Mike Babcock Elite Coach Appreciation thread

[IPS]

I think gallant is no better or worse than how he was when he was fired in florida.

I think the biggest difference is he has a team conpletly dialed in and listening to him and in florida he didnt.

Is that his fault one team is dialed in and one team wasnt? Or is it a case of happistance?

No way.

Gallant learned from his previous failures, and designed a new and improved system that's custom-tailored to today's NHL.

Babcock refuses to learn from his previous failures and continues to impose his outdated methodologies from a decade ago. Maybe one day the guy will learn that 100 foot stretch passes ain't the best way to run a breakout anymore.

 

[Drytoast]

No way.

Gallant learned from his previous failures, and designed a new and improved system that's custom-tailored to today's NHL.

Babcock refuses to learn from his previous failures and continues to impose his outdated methodologies from a decade ago. Maybe one day the guy will learn that 100 foot stretch passes ain't the best way to run a breakout anymore.

Regarding Gallant suddenly becoming a genius...

Regarding Babs 100 foot stretch passes...other teams fear our transition game. And that's how we put pressure on Boston. We didn't lose because of stretch passes.

 

[Nithoniniel]

No way.

Gallant learned from his previous failures, and designed a new and improved system that's custom-tailored to today's NHL.

Babcock refuses to learn from his previous failures and continues to impose his outdated methodologies from a decade ago. Maybe one day the guy will learn that 100 foot stretch passes ain't the best way to run a breakout anymore.

That's not true. For one, if you knew Babcock you'd know he spends the summers playing catch-up to any new trends in hockey. He has implemented changes. Our systems are not even close to the same as he used in Detroit in many ways. As for our outlet passing, that was a change implemented during this season that he didn't rely on before. I'm not a fan either, but your comment is still way off.

Gallant learned from his previous failures, and designed a new and improved system that's custom-tailored to today's NHL.

Gallant is using the same kind of system he ran in Florida. Player personnel is the main difference, and what caused him to be fired was mainly a weak roster due to injuries.

Not taking anything away from Gallant. I love how his teams play. But he didn't change a thing since he's Florida times. And if you don't trust my word on it, he's pretty much said so outright himself.

 

[stickty111]

The Marlies great run is making Mike Babcock look good.
He left Johnsson in the minors longer then the "is Johnsson a man" posters would like, but considering his star calibre play, it looks like Babcock was right!
Not only do we have a great coach, he also seems like he knows when a player is ready to be called up, and when they need more time. Thats called a great developmental coach.

Kapanen and Dermott agree

 

[DarkKnight]

Lucky to have him.

 

[Field of Dreams]

The bottom line is if we fired Babcock today, we wouldn't be able to find a better guy, and if you are unsatisfied with Babcock, you are unsatisfiable.

 

[MR4]

The bottom line is if we fired Babcock today, we wouldn't be able to find a better guy, and if you are unsatisfied with Babcock, you are unsatisfiable.

Who else could bring us to two first round exits! Oh the horror of the thought of losing him! He's been so good to get like 8 first round exits in the past 10 years!

Have seen Babcock be worth being deemed good, haven't seen any greatness from him.

 

[Leafs at Knight]

Who else could bring us to two first round exits! Oh the horror of the thought of losing him! He's been so good to get like 8 first round exits in the past 10 years!

Have seen Babcock be worth being deemed good, haven't seen any greatness from him.

I'm just going to assume this was sarcasm to save myself from banging my head off the wall.

 

[1specter]

I'm just going to assume this was sarcasm to save myself from banging my head off the wall.

It's pretty funny how people forget that the Leafs were pegged to be a lottery team in the 2016-2017 season..

 

[Nithoniniel]

The bottom line is if we fired Babcock today, we wouldn't be able to find a better guy, and if you are unsatisfied with Babcock, you are unsatisfiable.

I've been saying the same. The standards people have for their coach means that they'll pretty much never be satisfied with their coach. They take what should be minor complaints and make it their focal argument for why he is incompetent. I'm not a fan of some of the things he does either, but I'm capable of seeing the greater picture. Our team is doing great, they are highly competitive, our defensive and offensive system allow us to penetrate danger zones better than most, and we are right there when it comes to the major tactical trends in the league (strong side faceoffs, 4F1D PPs, outlet passing through the middle.)

I don't think he's one of the absolutely best. His reactive nature (the line matching, being overly concerned with neutralizing opponents rather than getting the most out of his own lines) and over-reliance on dependability holds him back from being in that group. But the group of coaches I'd take before him is very small.

 

[MR4]

It's pretty funny how people forget that the Leafs were pegged to be a lottery team in the 2016-2017 season..

That's totally wrong. Adding Andersen, Matthews, Zaitsev & Marner among others to the team was the main reason for the success.

Like I said, he's done good enough to say he's in the maybe 6-12 range where you can't get too mad over his shit but really the negatives Nith listed and his brutal zone exits strategy this season, with the lack of any success in the past 10 years, holds him away from my top 5 personally

 

[Nithoniniel]

That's totally wrong. Adding Andersen, Matthews, Zaitsev & Marner among others to the team was the main reason for the success.

Well he's not really wrong. We were pegged as a lottery team in most places. How to distribute credit for crushing those expectations can be argued though.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

That's totally wrong. Adding Andersen, Matthews, Zaitsev & Marner among others to the team was the main reason for the success.

Like I said, he's done good enough to say he's in the maybe 6-12 range where you can't get too mad over his **** but really the negatives Nith listed and his brutal zone exits strategy this season, with the lack of any success in the past 10 years, holds him away from my top 5 personally

The fact that all this youth came in at the same time and were successful and most have gotten better is a positive for Babcock, not a negative.

The negatives Nith have brought up such as obsessively line matching IMO have been necessary to ensure that kids coming in are put in a position to have success. We all rave over how great Dermott is but if he were caught on the ice with a lot of Riellys competition his confidence might be in a different spot by the end of the season.

As the core gets older I don’t think he’s going to be worried so much about matchups, but I suspect managing ice time is something that is going to drive fans nuts for a long time. And hilariously enough I suspect that’s coming from sports science staff and one fundamental thing this “stubborn coach” has changed substantially from his Detroit days.

 

[Morbo]

Yeah, our best season ever in 100+ years is nothing special...

well, to be fair, it really isn't when you compare best seasons with a lot of other teams. 100-105 points is a really good season. but it's not great or especially noteworthy, or shouldn't be at any rate.

 

[1specter]

That's totally wrong. Adding Andersen, Matthews, Zaitsev & Marner among others to the team was the main reason for the success.

Yeah it's totally wrong now when you know for a fact that they ended up being good. It's always easy to say stuff in hindsight. But most fans here and in general, as well as media and analysts had the Leafs as most likely to be a bottom 10 team, and at best missing the playoffs by a few points. They had just finished last place and the only really proven commodity they added was Andersen, everyone else was unknown. Plus in October I think they only had 2-3 wins.

You can't just say 'oh x players were really good that's the only reason they made it' while completely discounting the coach's contributions. He put them in the best positions to succeed.

 

[Field of Dreams]

I've been saying the same. The standards people have for their coach means that they'll pretty much never be satisfied with their coach. They take what should be minor complaints and make it their focal argument for why he is incompetent. I'm not a fan of some of the things he does either, but I'm capable of seeing the greater picture. Our team is doing great, they are highly competitive, our defensive and offensive system allow us to penetrate danger zones better than most, and we are right there when it comes to the major tactical trends in the league (strong side faceoffs, 4F1D PPs, outlet passing through the middle.)

I don't think he's one of the absolutely best. His reactive nature (the line matching, being overly concerned with neutralizing opponents rather than getting the most out of his own lines) and over-reliance on dependability holds him back from being in that group. But the group of coaches I'd take before him is very small.

For the most part these are my thoughts in a much more eloquent explanation. However I do believe Babcock is among top three coaches at the very least.

I think the line matching has been a byproduct of only having two forward lines he can trust in all situations. I think finding a more defensively responsible middle 6 centre will allow babcock to be more flexible in that regard.

 

[Field of Dreams]

Who else could bring us to two first round exits! Oh the horror of the thought of losing him! He's been so good to get like 8 first round exits in the past 10 years!

Have seen Babcock be worth being deemed good, haven't seen any greatness from him.

Our core was under 20 years old, and our defense has been among the worst in the league. He clearly was a miracle worker to get this team in the playoffs last year, and has done very well to get above 100 points this season.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

The bottom line is if we fired Babcock today, we wouldn't be able to find a better guy, and if you are unsatisfied with Babcock, you are unsatisfiable.

I probably agree with your first point since the pickings are pretty slim. The second part is pretty off base though. Babcock is far from perfect

 

[LeafChief]

I probably agree with your first point since the pickings are pretty slim. The second part is pretty off base though. Babcock is far from perfect

If we didn't have Babcock, we'd be looking for a Babcock.

If Babcock had gone to the Sabres and turned them into a playoff team as fast as he did to the Leafs (which face it, the Sabres have high end young talent just like the Leafs do), we would be freaking out on these boards talking about how we missed out on him.

 

[IPS]

If we didn't have Babcock, we'd be looking for a Babcock.

If Babcock had gone to the Sabres and turned them into a playoff team as fast as he did to the Leafs (which face it, the Sabres have high end young talent just like the Leafs do), we would be freaking out on these boards talking about how we missed out on him.

You seriously think he could have turned the Sabres into a playoff team?

I really don't know if Babcock can get anymore overrated on here.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

If we didn't have Babcock, we'd be looking for a Babcock.

If Babcock had gone to the Sabres and turned them into a playoff team as fast as he did to the Leafs (which face it, the Sabres have high end young talent just like the Leafs do), we would be freaking out on these boards talking about how we missed out on him.

This isn't really a counter to my opinion that Babcock isn't perfect and that it's possible to have criticisms of his coaching. It's also some pretty wild speculation

 

[LeafChief]

This isn't really a counter to my opinion that Babcock isn't perfect and that it's possible to have criticisms of his coaching. It's also some pretty wild speculation

Correct - it is speculation. Which is why I started the post with "if".

Babcock isn't perfect. Tell me though, who is a perfect coach?

 

[BertCorbeau]

You seriously think he could have turned the Sabres into a playoff team?

I really don't know if Babcock can get anymore overrated on here.

He said "if" as in a hypothetical situation.

Calm down on the vendetta against Babs

 

[IPS]

He said "if" as in a hypothetical situation.

Calm down on the vendetta against Babs

Pretty unrealistic hypothetical if you ask me.

A proper one would have made his point a lot more valid.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Correct - it is speculation. Which is why I started the post with "if".

Babcock isn't perfect. Tell me though, who is a perfect coach?

Yes, but there's a difference between rational speculation and wild speculation. Buffalo isn't even close to as good as the Leafs and it's not due to coaching.

Yeah no coach is perfect. Babcock still has enough flaws that you can't say that everyone must be satisfied by him or else there's something wrong with you. That's the claim I took issue with