Post-Game Talk: Lightning keep Jets grounded - 8-3 - "Hit the reset button"

[garret9]

I agree that Pavelec has been playing awful in the last 3 games & allowing some routine saves to beat him.

I still however think that the Jets defense has hung him out to dry many times & is not doing their job clearing opposing players from the front of the net for him.
It is obviously a confidence killer for him right now & he is questioning himself.

Hopefully when Byfuglien & Bogosian come back this will stop & they can make players pay for standing in front of Pavelec.

Agreed.
I've been tough on Pav's and pointing most of the fingers at him, because in my mind he isn't doing his job and isn't playing up to his abilities.
BUT, his job is tougher then it should be... Now do you put the blame on those playing well-well above their heads? Hainsey a #4/5 playing #2, Stuart a #5/6 playing #3, Redmond a rookie #6/7 playing #4, Postma a rookie #6/7 playing #5, Clitsome a #8 playing #6....
Return Byfuglien and Bogosian, we get the net cleared, we reduce shots against and limit the dangerous ones, and everyone falls back to a more natural placement...

 

[Winnipeg Jets]

We need more depth on D, plain and simple. Two guys down (Bogosian, Byfuglien) and the Dmen that we have are playing way over their heads.

I noticed in the last three games, the D can't make a breakout pass to save their lives. The puck gets dumped in and they get hemmed in making stupid passes, this team was built to be a north/south type style and that needs to be echoed with our defensmen. What this team was good at is on-the-fly offense and when the D is slowing you down your whole game collapses. I just feel like we're totally bottlenecked on offense because the D can't keep up.

edit: Another thing I'm not liking is the PK (obviously). It's way too static. Everyone is sitting there waiting for the pass and not pressing. The second Conacher tip just made me so mad, the Jets let two guys set up in front of Pavs with Enstrom tasked to clear the crease. Conacher was left absolutely unimpeded and got his second goal on an easy tip. This team needs to press on the PK, they're not going to get anywhere by standing there and letting the other team set up no problem, they need to press.

 

[Jet]

Everyone needs to take a step back and calm down. It was one game (or one road trip).

Lets move on. Tuesday is another game.

name all of the games out of the 8 this year that you would consider to be GOOD games from the Jets. Throw wins and losses out the window. GOOD games?

I say maybe 2. That is why people are upset. I don't like quitters on my team and I saw plenty of quit on this trip. We have the size to grind teams into the boards. We did that for 2 games this year. The rest of the time it was flat play, no passion, no aggression. Stupid selfish lazy penalties and terrible goaltending.

That is why people are upset. Some of us expected more from this group.

 

[Jet]

I agree that Pavelec has been playing awful in the last 3 games & allowing some routine saves to beat him.

I still however think that the Jets defense has hung him out to dry many times & is not doing their job clearing opposing players from the front of the net for him.
It is obviously a confidence killer for him right now & he is questioning himself.

Hopefully when Byfuglien & Bogosian come back this will stop & they can make players pay for standing in front of Pavelec.

I'll tell you something though. When you are a maxed out D with a bunch of guys playing way above your head, and your goalie lets in bad goals and raises his hands every time he gets scored on, that is infuriating. If I was the coaching staff I would tell him to stop that immediately. Not only does it tell your team "I can't stop the puck" it also says "that is all your fault"

Instead of quitting, Pavelec, why don't you get pissed off and show us beast mode Pavs. We have seen him before.

I'm starting to think that contract they gave him was the biggest error the management has made to date.

 

[allan5oh]

i'm starting to think that contract they gave him was the biggest error the management has made to date.

x2 ..

 

[Stej]

x2 ..

x3

We can't affort to pay players based on potential and I feel like that Pavs contract was largely based on future expectation.

 

[Ossific]

I'll tell you something though. When you are a maxed out D with a bunch of guys playing way above your head, and your goalie lets in bad goals and raises his hands every time he gets scored on, that is infuriating. If I was the coaching staff I would tell him to stop that immediately. Not only does it tell your team "I can't stop the puck" it also says "that is all your fault"

Instead of quitting, Pavelec, why don't you get pissed off and show us beast mode Pavs. We have seen him before.

I'm starting to think that contract they gave him was the biggest error the management has made to date.

I can't stand it when he does that.

 

[Hank Chinaski]

I'll tell you something though. When you are a maxed out D with a bunch of guys playing way above your head, and your goalie lets in bad goals and raises his hands every time he gets scored on, that is infuriating. If I was the coaching staff I would tell him to stop that immediately. Not only does it tell your team "I can't stop the puck" it also says "that is all your fault"

I remember when I was 13 or so, my dad told me to stop doing that. I was confused at first, because I didn't do it as any disrespect to my teammates, it was more of a "wtf, how didn't I stop that?" kind of reaction.

Only until I became older and wiser did I realize why that was sage advice. It's terrible body language and sends the wrong message to your teammates.

Just looking at Pavelec after some of those goals, you can tell he's frustrated with how bad he's playing. It's weird, because that was one thing that stood about him last season, he was always looking cool as a cucumber regardless of how he was playing.

 

[Jet]

I remember when I was 13 or so, my dad told me to stop doing that. I was confused at first, because I didn't do it as any disrespect to my teammates, it was more of a "wtf, how didn't I stop that?" kind of reaction.

Only until I became older and wiser did I realize why that was sage advice. It's terrible body language and sends the wrong message to your teammates.

Just looking at Pavelec after some of those goals, you can tell he's frustrated with how bad he's playing. It's weird, because that was one thing that stood about him last season, he was always looking cool as a cucumber regardless of how he was playing.

Honestly, I never thought of it that way, Hank. See, as a defenceman, I see that as an indictment of my play on the ice. I never thought that Pavs may be super frustrated with himself there.

I wonder with all that happened to him with his poor play overseas and his DUI that he is questioning his ability right now? Of all of our percieved issues right now Pavelec really worries me the most. We are going exactly nowhere with this type of goaltending.

 

[SensibleGuy]

Yeah I agree about Pav's body lingo. I'm pretty certain he's frustrated at himself as much as anyone else, but it still doesn't look good. It gives an impression of futility and you don't want that impression of your goaltender...

 

[Hank Chinaski]

Honestly, I never thought of it that way, Hank. See, as a defenceman, I see that as an indictment of my play on the ice. I never thought that Pavs may be super frustrated with himself there.

I wonder with all that happened to him with his poor play overseas and his DUI that he is questioning his ability right now? Of all of our percieved issues right now Pavelec really worries me the most. We are going exactly nowhere with this type of goaltending.

I'm not so much worried about him turning it around, it's more that in this shortened season, the Jets can't afford to have him play this poorly for an extended stretch.

That's really what defines how average Pavelec is. He can go for stretches where he looks like an upper-echelon goaltender and steals games, but he also has stretches like this, where he inspires zero confidence and allows soft goals in bunches. Hopefully he eventually learns how to sustain that play, because if not, it could go down as one of Chevy's biggest contract blunders.

 

[Huffer]

Burmi: 8 games, 1 goal, 0 assists

Last 29 games as a Jet, 2 goals, 4 assists

Overrated I think so, if you guys think he is a key piece of the puzzle I don't know.

I don't think anyone is going to say they have been happy with his offensive numbers, but to only use goals and assists as the sole metric of his worth, while purposely ignoring everything else he has been doing to help the team win is pretty disingenuous.

 

[Huffer]

Agreed.
I've been tough on Pav's and pointing most of the fingers at him, because in my mind he isn't doing his job and isn't playing up to his abilities.
BUT, his job is tougher then it should be... Now do you put the blame on those playing well-well above their heads? Hainsey a #4/5 playing #2, Stuart a #5/6 playing #3, Redmond a rookie #6/7 playing #4, Postma a rookie #6/7 playing #5, Clitsome a #8 playing #6....
Return Byfuglien and Bogosian, we get the net cleared, we reduce shots against and limit the dangerous ones, and everyone falls back to a more natural placement...

We need more depth on D, plain and simple. Two guys down (Bogosian, Byfuglien) and the Dmen that we have are playing way over their heads.

I noticed in the last three games, the D can't make a breakout pass to save their lives. The puck gets dumped in and they get hemmed in making stupid passes, this team was built to be a north/south type style and that needs to be echoed with our defensmen. What this team was good at is on-the-fly offense and when the D is slowing you down your whole game collapses. I just feel like we're totally bottlenecked on offense because the D can't keep up.

edit: Another thing I'm not liking is the PK (obviously). It's way too static. Everyone is sitting there waiting for the pass and not pressing. The second Conacher tip just made me so mad, the Jets let two guys set up in front of Pavs with Enstrom tasked to clear the crease. Conacher was left absolutely unimpeded and got his second goal on an easy tip. This team needs to press on the PK, they're not going to get anywhere by standing there and letting the other team set up no problem, they need to press.

I agree with both of you guys here.

Pavs has played bad. Not trying to sugercoat it. But like you say Garret9, let's at least see how he does when he has a defense core in front of him not vastly playing outside of their talent level.

And agree with Winnipeg Jets on our PK. Way too passive, and we don't have one guy that will move a body out of the way in front of the net.

 

[sipowicz]

name all of the games out of the 8 this year that you would consider to be GOOD games from the Jets. Throw wins and losses out the window. GOOD games?

I say maybe 2. That is why people are upset. I don't like quitters on my team and I saw plenty of quit on this trip. We have the size to grind teams into the boards. We did that for 2 games this year. The rest of the time it was flat play, no passion, no aggression. Stupid selfish lazy penalties and terrible goaltending.

That is why people are upset. Some of us expected more from this group.

Thank you very much!!

For the older guys here, who wouldn't want former Jet Doug Smail on the PK here now!

 

[Kinjero]

The Sabers had a bad one this afternoon in Montreal...

 

[Lynk]

The Sabres had a bad one this afternoon in Montreal...

Another team showing how important goaltending (or lack thereof) is.

Not sure what's wrong with Ryan Mills.

 

[Tdoe42]

I dont know where the sense of entitlement comes from around here??

We got a team that no one watched because they were bad forever so I dont understand why everyone is surprised. TN does some amazing things but they dont make magic.

What we did get tho is a team 3/4 of the way through a basic NHL rebuild and we are a few years away from being the team that everyone thinks we are. Our best players are in their early 20's so this is exactly what your gonna get.

Fortunately being an PT Oiler fan prepared me for this lol

 

[blueandgoldguy]

I'll tell you something though. When you are a maxed out D with a bunch of guys playing way above your head, and your goalie lets in bad goals and raises his hands every time he gets scored on, that is infuriating. If I was the coaching staff I would tell him to stop that immediately. Not only does it tell your team "I can't stop the puck" it also says "that is all your fault"

Instead of quitting, Pavelec, why don't you get pissed off and show us beast mode Pavs. We have seen him before.

I'm starting to think that contract they gave him was the biggest error the management has made to date.

I wonder if the supposed threat of Pavelec bolting for Europe forced the JEts to offer that 5 year contract or if they simply felt they were getting a real bargain signing him to such a long term contract. I always felt it was too long myself. 3 years should have been adequate. As it is, even if he plays poor the rest of the season, I could see the Jets giving him at least one more year AT LEAST before even contemplating a buyout. I can't see this team spending $10+ million to buy him out after the first year of the his contract They won't waste that type of money.

Hopefully he can turn things around in a big way because I believe we are stick with for at least a few more years.

 

[sipowicz]

I don't think anyone is going to say they have been happy with his offensive numbers, but to only use goals and assists as the sole metric of his worth, while purposely ignoring everything else he has been doing to help the team win is pretty disingenuous.

Right he is dynamite on the PK and in the faceoff circle right?

Don't get me wrong I like the guy, he is magical with the puck on his stick, but sooner or later he has to start to produce, I call it as I see it.

He seems to be in a funk carried over from mid point last season, through St. Johns and now into this season.

 

[Huffer]

Right he is dynamite on the PK and in the faceoff circle right?

Don't get me wrong I like the guy, he is magical with the puck on his stick, but sooner or later he has to start to produce, I call it as I see it.

He seems to be in a funk carried over from mid point last season, through St. Johns and now into this season.

What's with the shakehead? You don't think he is great on the PK, or the dot this season? To say he hasn't been excellent in those areas is crazy.

Of course sooner or later he's going to have to produce. Who here has ever said he is going to stay on the team until he is 30 if he doesn't produce?

Most are just saying to give the kid a legitimate chance. This could very well have been his first NHL season.

Is everyone on this page besides Hall, Seguin, Skinner, and Fowler getting the same treatment from their fanbases? That they either have to produce big this season or it's over?

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2010e.html

 

[SCP Guy]

Can we delete this thread??? It is like watching a car accident over and over and over lol

 

[angrymnky]

For the older guys here, who wouldn't want former Jet Doug Smail on the PK here now!

Always liked seeing the effort he gave. Too bad he couldn't do much with the puck whenever he stole it shorthanded.

 

[Gnova]

I blame this loss on the GDT.

The second season of GOT sucked so obviously it's inclusion into the Jets season two did this.

Case closed.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

I blame this loss on the GDT.

The second season of GOT sucked so obviously it's inclusion into the Jets season two did this.

Case closed.

BLASPHEMY!

I know people are upset at the loss but don't go bringing down GoT



(Also, Storm of Swords is the best book, so expect season 3 of GoT to be the best yet)

 

[TroubaFan1]

Instead of quitting, Pavelec, why don't you get pissed off and show us beast mode Pavs. We have seen him before.

I'm starting to think that contract they gave him was the biggest error the management has made to date.

I think this is a bit of an over reaction. I would say passing on Hamilton and Couturier was the biggest error management has made thus far.