Marty St. Louis

[SA16]

What's amazing is no one here claimed it's the only thing that matters.

Since he's one of the most talented players in the NHL I'm more inclined to not care about his possession stats, but he gives the puck away so much in all three zones that it becomes a real problem.

Your logic for getting rid of him stated he is purely a powerplay scorer (false since he's basically 3rd EVpts/game on the team. This also implies being a poor possession player) and that he is "detrimental to our possession game" where I just showed that his possession game this year is really no different than it has been the past five. It's a minor factor. His constant fumbling of passes and mishandling pucks is more of an issue. That I never really saw of him in Tampa. Even so he has by far the best one timer on the team, great vision, and a really good shot.

 

[silverfish]

Okay, and?

Eh, I don't know. You could be the worst ****ing player in your own zone in the world, as long as you're scoring more than you're giving up, I think I'm okay with it.

 

[pld459666]

Pretty simple. If you were Glen Sather, do you let MSL walk, or try to re-sign him? Lets assume that he'll be fair about his contract, and won't ask for any more than 4 million (whether that'll be a bonus-ladden deal, or year by year, will not be known).

The only answer I can provide is one based on what is known.

Is he willing to take 2 as a base and 2 in bonuses? If yes, then I re-sign him

If the answer to that is no, then I let him walk.

But I cannot give a black/white answer on a complete grey area.

 

[Raspewtin]

Your logic for getting rid of him stated he is purely a powerplay scorer (false since he's basically 3rd EVpts/game on the team. This also implies being a poor possession player) and that he is "detrimental to our possession game" where I just showed that his possession game this year is really no different than it has been the past five. It's a minor factor. His constant fumbling of passes and mishandling pucks is more of an issue. That I never really saw of him in Tampa. Even so he has by far the best one timer on the team, great vision, and a really good shot.

Yeah, that's the real problem with him this year.

I even just said that I usually wouldn't care about his poor possession play if he wasn't giving the puck away so much.

Eh, I don't know. You could be the worst ****ing player in your own zone in the world, as long as you're scoring more than you're giving up, I think I'm okay with it.

Well yes of course, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't like to see better defense from him.

 

[RangerBoy]

Brooks wrote there is no doubt the Rangers want to keep Marty. It's just a matter of working out the contract. Any bonus laden contract rolled over will hurt the Rangers. Paygo.

 

[Raspewtin]

This thread is, in all honesty, outrageous and, yet again, shows why advanced stats can be taken way too far.

Ridiculous thread.

How in the world does this devalue advanced stats?

I literally said "he's a bad possession player" once, and followed it up with "I usually wouldn't care because he's so talented".

 

[GAGLine]

Brooks wrote there is no doubt the Rangers want to keep Marty. It's just a matter of working out the contract. Any bonus laden contract rolled over will hurt the Rangers. Paygo.

Exactly. People act like those bonuses won't have to be paid.

 

[coolbean04]

I resign him for 1m and another 4m in bonuses that gets paid the following year.

 

[Beer League Sniper]

I'd absolutely re-sign MSL, depending on the contract.

He's going to need to take a pay cut, but I can't see that being a huge hangup at this point in his career. The man is set for life, as long as he's not at Mohegan Sun or OTB on off days.

 

[coolbean04]

Exactly. People act like those bonuses won't have to be paid.

Yes it gets paid but that is also another year of the cap going up.

Also another year to evaluate your players.

Another year with prospects developing who might step in.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

The only answer I can provide is one based on what is known.

Is he willing to take 2 as a base and 2 in bonuses? If yes, then I re-sign him

If the answer to that is no, then I let him walk.

But I cannot give a black/white answer on a complete grey area.

Exactly. Can't answer this in a vacuum, there are way too many other factors that play into the decision:

1) What contract IS he looking at?

2) What does Zucc want?

3) What does Hags want?

4) What can we get for Zucc?

5) What can we get for Hags?

6) How far does the team go this season - if they win it all, does MSL want to retire?

7) Does the org think Duke, Buch or both are ready to step in?

I'm sure I'm missing some, but you get the idea. Impossible to just say yes or no.

 

[silverfish]

Brooks wrote there is no doubt the Rangers want to keep Marty. It's just a matter of working out the contract. Any bonus laden contract rolled over will hurt the Rangers. Paygo.

Well, what's the projection on the 16-17 cap?

Boyle's $4.5m is going to be off the books.

And, as of now, the Rangers FA situation in the 2016 off-season is as follows:

RFA's: Hayes, Kreider, Haggerty, Noreau, Bourque (tried to only include players of substance or potential substance)

UFA's: D. Moore, Boyle, Talbot.

All in all, a pretty easy off-season. Kreider negotiations will be tough. Hayes will get a bridge deal. Potential of all three UFA's walking.

That bonus might be easier than we think to eat.

 

[Raspewtin]

I resign him for 1m and another 4m in bonuses that gets paid the following year.

I'm cool with this if we completely and 100% go for it next season.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

I see him taking a discount to stay here. The truth is even at 40+ he still has the potential to lead the team in scoring. He's a playoff performer, wanted to be a Ranger, second in scoring this season and provides such leadership.

I 100% want him back.

 

[Riche16]

Is he slowing down? Probably. But we all knew that was coming at some point. He's still VERY dangerous on the ice. He makes us a tough team to defend against.

IMO this is a no brainer. You resign him. I fully understand that bonuses have to be paid, and our future cap is where it's going to get hit, but you don't thrown away two 1sts for 1 full yr and 2 play-offs. You sign him to a 1 yr-2yr deal (hope he doesn't ask for the moon) and go to war.

He may not bring it night in and night out but come play-off time he'll step it up.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

I would certainly prioritize keeping Zucc over MSL.

In an ideal world, both would be kept.

 

[NYRangerFan*]

This thread is, in all honesty, outrageous and, yet again, shows why advanced stats can be taken way too far.

Ridiculous thread.

agreed. MSL fits the team perfectly

 

[NYR Viper]

Well, what's the projection on the 16-17 cap?

Boyle's $4.5m is going to be off the books.

And, as of now, the Rangers FA situation in the 2016 off-season is as follows:

RFA's: Hayes, Kreider, Haggerty, Noreau, Bourque (tried to only include players of substance or potential substance)

UFA's: D. Moore, Boyle, Talbot.

All in all, a pretty easy off-season. Kreider negotiations will be tough. Hayes will get a bridge deal. Potential of all three UFA's walking.

That bonus might be easier than we think to eat.

You need to replace those players. Why ruin a chance at a big time UFA if you don't need to.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

In terms of 5 on 5 points/game MSL is 5th on the team. Nash, Stepan, Brassard, Zucc then MSL.

Would be a mistake to give him 5M+ and let Zucc walk.

 

[RangerBoy]

Exactly. Can't answer this in a vacuum, there are way too many other factors that play into the decision:

1) What contract IS he looking at?

2) What does Zucc want?

3) What does Hags want?

4) What can we get for Zucc?

5) What can we get for Hags?

6) How far does the team go this season - if they win it all, does MSL want to retire?

7) Does the org think Duke, Buch or both are ready to step in?

I'm sure I'm missing some, but you get the idea. Impossible to just say yes or no.

How much money do the Rangers have committed for next season? How many signed players? Where will the upper limit be set? It will not be $73M. Teams were told it won't go below $71M. The loonie is trading below 83 cents. Bettman said the cap would 73 with an 88 cent loonie.

 

[NYRangerFan*]

I'm gonna laugh when the cap goes up and we keep everybody somehow lol

 

[silverfish]

You need to replace those players. Why ruin a chance at a big time UFA if you don't need to.

All true, and impossible to predict, but in terms of the UFA's. Is it safe to assume Lindberg could be a Dom Moore replacement in 16-17? Maybe.

Could Talbot be replaced by a cheaper veteran backup/journeyman? Will he even want to test the market or go somewhere he can be a starter? Will he re-sign for something similar to his current deal?

At this point, Boyle is probably the toughest guy to replace out of those three.

I hate trying to predict so far into the future, so this conversation is getting away from me a bit, but it could be worth it to start thinking about.

I'm gonna laugh when the cap goes up and we keep everybody somehow lol

It's not going to go up. The math doesn't work. The low loonie is going to kill the Hockey Related Revenue #.

 

[McRanger]

Your logic for getting rid of him stated he is purely a powerplay scorer (false since he's basically 3rd EVpts/game on the team. This also implies being a poor possession player) and that he is "detrimental to our possession game" where I just showed that his possession game this year is really no different than it has been the past five. It's a minor factor. His constant fumbling of passes and mishandling pucks is more of an issue. That I never really saw of him in Tampa. Even so he has by far the best one timer on the team, great vision, and a really good shot.

Yeah the bold has driven me crazy.

I don't expect him to win many board battles. But I do expect him to be able send/receive a pass without falling down.

 

[Raspewtin]

I'm gonna laugh when the cap goes up and we keep everybody somehow lol

We're all coming to my house for shots if we somehow keep everybody.

 

[Raspewtin]

All true, and impossible to predict, but in terms of the UFA's. Is it safe to assume Lindberg could be a Dom Moore replacement in 16-17? Maybe.

Could Talbot be replaced by a cheaper veteran backup/journeyman? Will he even want to test the market or go somewhere he can be a starter? Will he re-sign for something similar to his current deal?

At this point, Boyle is probably the toughest guy to replace out of those three.

I hate trying to predict so far into the future, so this conversation is getting away from me a bit, but it could be worth it to start thinking about.

Trying to predict the future in hockey is literally impossible, especially with this team.

Two years ago we were in the middle of that garbage 2013 season where pretty much everyone underachieved except Nash and Stepan, and couldn't consistently win three games to save our lives.

And now...........well........we're better