tuning in to watch. Tom Ricketts isn't. Larry Dolan isn't. Should I sympathize with Rogers communications?

 

[bleedblue1223]

I'd much rather see money in the hands of labor over ownership. Owning a baseball team is a license to print money, and franchises only go up in value. Nobody should be striking when everybody is making so much damn money though. Negotiate a better contract/agreement when it comes up.

It is not a license to print money. Owning a team is like the stock market, sure it goes up in value now, but nothing is a guarantee. There are definite scenario's where an individual club's value could plummet. Nothing is a guarantee. Then you have to factor in the fact that on any given year, a club could be hit with a massive loss. If you are bleeding money in the short-term, you might not care about the long-term gain, if there is one.

 

[bleedblue1223]

In the 'real' world when the profits rise but the wages for the employees fail to rise as well people complain. What's the difference here??

Wages for players have definitely risen. Are you arguing the salaries have flat-lined over the years?

 

[bleedblue1223]

I'm legitimately blown away by your continued desire to blame the labor pool for everything and blindly support billionaires. Every lockout. Every strike.

Calling any of the major sports player unions just a labor pool is entirely disingenuous. This is a fight over the 1%. What about the lower and middle class workers of the clubs? Those are the people that get screwed in these situations.

 

[Nurmagomedov]

Calling any of the major sports player unions just a labor pool is entirely disingenuous. This is a fight over the 1%. What about the lower and middle class workers of the clubs? Those are the people that get screwed in these situations.

Yeah. Every players union happily negotiates away the rights of those who aren't yet members and can't vote for themselves in order to benefit themselves. If the MLBPA came out fighting for higher minor league minimums and NHL style restricted free agency they'd get a lot more support from the public.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Yeah. Every players union happily negotiates away the rights of those who aren't yet members and can't vote for themselves in order to benefit themselves. If the MLBPA came out fighting for higher minor league minimums and NHL style restricted free agency they'd get a lot more support from the public.

The public generally doesn't care about this stuff. Regular people are just annoyed at all pro sports strikes and lockouts.

Edit: Pretty sure I misinterpreted that part.

 

[bleedblue1223]

i'm not because i'd rather the skill get the money, not the guy who owns the team.

That's the way anything in business works. Do you think the developers at Apple, Microsoft, Google, etc. are the highest paid workers or do you think the execs and owners make more? Like it or not, the guys at the top carry the risk and are needed to ensure the business stays strong moving forward, and that means they will be paid more.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

Wouldn't it be nice if these millionaires and billionaires took paycuts in profits and salaries and pass the savings on to the consumers/fans who make 0.0029723% of what they make? It would fill stadiums, have more people watching games online/on tv, sell more merch, grow the game worldwide ultimately raising the value of their businesses and the game all while increasing add revenue...

 

[bleedblue1223]

Wouldn't it be nice if these millionaires and billionaires took paycuts in profits and salaries and pass the savings on to the consumers/fans who make 0.0029723% of what they make? It would fill stadiums, have more people watching games online/on tv, sell more merch, grow the game worldwide ultimately raising the value of their businesses and the game all while increasing add revenue...

Stadiums are already pretty full, I imagine people that want to watch are already watching, and if consumer/fans get more money is this scenario, I doubt they are going to spend it on more MLB merchandise. If prices of merchandise go down, I doubt you'd see any significant spike in purchases. The prices are probably pretty darn close to their equilibrium.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

Calling any of the major sports player unions just a labor pool is entirely disingenuous. This is a fight over the 1%. What about the lower and middle class workers of the clubs? Those are the people that get screwed in these situations.

I've already said I don't agree with lockouts/strikes. Nobody is hurting, these aren't middle class families. You don't like the terms of your agreement? Negotiate different terms when the CBA is up. I won't agree with the players striking even though I sympathize with them way more than I do owners and the NHL lockout I was firmly in the players camp.

When billions of dollars are being made, honor your agreement. Especially in a sport that has guaranteed contracts.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

That's the way anything in business works. Do you think the developers at Apple, Microsoft, Google, etc. are the highest paid workers or do you think the execs and owners make more? Like it or not, the guys at the top carry the risk and are needed to ensure the business stays strong moving forward, and that means they will be paid more.

The guy delivering packages is replaceable. The guy knocking 40 HR's off the worlds best pitchers isn't. Like you said, this isn't the average labor pool. In most businesses the guys at the top are the ones who are largely responsible for the money being made. Professional sports? Not so much.

 

[bleedblue1223]

The guy delivering packages is replaceable. The guy knocking 40 HR's off the worlds best pitchers isn't. Like you said, this isn't the average labor pool.

Of course that guy is replaceable, there are just fewer guys that can replace that, which is why they make so much money. Everyone is replaceable, in every industry, of every level.

An entry level accountant is easily replaceable, but the demand is enough that they'll roughly make 50k. An elite MLB player is replaceable by other high-end baseball players, but since there are fewer of those and a variety of other factors, they will make over $20 million.

 

[GordonGecko]

Calling any of the major sports player unions just a labor pool is entirely disingenuous. This is a fight over the 1%. What about the lower and middle class workers of the clubs? Those are the people that get screwed in these situations.

For real, if the players went to strike over making sure all the concessions staff and beer guys made $25/hour, then that would be something to get behind and support. But do you think the players give a crap about real labor? They're too busy complaining about having to settle for $50 million instead of $80 million with all expenses paid

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

Stadiums are already pretty full, I imagine people that want to watch are already watching, and if consumer/fans get more money is this scenario, I doubt they are going to spend it on more MLB merchandise. If prices of merchandise go down, I doubt you'd see any significant spike in purchases. The prices are probably pretty darn close to their equilibrium.

I dunno. I go to a handful of games every year. Maybe 5-10 max. Ticket prices aren't sooo bad here in Toronto but they are climbing every year and if you want 'good seats' then it gets up there for sure. I know that if it were cheaper I would certainly go to more games. Food and drink are so outrageously priced that I never even consider getting anything at the stadium. I also find the merchandise to be very overpriced so I haven't bought a single piece of gear in maybe 10 years. You lower the prices and I'll buy some hats/jerseys/bumper stickers, etc. I guess maybe I'm not the typical fan in terms of spending habits though.